Has anyone on the board learned to hit 130mph serves?

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by kiteboard, Mar 19, 2011.

  1. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    I gotta say, in defense of us who thought second serves were the only ones hit, .....who can watch long enough with that music in the foreground?..
     
  2. wy2sl0

    wy2sl0 Hall of Fame

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    lets just realize one thing...

    Out of all these Karlovic 156, and Roddick 155 serves on Davis Cup guns (which I believe Roddick can hit, or close to, and Karlovic couldnt - which is obvious his 156 is an error)....this seems the fastest...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ng5UolJt5LY

    Even in slow motion it is like 3 frames and hitting.
     
  3. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    I couldn't take it. Bad jazz does not go well with second serves.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2011
  4. Tennis_Monk

    Tennis_Monk Hall of Fame

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    Stop making assumptions at me, someone you dont know. will ya?.

    Your experience means zilch to me. You can continue to marvel or get frightened by whatever you want to.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2011
  5. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    FYI, when I make it up to SF to play tennis with you guys, I'll be bringing
    my giant boombox on court and playing the same song.

    http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...sQO2h8n3CA&page=1&ndsp=61&ved=1t:429,r:15,s:0
     
  6. Tennis_Monk

    Tennis_Monk Hall of Fame

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  7. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Might be a good idea to play that song.
    We won't be listening to it, instead, we'll concentrate on beating you to get off the court quicker! :)
    Now if you play some Eagles or Temptations, I'd be grooving to the music and forget all about smart choices of shots...:shock:
     
  8. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    Davis cup guns are juiced.. Players said as much.: Roddick.
     
  9. Jonny S&V

    Jonny S&V Hall of Fame

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    I don't have to do anything and you'll leave me be, ok? :)
     
  10. TennisAddict121

    TennisAddict121 Banned

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    Well played
     
  11. dr325i

    dr325i Legend

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    EXACTLY!
    Jonny S&V -- post your 120 mph serve at least...
    Tipsa's been "clocked" at 400-something, that does not mean jack...
     
  12. fluffy Beaver

    fluffy Beaver Professional

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    Funnily enough, Jonny has a youtube account full of service vids all below 100 MPH but he says he has too much of a social life to make a video hmmmm.
     
  13. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    Chela has been clocked at 500 km/h. That's 310.7 mph.

    Milos who?

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2011
  14. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    You guys care way too much about other people's claims on the internet. It's the internet. Your life must be pretty empty if you're still badgering him about posting a video just to satiate yourself.
     
  15. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    IMO a 99mph pitch is more like 140 than 130.
     
  16. Nellie

    Nellie Hall of Fame

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    A little off base, but do you remember a couple of years ago there was a game show in India about tasting thousands of people (cricket players, javelin throwers, etc.) to see if anyone could through throw hard enough to be professional baseball players.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/07/01/ap/sportsline/main5127266.shtml

    The two winners pitched in the low 90s.

    So I wonder how fast people, who never played tennis before, could serve. I would guess 90+ mph translate to about 130.
     
  17. Kevo

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    I seriously doubt you'd have anyone hitting a pro level serve having never played tennis before. Throwing something is a pretty normal skill for just about any athlete, hitting a serve in tennis is somewhat unique.
     
  18. Jonny S&V

    Jonny S&V Hall of Fame

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    Let me rephrase: Too much of a social life to prove anything to trolls like you. If I'm gonna post a video, it's for technique critique and nothing more. I have nothing to prove over the internet, since I'm sure that if I posted a video of myself playing a match, I'd get everything from 3.5 to 6.0.

    I'm sure I'll make a video here one of these days, but after practices, I don't feel like hitting any more tennis balls than I have to.
     
  19. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    That's the nail on the head again. This guy is on it.
     
  20. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    No way. They might be able to hit 100-110.
     
  21. mightyrick

    mightyrick Hall of Fame

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    I agree with this.

    Also, pitching in major league baseball requires more than just being able to throw in the 90s. Being able to throw hard is different than being able to throw hard, five different ways, for hours a day, in incredible heat, incredible batter memory, et cetera.

    The same for tennis, obviously.

    A similar comparison would be to see how well a major league batter could either a tennis serve. A major league batter can swing that piece of lumber at 110mph or more. I can't imagine what they'd do to a tennis ball with an 12oz racquet... presuming they could keep the ball in court.
     
  22. mtommer

    mtommer Hall of Fame

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    I've faced a 95mph pitcher as well as high nineties pitching machine sessions before while playing college ball. I've faced 115 mph to 125 mph serves from the top juniors in the nation. A 95mph pitch is faster than a 125 mph serve so you're right on track although it's hard to say exactly where that number is. By no means am I implying that 125 mph serve is easy though but I can definitely track the ball easier.
     
  23. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    "tracking the ball".....
    Very different for pitcher's/server's who HIDE the ball and their intentions.
    A pitcher like MadisonBaumgardener, or BarryZito, if he doesn't HIDE the windup/ball, he get's taken to the cleaners.
    A server hides the ball with low toss, sometimes funky motion, sometimes just plain old too good.
    I notice a huge difference in returns of my serves when I toss low and hit at zenith, compared to my normal higher toss, waiting for the ball to drop 2'.
     
  24. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    I agree. Hitting a baseball is ***WAY*** harder than hitting a tennis ball.
    The tennis ball slows down a lot more from wind resistance and also from
    the court. A baseball bat is much heavier and round. Small sweet spot.
    Harder to swing as fast. A tennis racquet is 60-125 sq inches, flat, lighter.
    IMO, even an 85 mpg baseball pitch is harder to hit than a 130 mph serve.
     
  25. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    You're stretching this here. There are high school and low level college pitchers who can put up those numbers. You really need to be D1 or pro level to be putting up 130mph serves regularly. Even then, those players have the high unreturned numbers even if it's just based on pace alone (Roddick, Ivanisevic, Isner, Phillippoussis, Raonic, etc.) versus razor sharp placement (Federer, Sampras).

    If you look at the stats, the faster servers tend to have similar numbers to those who can paint the lines simply because you need to prepare before the ball is even hit for a 130mph serve a foot from the edge of the box whereas that same serve at 120mph in the same spot can usually be returned. 120mph painted on the T ala Sampras, however, is going to almost always be unreturnable. However, having personally served 119 and then facing someone serving in the low 130s, it's an entirely different ball game. You just need to pray it's near you, and even then, you better make a solid block on it.

    So no, if pitches in the 80s are found at the HS and college level and are regularly returned while a 130mph serve is returned only by the BEST returners out there, and even then, it needs to be near them, I'd easily argue the 130mph tennis serve is more difficult. Add 10mph to that pitch and then we're talking.
     
  26. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    That's the nail on the head again. First taped Sampras in 89 Phillie indoor. 120 on the line any time he got into trouble was almost always unreturnable or an outright ace, by a 18yr. old.
     
  27. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    pvaudio & kiteboard, you guys misread my post. I was referring to returning
    a serve and hitting a pitch, not serving or pitching. I probably could have
    phrased it more clearly. Just pointing out that on the receiving side (batter
    and serve returner), it's much harder in baseball.
     
  28. HunterST

    HunterST Hall of Fame

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    That's what he just refuted. I think you misunderstood him.

    The serve doesn't have to be anywhere near the returner. Therefore, it is quite possible for the returner to get a serve that is physically impossible to return. In baseball, it is a rule that the ball has to be hittable (a strike).

    It's comparing apples and oranges, really. Hitting a baseball and returning a serve are not at all comparable.
     
  29. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    Tell that to Blake when he was aced 10 times in a row by Querrey.
     
  30. mtommer

    mtommer Hall of Fame

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    They absolutely are comparable to some degree having played both. Namely, reaction and anticipation. It's not an apples to apples comparison but it's not an apples to oranges comparison either.
     
  31. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    That's interesting to say. When returning, you have to move forward with your weight going into the forward split step, so inertia is overcome, but it's also a psychological movement as well. You are moving to aggressively strike a shot that you don't know exactly where it is going to land. You have to be snake quick and loose as a goose to be able to strike hard and fast, on well placed/spun serves or flat serves. The hitter has to coil just as fluidly, with his weight back, and then step aggressively into his strike zone, it's just a more exact strike zone, and a small round bat vs. a large flat racquet. If you only bat 300 returning, you can never break anyone. But the attack mind is similar. The techniques to increase your odds are similar: take a deep breath before each return. Move and release your upper body tension. Get your weight into the shot/bat. Keep your wrists firm and your stroke short. Adopt a can do attitude. You are the attacker, not the helpless defender.
     
  32. DownTheLine

    DownTheLine Hall of Fame

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    On my serve does my backfoot(right) go too far to the front or is it fine? I'll try and get a video tomorrow or monday of me serving with the feet in hopefully the corect position.

    Could you guys check it out for me?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHZbXq6R7XA

    THANKS FOR ALL TH HELP GUYS!
     
  33. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    I'd change to the stance that Fed, sampras, becker, Raonic, all use: the chong. Lendl used to do what you do now, and I did too, and found it hurt my left hamstring. STudy this sampras oh sequence, and you will be able to serve 130+.

    [​IMG] sampras serve oh
     
  34. DownTheLine

    DownTheLine Hall of Fame

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    I tried that and it just feels sooooo unnatural and i couldnt hit a serve. I am pretty much doing the Soderling, I think.
     
  35. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    You make some good points about batting, but forget that returners in tennis face more spin, more speed, more speed change via decel, must clear the net, get it down into the court, must take a ball off the wicked bounce, must be a switch hitter, and don't even know if it's a Fh or Bh! to name a few things to go along with the fact that most pro servers are able to make serves at times that are NOT returnable period.

    so while baseball batters have a tough job, all strikes need to be in the strike zone unless you get fooled, So clearly IMO in the bigger picture it pales beside returning serve at the higher levels.
     
  36. anontennis

    anontennis New User

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    I think many of the posts here are a bit one sided in the favor of tennis. Returning is certainly difficult; against a good pro server even more so. That being said, baseball is also incredibly difficult. To add to your factors, if you swing in baseball it's the same thing as if the pitcher pitches a strike. You have to swing a bat many times the weight of a tennis racquet. The distance is shorter in baseball. Getting hit with the ball is more dangerous in baseball. etc. I think the two concepts are comparable, but to say that tennis is far harder is absurd IMHO.

    Also, I take back my claim that I might be able to serve 130 this summer. Forgot how hard it was to get anything within a few mph of that, let alone to 130...
     
  37. dozu

    dozu Banned

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    even though I don't think baseball is a sport, I'd still say hitting in baseball being the most difficult action in all sport.

    you hit .250 you survive in the big leagues, .300 you are a star.

    try .250 in tennis.... you are out of a job pretty soon.
     
  38. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    Are pitchers more skilled than top servers? Top pitchers can throw high 90s, without the racquet, but top servers can hit 150+ and place it near a line. Far more pitchers can throw 90s, than servers can hit 150! ONly four or five have hit that speed in tennis. Dent, Roddick Karlovic, Raonic, etc., while even some high schoolers have thrown 90+.
     
  39. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    Sod does not bring it all the way up to the line, but it stays behind his front left foot, and out to the side a little bit, but he does use a pin point stance like you do.
     
  40. DownTheLine

    DownTheLine Hall of Fame

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    Ill try and get a video of my serve today along with some groundies. If not today, will do tomorrow.
     
  41. Jonny S&V

    Jonny S&V Hall of Fame

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    Actually, pitchers are probably more skilled than servers in using the utmost power that the human body can provide. There isn't anything different from pitcher to pitcher, as equipment is constant (you can't exactly string your arm tighter or looser), while a server can change strings, racquet, grip, pinpoint/platform, etc...
     
  42. DownTheLine

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  43. mightyrick

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    You can't really compare tennis serves to baseball pitches -- apples to apples. The only reason tennis players can hit a 140mph serve is because of the racket and the ball.

    Case in point, remove the racquet from the equation and let Karlovic throw the tennis ball as fast as he can. I guarantee he isn't going to throw it 100mph. In fact, he isn't going to get even close. Put a baseball in his hand and he might be able to throw it 90mph. Although he may dislocate his shoulder doing it without proper mechanics.

    Baseball pitching requires pinpoint accuracy -- like tennis serving. The best baseball pitchers can throw a ball through a 36sq inch hole from 60 feet away.

    I think both tennis serving and baseball pitching are equally technical and require equal amounts of brainpower.
     
  44. DownTheLine

    DownTheLine Hall of Fame

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    Put a racquet in a pitchers hand they won't get the ball over the net.
     
  45. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    I totally agree. Just b/c there are more people throwing 90mph doesn't
    mean it's easier than hitting a 130mph serve. I think if some of these
    90+ and 100+mph pitchers had learned to play tennis instead of baseball,
    we certainly see speeds exceeding roddick, ivo, etc. Just my opinion.
     
  46. Devilito

    Devilito Hall of Fame

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    What does a pitcher do but pitch? A tennis player serves then decides if he wants to come in behind it, stay back, anticipate a strong or weak return, hit a forehand, backhand, construct a point etc. You’re comparing the entire job of a player (pitching) with what’s only a small part of a complete tennis game. Tennis is difficult because of the many aspects to the sport both physical and mental and the precision it requires. Taking one element from it and breaking it down against a sport that only uses that element is short sighted.

    It’s like saying. MAN what if Usain Bolt played tennis. He would own Rafa, he’s SO MUCH FASTER. Ok and? Can he hit banana forehand on the run around the net post off a 90mph drive? Can he play 7 best 3 of 5 set matches in a row and get through the ups and downs of hours upon hours of on court play?
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2011
  47. DownTheLine

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    I can't believe people are actually comparing baseball to tennis!

    Baseball is the only sport where you don't have to be athletic and can be 100 lbs overweight! It's such a joke!
     
  48. mightyrick

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    It is the difference between a team sport and a purely solo sport. That is why I'm saying to compare them isn't really apples to apples. In a team sport, you have usually one or two jobs primarily. In a solo sport, you do it all yourself.

    Pitching requires precision and brainpower and ability to handle adversity and immense pressure. Same for tennis.

    We can say that baseball pitching and tennis serving are similar. They use a similar kinetic chain. They require the same kind of precision. They require the same kind of mental preparation and confidence.

    But as far as I'm concerned, that is where the similarities between the two sports end.
     
  49. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    I'm just comparing the pitch to the serve. Nothing more. btw, the Flash would
    work nadal in a rally and the Hulk can beat every MMA fighter out there.
     
  50. GuyClinch

    GuyClinch Hall of Fame

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    Absolutely. There is more money in baseball AND you can really specialize is just the throwing motion. I'd actually go farther then that.

    You could take a good coach (like the Serve Doctor) and in a few weeks teach pro pitchers how to hit MASSIVE serves that would match Roddick. (Granted Roddick might be able to serve a bit harder if that's all he was going for).

    There is a ton of crossover between the two actions. Most pro level servers could quickly be taught to throw a passable fastball (75-85 mph) and by the same standard fireballing pitchers could quickly be taught to blast huge serves (as could NFL quarterbacks).

    If you have a good throwing motion you are going to have a good serve...and vice versa.
     

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