Hitting has made me think I can play with 13oz mids...

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by Lilguy1456, May 16, 2013.

  1. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    I'm furious.

    Some of the people I like to play tennis with just enjoy "hitting" more than playing actually games and sets. In many ways, this has ruined me. Not only has it made my serve and volley skills virtually nonexistent, but I have now been lulled into a false sense of security with my mid-size frames. My RDXs, my IG Mid, my VCore 89...ALL fantastic racquets to hit with. The feel is just tremendous.

    Now I come to find that I win sets with lighter MPs and lose them with heavy Mids. Fantastic. Hitting blows. It encourages bad habits and hitting down the middle of the net while discouraging aiming for lines/corners and attacking weaknesses. What a sh!tshow....
     
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  2. CivicLx

    CivicLx Professional

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    I have to admit, I think this has happened to me but in my case, it was me being the one that just preferred to hit. I started having shoulder problems (I'm sure due to bad technique) and it was uncomfortable to serve so I just preferred not to. I stopped playing on a regular basis in 2010 but just recently picked up a couple YT Prestige Mids because I love the feel of them but I think I may be in a for a rude awakening when I try and play a singles set. I had demoed the racquet a few times back in '10 and I'm sure I used it for doubles sets but enough rambling. I know what you mean:(
     
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  3. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    Right...'hitting' sticks can be as demanding as you want. I go for the feel...

    Then I step on the court and try to hit a cross court winner, only to find it go RIGHT over the middle of the court lol. Can't whip those heavy sticks through the zone at all (at least I certainly can't)
     
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  4. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    I know several 5.0 looking hitters who actually play at high 3.5.
    I"m a horrid looking 3.5 hitter who plays singles just like he looks.
    Fortunately for me, since I can't run even one step, I restrict myself to doubles where I seem to do fine in 4.5 level doubles.
     
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  5. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

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    I never understood why people have "hitting sticks" and "match sticks". Aren't you practicing so that when you play a match, you're comfortable with your shots, and this confidence allows you to go for shots and etc.

    What's the point of practice if what you're using in a match will be completely different than what you practice with.
     
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  6. hisrob777

    hisrob777 Rookie

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    I hit too much also. I'm a 4.5 hitter but a 3.5 match player. Lol
     
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  7. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    You are EXACTLY right. It shouldn't be like that. The only thing that makes them "hitting" sticks is that I like hitting with them, and then lose with them on the court lol.
     
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  8. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Aren't we all? :wink: LOL
     
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  9. MikeHitsHard93

    MikeHitsHard93 Hall of Fame

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    Yup this is what I feel like too. I can hit nearly any shot I want when just hitting and then I get a rude awakening with I have to serve and return and not over hit...
     
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  10. mad dog1

    mad dog1 Hall of Fame

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    what happened to this?

    i thought you were able to get used to any stick after a hitting with it for a bit?
     
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  11. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    I still stand by that quote 100%. How does realizing I play better with lighter sticks contradict that quote? I STILL play with a stick in stock rofl.
     
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  12. MikeHitsHard93

    MikeHitsHard93 Hall of Fame

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    Bahahahaha you guys crack me up!
     
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  13. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    HAHAHA, clown. When did I say I could play with any stick? Silly silly forum trolls.
     
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  14. pfchang

    pfchang Professional

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    story of my life in this thread.:)
     
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  15. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    if you can hit with it you can play with it. Its all mental. You just need to work on the nerves a bit.

    Getting sucked into the hitting trap is black hole for any tennis player. Its great for recreation and staying in shape though. Just have fun with it.

    Now if we are just talking match play........practice your serve a lot more. Many people who hit a lot neglect the most important shot in the game. It takes a loooong time to develop a truely great serve in order to hit slice and kickers while hitting your spots in the box.

    Hitting tennis balls and actually playing tennis are two very different things. There is no reason you cant do both though if you want to. You just have to be smart about your time on court. If you want to hit groundstrokes just start the point out with a second serve and work the ball around.

    A big part is having practice partner who are trying to get better instead of winning points. Good players could care less about winning points when they are working on skill development. People trying to outhit each other when feeding the ball in are idiots if they think they are working on anything important.

    All great players play below their actual level in matches. Even the pros. Its probably 3% of the time when everything goes as smooth as a practice session when you actually have the preasure of matchplay. Welcome to tennis.....everything is mental in this game.
     
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  16. kaiser

    kaiser Semi-Pro

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    So true, sigh...
     
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  17. spaceman_spiff

    spaceman_spiff Professional

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    I'm better in match play than in rallies. I practice with a couple of guys who can grind out rallies all day long, but they need that rythm you get from the feed and the first couple of warm-up shots.

    When we play rally points, they always beat me. But when we play sets or tiebreakers, then I win a majority of the time. It all comes down to serves and returns.
     
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  18. maxpotapov

    maxpotapov Hall of Fame

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    If hitting means "keeping the ball comfortably in play" ping pong style then yes, you will be in trouble playing matches occasionally.

    My definition of hitting session is practicing all kinds of shots, especially those "easy" put aways and top spin defensive shots, should the partner cooperate. Then playing points or a match is not much different mentally and technically.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2013
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  19. Slitch

    Slitch Rookie

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    Increase in spin and power has migrated the sport towards baseline playing. As a S&V player you're at a disadvantages because of the increase in speed of modern tennis. It's the sad truth....
     
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  20. Deuce Bag

    Deuce Bag New User

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    This is the most poignant and thought provoking topic I have read here in a long time. Well done to the OP for searching within yourself and expressing your feelings. What you say strikes a chord with me, but I will still persist with my Bio 200 Tour as it helps me to prepare early and not get lazy so that when it's time to switch to a more forgiving racquet my muscle memory will be so entrenched that it will be a breeze to play with a MP racquet. I give this post five stars.
     
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  21. axel89

    axel89 Banned

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    lol play with the same racket or get a new opponent? Practive volleys on a wall and practice serves. Sign up for tounraments
     
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  22. MAXXply

    MAXXply Hall of Fame

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    I agree. There is a casual profundity to the OP's post that makes me question every racket I've acquired since my long descent into internet-induced racketholism. The aftermath of serious competitive/tournament play always focusses one's mind on their racket threshold. For me I swing out with the most confidence whenever I play with classic headlight rackets around 12-12.5oz.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2013
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  23. Alex78

    Alex78 Semi-Pro

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    Spot on, MAXXply!
    I was perfectly fine with my MG Prestige MPs until - I stumbled across this place...
    I somehow started to believe that I needed some more racket assistance, and the result is a nice little collection of rackets I'll probably never be able to play on a regular basis :)
    Always looking for that unique "feel" (joy of playing - that's all that I care about) the Prestige offered me, I've now bought two YTIG Prestige MPs. End of story, at least for a few months :)
     
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  24. Sander001

    Sander001 Hall of Fame

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  25. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

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    Yes.. it does. With the ladies not so much. Men need to serve and return well. If you get behind in the point with anyone over a 4.0 plus.. you are losing the point most of the time. Post is very much right on the money.
     
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  26. anirut

    anirut Legend

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    I'm too old for match play.

    So I just hit, and hit, and hit.

    Yes, I'm a 4.5 hitter and a 2.5 match player.

    And I love my mids ...
     
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  27. The Isomotion31

    The Isomotion31 Semi-Pro

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    hmmm can't say I have experienced this. I am lucky to have a friend that is down to hit, then do drills then play a match after when we do get the chance to play.
     
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  28. Brian72

    Brian72 Rookie

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    Lilguy,

    What mid sized racquet have you played stock that is 13 oz?

    As for the original premise that hitting is bad for your game. I can't imagine going a playing tennis with out some purpose. Just hitting isn't nearly as enjoyable for me as actually play out points. I usually play points to 11 or 21 with my hitting partners. And this is without serves involved. It has been tremendous for my game. Now, when I do serve, I don't feel rushed and I feel more confident in my ground game and hitting out. It has also improved my net game, as I usually make several efforts or even play a whole game where I trying and hit approach shots and come to the net.
     
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  29. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    I don't know about Lilguy, but lots of older mid rackets are around 13 oz.
     
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  30. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    It's serving that makes me think I can play with my old mid rackets. Can serve bombs using the weight of the racket and don't have to chase down the balls (except on really bad tosses) so it is easy to hit the sweetspot.
     
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  31. Brian72

    Brian72 Rookie

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    I understand that. He actually listed these as the mids he was referring to:

    My RDXs, my IG Mid, my VCore 89

    IG mid is the heaviest at 12.3 oz.

    Is there a difference between 12.3 oz and 13 oz? Hell Yes!!

    Maybe he just had a typo.

    I'm just giving him a little grief due to his strong stance against racquet mods. :)
     
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  32. BlueB

    BlueB Hall of Fame

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    That's interesting, I serve a lot better with tweeners then heavy or heavy SW sticks...
    As for the match play, a heaftier 100, or even 107 is a lot easier then a heavy mid, IMO.

    I'm about the same level matchplayer and hitter. Maybe slightly better matchplayer, actually.
     
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  33. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    I'm an old guy who grew up with heavy rackets and use the weight to my benefit. I'd guess you use racket head speed more than weight for your benefit. It all depends on the form you use.
     
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  34. BlueB

    BlueB Hall of Fame

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    I'm no sping chicken either, at 44 :)
    Grew up playing the woodies, hated them... Amongst the other things/sports, the weight of those racquets ruined my girly wrist, so I stoped with tennis for 20+ years.
    Yeah, on the serve, the RHS is everything to me. Larger head size helps TS, too.

    That being said, I can hit the heaviest grundies with a heavy MP. However, if my timing is off, or I need to hit a reflex shot, I'm doomed.
     
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  35. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    I exaggerated a bit...but still...a 12.3oz stick with overgrip and dampener etc....can come in close to 13. Amen about playing with a purpose though.
     
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  36. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    The essence of my post is about heavier racquets...my apologies...I should have said 12.5oz racquets. My thesis remains constant.
     
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  37. Brian72

    Brian72 Rookie

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    Lilguy,

    I'm asking this question in all sincerity, not to give you a hard time.

    Have you ever modified a racquet?

    If you have and you got crappy results I understand.

    If you haven't, and you just refuse, I'm confused ;)
     
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  38. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    I have in minimal capacity. I don't buy in to the idea that adding lead tape to a frame can fix problems. Customizers need to answer me this (off topic, but whatever, it was brought up)...Is an extra 10g or whatever of lead at 12oclock in the hoop EQUAL to if there had merely been an extra 10g in the CONSTRUCTION of the hoop to begin with?

    If those 2 things are NOT the same, I will never customize a racquet. I'll find a racquet that has the weight I need where I need it within the frame itself.

    Does that make sense? If I would only like a stick with lead, then I don't really like the stick...
     
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  39. stronzzi70

    stronzzi70 Professional

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    hate just hit, hit and hit..........I like action,,,play a match,,,,think and try to win......some people just hate lose.. that´s why just hit all the time,,,come on!!!..........play a set, play points, play a full match!
     
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  40. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    this


    .
     
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  41. spinovic

    spinovic Hall of Fame

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    Good question. I've often wondered this myself.
     
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  42. Backhanded Compliment

    Backhanded Compliment Hall of Fame

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    Loving this thread... I had a "just hit" on a wet court today and pulled out my ultra plush becker London strung with OGSM. It was so much fun and we were just trying to hit it back to the other person because witha wet court it is too dangerous to do anything else. I dont mean damp either I mean sopping wet. It was good consistency practice.

    But the fact remains that my heavier MP Prestige simply returns better and hits better second serves. I find most of my matches depend wholly on how I play my second serves and my returns (related somewhat to my 1st serve %'s too of course but the Becker mid is better for flat and slightly topspinny bombs Prestige MP wins the must win points more).

    also The Prestige MP is a more dangerous stick for topspin groundies on both sides.... but GAWD is it fun playing with a flexy noodle mid in the rain!
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2013
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  43. Backhanded Compliment

    Backhanded Compliment Hall of Fame

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    you do have a point but only to a point.

    Lead in the handle area is about the same as having more weight in the handle. Also its true lead doesnt actually make the hoop physically stiffer but it can actually make the hoop feel stiffer because the greater mass and inertia gets transferred to the ball. Put it this way... if I fill a Mini Cooper with lead and crash it into a non modified mini cooper the non modified car will absorb more damage and generally be more crumpled (head on collision, same speed). Is the leaded up car stiffer? Only marginally but its moment of inertia is drastically altered.

    Just remember that a graphite composite racket isnt just graphite... there is a resin binder and foam filled frames like Donnay and Angell, and the original pro staffs do have additional mass that isnt making it that much stiffer.. though the foam can have complex interactions with warping frame upon impact with a ball.

    It gets very complicated and if you like keeping it uncomplicated because you dislike customizing... it is good for you. Me, I cant play anything stock because my 1HBH is not not your typical 1HBH. I can play with anything but my return and backhand game get markedly better with altered frames.
     
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  44. GBplayer

    GBplayer Semi-Pro

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    It depends on why you modify with lead. I started out with a light racquet and over a period of about one year tryed lead in different places until I liked the feel of the racquet, to the point that even when on court for several hours I was comfortable with it and it felt like an extension of my arm. Then presuming manufactures could do a better job than me looked for one with the same specifications that I had created. I couldn't be more happy.
     
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  45. Brian72

    Brian72 Rookie

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    Basically you are saying that if you don't like the racquet stock you can't be bothered to try it modified??

    Also, what do you define as problems? Lack of Stability, Plow Through, Lack of power, small sweet spot, dead in the upper portion of the string bed, lack of spin?

    Lead can correct all of these things. If lead can't fix problems then why would anyone modify? Are you suggesting it's a figment of my imagination that I get any quantifiable benefit from adding weight.

    In previous threads you made the point that people get all worked up over adding 1 or 2 grams here or there, and how could someone really feel the difference over 1 or 2 grams. I would agree. But, adding 4 to 8 grams in certain spots certainly can be.

    Pro Stock racquets have a certain layup. But with out lead, none of the pros would play with a pro stock in it's original form. Distribution of weight makes a huge difference. As is evidenced by retail frames with different weights, swing weights and balance points. Also, graphite is a light weight material. Adding just extra graphite to increase weight doesn't create enough polarization or depolarization that most professional players seek. If that were the case, every pro would have the manufacturer just make the racquet out of graphite to meet their exact spec. Yet, almost every pro adds lots of lead to their racquet.

    Why wouldn't we mere mortals benefit from using the same principles to modify our own racquets?

    I guess I just don't see the harm in adding some weight to a frame and playing around with different setups before discarding it.

    That being said, I fully recognize that lead can't solve every problem, and the distribution of weight in the frame to begin with can positively or negatively impact the gains that can be achieved in any one problem area.

    Once you realize the limitations and the gains that can be made from adding lead, you can play with a racquet and recognize with in a few hitting sessions what mods you would make to get the gains you are seeking. TW's Chris does it all the time.

    You could always just stay in the closet. While maintaining your status on the boards as a guy who only plays stock racquets :twisted:
     
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  46. mad dog1

    mad dog1 Hall of Fame

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    ^^ there's this saying...it goes something like this...

    ignorance is bliss.

    :)
     
    #46
  47. Relinquis

    Relinquis Hall of Fame

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    there are different drills you can do with hitting partner other than hitting short loopy topspin down middle to other guy...

    do butterfly* drills and alternate positions every 5 points/rallies... half an hour of this is a great workout and very useful for actual matches.


    * one player hits only cross court and the other hits only down the line for the whole rally...
     
    #47
  48. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    LOL....Back in my youth I used to do this all day. Now I have to be the one hitting crosscourt when I hit with anyone above a 4.5. I and up hitting a lot of backhand slices to.

    Great drill though. Most rec players cant do it and give up. Most juniors quit and go back to blasting random shots with no purpose.
     
    #48
  49. Lilguy1456

    Lilguy1456 Semi-Pro

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    TW's Chris will often say "All i'd do to this stick is add a little lead here or there and it'd be good to go" and then he proceeds to NEVER play with that racquet ;)

    I think MOST people play with a stick that simply works for them. The #1 factor that determines if I PERSONALLY choose a racquet is feel, and I don't believe lead will change that all THAT much.

    Look, I HAVE added lead before. I've had sticks that I would like to have more plow, so I've put some lead at 12...then tried 10 and 2...then 9 and 3, just to play around....my personal result was this....less maneuverability and same level of plow lol.....but that's me.
     
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  50. GBplayer

    GBplayer Semi-Pro

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    I will try that.

    Another workout I like is when you have hit the ball, move to wherever you want on the court. But your hitting partner has to return the ball to you, then they move and you return to them. Being doubles players we use the whole court. A good way to stay warm in the winter, and helps improve accuracy rather than just hitting back and forth to each other.
     
    #50

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