If Federer had a winning H2H against everyone, would you consider him the GOAT?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by tank_job, Jul 30, 2012.

  1. Enigma_87

    Enigma_87 Professional

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    Laver was 5' 8''. Not to take away anything from him, but can you imagine playing serve and volley at Wimbledon today with the current technology and rackets?

    Yes Laver is an all time great, but his physique wouldn't allow him to be dominant in the current field.
     
    #51
  2. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    Federer fans still have something to cheer about. :p He could go for other personal records, such as reversing the 0-2 HC slam H2H he has with :D Rafa :D. (Though this is not likely.)
     
    #52
  3. Zarfot Z

    Zarfot Z Semi-Pro

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    Answer the question.
     
    #53
  4. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    This sums it up pretty good.
     
    #54
  5. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    The "GOAT" is Nadal's slam *****.
     
    #55
  6. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    On clay yes and so what.
     
    #56
  7. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    Australian Open 2-0, ouch.

    And Wimbledon 1-2, but Nadal had the last laugh, ouch.
     
    #57
  8. Iron Man

    Iron Man Rookie

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    false premise , Federer is already the GOAT with his losing H2H against Nadal

    he's human after all and nobody's perfect
     
    #58
  9. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    This and
    Yes, 3-2 on other surfaces, totally pales against Federers other records.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2012
    #59
  10. primetennis

    primetennis Rookie

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    just because federer lost a few close matches you can't say that he is mentally weak..in fact roger is very strong mentally which is why he accomplished so much..he has won a few matches being 0-2 sets down..how many times has nadal done that??also people like you who think that only nadal is mentally strong are complete d***heads..
     
    #60
  11. Russeljones

    Russeljones G.O.A.T.

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    When are we going to stop bringing up the achievements from the amateur era? That's like Romario counting the goals he scored in warm-up pre-season tournaments.
     
    #61
  12. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    How does 2-8 look? That's Federer's record at the slams vs Nadal. The "GOAT" is Nadal's b1tch, on the grandest stage. I have no doubt it will be 3-0 at the Australian Open if they meet again. I hope we get to see a US Open meeting too, because that would give Nadal the Career Grand Slam vs Federer.
     
    #62
  13. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    :D Rafa :D is 8-2 against Federer in ALL slams. Only 5 of those 10 meetings were on clay. It's pointless taking away the 5-0 Roland Garros H2H, since not only does Nadal still lead 3-2, but you should also take away Federer's best surface as well, which people claim to be grass. H2H becomes 2-0 in favour of Nadal. :oops:
     
    #63
  14. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    I hoped for it in 2010 and in 2011. But I'd prefer it to be in the final of the US Open. But I'm still happy with what we got in 2010 and 2011; more Nadal-Djokovic.
     
    #64
  15. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    I agree, Nadal-Djokovic is the true great rivalry.
     
    #65
  16. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    It'll get even greater come the 2012 US Open and 2013 Australian Open. If :D Rafa :D can grab those two slams, and pile on another Roland Garros, we could be set for another tense Nadal-Djokovic battle at Wimbledon 2013, much like we saw at Roland Garros 2012, which had one of the most tense 4th sets I'd ever seen.
     
    #66
  17. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    Hahaha.

    *******s getting desperate.

    What is next? You will hope that Federer is 40 and he meets some 25 year old player, to spank him at the WTF, to say, that he is beatable on relative fast surfaces too?

    Your boy had to wait for Federer to be old enough and simultaneously the surfaces made slow enough for him to beat Federer outside RG. Deal with it.
     
    #67
  18. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    Without doubt the most crucial set of 2012 (more crucial than the 2012 AO 5th set).
     
    #68
  19. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    Federer is old? Isn't Nadal on the verge of retirement?
     
    #69
  20. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    Agreed. Even on match point, you did not feel that it was over. Despite it being a 4-set victory, it was not far away from Wimbledon 2008 (which Nadal should have won in 4 sets).
     
    #70
  21. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    True, I hope Nadal gets another shot at Federer at Wimbledon. 2008 was a win, but overall a frustrating match.
     
    #71
  22. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    I think what's more frustrating is that they didn't meet again in 2009 due to :D Rafa's :D withdrawal. It was the best chance to even up the grass H2H to 2-2.
     
    #72
  23. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    Could you give me a link with his presser on that matter, please?

    :twisted:
     
    #73
  24. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    I think he was talking about the views of some posters on this forum (that Nadal should retire).
     
    #74
  25. Feather

    Feather Hall of Fame

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    I am a big Roger Federer fan and I am more than happy with him being one of the greatest players of all time.

    I think the title GOAT is a disservice to many players that played under different conditions facing different opponents. I think it's pointless to argue about hypothetical matches and claim one is the GOAT
     
    #75
  26. Feather

    Feather Hall of Fame

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    The new account here..:)

    So in case Rafa doesn't win US 2012, I think it would be "rafawon2013" :wink:
     
    #76
  27. The-Champ

    The-Champ Legend

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    Do you think Rafa will eventually break Pete's record of winning at least a major in his teens, twenties and thirties? :shock: Do you think Rafa will beat Pete's record of winning at least a major for 8 consecutive years? :shock:
     
    #77
  28. Talker

    Talker Hall of Fame

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    I can't take those guys seriously, most of the arguments are a joke.


    But at least the past greats have come foreward as I mentioned in an earlier post agreeing with the Fed followers, who can argue with them?
     
    #78
  29. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    I'm extremely confident of both of these things. Even if :D Rafa :D declines at the other slams, there is still no one to challenge him at Roland Garros. His 52-1 record there makes him the obvious favourite for 2013 and he can continue racking them up into his thirties. And, as you mentioned, he can break the Borg/Sampras/Nadal/Federer tie, and claim one of the most important longevity records.
     
    #79
  30. Geology_Rocks!

    Geology_Rocks! Semi-Pro

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    Wow, this is taking trolling to a new level.
     
    #80
  31. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    I don't understand what you just said.
     
    #81
  32. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    True. If Nadal was a contender for goat, the h2h could come into play, as it is, it doesn't. Live with it.
     
    #82
  33. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    The only essential criteria for GOAT is the Calendar Year Grand Slam. You need at least one of them.
     
    #83
  34. TheNatural

    TheNatural Legend

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    If Fed had a 6-2 record vs Nadal in slam finals he might be considered the best of this era instead of Nadal.
     
    #84
  35. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    None.

    Not only the past great players have Fed #1, but many journalists like Steve Flink placed Fed at the top.
     
    #85
  36. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    Care to explain why? Where are Federer's 200 titles like Laver or 8 years as the world's best player like Gonzales? You see, it would be false to say that Federer doesn't have challengers to the title of the Greatest of All Time. If you're going to talk about all time, then showing respect for past eras is paramount.

    I prefer to do the thinking for myself. A golden rule is never truly believe what you are told, only what you know.
     
    #86
  37. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    :roll:

    10agendaloadedthinkings
     
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  38. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    Funny stuff.
     
    #88
  39. Gangsta

    Gangsta Rookie

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    I already consider Federer the GOAT. But if he did have a winning H2H against Nadal, it would just make it that much clearer in my head. But, at the moment, that is not how it is. And if Nadal gets close to Federer's slam count, I would probably incline towards Nadal.
     
    #89
  40. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    he needs to have a winning h2h against his rival rafa, that is it, especially when you consider nadal is in the GOAT debate as well
     
    #90
  41. nadal2012uso2013ao

    nadal2012uso2013ao Banned

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    Laver has won the Calendar Year Grand Slam twice. If you want to contend with his all-time greatness, you need at least one Calendar Year Grand Slam. The reason I say this is because the Calendar Year Grand Slam is the most difficult feat in tennis, obviously.
     
    #91
  42. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    He is not really in the goat debate. Have you compared their respective records?
     
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  43. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    Federer has several records that are equally hard to obtain (if not, Nadal would probably have done it).
     
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  44. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    tell that to Rod laver, Pete Sampras and Borg who all agree Rafa is in the debate, you just have to look at how young rafa still is, he would have 14 by now if not for nole.
     
    #94
  45. Rippy

    Rippy Hall of Fame

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    Nadal needs to have a positive H2H against Rosol to be included in the GOAT debate.
     
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  46. TennisBatman

    TennisBatman Semi-Pro

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    In short, yes...

    As a true Federer fan, I really had high hopes for him to show his mastery (over Nadal) in the time spanning mid 2008 to early 2009, which covered Wimbledon 2008, Olympics 2008, US Open 2008, and Australian Open 2009.

    In hindsight, it was probably bad for Federer overall that he had a final against Andy Murray in 2008 US Open, as it denied him the chance to play Nadal there and redeem himself.

    But fortunes swing both ways, and Federer got one benefit in US Open 2008 (the title) at the expense of perhaps one missed opportunity (the chance to play Nadal there).

    His last stand in the rivalry with Nadal was in Australian Open 2009, and I believe at that point, the rivalry creaked against his favor (as the post-match ceremony revealed).

    I was really pulling for Federer to show himself in that match...
     
    #96
  47. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    Weren't all 3 of those guys part of TTC 100 Greatest players special where Rafa was not in the top 3 of all time and Roger was voted #1?

    I think they have spoken.

    Of course like you said Rafa is young and time can change things but as of now Rafa is not in the debate for GOAT.
     
    #97
  48. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    except rosol in not a contender for GOAT or rafa`s main rival unlike rafa is to Fed
     
    #98
  49. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    Yes potentially he could become a goat contender, but for now he is not.
     
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  50. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    Rafa is ahead of borg in that list and he is considered to be the greatest by many
     

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