Is Babolat just a fad?

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by BreakPoint, Oct 6, 2004.

  1. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Many pros use the PD because Babolat pays them big bucks to use it. Many people use the PD because they see the pros using it. Babolat, like Nike, is mainly a marketing company and they are both doing a great job at it. Yes, endorsements do work and they do influence the buying public's purchasing decisions. That's why some hot basketball players can command $100 million dollar endorsement deals from the likes of Nike, Reebok, or whomever. They sure have to sell a helluva lot of basketball shoes to earn back that $100M don't they.
     
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  2. backhand

    backhand Rookie

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    If we stopped trying to form arguments around which tennis god's stick is bigger, racquet choice seems like a simple cost benefit:

    Cost of the PD+ is that its volley and feel are lower. More work for the same outcome. Benefits are that its power and spin are higher. Less work for the same outcome. If the costs outweighed the benefits, no pro could afford to swing a PD+ for very long. Initial sponsorship notwithstanding, you gotta win matches once in a while.

    Same for amateurs, except that we can include intangible benefits like how our stick fits with our self image, or if we like the pro who uses a painted copy. And if that produces higher costs, like a bad fit to our skills, it's our pride, not our paychecks.

    Don't expect the equation to change - or all the Babolat users to "see the light" - because one player wins a lot of finals this season.
     
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  3. David Pavlich

    David Pavlich Professional

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    After reading all of this, I would like to invoke one of my favorite phrases: Paralysis by analysis.

    If one plays well with a specific frame then that's the frame that player should use.

    Is the PD a good frame? Yep. If it was garbage, it wouldn't be selling. It holds up well (sturdy) and does what it says it's going to do. However, it's subjective. I'm sure there are as many players out there that would say the St. Vincent is not a frame for them as there are that would say it's a great frame. A lousy frame? How sacreligious! But a 2.5 53 year old hacker would not think it's a very good frame because what it requires to make the frame work properly is not within the realm of his skills. So to that person, the frame is useless.

    And on it goes, that Babolat conundrum.

    David
     
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  4. NoBadMojo

    NoBadMojo G.O.A.T.

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    shane i think what the people like me who say 'it's the archer not the arrows' are referring to is that for say the average 3.5 player, the racquet sure isnt likely to make them into a better player. those players at that level who constantly change gear are really delaying their progress i believe, and the racquet really isnt that impt if it is something reasonable. 3.5s can afford to lose points because their gear isnt perfect for them because the people they play are giving them lots of cheap points, and each point is far less important. now if a pro or really anyone say 5.0 or better can find a great combo of racquet and string and pick up a small few points during a match because of having a great setup for them, then that is huge because points are alot more crucial at that level. they really are two different things i think. i dont condemn the pd+ because i dont happen to like it, i'm just stating the obvious that it just doesnt volley well and later say that it really doesnt matter so much anyway because the volley isnt in alot of peoples' shot selection arsenal anyway these days..i do confess to getting pleasure out of beating ranked pure drive bollitierri kids tho, who leave the court dragging their bab team bags behind them muttering something about how they cant believe some old guy thumped them :)
     
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  5. bcaz

    bcaz Professional

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    Big Boy, I gotta tell ya, having watched a lot of pro tennis (U.S. Open, Scottsdale) up close, the best players, and seeing lots of talented juniors here in Az and elsewhere, "show me the net?" ... I love the net, but I'm 50 and get blasted by younger players all too often ... many young players, if they love the net, will lose some teeth in the face of groundstrokes today. They stay back for a reason. I don't like it, but I'm not the one out there competing for a scholarship, or money ... let's hope it changes someday ... and as for the blanket comment about 98" sticks, I would suggest the C-10 Pro is among the best S&V racquets out there, although it won't be around much longer. The Yonex Ti-80 and the Head Prestige MP are are a couple of other 98" bats that are excellent all-court tools. Then again, if you aver actually examine or even measure the 98s against the 95s or even the 93s out there, there is very little difference. My gamers are 92s, but they seem to play larger than that, yet they are lethal at the net -- except against 99 mph bullets from a 25 year-old baseliner sporting a Pure Drive ...
     
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  6. badmice2

    badmice2 Rookie

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    Pure Fab? or is it Pure Crap? I'll let yall pick.
     
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  7. lacoster

    lacoster Professional

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    There are definitely trends in frame sales as far as pro player endorsements are concerned. As a former tennis shop clerk, we carried the Yonex Ultimum-Ti Frames with all the hype and marketing from Ultimum users Hingis, Seles, Kournikova, Krajicek, and Rios. But once they all suddenly decided to retire (or take up swimsuit modeling) at the same time, all the hype left and therefore our Yonex sales declined. During this time, our Babolat sales tripled (many thanks to Roddick, Clijsters, et al.) This caused us not to carry Yonex for the next couple of seasons .....until the RDX-Series came out. Now everyone wants them, but we didnt carry them until just recently to keep up with the huge demand from what our clientele saw this season from Hewitt, Johansson, Nalbandian, Dementieva, Vaidisova, etc. So yes, there are definitely huge market trends among racquet companies that are attributed to pro-tour performance.
    ________
    Herbal vaporizer reviews
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2011
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  8. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    I used to dislike Babolat. Mainly for the Pure Drive. But they've really grown on me. Best strings, grips and shoes in the industry.

    Definitely not a fad. Here to stay, evolving. A third of the ITF juniors and US college players use Babolat, so it's safe to say the future looks like a Babolat.
     
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  9. dave333

    dave333 Hall of Fame

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    Well since thread just back, Babolat definitely has a sound future. Though I don't use one, I've tried a PD, APD, and their cortex versions and absolutely loved them (too pricey for me though). 1/3 of my team uses a Bab, including the 1, 2, 3 players. Half the racquets my local club sells are babs and the rest are similar to babs (like surges, npro opens, etc.)
     
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  10. kanjii

    kanjii Semi-Pro

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    I thinks it's good racquet technology, not a fad...or there would be a bunch of Adidas Lendl GTX Pro-Ts out there, or McEnroe racquets during there #1 ranking years....during the Sampras and Agassi, there was probably a lot of racquets sold and that is also due to technology, not just that Roddick can't beat Fed.
     
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  11. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    Venus Williams, Lindsay Davenport, and others have had wrist injuries with Wilson racquets.

    The racquets of today are just not safe in general, in conjunction with the strings and hard courts. I discuss this in the topic linked in my signature.
     
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  12. dragonxking

    dragonxking Rookie

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    this is an 04' thread...
     
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  13. Noveson

    Noveson Hall of Fame

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    You're an idiot. Look at the stats at Wimbledon. Nadal came to the net FAR more times than Federer did. Guess who won? Maybe you could take your head out of your *** long enough to realize that Federer might be winning because he is better? Styles don't beat each other, players beat each other. I love how you try to put all of Babolat on Roddick. What about Clisters? She did pretty well for herself. Oh, also there's a guy named Nadal. He's beaten Fed a few times hasn't he? That's a baseliner if I ever saw one.

    By the way I have nothing against Federer or the S/V game. I'm actually an allcourter myself.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2007
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  14. staedtler

    staedtler Semi-Pro

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    I think initially Babolat was a fad, but they've grown enough to be a big time player in the market now. I dont think they will go away for awhile as long as they keep putting their racquets on the tour. I think Babolat and Tecnifibre are two companies that make a good compare and contrast. Both are French string companies that have decided to delve into racquets. One company got decently lucky and had their racquets found into some top players that won some Grand Slams. The other, Tecnifibre, has had trouble with the players they have been sponsoring. Tecnifibre has a decent stable of pros, but their results have only been decent.
     
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  15. RVCTennis

    RVCTennis New User

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    here in illinois you see very few babalats....however ncodes are a different story.. I know my coach two years ago( i was a junior in hs) got a very nice deal on ncodes and sold them to us for cheap. All of us on varsity for the last two years used them, and it was nice having a team match in every way. However, i have now switched to dunlop this summer and will be using dunlop for my college career. So as i can tell, it just depends where you live to what rackets are being played.
     
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  16. ohplease

    ohplease Professional

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    Way to bring back a dead thread.

    Still, it's telling that some fortune tellers proved to be totally and completely wrong in predicting the fortunes of Babolat.
     
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  17. socalstar

    socalstar Banned

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    so you make your racket choice depending on what other people are using at the time?
     
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  18. bluetrain4

    bluetrain4 Legend

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    An entire generation of kids have grown up with Babolat, and that wasn't the case with Vokyl (at least not in the US)

    I don't like most Babolat frames, and they seemed to get bashed on TW by old school tennis heads who think they have no feel. But, to kids who have used the the entire time they've played tennis, they feel normal.

    I'm guesing they'll be around for a long time.
     
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  19. Hey I grew up on a wooden racquet, think S&V should come back in a big way, and I think Babolat racquets are fantastic.
     
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  20. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    Me too. Same with Rod Laver....who of course, plays with a Babolat.
     
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  21. A.T.S.

    A.T.S. Semi-Pro

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    I buy babolat because the Pure Drive w/cortex suites my baseline puncher style.
     
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  22. Mr. Hokey

    Mr. Hokey Rookie

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    don't dig up old posts man...
     
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  23. Duzza

    Duzza Legend

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    Don't get me wrong. This thread is 2 years old and I haven't read any of it. But I think it is still pretty "hot" and will continue to be.

    I think Babolat make very solid racquet. I love the PD and would buy some if it wasn't for the weight (I CBF with lead tape) so I chose the Pure Control :)
     
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  24. pow

    pow Hall of Fame

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    Roddick used to use the POG? Mid or Oversize? Whoa!
     
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  25. travelerb

    travelerb New User

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    You realize BigboyDan made his post nearly 3 years ago right (and only about 6 months after Federer took over the #1 ranking from Roddick)?
     
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  26. NadalIsTheBest

    NadalIsTheBest New User

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    ding ding, we have a winner!
     
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  27. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    It's a fad built on marketing, but as with Nike that won't necessarily stop it from having longevity.

    It works well for a celebrity culture. Its so Babolah-de-dah.
     
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  28. cork_screw

    cork_screw Hall of Fame

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    Volkl was never at the same popularity as Babolat. Babolat is tested and it's been around since 2000. It would take some really f*ing up to mess up something that's been established for going on 13 years. Volkl was more used by older skilled players, but not so much on tour. Babolat spreads its popularity with young and old. Young guys love it and older guys also love it for the easy access to power. It's used by doubles and singles and they have all these ridiculous technologies that could go on forever. Seriously they don't even need evidence of a technology anymore. Has anyone here ever questioned what GT did? What is GT? Fibers? Really? And the 2012 Roddick, what technology is going on there? They didn't even bother to come up with one because they're just wanna see how much they can get away with. Black paint, I guess that's the next great technology.

    Yeah, they're not even trying anymore and they still make money. If anything Babolat is becoming the overpaid cop who just sits in his squad car all day and whacks off to porn on his iphone while also getting off that he'll be collecting pension and full benefits in retirement in the next few years .
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2012
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  29. Rock Strongo

    Rock Strongo Legend

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    This was an interesting bump...

    Babolat's been popular since they first came out with the Pure Drive back in 1994 thanks to Moya. I wouldn't call 19 years of popularity a fad.

    BTW, the PDGT was weirdly superb at net...
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2012
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  30. vsbabolat

    vsbabolat Legend

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    Babolat has had racquets since 1994 and tennis strings since 1875......................
     
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  31. bear

    bear New User

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    No Fad, Dad

    Well, I don't know if Volkl was "all the rage" like you say it was. Because Babolat was out then! The reason Babolat frames are so popular is because they are great frames. The AeroPro and Pure Drive are not like any other standard designed frames with box frame construction. Even the Babolat frames like the Pure Storms are uniquely designed box construction frames. Those frame molds that Babolat designed are one of a kind. No other frame manufacturer has ever designed a frame like a Babolat. Second, Babolat has designed the frame for modern stroke production. Remember the days when the teaching pro would teach like this: "Get your racquet back and down. Step to the ball. Cross over with your foot. Swing to the point of contact. Now follow thru..." and that follow thru was some wack job salute to the sun where the frame stayed perfectly vertical and kept going straight up. That is called old school. Those days are gone. Modern stroke production means that the racquet is stalking the ball out in front of your body. The stroke moves in a circular arm motion and the frame head drops below the ball and brushes it from low to high and the frame goes over the shoulder for the follow thru. That is modern stroke production. Babolat was designed for the modern stroke of topspin power tennis. They are also the premier manufacturer of natural gut. The company has a heritage. No fad there.
     
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  32. vsbabolat

    vsbabolat Legend

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    Babolat was the premier manufacturer of natural gut until they ruined the gut with BT7. Also the design of the Pure Drive is very similar design of the ProKennex Destiny line that came out in 1989.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2012
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  33. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

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    Well said. I agree.
     
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  34. Top Jimmy

    Top Jimmy Semi-Pro

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    Wow, some of you anti-Babolat people are plain stupid. I've played for 25+ years and I've owned Rossignols (F series), Dunlops (200g, 4d tour), Wilsons (ultra FPK, Profile, PS85, Jack Kramer, K90, KBlade) Heads (Radicals, prestige's), Pro Kennex, Prince (90, Response 90, CTS Graduate), etc and have recently owned a APD GT and it's a very nice racket. It volley's very well regardless what many of you say is only a baseline basher's stick.

    If you get tennis elbow because of the "horrible Babolat rackets", maybe your form is junk. Played a year with one, not so much an ounce of pain from it.

    Just reading some of you know it all's makes this forum unbearable some days.
     
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  35. bear

    bear New User

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    Well Said

    The only thing that should be well said is that just because it is legal in some states doesn't mean you should smoke it. It was a shame in that region of NoCal. They were so far gone that they thought we were created by space aliens. Maybe some also have their underground shelters because today is the end of the world. So much for those old schoolers. Real denial is longer than the river in Egypt...
     
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  36. Power Player

    Power Player Talk Tennis Guru

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    I love old posts like this.

    Hilarious.

    Owned by time.
     
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  37. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Babolat is just another racquet manufacturer with better marketing than the rest.

    Their signature racquets are stiff, widebody racquets which are good examples of their type despite the build quality.
     
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  38. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    Old thread, still relevant? Hmmm.
    Babolat never was a 'fad' brand. I don't think it'll ever be.

    Despite vsbabolat's bad news about BT7 (I like it and cannot tell the difference when paired with poly crosses), I still think of Babolat as the best gut...who happen to now market a solid line of racquets and the best shoes ever.

    Not sure how they did it, but hats off. I'm a Babolat customer as long as they keep making the Storm Tour, the great leather grips and natural gut, hurricane at a decent price, the Propulse, the SFX, and the nice thick wristbands with the tiny logo.

    This past week, I tried the new APD with the different cortex. Normally, I'm not into this type of frame, but this is a good one.
     
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  39. db10s

    db10s Hall of Fame

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    Yeah.... And all this thread does is get revived every 3-5 years...... Odd.
     
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  40. raging

    raging Professional

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    vs you are right on both counts but in the late 80s they had little choice.The natural gut market was under threat from polys & Babolat took the opportunity with the Pro Kennex racket. I was a sale agent for Head & Babolat at this time & can tell you how tough it was.
    Things had to change & they did.
    I also played the Prestige Classic & used VS Gut & it was great!
    Then I got older...:oops:
     
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  41. teocem

    teocem New User

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    Babolat versus others

    In my tennis bag there is a Pure Drive 2012 and a Wilson Blade 98 16x19 2013.
    I may be hitting exactly the same shot with same power and trajectory with them, but ther is a difference; with Babolat I do not feel much, with Blade I sense it all the way...
    I could give another more interesting example, but I am sure most can predict it and I of course can not dare to ;-)
     
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  42. Winners or Errors

    Winners or Errors Hall of Fame

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    All things we buy are fads. How many products that were "hot" 20 years ago are hot today?

    As to whether or not Babolat is simply an excellent marketing company or makes usable tennis racquets, I have to say, as I've said before, that I see more than kids using Babolats. Everyone I play with regularly is over 40, many of them play with what I think of as ridiculously stiff, over-powered Babolats, and can only think of one who is having arm trouble he believes is related to racquet stiffness. The others are fine.

    Many people like Babolats. It's not just kids. In fact, I can't think of any kids I ever see on the public courts where I play, but I see a lot of Babolats.
     
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  43. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    All makes have a 'drive' line of racquet, but they were the first to make it fashionable so they have the lead and have done well to keep it.

    Its not just the stiffness that has been an historical issue with the brand, but the woofer grommets as well.

    Five years ago the consensus was that they gave the racquet not only no feel but also too much of a trampoline effect whereas nowadays it is a complaint seldom heard.

    The lively powerful stringbed has an immediate attractiveness to it - a bit like a sugar hit.
     
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  44. themitchmann

    themitchmann Hall of Fame

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    The Pure Storm is hardly a revelation. Not sure why you think no one else has produced a frame like Babolat...I've seen plenty of frames that have had similar features to the Control/Storms and the Pure Drives. Sure, their molds are original, but so are molds from other brands.

    Their popularity has a lot to do with marketing, how the company is run, and the shift in playing styles. I'm not disagreeing that they are a solid company, I just don't completely agree with some of your points.
     
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  45. dyldore

    dyldore Rookie

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    That is the biggest difference to me. More younger players, myself included, play like nadal or roddick than sampras or federer. Even then Babolat makes rackets with smaller heads and thinner beams, they are just not as popular.
     
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  46. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    Sampras likes a Babolat. Laver uses one.
    If Federer used the Babolat Storm Tour I use, he'd still be one heck of a player.

    I might be understating this a little bit, but I feel too many players make too many generalizations about racquet brands and playing styles. This is nothing new in tennis. It's just intensified since the 90s.

    To wit: Tsonga, who you'd think might enjoy a flexible, headlight, Becker-esque frame seems to have been playing some great, attacking tennis with a racquet that resembles that of Nadal.

    Then you've got Monfils, who plays with a thin-beam, but plays a great deal of defense from behind the baseline.

    Are the exceptions just brothas from France? Hmmm.

    DelPotro uses a 95 mid profile Wilson Pro Staff that is not too far off the specs of a Babolat Pure Control/Storm Tour.

    Gasquet uses a Head, but it's a little like a Pure Drive in terms of beam width and headsize.

    Nole and Muzzer do not play much like Fed or Sampras, but they use thin beamed sticks with headsizes in the 90s.

    Anyway, much ado about nothing. I just hope people find what they're looking for.
     
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  47. rst

    rst Rookie

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    Babolat has been the "hot" brand to be seen using.......

    do a number of professioanal players use babolat...for fad-ee-ness??
     
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  48. rst

    rst Rookie

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    ther is a difference;..............


    thank goodness
     
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  49. rst

    rst Rookie

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    "...was made for leisure-women's playing."

    Enough said.


    DOESNT ANY MARKETER HOPE THEIR PRODUCT WILL GO BEYOND THEIR MADE FOR MARKET??
     
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  50. pshulam

    pshulam Hall of Fame

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    Now and future .. "Our racquets are designed for power, spin control, and precision .. the new names are Pure Power, Pure Spin, Pure Precision, Pure Magic, .. Pure Iron, Pure thunder, Pure luck" :):):)
     

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