Is Davydenko really the 4th Best in the world.

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by andyroddick1, Sep 20, 2007.

  1. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Yeah to beat Federer you must take it high to his backhand or just do better what he does which isn't likely. Djokovic might eventually be able to do better than Federer does but not for a while.
     
    #51
  2. Alex132

    Alex132 Guest

    Davy is awesome, like everyone said he does works extra HARD to keep his spot, even tho he looses against top players most of the time. You have to give him the credit tho, he is just that good :)
     
    #52
  3. edmondsm

    edmondsm Legend

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    Ditto. If the guy can play every week of the year and make a couple GS semis along the way why shouldn't he be the number 4 player. It wasn't that long ago that that would have gotten you to #2 or even #1 in the world.
     
    #53
  4. Chang

    Chang Rookie

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    Davydenko is underrated. i think he's quite good. Sure, he doesn't have very much power but tennis isn't all about power. He gets beat by some of the top 10 players but he's still more consistent. he plays a lot of tournaments because he has the physical stamina. He won the matches required so he deserves the top 4
     
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  5. seestern

    seestern Rookie

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    Right now, plx dont compare Roddick and Nadal. Forget clay, Nadal is much better than him on grass, and how to H2H on hard courts?
     
    #55
  6. seestern

    seestern Rookie

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    I can say Davy has a shot at a GS if the top three somehow strike bc of whatever reason from APT :D
    Roddick???, I say NO
    saw him play in USO 2007, if not Fed, who could own him that easily????
     
    #56
  7. anointedone

    anointedone Banned

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    Bingo! It is like people talk about how bad people seem to play vs Nadal. Well Nadal is so hard to play well against since he hits such a heavy ball and he makes the court seem small with his defensive prowess. Roddick is easy to have nice clean stats against, the hardest part is weathering all the free points from his serve, and not allowing that one lapse game to lose you the set.
     
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  8. 0d1n

    0d1n Hall of Fame

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    I try not to use terms like "sucks" or "stinks" when talking about pro tennis players simply because I know that being even in the top 500 in the WORLD is an incredible achievement. I know this because I've been beaten too many times by players who ARE NOT world class players by any stretch of the imagination.
    I take your point, nobody in the top 10 is average per se...otherwise they wouldn't be top 10. However...his GAME is average or even bellow average (FOR A PRO TENNIS PLAYER !) on all surfaces except hard court. That's ALL I can give you ;), if you don't agree...that's life ... I think we can both live with disagreeing on this particular point.
    PS (this is not for you Eviscerator ... from your posts I've seen enough to know you don't require this type of clarification ... but some DO :p)
    I hope everybody here understands that using even terms like "average" in the context of Blake...or any pro tennis player is NOT EQUIVALENT to using it when comparing with regular people ... hence please don't come back with replies like "are you good enough to beat x and y pro"? I'm perfectly capable of understanding that I'm probably not good enough to take a single game from somebody ranked even in the top 1000 ...
     
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  9. 0d1n

    0d1n Hall of Fame

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    Same can be said about Davydenko

    Funny how you can see that when it comes to Roddick but not when it comes to Davydenko. Please have a look at this...a pretty solid argument can be made with the fact that for all you know Davydenko could have won 3 grand slams and some Master Series events if Federer wouldn't exist (the same can be said about other people as well :rolleyes: ).
    Have a look at this please :


    ATP, Davis Cup and Grand Slam Main Draw Results 2007
    US Open NY, U.S.A.
    Hard
    S
    Federer
    7-5 6-1 7-5
    Stats
    2007

    Roland Garros France
    Clay
    S
    Federer
    7-5 7-6(5) 7-6(7)
    Stats
    2006

    US Open NY, U.S.A.
    Hard
    S
    Federer
    6-1 7-5 6-4
    Stats
    2006

    Australian Open Australia
    Hard
    Q
    Federer
    6-4 3-6 7-6(7) 7-6(5)
    Stats
    2005

    ATP Masters Series Hamburg
    Germany
    Clay
    S
    Federer
    6-3 6-4
    Stats

    This info is from Davydenko's head to head against Federer. Care to count the important matches he lost to Federer ... all or most of which were in HUGE tournaments ???

    Are you suggesting that Federer "brings his F game" when playing Davy and his A game when playing Rodick ?? Care to back that up with something ... anything???!
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2007
    #59
  10. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

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    I think Davydenko has a better shot at the French than Roddick has at the US Open.
     
    #60
  11. fps

    fps Legend

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    I think Davy would have a better shot at a GS than Roddick in a Federerless draw.
     
    #61
  12. Thor

    Thor Professional

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    Mentally the weakest top 10 player.
    I have never seen anyone choke so much as Davy while playing fed.
    In the last 3 matches he served for sets several times,had amazing opening to the set(4:0) and played some amzing tennis only to be beaten in straight sets.
    He has game,but IMO he's the biggest choker on tour.
     
    #62
  13. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    And I agree.
     
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  14. Sliceboy2

    Sliceboy2 Rookie

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    I had the same thoughts, He has a more solid consistency on the baseline which makes a big difference on clay.
     
    #64
  15. 0d1n

    0d1n Hall of Fame

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    You said it ... I agree.
     
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  16. Rodditha

    Rodditha Banned

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    That is nonesence, Davydenko is a useless player, he
    can only win low tourneys except a GS and MS. Roddick still has a shot at all tourneys except on clay. Can someone on this forum bet all their money on Davydenko to win the Tennis Masters Cup ?
     
    #66
  17. MEAC_ALLAMERICAN

    MEAC_ALLAMERICAN Legend

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    Can you bet all your money on Roddick winning the Masters Cup?
     
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  18. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

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    Look I appreciate that obviously you don't like him and want to support Roddick but that is a pretty stupid thing to say.
    You don't go back-to-back to slam semis by being useless.
     
    #68
  19. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    Davydenko is a better indoor player than Roddick.
     
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  20. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    Davydenko won Paris last year. That's a Master Series.
    Roddick won Master Series too.

    Davydenko has as much shot at ALL tourneys just like Roddick. In fact, Nikolay is better on grass than Roddick on clay. And that's a biiiiig claim.
     
    #70
  21. AAAA

    AAAA Hall of Fame

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    The computer rankings are determined by how many points a player has earned. A player who is forth on the list has the forth most points. Being ranked 4th doesn't and never has implied the player has the forth best chance of winning any given tournament after the 3 players ranked 1,2, and 3.
     
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  22. tennis_hand

    tennis_hand Hall of Fame

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    maybe not No 4. but at least better than the roddick basher.
     
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  23. phoony

    phoony Banned

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    Although he got the most boring games on tour but he can play. A lot and much more better than Roddick. At least he know how to volley.
     
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  24. z-money

    z-money Semi-Pro

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    Davydenko plays way more tournaments than anyone else on tour, and he loses in the first round about 8 times a year. If he only played 17 or 20 instead of 27 tournys a year he wouldnt be in the top 10. cause he would miss out on points. He is a good return of server that is the only category in which you can put him in the top ten. and even then he is about the 5th best overall returner, the only reason he is that high is his break point conversion %. but he cant hold, be would be an older smaller version of murray so id say no. and the reason he is is cause he plays 7 more tournaments than the average top 50 player.
     
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  25. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

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    So what, the amount he plays could be the reason he sometimes loses early. Davy plays a lot because he prefers it to practicing. Perhaps Roddick would lose early too if he had such a heavy schedule. Davy earned his points and he's done better at the majors this year than Roddick which is the main reason he's ranked above him.
     
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  26. DashaandSafin

    DashaandSafin Hall of Fame

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    Davy lost to Kolshriber.
     
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  27. andyroddick1

    andyroddick1 Rookie

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    This is what I am talking about. Roddick doesn't lose to unknowns anymore.
    (Dancevic is exception)He does get upset a few times, but it isn't against someone who people generally think has no chance against the guy. If he gets upset, it is against a guy who we all know has the the capability to beat him.
     
    #77
  28. superman1

    superman1 Legend

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    I'll still take Roddick over him. Rankings aren't perfect because a lot of it depends on where you are in the draw relative to Federer. If Roddick was on the other half of the draw in the US Open, we wouldn't have this thread.
     
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  29. rod99

    rod99 Professional

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    huh? davydenko has probably the worst volley of anyone in the top 50. roddick's volleys are not great but they're much better than davydenko's. however davydenko's groundstrokes and movement are light years ahead of roddick's.
     
    #79
  30. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Roddick loses to everyone on clay. haha
     
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  31. J-man

    J-man Hall of Fame

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    Nethier Roddick or Davydenko are that great #4's in the world in my opinion. But Roddick does better against the top 5 players in the world then Davydenko, but Davydenko does not have the serve of Roddick. For what Davydenko is he has done some great things.
     
    #81
  32. saram

    saram Legend

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    Your credibility within this thread is gone. You are so far in support of Andy that you do not see the forest for the trees.

    Davy does have a better shot at the FO than Andy at the US. Sorry, others stated it prior and I agree whole-heartedly.
     
    #82
  33. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    I wouldn't go that far. It's just that Davydenko is better on hard courts than Roddick on clay.
     
    #83
  34. anointedone

    anointedone Banned

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    I guess the question would be does Roddick have a better shot to beat Federer at the U.S Open, then Davydenko does Nadal at the French Open. Or perhaps even more accurately does Roddick have a better shot to beat Federer, and either 1 or 2 out of Djokovic, Nadal, Davydenko, at the U.S Open as Davydenko does both Nadal and Federer at the French Open.

    To that the answer is not an easy one. Both are pretty close to nothing.
     
    #84
  35. coloskier

    coloskier Legend

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    If you watched Davy play Kohlschreiber today you would see just how bad DAvys serve is. He has top 5 movement, top 10 strokes, and a top 100 serve.
     
    #85
  36. WhiteSox05CA

    WhiteSox05CA Hall of Fame

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    Davydenko is pretty good! Is that Joko Joke really a #3? Roddick is SICK, he deserves #2 at least.
     
    #86
  37. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Lmao. Roddick deserves what he gets. He is nothing but a serve.
     
    #87
  38. iamke55

    iamke55 Professional

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    Top 100 serve is pushing it. It's stupid to judge players by the ranking of their individual strokes, and these one-aspect ranks are probably way exaggerating how good a shot is, because there are probably hundreds of one-shot specialists floating around the top 1000 who have one shot better than many top 10 players but the rest of their game isn't 7.0. Just look at Isner, he's probably tied with Roddick as having the second best serve after Karlovic yet he's barely been on the tour for a few months, so do you really think there are less than 100 one-dimensional pros in the top 1000 and college level who serve better than Davydenko?
     
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  39. callitout

    callitout Professional

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    Davydenko, Semi's at RG,USO; 1/4 at AO, R16 at Wimby.

    Blake R16 USO, AO, R32 Wimby, R128 RG

    Roddick Semi's AO, 1/4 Wimby,USO, R128 RG

    Ferrer Semi's USO, R16 AO, R32 RG, R64 Wimby

    So Davydenko's results in GS are the better than the guys ranked below him. It's not simply that he gets ranking points by playing small tournaments.

    If you go with head to head results then Rafa should be ranked ahead of Fed. But most people go with the results in tournaments, and majors are accorded the most weight.
     
    #89
  40. andyroddick1

    andyroddick1 Rookie

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    Yeah, but if it was a Roddick, Davy semi, Roddick would go through at the USO.
     
    #90
  41. TenZero

    TenZero New User

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    Davy deserves his number 4 position. Mainly because he is number 4; that should be enough.

    Don't get me wrong. I'm a Roddick fan, but get over it; he's number 5.
     
    #91
  42. icazares

    icazares Rookie

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    Of course he's #4. Remember how close he was to defeat Nadal in Rome (in my mind the best match of 2007 along with the Wimby final). He's probably #3in clay (after the obvious 2) and probably #4 in hardcourts (semis at USOpen in last 2 editions losing to Fed). Regarding his rivalry with Blake, I dare to say that going forward the rivalry will reverse. Regarding Roddick, Roddick will never defeat Davydenko in clay and I actually think that he has a chance in hardcourts. I must add that, as the short guy that I am, I profuse admiration for any top player shorter than 6 feet..
     
    #92
  43. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    I'd give it to Roddick since he already won the US Open but both probably have no chance of doing that.
     
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  44. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

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    Look pretty soon there will be threads asking 'Is Nadal really the 2nd Best in the world' if he goes on another one of his lengthy final droughts, so be ready.
     
    #94
  45. lambielspins

    lambielspins Banned

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    Lets see. Compare their games:

    Serve-Roddick
    Return of Serve-Davydenko
    Forehand-Davydenko
    Backhand-Davydenko
    Volley-Even
    Movement-Davydenko
    Mental Game-Davydenko

    I think Davydenko wins out there.


    Grand Slam results:

    Australian Open- semis Roddick, quarters Davydenko
    French Open- semis Davydenko, first round Roddick
    Wimbledon- quarters Roddick, 4th round Davydenko
    U.S Open- semis Davydenko, quarters Roddick

    Davydenko comes out ahead here too I think.


    Masters titles in the last year: Davydenko-1, Roddick-0

    Davydenko comes out ahead here too.

    Titles in the last year: Davydenko-2, Roddick-2. Dead even here.

    Conclusion. Yes Davydenko indeed deserves to be ranked #4 ahead of Roddick. He has the better overall game, better overall results, and that is just the way it is.
     
    #95
  46. saram

    saram Legend

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    glad someone took the time to break it down. well done.
     
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  47. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    Roddick won Cincinatti last year. And according to ATPtennis.com, that was the only title he won last year.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2007
    #97
  48. lambielspins

    lambielspins Banned

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    It was a pleasure.
     
    #98
  49. lambielspins

    lambielspins Banned

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    Yes he did, but that is now not in the past year. We are now more then a year past that, so he still has no Masters title in the past year. When I said "last year" I meant the past 12 months, from this past now last year to today.
     
    #99
  50. 93sq.

    93sq. Semi-Pro

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    Playing davydenko is like play with a wall.....
    So blind hitters like andry roddick are disarmed against him if they are not in their best shape...
     

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