Is Djokovic Really a Bad Matchup for Nadal?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Murrayfan31, Sep 22, 2013.

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Is Djokovic a bad matchup?

  1. Yes. Bad matchup.

    30.4%
  2. No. Nadal is a bad matchup for Djokovic.

    21.4%
  3. Neutral

    48.2%
  1. Death Master

    Death Master Banned

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    the old "matchup" excuse again.

    try convincing the top 30 players of that. they ALL have a losing record against nadal.
     
    #51
  2. Goosehead

    Goosehead Hall of Fame

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    they take it in turns to "have a party" inside each others head..:)

    and this year its mainly been rafa "having a party" inside djokovic's head.
     
    #52
  3. Murrayfan31

    Murrayfan31 Hall of Fame

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    Matchups are based on how a players strengths and weaknesses compare with the opponent. To me, Djokovic plays too passive to be a bad matchup for Nadal. Nadal dictates the outcome. Though he obviously has to play at a high level to win.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
    #53
  4. aldeayeah

    aldeayeah Hall of Fame

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    delete post
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
    #54
  5. reversef

    reversef Hall of Fame

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    Djokovic is a bad matchup for Nadal and he has always been. When Nadal plays his best tennis and Djokovic only plays very well, it's still very close. The fact that Nadal can win the most important points when he's the most confident, on form player doesn't change that fact: Nadal has always had tons of problems with Djokovic's game. Djokovic's incredible backhand and return, his ability to take the ball on the rise, to change direction at will and his ability to grind almost as well as Nadal make him a terrible match up:
    - he's not very vulnerable to high top spin balls
    - he can stay with Nadal in the rallies and find Nadal's backhand while no other player could
    - he constantly puts Nadal under pressure on his serve

    He's a very bad match up for Nadal, and every tennis fan knew that much before 2011. But of course, Nadal can win against him, just like Federer can win against Nadal, despite the matchup.
     
    #55
  6. victorcruz

    victorcruz Semi-Pro

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    I'm more neutral, but I'll admit this. Nadal owns everyone, but Djokovic makes him work the hardest.
     
    #56
  7. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    people throw around this :bad matchup " thing like its water. Just because Joker gives Nadal a hard time doesnt make it a bad matchup! Its just good competition.....something That Federer is not able to give Nadal since 2008.

    a bad matchup excists when there is something weird going on.....like the #1 player in the world keeps losing to the #200 player. Sort of like Safin vs Santoro.
     
    #57
  8. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    :confused:

    Great post. The answer to the OP.
     
    #58
  9. ripitup

    ripitup Banned

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    That is only since Djokovic fanboys seem to have perpetuated a myth Djokovic has never played his best tennis vs Nadal, and Nadal plays his best tennis everytime he has ever played Djokovic. Such is not reality. Tell me even one occasion Nadal played his very best and even "barely beat" Djokovic. Other than maybe 1 or 2 of their hard court matches during Djokovic's 13 months of dominance.

    I laugh for instance reading Djokovic fans claiming the French Open semis this year was Nadal's best vs a subpar Djokovic. What a joke, Nadal has probably played 200 matches on clay in his career better than that one, and Djokovic probably only about 7 better than that one. Nadal still should have won it in 4 sets max. Even on clay Djokovic fanboys have deluded themselves and even managed to delude a few of the dumber and more naive non Djokovic fanboys that Djokovic's best tennis is better than Nadal's. 8 French Opens vs 0 and something like a 15-3 clay head to head notwithstanding.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
    #59
  10. Tenez101

    Tenez101 Hall of Fame

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    Novak was outplaying Rafa in the second set and pretty much choked away the match by blowing 0-40 at 4 all in the third. Ask Nadal himself whether he thought that was an easy match.
     
    #60
  11. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    Oh, it hasn't been because of stamina that Rafa has beaten Djokovic this year (or last)

    Well, that is one way to think of a match up problem, other people here have come up with other concepts.
     
    #61
  12. 5555

    5555 Hall of Fame

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    It's a factual statement.
     
    #62
  13. Sid_Vicious

    Sid_Vicious G.O.A.T.

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    He can definitely get on Nadal's nerves more than anybody else, but he does not have that much of an edge to call it a bad matchup.
     
    #63
  14. Murrayfan31

    Murrayfan31 Hall of Fame

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    Most would agree Nadal was a bad matchup for Federer. It doesn't take something weird ranking to see that. Federer did better against the rest of the tour. But once they played each other, Nadal was able to exploit a weakness in Fed's game. Most other players were able to handle the high backhand. But Fed struggled with it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2013
    #64
  15. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    Nadal has always been a bad match-up for Federer like Fed was for Roddick and Hewitt and others.
     
    #65
  16. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    No .....Nadal is just better because Federer refuses to change his game.

    Nadal on the other hand adapted to beat Joker.
     
    #66
  17. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    How to differentiate being better from a matchup problem?

    Any player loosing to other player can not pull up the matchup card.

    A matchup issue is indicated when an otherwise clearly lesser accomplished player consistently gets much better results against a more successful one.

    Like, Nadal and Roger. Roger could whip the guys Nadal used to loose to. Nadal would bow out in Semis or earlier and Roger would make finals. But Nadal would beat Roger. THAT'S a matchup issue.

    Same goes for Nadal Davydenko.

    But Gasquet can't say that Nadal and Djoker are bad matchups for him.
     
    #67
  18. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    personally i like the Safin vs Santoro example.

    Safin is 2-7 against Santoro.
     
    #68
  19. Murrayfan31

    Murrayfan31 Hall of Fame

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    So it looks like most agree it is a neutral matchup. The better player at the time usually wins. If anything Djokovic has found it easier than Nadal against other players in general. Breaking them at will.
     
    #69
  20. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    Yes,

    Djokovic Nadal is as close to a balanced rivalry as you get. For no match can the winner be predicted with confidence.
     
    #70
  21. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    Rafa wasn't on his prime on hc then though.
     
    #71

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