is it really that easy to get a Wild Card into a Challenger?

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by jmnk, Jun 29, 2013.

  1. jmnk

    jmnk Professional

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    I'm confused.

    According to the order of play for Nielsen Pro Challenger posted here:

    http://nielsenprotennis.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/saturday-order-of-play.pdf

    one of the participant with the wild card is Rajendra Kedam. A quick check on USTA tennislink shows that he plays in NTPR 4.0 tournaments:

    https://tennislink.usta.com/Tournaments/Rankings/RankingHome.aspx?Page=PlayerRecord&ID=1220886&P=105&Type=viewranklist&C=&FirstName=&MiddleName=&LastName=&Year=&PlayerID=WqaaG0aln8uhV6b4%2fZEbzA%3d%3d

    so, I have two questions;
    1) is it really possible that a player with NTPR 4.0 ranking gets a wild card into a regular Challenger event?
    2) what do I make out of it if he actually won a set in a qualifying round (meaning that while he lost the first round qualifying match, he was not that entirely overmatched)
     
    #1
  2. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    That's just the pre-tournament 1st qualifying round is it not? He would have had to have had to won all 4 rounds in qualifying to have got into the main draw but lost in the 1st round of qualifying.

    His background is likely to be from abroad as he has no USTA record prior to this year and is probably just using the NTRP tournaments to find his level. Not uncommon. But he'll be higher than 4.0 given that he's winning all his matches at that level pretty easily, but he's clearly not at challenger level.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2013
    #2
  3. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    Look at this page and select mens 4.0 singles then click his name in the draw and you get a larger record of his tournaments

    http://tennislink.usta.com/Tournaments/TournamentHome/Tournament.aspx?T=133108

    It looks like he plays open (although it's not like he wins them all) and then he has a couple 4.0 tournies thrown in where he hasn't lost a set except when he withdrew. Perhaps where he is there isn't much tennis and the organizers allow him to play 4.0 sometimes (assuming there isn't anything higher at those tournies)

    Still looks a little weak to be getting a wildcard into a futures ... but maybe someone who knows a little more can shed some light.
     
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  4. josofo

    josofo Semi-Pro

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    I have told this story before. A local 5.0 showed up at the challenger and asked to get in (the quailes) they let him in and he lost 6-0 6-3 to a young dimitri tursenov
     
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  5. jmnk

    jmnk Professional

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    Exactly the point. Judging from his official USTA results it seems he is not really close to a challenger level player. So why would the organizers give him WC? This is a tournament in the Chicago suburb. One would think there's plenty of players form colleges nearby, no?

    yes indeed. plus this is a Challenger, a step above futures. (And he actually did lose sets in those 4.0 NTPR tournaments).

    I suppose that must be it. I still can't believe that organizers of a Challenger in Chicago suburb can't fill the qualifying draw with players with at least established college results.
     
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  6. asusundevils1971

    asusundevils1971 Rookie

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    I suppose that must be it. I still can't believe that organizers of a Challenger in Chicago suburb can't fill the qualifying draw with players with at least established college results.[/QUOTE]

    Maybe they just want to fill the qualifying draw up. Take his free money and let the guy play one round in the qualifying. No harm and no foul..
     
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  7. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Agreed. It's not a big deal. Maybe another player pulled out at short notice and they needed to fill a spot in the qualifying rounds with other reserve players not being available. And maybe they were unsure of his level as his playing history is mostly abroad. There are tournaments all over the place, and you're always occasionally have the odd person who's at the wrong level. No big deal.
     
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  8. Rob_C

    Rob_C Hall of Fame

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    #8
  9. Milan

    Milan Rookie

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    There's no money in Qualies anyways, who cares?

    And, to get a Wild Card in the Main Draw isn't hard either.. it's called "paying under the table" and happens every weeek,.
     
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  10. coolschreiber

    coolschreiber Semi-Pro

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    Wow! A 5.0 took 3 games of Tursunov??? I find that hard to believe, that dude must be above 5.0.
     
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  11. rajah84

    rajah84 Semi-Pro

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    If you knew Tursunov when he was younger you'd believe it.
     
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  12. Doubles

    Doubles Hall of Fame

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    Mental problems? Inconsistency? I find it hard (though not impossible) to believe Tursunov would drop even 3 games to a 5.0.
     
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  13. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    i'd guess he wasn't very focused since he knew the opponent was no threat to him.
     
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  14. josofo

    josofo Semi-Pro

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    this is what the guy said when i asked him about it 8 years later.


    i remember the first time i posted this, there was some debate about how flukey it is for a 5.0 to lose a set 6-3 to a pro. i thought it was more of a natural part of the game of tennis (people dont focus quite as well when they are winning so easily) . the tt forum thought it was more of a complete fluke.
     
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  15. kedam

    kedam New User

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    hello

    Hi there,

    I am the one you guys are talking about, well idk how i play, but i practice harder and train harder want to become a ranked tennis player , since the before night , i didn't know that i can play that tournament and that is my first tournament and i scared alot otherwise i would easily win the first round. Ok coming to the point, acctually they gave me a oppurtunity to play with one of the ranked 190 faruk dustov for practice hitting partner and i practice in the same courts to, so i went to there , i did practiced with him and he told me, hey for qualifying any one can sign in, go and sign in there are less people, so you might play, then i went to there and i did sign in, so less players and i got a chance and even i asked them before they didnt responded back to me. I lost my hope at all , atleast i can practice and i gonna know how they play and all those stuff , luckyly got a chance and played and even after that, i mail to another director for another challenger they said , if there are less people in sign in for qualies, we will take you, but i didnt go. I know i have good game that, i can play with guys like 190 and others, but i am smart , still learning, i hope, its clear for everyone. Nothing offence , but even i do understand about others thinking about me. I am happy. Looking forward. See guys, idk who you guys are but just sharing, my dream is to get into top 100, but idk i can make it or not. But working on it. Thank you guys.
     
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  16. kedam

    kedam New User

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    any questions or any suggestion , please free to ask.
     
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  17. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    I was once asked to sign up for an Open because they needed the money. I was told that at least I would get to play 1 match.
     
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  18. Aurellian

    Aurellian Semi-Pro

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    Good luck to you.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2013
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  19. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    May I ask how old you are and how long you have been playing?
     
    #19
  20. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Hall of Fame

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    Anyone can sign in, but you can't be directly entered into ATP World Tour or Challenger Tour events without a wildcard if you don't have a ranking. That tournament did not have a full qualifying sign in, so if that is the case, the tournament director can decide to give wildcards to unranked players to fill up more of the draw. But, without a wildcard into qualifying, he could not get in without a ranking, and had there been a full draw sign-in for qualifying, it would have been a lot harder for him to get a wildcard.
     
    #20
  21. kedam

    kedam New User

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    I am 26, playing from my 6, started seriously about three ago. for real. Yeah any can sign in, even if you have ranking or non ranking you know.
     
    #21
  22. kedam

    kedam New User

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    you can enter into any qualifying, unless if they dont have any players, i told you, i knew before the 5 pm on the day of sign in and this guy told me and i went to there and i did it. But I dont know about ATP 250 and above, remaining its depends upon your luck.
     
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  23. kedam

    kedam New User

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    while you wanna go to challengers, you just have think like , i am going to there to pratice or hitting with them, if i get a chance ,then its my time, simple and age is not a big deal, its all you.
     
    #23
  24. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Hall of Fame

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    You can sign in, yes. But without an ATP ranking, you are not eligible to play in Qualifying or Main Draw of an ATP World Tour or Challenger Tour event without receiving a wildcard. In this case, even though not 32 players signed into qualifying, it is up to the discretion of the Tournament Director to grant additional wildcards to unranked players. If the Tournament Director did not grant wildcards to unranked players, you would not have been allowed to play.
     
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  25. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Hall of Fame

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    Here's the rule, for those that are interested, out of the ATP rulebook:

    B. Singles Qualifying
    1) Direct acceptances shall fi rst be selected from players who sign in with the highest
    position on the most recent Emirates ATP Rankings list, including a protected
    ranking.
    2) If there are still places available for direct acceptances in the qualifying draw, the
    next players selected shall be those with the highest position on the most recent
    Emirates ATP Doubles Rankings list.
    3) If there are still places available, the tournament shall be awarded additional wild
    card positions equal to the number of places available. The tournament may, at its
    option, choose to fi ll all, or some, of those places with these additional wild card
    designations.
    4) There shall be an alternate sign-in list comprised of players that sign in who are
    not selected as direct acceptances. In the event that direct acceptance players
    are not present for fi rst-round qualifying matches or if players are moved into the
    main draw from the qualifying (before the fi rst ball is hit), players shall be selected
    from the alternate sign-in list in the order described in sections 1), and 2) above.
    Alternate sign-in deadline is 9:00 pm local time the day before the start of the
    qualifying. Thereafter, the deadline is one half (1/2) hour before the fi rst scheduled
    match each day an Alternate may be required.
    5) Any vacancy created by the withdrawal of a seed, after the qualifying draw has
    been made but prior to the release of the order of play for the fi rst day of the
    qualifying event, shall be fi lled by the next highest positioned player or team in the
    qualifying draw eligible to be seeded. The position vacated by that next highest
    positioned player or team shall then be fi lled by the next eligible player or team on
    the qualifying draw alternate list.
    All Ranked Players Have Been Accepted and...

    Case: The tournament has elected not to use their wild card allocation
    to fi ll the qualifying draw with unranked players. Are they eligible
    to sign in as alternates?
    Decision: No. Unranked players are only allowed into the draw as a
    wild card selection.
     
    #25
  26. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    6 years old or 6th grade?

    As a junior player, you always have the benefit of ingrained muscle memory.
     
    #26
  27. kedam

    kedam New User

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    6 years old and yes you are right, but depends on some body's too, you know. Idk how to explain.

    Hey, i really dont know the rules, i did sign in and there are not alternates and finally , i got in and i played , thats it. I lost in first round, but i did it because a played told me, in atp you can do like that, its not futures or anything, go and sign in , if they allow , you are in and play , not pack your things and go home. simple.
     
    #27
  28. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Hall of Fame

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    Because the tournament director decided to give wildcards to unranked players to fill holes in the draw.

    This is the question that was posed in the OP. it is not that easy to get in unless there are not enough ranked players and the tournament director decides to open it to unranked players with additional wildcards.
     
    #28
  29. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Hall of Fame

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    Futures anyone can sign in an play. Ranked or unranked. If there are not enough ranked players to fill qualifying draw, it can be filled by unranked without a wildcard and TD permission.
     
    #29
  30. jmnk

    jmnk Professional

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    thanks for the clarification of the rules. Highly appreciated. I was not aware of the rules distinctions between ranked and unranked players, and regular entry vs. wild card.

    I was actually more shocked by the fact that the Challenger level tournament in Chicago, the city with seemingly plenty of Div 1 players from nearby colleges, can't fill the qualifying draw with such college players. And the tournament director is forced/willing to give out wild card to a NTPR 4.0 level player.
     
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  31. rajah84

    rajah84 Semi-Pro

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    Were you in Aptos by any chance? I was there and watched Dustov play a little.
     
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