Is Nadal's HC success overrated?
- Thread starter WhiskeyEE
- Start date
NatF
Bionic Poster
It has weakened? What hardcourt beasts have disappeared from the tour?
Federer for starters was rubbish all year. Murray was done on hardcourts after Miami last year. Del Potro has had early exits are all 3 Hardcourt slams from 2013 onwards.
Djokovic was eratic on hardcourts in the middle of the year although he preformed in the slams.
Forehand Of Doom
Banned
Quarter Pounder is a notorious Nadal hater. No big deal, really.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
You may never know. AO 2006 would have been a great opportunity had he not run into Roger. Roger also denied him some slam finals on HC in 2006 and 2007.
The point is Davydenko is one of Nadal's toughest opponents on HC. 6-1 H2H does not lie. For Rafa it would have been much harder to beat Davy on HC than Youzhny for ex
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
Davydenko won a WTF. He was good enough to win a slam, he just wasnt good enough to beat Federer, lol. He always seemed to play Roger in the semis or QFs. DAvydenko was a great HC player.
Forehand Of Doom
Banned
Nadal is benefitting from a weak era? How about Federer 2004-2007? We can play that game.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Many all time greats have beneffited from weaker opossition to inflate their numbers.
Kenshin
Semi-Pro
I know that very well. But the fact is he wouldn't be a favorite against Nadal in best of 5 at grandslams.
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
First off, I said the HC competition has weakened in the past few years,which is certainly has, aside from the big 4. Also, I didnt say thats the sole reason for Nadal's recent HC resurgence, but I said it surely didnt hurt either.
Second, its only your opinion that 04-07 was 'weak'
Old Fed reaching number one again in the midst of the 'strong era', and old broke down Haas cracking the top 20 a couple years ago belies that opinion.
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
It never happened so we'll never know. But I do know he handed Nadal some beatdowns on HC.
Forehand Of Doom
Banned
If the current hardcourt field is weak, so was 2004-2007.
The fact is both Nadal and Federer are great players. Each of them have their best surfaces, but both are very good at their worst surfaces as well.
Federer becoming #1 in 2012 means he is a superb player, and Nadal having his best hardcourt season in 2013 means Nadal is a great hardcourt player who has become better on that surface as time went on.
It's not the field. The way Nadal was playing last summer on hardcourts was magnificent.
NatF
Bionic Poster
You had Roddick, Hewitt, Safin, Nalbandian, Agassi (04), Nadal (
05 onward), Gonzalez, Davydenko, Blake, Ljubacic and then Djokovic coming in at various times. Not weak at all.Compare that to now, who did Nadal face on hardcourts in 2013. Djokovic, Berdych, a declining Federer and Del Potro. In 2010 Nadal only faced Djokovic in his worst year since 06.
09 he went through two great players at the AO, massive respect. In 2011-2012 his way was barred by some great players. But let's not get carried away based on 2013.
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
you can say anything you like, it doesnt make it so.
I have demonstrated how the HC field has weakened a bit with a loss of certain players, and now subpar Murray.
Meanwhile, a bajillion posts later and no, not everyone agrees that 04-07 was weak.
Nadal did play very well last summer.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Not really. Combinations of Nalbandian +Hewitt, Blake +Davydenko to reach a final are tougher than Verdasco+Youzhny and Robredo +Gasquet
F
FedererWinsWimbledon2014
Guest
Those losses were a result of a wrist injury. We all know how good delpo is when fit.
rocketassist
Rookie
The US Opens were a little weak, no question about it. 2010 he faced a load of his Spanish slaves and then a drained Youzhny n the SF, while last year freaking Boredo the useless pusher in the QF and Gasquet in SF. Extremely weak opposition.
However the AO 2009 (two incredible matches against Peakdasco and a Federer who played very well for most parts until set 5's meltdown, was arguably his most impressive slam outside of his first RG.
However the AO 2009 (two incredible matches against Peakdasco and a Federer who played very well for most parts until set 5's meltdown, was arguably his most impressive slam outside of his first RG.
clayqueen
Talk Tennis Guru
So let's hae some fun and compare their records on clay.
Wynter
Legend
What about on grass as well? :twisted:
But Federer's clay prowess is underrated, especially by the old-timers.
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
Overated?
The guy has been in six HC slam finals, three a piece between the two HC majors. He's beaten Federer and Djokovic, the two best HC players of this era in the finals for the titles.
He played the longest slam final match in history, on a HC.
Olympic gold on HC. He has completed the N America Hard Court swing, the first player in a decade to do it. He's won IW three times also, plus a few other big wins, including beating Federer in Dubai.
Had the best match of the year in 2010 against Murray on Indoor Hard Court at WTF.
Three finals at WTF, three in Miami, finals of Shanghai and Paris Indoors also. He has basically been in the title match of all major HC events.
How can you say he is overrated on HC, when he has done so much on what was arguably his third worst surface?
The guy has been in six HC slam finals, three a piece between the two HC majors. He's beaten Federer and Djokovic, the two best HC players of this era in the finals for the titles.
He played the longest slam final match in history, on a HC.
Olympic gold on HC. He has completed the N America Hard Court swing, the first player in a decade to do it. He's won IW three times also, plus a few other big wins, including beating Federer in Dubai.
Had the best match of the year in 2010 against Murray on Indoor Hard Court at WTF.
Three finals at WTF, three in Miami, finals of Shanghai and Paris Indoors also. He has basically been in the title match of all major HC events.
How can you say he is overrated on HC, when he has done so much on what was arguably his third worst surface?
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
You just went into hardcore NADALRECORD mode there Hitman! :lol:
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
It should go to show the ridiculously small amount of credit Nadal gets from the haters on here when Hitman has to post something like that.
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
haha!
Just saying it how I see it. Nadal has done very well on HC, considering it is quite possibly his hardest surface, but not only that, it also has the greatest depth of competition on imo. I do feel that Nadal doesn't get the respect he in my eyes has earned in making something of himself on HC.
Yes, he is not Federer or Djokovic on HC, but they aren't exactly Nadal on clay either. So lets give these guys some respect, and I mean all of them and rise above the hate.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Great post as usual, couldn't agree more.
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
You are one of the better Djokovic fans. And you understand what it is like when Novak gets discredited and called abusive names. The same goes for Federer, and his fans. So, if we can't condone them being thrown under the bus, we should at least have some mutual ground with fans of other players about their favs also.
Well at least you can admit when you have had too much to drink (check the dates again).
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Yeah what is it with posters on this forum when it comes to giving credit to certain players, even if it's one you don't like? Honestly it's like it would kill people to actually say something complimentary, as if they're doing the dirty on their favourite player or something lol. I just don't understand it and EVERY fanbase is guilty of it.
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
Yeah, this is what we normally get when a player wins.
Nadal wins, yeah the courts must be slow, his opponent choked as usual, he used gamesmanship, on court coaching, he must be on his new cycle, time violations, playing his lapdog, playing his cheerleaders, fake MTOs....
Djokovic wins, yeah must using the egg, must be on PEDS to have that stamina, his team are a bunch of thugs when they celebrate, he parades around like a disrespectful gorilla pounding his chest, time violation, attention w....
Federer wins, yeah we must be back in the weak era, all titles won against losers, all wins hollow, player choked, Federer fake back injury, Federer's wife is unattractive, his balls don't shrink against weak players, arrogant...
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Yep you pretty much covered it all lol. Posters on this forum are nothing if not predictable and it always gives me a good laugh. Seriously ever since I discovered Talk Tennis I don't even need to watch comedy dvds anymore when I'm feeling a little down- just one click on this forum is all it takes to wash my blues away haha!
Forehand Of Doom
Banned
You are an excellent poster. One of the rare voices of reason in a wasteland of hateful trolls and rabid fanboys.
P.S.: I am not that great myself.
Forehand Of Doom
Banned
I'm sorry, but I resent the fact that you consider me predictable.Yep you pretty much covered it all lol. Posters on this forum are nothing if not predictable and it always gives me a good laugh. Seriously ever since I discovered Talk Tennis I don't even need to watch comedy dvds anymore when I'm feeling a little down- just one click on this forum is all it takes to wash my blues away haha!
Thus, I bid you adieu with a totally random, unpredictable exit from the stage.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
I'm sorry, but I resent the fact that you consider me predictable.
Thus, I bid you adieu with a totally random, unpredictable exit from the stage.
That gif is hilarious FOD but you know I wasn't referring to you- you're one of the good guys on here! :wink:
Forehand Of Doom
Banned
Thank you, Djokovic2011!
Yes, the gif is from one of my favorite characters (Dr. Zoidberg from Futurama).
No he wasnt. He lost in london. He lost in Shanghi and he lost in China. He lost in Paris. He has won one of his last 7 hardcourt events. He hasnt been rocking on hardcourt.
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