Is the grass season too short?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by superstition, Jun 8, 2008.

?

The surfaces total should be

  1. 42% grass, 40% clay, 10% hard, and 8% carpet

    8 vote(s)
    4.8%
  2. 40% grass, 30% clay, 20% hard, and 10% carpet

    3 vote(s)
    1.8%
  3. 30% grass, 30% clay, 30% hard, and 10% carpet

    60 vote(s)
    35.9%
  4. 30% grass, 30% clay, 25% hard, and 15% carpet

    12 vote(s)
    7.2%
  5. 35% grass, 35% clay, 25% hard, and 5% carpet

    16 vote(s)
    9.6%
  6. 25% grass, 40% clay, 30% hard, and 5% carpet

    9 vote(s)
    5.4%
  7. 20% grass, 25% clay, 40% hard, and 15% carpet

    26 vote(s)
    15.6%
  8. 20% grass, 30% clay, 40% hard, and 10% carpet

    21 vote(s)
    12.6%
  9. 20% grass, 40% clay, 30% hard, and 10% carpet

    1 vote(s)
    0.6%
  10. 10% grass, 40% clay, 42% hard, and 8% carpet

    11 vote(s)
    6.6%
  1. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    Is the grass season too short? I say it is. The US Open and the Australian Open used to be played on grass. So many more tournaments used to be on grass. Players had longer careers and fewer injuries. Having more grass tournaments could bring greater variety back to the game. No one specializes in grass court play anymore because of the shrinkage. The argument that grass is hard/expensive to maintain forgets that most tournaments used to be on grass, so it's not like it's too difficult for pro tennis to be played on grass. The argument that players will need to train on grass as rec/college/juniors to be successful isn't accurate. The Williams sisters and countless others have won slams on grass despite growing up playing on hard courts. The argument that players don't like playing on grass isn't accurate. Most pros like playing on grass, although clay specialists tend to prefer clay. The real issue with hard courts is the damage to the body, particularly for WTA players.

    Clay is harder to master than grass for a hard court player. There should be more clay tournaments in the USA, and I don't see why more universities with big tennis programs don't have some clay courts.

    I've opened this as a poll.
     
    #1
  2. BeHappy

    BeHappy Hall of Fame

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    I actually think it's too long, waaaaaaaaaay to long.It's ridiculous!
     
    #2
  3. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    That's not what people were saying here and in other topics which is why I created this poll.
     
    #3
  4. obnoxious2

    obnoxious2 Semi-Pro

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    Grass season is the least tenuous on the body yet it's the shortest season. It's only like one month. 2 weeks for 2 separate warmups and 2 weeks of Wimbledon.
     
    #4
  5. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    It's the shortest season now, but it used to be the longest. I agree that it's silly since it's the best for the body.
     
    #5
  6. Fee

    Fee Legend

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    That's far too much math for me to do at this point of the day. Yes, the grass season is too short.
     
    #6
  7. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    The answer is obvious. 30-30-30-10, but that will never happen, unfortunately.
    Grass season will stay short for following two reasons mainly:

    1. RG and Wimbledon are too close and neither is willing to move.

    2. Not enough grass courts and venues.
     
    #7
  8. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    Most tournaments used to be on grass.
    Why is this a problem? The grass season used to be the longest. Were Wimbledon and RG played at different times in the past?
    This makes no sense since there were lots of grass court tournaments in the past. There's nothing stopping tournaments from going back to grass other than greed or climate. I agree that tournaments in dry places like Arizona shouldn't go grass, but other places have the right climate.
     
    #8
  9. Voltron

    Voltron Hall of Fame

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    Pffft, like I'd know
    Personally, I'd love a long grass season, as well as more grass courts for junior tournaments. I'd also love to see more clay for juniors. (but not for pros)
     
    #9
  10. Hot Sauce

    Hot Sauce Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, it's definitely too short. I'd go with 30-30-30-10. Why is it that the grass season used to be much longer, but now it's the shortest?
     
    #10
  11. lovecr717

    lovecr717 Rookie

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    30 grass 15 clay 40 hard 15 carpet
     
    #11
  12. cueboyzn

    cueboyzn Professional

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    There should be at least one Masters Series Event on Grass. To have 3 Masters events on Clay, 4 on Hard courts and 2 on Carpet and not even one on Grass is a joke.

    You have 3 Masters events as preparation for the French. But not even one masters event on grass as preparation for Wimbledon, which is supposed to be the most important/prestigious Grand Slam.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
    #12
  13. JamaicanYoute

    JamaicanYoute Rookie

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    Way too short. It's really ridiculous. As someone pointed out, they don't even have a Masters played on grass. That's just plain bad. Especially since so much used to be played on grass.

    And while we're on grass - these guys need to get back to the faster grass. Just like we have the 'clay court specialist', the 'grass court specialist' has gone extinct. I think for the most part Wimbledon is considered the largest/most prestigious tournament, so its only right to have a longer warm up to it.
     
    #13
  14. leonidas1982

    leonidas1982 Hall of Fame

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    There are plenty of venues in England (Manchester, Kent, Liverpool, and up north), Denmark, and the Netherlands.
     
    #14
  15. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    30,30,30,10

    Give all major surfaces even playing time while still alotting time for carpet.
     
    #15
  16. leonidas1982

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    Also, the slams should emulate the US Open with its US Open series build-up.
     
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  17. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

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    It's not even a season. It needs to be longer.
     
    #17
  18. Rabbit

    Rabbit G.O.A.T.

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    The grass court season should be extended. It should start after Roland Garos and go through the US Open. There used to be plenty of venues in the northeastern United States for grass and could be once again.

    The hardcourt season should really be between the Australian, yes I am not for the Aussie being on hardcourts, and the start of the claycourt season. This would encompass the Indian Wells and Miami events and that should pretty much be it except for the smaller venues and exhibitions.

    And I 100% agree with other posters that there should be a minimum of 1 Masters Series event on grass with the schedule as is. If they lengthen the grass court season, there should be more.

    Any mandatory event on the ATP/WTA schedules should be played on a natural surface IMO.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
    #18
  19. Vision84

    Vision84 Hall of Fame

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    It should be 35% grass, 35% hard, 20% clay, 10% carpet
     
    #19
  20. 93sq.

    93sq. Semi-Pro

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    Wait a minute...a Grass season!?
    Is there a grass season!?
    Is Wimbledon a grass tournament!?
     
    #20
  21. Vision84

    Vision84 Hall of Fame

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    Hardly. To slow for grass and allows clay courters to be dominant to easily.
     
    #21
  22. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    There are no MS on carpet anymore. Paris and Madrid are using indoor hardcourts for the past 2 years. MS Paris used to be my favourite MS shield with its ultra-fast carpet. Even Lyon's carpet has been slowed down :(
     
    #22
  23. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

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    30% grass, 30% clay, 25% hard, and 15% carpet

    CAAARPEEEET CAAARPEEEET CARPEEEEET
     
    #23
  24. Klatu Verata Necktie

    Klatu Verata Necktie Hall of Fame

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    The biggest obstacle I can see in instituting a longer grass court season is in the lack of grass court clubs for players to train on. Someone mentioned that there are grass court venues in several countries, but those are simply not enough to provide proper training for the players who will participate in the grass court season.

    I live in Miami, which is a virtual tennis Meca. We have loads of clay and hard courts to choose from, but if we want to play on grass courts, we have to reserve one of the 2 courts in the entire city! Grass courts are no longer as prevalent as they used to be, which explains the decrease in grass court tournaments.
     
    #24
  25. Benhur

    Benhur Hall of Fame

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    Yes, it is much too short, and so is the clay season.

    The third option (30, 30, 30 and 10) seems the most reasonable to give an accurate assessment of player's all-court ability.

    Distribution of master's series events should also follow the same proportions.

    Of course, that would be in a utopic world. In the real one, the current trend of hard court increasing predominance will probably continue.
     
    #25
  26. flyer

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    its a debatable subject, logically the fairest thing would be something along the lines of 30/30/30/10, but thats is unrealistic in actuality, also i think one of the things that makes wimbledon special is the fact that it is one grass and thats just about the only time be get to see grass tennis, when you think of lawn tennis you think of wimbledon, it does not need any masters series build ups or anything like that....i think extending the grass season would change wimledon in a way...
     
    #26
  27. CyBorg

    CyBorg Legend

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    I'm fine with the summer grass court season being the way it is. The more you think about it the less you know, really. It's very hard to institute a summer MS on grass.

    Instead I'd like to see Australia go to grass again. Along with that we'd have grass events in New Zealand and South Africa. That would be a treat.
     
    #27
  28. Rabbit

    Rabbit G.O.A.T.

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    Well, I really think it's a chicken/egg discussion. There are probably fewer HarTru venues around the country since 1978 when the US Open changed its surface choice. Prior to that, there was an entire US clay season.

    Ever since the late 70's, tournaments leading up to the Grand Slams have tailored their surfaces to give the players practice on the Grand Slam surface. If one of the Grand Slams changes their surface, like the US Open from clay to grass, these tourneys change their surfaces to suit. Should, not likely, but should the USTA opt for grass once again, I can assure you that you will see a resurgence in grass court facilities to match.

    So, the real reason for the decline in grass courts is the change in the Grand Slam venue.
     
    #28
  29. leonidas1982

    leonidas1982 Hall of Fame

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    Or it could be that the reduction in Grass tournaments has led to a decrease in grass courts at clubs. But as you said, you live in Miami, I don't expect the city to have much grass courts. There are other clubs in the US with grass courts, Northeast, Northwest, Georgia, and the *******. Plenty of places to train. How do the players train for the clay season, they travel to the continent (Spain, Monaco, Portugal, etc).

    Besides, let us not confuse the ATP circuit with the challengers and lower tours; they have a more grass tournaments.
     
    #29
  30. textbook strokes

    textbook strokes Semi-Pro

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    I am compelled to say... that tennis on grass is really boring for a big portion of tennis' fans population.
    Too many unforced errors and short points... . I know many posters will attack me after saying this. No matter, it should be said.
     
    #30
  31. leonidas1982

    leonidas1982 Hall of Fame

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    What is a big portion? Do you have numbers, facts? Or do you feel compelled to present your preference as fact?
     
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  32. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    Which is why grass events like Wimbledon were packed. I've heard this same theory about wood racquets and yet tennis was more popular when it was played with wood and there were many more grass tournaments - more popular than it is now.
    It's not unrealistic at all.
     
    #32
  33. textbook strokes

    textbook strokes Semi-Pro

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    Yeah, wood and grass... omg!.

    It just not going to happen.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
    #33
  34. dgrave2

    dgrave2 Semi-Pro

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    There are 4 different court types... 4 slams.. I think there should be a slam for each surface.. and I've never understood why there are back to back slams.. 4 slams.. 12 months.. put a slam once every 3 months. Sorry I'm a pattern type of person haha.
     
    #34
  35. leonidas1982

    leonidas1982 Hall of Fame

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    #35
  36. Yeah, gj011 is right about the French and Wimbledon both refusing to move part.

    The reasons given, and I may be wrong on this, but as I understand it, the FFT don't want to move Roland Garros up a week because of weather concerns. Meaning, that during the first week of the French (if it were moved up), during that time of year (middle of May instead of the end of May), the weather is too unpredictable. And often times it may be a bit too cold.

    Their argument makes total sense to me. Because given the weather here on the East Coast in the U.S., you never know what it's going to be like the week before Memorial Day. You can get some nice weather, or you may still need your winter coat. After Memorial Day though it's a lot more predictable.

    Wimbledon's argument is a little more shaky though, if you ask me. From what I understand, The All England Club and the LTA also don't want to move because of weather concerns. Their concern though it that it may be too hot if Wimbledon finished up in the second week of July instead of the first.

    That's kind of like, "Yeah, whatever..." to me.

    I think the real reason is, is that they're Wimbledon, and they're not moving "The Championships" for anyone or anything.

    Of course, with Wimbledon being my second favorite tournament after the U.S. Open, all I can say to their reasoning is... it works for me. (I fully agree that if anybody should move, it should be the French.)

    As for the fact that the grass court season used to be the longest:

    Well, remember, what is now the hardcourt season that leads up to the U.S. Open (at Flushing Meadows), that once upon a time was part of the grass court season leading up to the U.S. Open (at Forest Hills).

    One solution to solving the lack of a grass court season problem though, is to somehow convince Australia to switch back to grass.

    And I say Australia instead of the U.S. because tennis is more popular in Australia than in the U.S., and I think the Australians would be more open to doing something like that. Of course I could be wrong about this.

    The short-term risk (short-term as in a maybe one generation of players; 10-15 years) of Australia moving back to grass is that, the players who don't like to play on grass (and only play Wimbledon because it's Wimbledon) may not be so eager to make the trip all the way down to Oz just to lose early.

    For subsequent generations of players this probably wouldn't be as big of an issue. But in the short-term they could take a hit.
     
    #36
  37. Q&M son

    Q&M son Professional

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    Tooo short for me....
     
    #37
  38. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    OMG! Wood isn't what I was referring to and that's obvious from the post.
     
    #38
  39. mnguyen8

    mnguyen8 New User

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    Lengthen the grass season and shorten the clay season....please!
     
    #39
  40. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    We should keep in mind that clay is very popular in countries where tennis has a strong following. So, it's not a good idea to give clay short shrift. Really, we need to have more clay in the USA. Our players shouldn't be like fish out of water on it. Clay, although not as easy on the body as grass, is still easier on the body than concrete, too.
     
    #40
  41. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

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    Nah, get rid of some hard court tournies. We have a lot of HC tournies and some changes would be nice.
     
    #41
  42. pow

    pow Hall of Fame

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    30-30-30-10

    Grass is too short, it's entertaining, I'm surprised not many venues use it.
    Lazy?
     
    #42
  43. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    Grass court tennis is a bore, nothing but a serving contest. It is long enough now, dont extend it.
     
    #43
  44. matchmaker

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    Yes it is too short it should be at least about 6 to 8 weeks
     
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  45. Tempest344

    Tempest344 Professional

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    I would cut down the hard court tournaments...they are a major reason for knee injuries...very unforgiving

    and yes the grass season is too short
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
    #45
  46. Lendl and Federer Fan

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    There should be 2 AMS played on grass every year.
     
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  47. Vision84

    Vision84 Hall of Fame

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    I see your point but that means it is rare to see grass court specialists these days. Wimbledon is not that different from other surfaces now that it has turned into a baseline bashing fest. It makes it less enjoyable to watch and not really Wimbledon anymore.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
    #47
  48. Murray_Maniac

    Murray_Maniac Banned

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    Yea, the grass season is too short. I think that they should cut the canada masters and Paris. Theres already a big tournament in Paris! The canada masters seems like the least important hardcourt masters series. Im soo mad that they'll probably cut Hamburg. I like it better than Monte carlo and Rome. Its similar to hardcourt but its still clay. Plus that roof is cool.
     
    #48
  49. The balls in your court.

    The balls in your court. Banned

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    Grass is an antiquated surface that only one country plays on .

    Wimbledon should only be played with wooden racquest and looked at as a cute nostalgic surface that brigs us back to the roots of tennis. It has no place in todays tennis world.
     
    #49
  50. flyer

    flyer Hall of Fame

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    i see your point, however, im a nadal fan, so im ok with the slow lawn for a few more years, but i agree it does change it
     
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