Is this a common DQ?

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by tdhawks, Jul 8, 2013.

  1. tdhawks

    tdhawks Semi-Pro

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    We have had 5 matches in our USTA League, we're 4-1. This is my 1st year, same with another guy on our team so I apologize for not knowing all the rules.

    Today, he was DQ'd and bumped up to 4.5, resulting in our team giving back 2 matches and possibly missing districts. They said it was a "computer ranking".

    He is 3-1, and the matches which drew strikes against him were against older guys (40+) when playing singles, who all had losing records last year. In fact, a match that drew a strike was a doubles match that he and his partner lost.

    How can someone draw strikes when they beat crappy players and the records of those players he beats speak for themselves? Could it be because they have a track record for themselves and he is a self rated newbie?

    I am 3-1 as well and my only loss was 4,4 in singles, won the rest in singles play as well with scores not that close. Am I am risk too or does is just depend on who the competition is?

    Like I said, I am new to league so I'm sorry for not fully understanding this.
     
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  2. Govnor

    Govnor Professional

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    I can only relay what I've read here, but the computer is seeing "the bigger picture" and making lots of calculations that might not be obvious at first.

    Not sure if it can be appealed or not.
     
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  3. tdhawks

    tdhawks Semi-Pro

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    Our captain called to appeal and they said no dice, it's the computer.

    Oh well.
     
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  4. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    DQs can be confusing, no shame in asking about them.

    When you initial start playing USTA League, you self rate based on a set of questions. The DQ process is in place to determine if a player has self-rated too low and should be playing at a higher level.

    A DQ occurs after a player's dynamic rating (updated after each match is played) exceeds a level specific threshold 3 times in a USTA league year. Dynamic ratings are calculated based on who you play against and their rating, who you play with (if doubles), and the score of the match. It is important to note that win/loss record is not factored in, it is possible to have your rating go up when you lose (and go down when you win) based on the ratings of the players involved. Nor does age factor in, the computer only sees ratings and scores.

    As an example of how strange DQs can occur, see http://computerratings.blogspot.com/2013/05/analysis-of-strange-dynamic-ntrp-dq-in.html where a player went 2-4 and got DQd. If interested in more details or a report yourself, see the links to contact me in that blog entry.
     
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  5. J_R_B

    J_R_B Hall of Fame

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    This sounds a little bit unusual, but it's certainly not implausible. A person's rating is not necessarily related just to their W-L record. There are players who only play the "important" matches agaisnt higher rated opponents who may have pedestrian looking W-L records but could be very strong players with a high dynamic rating nonetheless.

    As for getting a strike in a losing match, there are even more variables in doubles with three other dynamic ratings to enter into the equation instead of just one. The algorithm maintains the differential between the partners in a doubles match, so if he played with a weak partner against strong opponents and barely lost, it could end up as a strike. For example, if the guy had a 4.0 dynamic rating andhis partner a 3.5, then the system maintains the 0.5 rating differential for the match rating. If the opponents were both rated around 4.0 and the match score was close, then the team's match rating would be around 4.0, but in order to maintain the 0.5 differential, the guy's match rating would be 4.25 and his partner 3.75.

    There is a further complication in that a player's dynamic rating is the average of the current match rating and his last three dynamic ratings. If a player's dynamic rating is below the strike threshold, the averaging makes it harder to get strikes, but the opposite is also true. Once your dynamic rating crosses the strike threshold, it will become very difficult NOT to get strikes because the averaging is done with dynamic ratings that are above the strike threshold. This sometimes causes third strikes to be a bit puzzling in relation to the first two.
     
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  6. tdhawks

    tdhawks Semi-Pro

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    Thanks for the insight guys.
     
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  7. J_R_B

    J_R_B Hall of Fame

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    NP. It's frustrating because DQs happen to first year players - i.e. the players who understand the least about the whole system to start with. Most of the time, it's clear what happened - somebody blows everyone off the court and gets DQ'd. But sometimes, you have to look more deeply inside the numbers beyond just intuitive assessments of the situation for it to make sense. Schmke is much better at that than anyone else. In almost every situation when some apparent anomaly occurs with the ratings, his algorithm can explain it.
     
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  8. tdhawks

    tdhawks Semi-Pro

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    We just had a 2nd member of our team get DQ'd this morning. This DQ stuff is getting awfully annoying. I'm starting to think the pool of players who choose to play league where I live isn't all that strong.

    Nothing more to add, just annoying.
     
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  9. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    If the pool wasn't that strong, you wouldn't be getting DQs unless your players are thoroughly dominating the weak players. It is more likely that your players self-rated too low and the DQs are legit, but I can't tell for sure without doing a full analysis.
     
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  10. tdhawks

    tdhawks Semi-Pro

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    You're right. Just a little frustrated as our team is being picked apart.

    BTW, you have some nice write ups on your page. I'm enjoying the read.
     
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  11. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    Thanks. Since we are discussing DQs, I assume you found the post on a strange DQ? If not, see http://computerratings.blogspot.com/2013/05/analysis-of-strange-dynamic-ntrp-dq-in.html.

    Sometimes DQs don't make sense on the surface, and certainly there are some that are "wrong" due to some of the peculiar ways the algorithm works, but it is fun to look at.
     
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