Like it or not Serena Williams is the Greatest

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by mistik, Sep 7, 2012.

  1. mistik

    mistik Hall of Fame

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    I never seen this kind of dominance not even from Steffi and Martina.I feel sorry for the other girls.If Serena plays her game no one but no one can beat her.They know it as well.She cant lose if she doesnt have serious issues.I love Graf more than her.I dont even love Serena.I think in a way her dominance made other players look bad and hurts WTA,but she is indeed the greatest player ever.
     
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  2. beast of mallorca

    beast of mallorca Legend

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    She can beat Roger and Rafa at the same time, we know :twisted:
     
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  3. tudwell

    tudwell Hall of Fame

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    She's a little short on slam titles and weeks at number one.
     
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  4. mistik

    mistik Hall of Fame

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    These are just statics.Game wise she is miles ahead.İf you take numbers all that seriously Margret Court still the best ever.:confused:
     
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  5. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    Serena just beat a 5'4" player with a serve at 60mph, no power, reach disadvantage. I'm sure many players can beat Errani.
     
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  6. The-Champ

    The-Champ Legend

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    I agree. Queen Serena is the greatest woman to play the game. She doesn't move as well as during her prime, but her serve has improved tremendously. She is serving smartly, hitting corners with speed and consistency.
     
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  7. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    Well, that's how it is in this forum when a player gets hot. Before, some Nole fans claimed Nole is the greatest. LOL
     
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  8. DRII

    DRII Legend

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    Peak Venus is better than peak Serena: faster, more athletic, more explosive, better at net, etc...
     
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  9. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    Maybe on grass, but everywhere it's Serena.
     
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  10. mistik

    mistik Hall of Fame

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    Venus isnt the same league of Serena game wise and she wasnt even in her peak.İn her her younger days you can argue she was more athletic player,but that doesnt make you better.Venus service action isnt all that great(she can serve bombs but still unreliable most of the time)Venus forehand another unreliable shot,it is in and out.Venus has a game that can only be good when you are so young,she doesnt have game that can bring you GS glory in your older days.
     
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  11. Warriorroger

    Warriorroger Hall of Fame

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    My thoughts exactly, what kind of field is she dominating??
     
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  12. mistik

    mistik Hall of Fame

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    This can also said about others greats as well.What kind field Graf dominated after Seles stabbing ? What kind of field Martina dominated ? Chris Everett with all the respect was her biggest rival and she was a very limited player outside of clay.
     
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  13. Soianka

    Soianka Hall of Fame

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    She has beaten Sharapova and Azerenka with the same level of dominance this year a couple of times each.
     
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  14. Soianka

    Soianka Hall of Fame

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    A much deeper field than Graf, Evert or Navratilova ever faced.

    The women from 1 to 100 are all true athletes with a lot of talent.

    It's harder than it ever has been to be a tennis pro.

    Graf often didn't have a real match until the quarterfinals of a slam.
     
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  15. tudwell

    tudwell Hall of Fame

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    If she's "miles ahead," how come she's still not number one playing against a bunch of one-dimensional choke artists?
     
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  16. mistik

    mistik Hall of Fame

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    She doesnt because she doesnt care outside of slams.( which is a bad thing ı have to say,no respect for the game)
     
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  17. pug

    pug Semi-Pro

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    Agreed. Womens tennis needs weight classes. Errani at 115 and williams at 200 just isn't fair.
     
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  18. tennisaddict

    tennisaddict G.O.A.T.

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    As much as my respect for Serena has grown over the years, it is not fair to compare her to Graf. A 40+ year old Graf was playing Kim Clijsters and Petkovic beautifully.

    Check out youtube.
     
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  19. waarp

    waarp Rookie

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    Let's face it, any woman whose thighs are big enough to crush cinderblocks belongs in the men's draw.
     
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  20. DRII

    DRII Legend

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    Psyche! Your post illustrates perfectly how quickly people forget!

    ...

    Yea, its just age a certain auto immune disease has nothing to do with Venus' drastic decline :confused:
     
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  21. Soianka

    Soianka Hall of Fame

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    Graf retired when she was 30.

    Are you talking about some exhibition matches? :?
     
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  22. NikeWilson

    NikeWilson Semi-Pro

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    #22
  23. The-Champ

    The-Champ Legend

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    that's exhibition. Do you also believe that Sampras beat Federer fair and square in Macao in 2007? lol
     
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  24. mistik

    mistik Hall of Fame

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    Venus didnt shine outside of grass since 2001 and that has to say you something right,and this has nothing to do with immune disease,because she won many Wimbledon titles after 2001.Serena one of the greatest ever,Venus great but certainly not in the same league with Graf,Martina and Serena.
     
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  25. DRII

    DRII Legend

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    You can't have it both ways!

    As far as records -- no, Venus is not of the caliber of Graf, Navratilova, Everett; but neither is Serena! At least not yet, the only category she might catch up in is # of slams (I highly doubt she will reach Graf's 22)...

    As far as form: Venus is the best I've ever seen, except on clay. No woman has been faster or more offensive and explosive. If you disagree, thats your prerogative, but don't act as if your opinion is fact; particularly when it's being bolstered by Serena's results against a very weak current field...
     
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  26. 90's Clay

    90's Clay Legend

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    Serena is far from the greatest. Winning slams in the worst WTA field in HISTORY full of talentless mugs wouldn't change that
    If Graf spent half her career playing this awful field she manages a slam count in the high 30s


    Hell Serena can't even stay at #1 vs. this mug field
     
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  27. Soianka

    Soianka Hall of Fame

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    Except all of that is a complete lie.

    Evert, Martina N, Pam Shriver, etc have all admitted that women's tennis is deeper than it ever was.

    During their eras, they most often didn't play competative matches until late in the 2nd week of a slam.
     
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  28. tennisaddict

    tennisaddict G.O.A.T.

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    Forget exhibition and also forget 22 > 14.

    Graf's era spanned Martina Navratilova, Monica Seles , Sabatini, Hingis, Chris Evert , Arantxa Sanchez , Lindsay, Venus, Conchita Martinez, Mary Pierce.

    Serena's era - only noteworthy opponent is Justine Henin.
     
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  29. Soianka

    Soianka Hall of Fame

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    Take a look at some of the draws of the slams Graf won and see who she played in round 1 through round 4.

    Sorry, but there is a ton more depth in today's game than what Graf faced.

    Graf basically got 4-5 easy wins every slam. No wonder she won as many slams as she did.

    Graf would definitely not be as dominant a player today as she was in her heydey...especially if she still never developed a solid topspin backhand.
     
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  30. NikeWilson

    NikeWilson Semi-Pro

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    #30
  31. BauerAlmeida

    BauerAlmeida Semi-Pro

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    Lol, today they don't even play competitive matches at all.

    Players outisde the TOP 20 (or even top 10) lose 6-2 6-0 to the top players. This is the worst WTA ever. Graff and martina are better than Serena.
     
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  32. kishnabe

    kishnabe G.O.A.T.

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    Graf is the greatest.......
     
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  33. Vcore89

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    Steffi is the greatest! Seles might have been the Nadal of Graf had she not been stab (the signs are showing more and more back then)...
     
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  34. Gizo

    Gizo Hall of Fame

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    Serena cannot be the greatest when she has only reached one French Open final during her career.

    Since Henin's first retirement in 2008 the women's clay court field has been incredibly weak, and Serena still hasn't been able to reach the last 4 at RG during that time as well.
     
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  35. Gizo

    Gizo Hall of Fame

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    Still I will reiterate that Serena has played by far the best tennis I have ever seen from a woman on grass and hard courts. Incredible stuff to watch.

    And unlike someone like Navratilova who is obsessed with her legacy, I don't think Serena overly cares too much about where people rank her in relation to other greats. Still it would be funny if Serena could surpass 18 slam titles, to see how Navratilova would react to that. Evert congratulated Graf when she moved past 18 slam titles at RG in 1996, while Navratilova was incredibly bitter.

    I really do fear the future of women's tennis when Serena and Venus do eventually retire. Even Sharapova hasn't been able to draw huge TV ratings for her big tournament finals in recent years against the likes of Kvitova and Errani. She has needed Serena on the other side of the net like with the Olympic final to get many casual fans to tune in.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2012
    #35
  36. dominikk1985

    dominikk1985 Legend

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    yes but in grafs or everts time there were just erranis while serena had to face justine, davenport, kim, maria, kvitova, ivanovic and other tall and really hard hitting girls. she also had to face venus and lost a few titles to her.

    I would still not call her the best ever but she faced a lot tougher opposition as steffi, evert or even moreso court and jean king faced.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2012
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  37. jelle v

    jelle v Hall of Fame

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    Well I'm 32 years old, been watching tennis since 1986 or so and I have never been really impressed with Venus her game.. I agree with the poster. I think Serena's game is a level above Venus her game.

    When Venus was just on tour and quickly was a major force, people in that time were already saying that Venus had a younger sister who was even more talented, so I don't think it is far fetched to think that Serena is the better player.
     
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  38. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Serena never faced the density of champions that Graf or Hingis faced at their prime.Like Federer, the weak fields she faced belittle her achievements and put them straight into second tier ( which ain´t bad)
     
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  39. Evan77

    Evan77 Banned

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    no she is not. It is Graf by far. check your facts guys. Serena will never achieve what Steffy did, plus she is playing in this silly era with no competition.

    when you grow up, go watch some Graf's s matches and you'll understand.
     
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  40. DeShaun

    DeShaun Banned

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    Could Serena have beaten Evert with wooden rackets inhibiting heavily powered topspin strokes familiar with Serena, insisting instead on levels of stroking accuracy that are off of the charts? And repeat those strokes using only wooden rackets. . .it cannot be done. Serena would be disadvantaged, IMO. Serena has harnessed the power of modern rackets, defining the upper limits to power in the women's game. She is not some undisputed goat or "the best ever to play," but I am immensely proud of her coming back and it's frightening how quickly she became dominant again.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2012
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  41. tennisMVP

    tennisMVP Banned

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    I agree that Serena is the greatest player ever. The only player she ever struggled with was Hingis, I think Serena leads that 7-6.
     
    #41
  42. Nathaniel_Near

    Nathaniel_Near Talk Tennis Guru

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    Relax folks, ...
    True, and overall titles. To me it seems like she isn't nearly as dominant as some past greats -- maybe only on a match by match or tournament by tournament basis.
     
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  43. Chillaxer

    Chillaxer Semi-Pro

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    Does anyone even care? Women's tennis is so boring now.
     
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  44. Nathaniel_Near

    Nathaniel_Near Talk Tennis Guru

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    Relax folks, ...
    Very true.
     
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  45. rainingaces

    rainingaces Legend

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    Weak era. Anyone who could have challenged her has retired.
     
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  46. THUNDERVOLLEY

    THUNDERVOLLEY G.O.A.T.

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    As much as i'm a big fan of SW, she did not display the concentrated dominance at the majors within a season to win the Grand Slam--and I do not count the jumpoing over of one year into another for "personal slams" (a tennis PTB/media invention to pump the careers of ottherwise unimpressive players like Agassi). So, while she is--without question--one of the greatest players ever to step on a court, the's not the all-time best. That title belongs to Graf.
     
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  47. THUNDERVOLLEY

    THUNDERVOLLEY G.O.A.T.

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    Yeah, like after Wimbledon when several threads were created by Federer fanatics trying to convince themselves that the win made him the GOAT (obviously to even argue in that manner revealed the doubt they deny), but then there was the Olympics gold medal match v. Murray....and this USO and Berdych...

    LOL indeed.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2012
    #47
  48. Warriorroger

    Warriorroger Hall of Fame

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    as does Williams!! Come one, do you really think Radwanska/Wozniacki/Jankovic/Ivanovic/ would stand a chance against, Graf-Seles-Sabatini-Novotna-Navratilova??.
     
    #48
  49. fuzzyball

    fuzzyball Rookie

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    No, almost half of them have too high body fat, with even some top 10 female players who have a fat belly that true athletes never have.
     
    #49
  50. boredone3456

    boredone3456 Legend

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    Evert a limited player outside of clay? You just lost all your credibility right there.
     
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