LLAR related question about staggered start times

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by roman40, Mar 28, 2013.

  1. roman40

    roman40 Rookie

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    Let's say opposing team specifies staggered match times (two sessions). For example, 1st singles and 1st/2nd doubles at 1pm, and 2nd singles/3rd doubles at 3pm.

    Let's also say that they know they'll default one doubles line (we don't obviously).

    LLAR rules state that if you default a doubles line during your first session, and you don't have substitutes, you play the second session as specified in the original lineup.

    This technically means that opposing team, knowing they'll default one doubles line, can make it look like their 2nd line player(s) didn't show up, and default their 2nd line, instead of 3rd line.

    Unless we drop our 2nd team to 3rd line more than 49% of the time (which would be stupid), the opposing team has the advantage, because we have to stick to the lineup in second session, and can't move our 2nd line to the second session.

    I think that's a clear loophole in the rules. Or am I missing something?
     
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  2. roman40

    roman40 Rookie

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  3. roman40

    roman40 Rookie

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    Bump. Come one, there must be some USTA captains here with an opinion on this.
     
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  4. OrangePower

    OrangePower Hall of Fame

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    Ok, I'll bite.

    I think only a d-bag captain would make an opposing player(s) show up to match where the captain knows he will be defaulting the line. All the captains I know would extend the courtesy of letting the opponents know ahead of time, so that they don't end up coming for no reason.

    This is rec tennis, not a knife fight to the death.

    As for the rule in the LLAR, I think it is more targeted at unexpected defaults, in which case it makes sense since it is not pragmatic to shuffle players and start times around at the last minute.
     
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  5. jonnyjack

    jonnyjack Rookie

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    Yes, it's a loophole. What you can do is make sure everyone in the first shift is there when you exchange lineups and if they're not, they have to adjust the lineup to accomodate this. Don't let them see your lineup though.

    And don't let them say, "they're on their way so we'll start the other matches first." Since you have to default from the bottom up then their #3 line will have to play against your #2 line. Of course your #2 line will now need to sit around until the opponent's second shift shows up.

    Edit: Just saw OrangePower's post. Completely agree, it's common courtesy if they know ahead of time that they can't field a full lineup. I haven't run into that personally yet but if that happens to me, I'm going to be pissed. If the guy just ends up being late past the 15 minute default window, I'm not going to take a default win. I'm there to play tennis.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2013
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  6. roman40

    roman40 Rookie

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    Interesting, in our area, it's common practice to without default information. In two years that I've been playing, we were never informed of a default ahead of time. I think it should be required to mention default before lineups are exchanged, but it's not in the rules, as far as I can tell, so teams that value winning over sportsmanship choose the most advantageous option.

    I am wondering how I can start to change this practice. Perhaps we should send out a note to all captains requesting that defaults be communicated as soon as possible, and always before lineups are exchanged. Not sure what kind of a response that would get.
     
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