La_Para
Rookie
I assume everybody knows about the Big four:
Rafael Nadal, better known as the king of clay, no one has dominated one surface like he did. besides his numerous achievements on the surface he's also completed the career grand slam and is currently in the posession of 11 slams.
Roger Federer, considered by many to be the GOAT of tennis, on basis of his achievements one of the best performing/most succesful players the game has ever seen. Possesses 17 slams at the moment.
Novak Djokovic, the man who broke the Fedal stronghold in 2011, a feat which many considered to be impossible. he is in possession of the third best season of all times according tot Tennis Magazine, and has cemented that position. Certainly no longer 'best of the rest'. Possesses 6 slams.
Andy Murray, a man who faced great adversity, who struggled, fought, and was ultimately awarded with olympic gold and his first slam. He was always at the heels of of the three above and seems to have gotten it all together. Possesses 1 one slam.
These four have been at the top of the game for I can't remember how long. Their consistency, and level of play, is amazing. At times is seems as if the number 5 position is the highest possible for the rest of the field. People at the number 5 position have come and gone, but none have been able to turn the Big 4 into a big 5.
The question I'm asking is as follows:
which of the players on tour, do you think, has/had the biggest possibilities of making the Big 4 a Big 5? What is it that gives your player the edge over the others, and what flaw is it that prevented him from doing so? If he fixed it, where do you think he would rank among the Big 5(going by supposed prime).
When talking about the flaw, please, no trolling. The flaw has to be something which the player has shown he can overcome. So no: Nishikori for 5 because if he had the Nadal forehand, Federer footwork and Djokovic backhand, he would own everybody, sort of thing. You would have to provide a match showing his forehand to be on par with Nadal, for example.
My pick for the guy I think had/has massive chances of making a Big 5 would be, believe it or not, Jo Wilfried Tsonga.
When I look at Tsonga I see a man full of possibilities. He's got a wicked forehand, great serve, seems to be dancing on court at times and has shown that he can have deft touch at the net:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=41s
His backhand isn't his strongest shot, but when it's working he can deal some real damage, for example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=07m53s
His forehand can be quite imposing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=10m27s
Tsonga is quite a complete player/has a lot of variation, and has got multiple tools at his disposal to use. Despite all this he hasn't been able to become a Big 5 player, I think this is due to several reasons.
His Miami match vs Nadal shows several issues which have been recurrent throughout his career.
First of all,he's known for making bad choices:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=06m18s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=05m10s
Something is not quite right in his head at times. If you've watched matches you'll know what I'm talking about. Going for 'miracle balls', forgetting whether he has a double of a single hander(jack of both backhands, master of none), playing shots which appear to be plain suicide when he thinks the point takes too long. A commentator once said that you never knew what could happen when you're up against Tsonga, as long as you keep the ball in play.
Secondly, It doesn't seem as if he's got the drive to realize all of his potential. I heard a commentator once praise him for being honest, he had said in a press conference that 'he didn't have what it takes' to go on court every day and practice like the top four does. He said it had gotten less when he got a new coach, promptly making the semi's of the AO 2013 where he lost a five setter vs Federer. I thought it was going in the right direction... but then he lost the next tournament(ABN Amro, rotterdam) where he went out in the first round...
Finally, I think he could lose a little bit more weight, not only would it make him faster on court, it would also make him less injury prone, wouldn't it?
You can say that Tsonga can improve on technical aspects(backhand, slice), but his main problem is a mental one. The times when he gets over them, he's a problematic threat to everyone on tour, including the big four.
If he could solve his problems, become more stable and look at things on a match to match basis, I could see him cement his place in the big 5. My pick of the big 5 would then be:
Federer
Nadal
Djokovic
Tsonga
Murray
I could definitely see see Tsonga overtake Murray, seeing as he's got a more agressive, more dominant type of play. Tsonga has said he has problems with Murray his playing style, but I think that if he gets over his mental problems he would be able to turn things around, securing the number four position in the big 5.
As to how he would fare against the other three, it's hard to imagine, but prime vs 'supposed prime' I think they have the edge over him. I don't see him beating them on a consistent basis, I'd guess 6 out of ten matches in favour of any of the top 3.
Note: The top 3 in my example are interchangeable, It's solely about your guy and what place he takes in the big 5. Whether it's Djokovic, Nadal or Federer at number 1 is of lesser importance. Important is whether or not they're above your pick in level of play. I hope to avoid arguments like whether Nadal is better than Federer this way. We already have more than enough of those, don't we?
Do you agree/disagree? If you do, then name your pick.
Rafael Nadal, better known as the king of clay, no one has dominated one surface like he did. besides his numerous achievements on the surface he's also completed the career grand slam and is currently in the posession of 11 slams.
Roger Federer, considered by many to be the GOAT of tennis, on basis of his achievements one of the best performing/most succesful players the game has ever seen. Possesses 17 slams at the moment.
Novak Djokovic, the man who broke the Fedal stronghold in 2011, a feat which many considered to be impossible. he is in possession of the third best season of all times according tot Tennis Magazine, and has cemented that position. Certainly no longer 'best of the rest'. Possesses 6 slams.
Andy Murray, a man who faced great adversity, who struggled, fought, and was ultimately awarded with olympic gold and his first slam. He was always at the heels of of the three above and seems to have gotten it all together. Possesses 1 one slam.
These four have been at the top of the game for I can't remember how long. Their consistency, and level of play, is amazing. At times is seems as if the number 5 position is the highest possible for the rest of the field. People at the number 5 position have come and gone, but none have been able to turn the Big 4 into a big 5.
The question I'm asking is as follows:
which of the players on tour, do you think, has/had the biggest possibilities of making the Big 4 a Big 5? What is it that gives your player the edge over the others, and what flaw is it that prevented him from doing so? If he fixed it, where do you think he would rank among the Big 5(going by supposed prime).
When talking about the flaw, please, no trolling. The flaw has to be something which the player has shown he can overcome. So no: Nishikori for 5 because if he had the Nadal forehand, Federer footwork and Djokovic backhand, he would own everybody, sort of thing. You would have to provide a match showing his forehand to be on par with Nadal, for example.
My pick for the guy I think had/has massive chances of making a Big 5 would be, believe it or not, Jo Wilfried Tsonga.
When I look at Tsonga I see a man full of possibilities. He's got a wicked forehand, great serve, seems to be dancing on court at times and has shown that he can have deft touch at the net:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=41s
His backhand isn't his strongest shot, but when it's working he can deal some real damage, for example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=07m53s
His forehand can be quite imposing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=10m27s
Tsonga is quite a complete player/has a lot of variation, and has got multiple tools at his disposal to use. Despite all this he hasn't been able to become a Big 5 player, I think this is due to several reasons.
His Miami match vs Nadal shows several issues which have been recurrent throughout his career.
First of all,he's known for making bad choices:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=06m18s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RgPC0wEvug#t=05m10s
Something is not quite right in his head at times. If you've watched matches you'll know what I'm talking about. Going for 'miracle balls', forgetting whether he has a double of a single hander(jack of both backhands, master of none), playing shots which appear to be plain suicide when he thinks the point takes too long. A commentator once said that you never knew what could happen when you're up against Tsonga, as long as you keep the ball in play.
Secondly, It doesn't seem as if he's got the drive to realize all of his potential. I heard a commentator once praise him for being honest, he had said in a press conference that 'he didn't have what it takes' to go on court every day and practice like the top four does. He said it had gotten less when he got a new coach, promptly making the semi's of the AO 2013 where he lost a five setter vs Federer. I thought it was going in the right direction... but then he lost the next tournament(ABN Amro, rotterdam) where he went out in the first round...
Finally, I think he could lose a little bit more weight, not only would it make him faster on court, it would also make him less injury prone, wouldn't it?
You can say that Tsonga can improve on technical aspects(backhand, slice), but his main problem is a mental one. The times when he gets over them, he's a problematic threat to everyone on tour, including the big four.
If he could solve his problems, become more stable and look at things on a match to match basis, I could see him cement his place in the big 5. My pick of the big 5 would then be:
Federer
Nadal
Djokovic
Tsonga
Murray
I could definitely see see Tsonga overtake Murray, seeing as he's got a more agressive, more dominant type of play. Tsonga has said he has problems with Murray his playing style, but I think that if he gets over his mental problems he would be able to turn things around, securing the number four position in the big 5.
As to how he would fare against the other three, it's hard to imagine, but prime vs 'supposed prime' I think they have the edge over him. I don't see him beating them on a consistent basis, I'd guess 6 out of ten matches in favour of any of the top 3.
Note: The top 3 in my example are interchangeable, It's solely about your guy and what place he takes in the big 5. Whether it's Djokovic, Nadal or Federer at number 1 is of lesser importance. Important is whether or not they're above your pick in level of play. I hope to avoid arguments like whether Nadal is better than Federer this way. We already have more than enough of those, don't we?
Do you agree/disagree? If you do, then name your pick.
