Martina Navratilova: Shut Up

Discussion in 'Former Pro Player Talk' started by AngieB, May 2, 2013.

  1. jaggy

    jaggy G.O.A.T.

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    I remember reading about some issue in I believe Florida where Steffi was nude sunbathing and a small plane kept circling overhead and thinking to myself. hmmmm. Or something like that.
     
  2. suwanee4712

    suwanee4712 Professional

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    Hana didn't like Steffi on any level. She gave Steffi the cold shoulder much like Rosie gave to Chris early on and for the same reasons. They hardly spoke to each other until near Hana's retirement. Oddly enough, Hana liked Heidi Graf and got on well with her once it was obvious that Hana was no longer a threat.
     
  3. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Becker and Lendl couldn´t stand each other, either.So much historical hate between Germans and czechs...
     
  4. dannythomas

    dannythomas Semi-Pro

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    It is a joke to put Margaret Court forward as GOAT . A huge percentage of her slams were Australian Opens when hardly any of the top players competed. Often beating other Australians. Whether Steffi or Martina or Serena merit that accolade is debatable. There is a case for any of them. But certainly not Seles. Her 2 handed style on both sides got found out when she was still in her prime. Her game was ugly and she would probably never have won Wimbledon . Serena may be remembered for her serve, Steffi for her forehand and Martina for her net play. Monica for...... Her grunt.
    If there was a 3 way tie Steffi should get it because she let her tennis do the talking and didn't bad mouth opponents or officials. A true champion.
     
  5. Vcore89

    Vcore89 Hall of Fame

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    Court to me is GOAT although I subscribe to Graf being the modern GOAT! Now, MN, while she couldn't deny Court, simply couldn't stomach the indignity of being bumped off as second best (at least).:oops:

    Anyway, I would've loved it to be a four-way horse with Evert, Navralitova, Graf and Seles all collecting 18 Grand Slams apiece. Who would be GOAT? Court, yeah? Sure!:) And Navralitova chairing the debate for... ''Who is second best?''
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2013
  6. Vanhool

    Vanhool Hall of Fame

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    I was a big fan of Martina's, but she does seem pretty bitter/jealous. I think if how generous Chrissy is toward Serena...she just wrote a really nice long piece nominating her for Sportsman of the year (SI), or how kind BJK is to the players that have come after her. I think Martina is just SO competitive, she just can't let it go after all these years. It's kind of sad and annoying, but when I think about it, it's just who she is. Might as well think of it as endearing in its own way...if she wasn't so competitive she wouldn't have been champion all those years. She really wanted to be GOAT and played a long time and put a lot of work in to accomplish that. And she succeeded in a lot of people's eyes, but she wants it all. Must be extra frustrating that Steffi seems so relatively disinterested.
     
  7. Frankc

    Frankc Semi-Pro

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    Just to present the other side...

    Actually, I really enjoy and appreciate her commentary and seek out matches where she handles that role. She is very insightful, candid, and she knows her stuff. For me, she will say what she is thinking - one of the few who will. She does not spend all her energies attempting to coin catchy lines, does not slobber all over the stars, and does not stay within the corporate, PC realm. All the power to you, Martina.
    And in her prime, everyone else was standing still, it seemed.
     
  8. Bryguy011

    Bryguy011 New User

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    I think a lot of these posts are valid and bring up certain points..Graf in no way is to blame for the stabbing..would Seles glam slam dominance continued ? yes most surely and the final tallies would be different..now let's take a look at the facts of graf's behaviour ( remember these are facts) .1) Graf early on only when pressed spoke about Monica after hamburg2) she did not speak out or vote to retain Monica number one ranking while she was away3) she openly complained about Seles protected co number one ranking when Martina ruled on it in 95. 4) she did hint she could possibly complain about Seles grunting in her post semi final press conference at Wimbledon in 92. 5) she signed a lucrative sponsorship deal that monica was about to sign just before the stabbing 6) she whined when she did not get a congrats card from Martina Navratilova when she won her 19 th slam..now I think Martina ( who went to visit Monica several times after Hamburg) was instrumental in getting her back to tennis and Graf sorry did nothing...the thing is it was in graf's best interests and legend status to play Monica in her prime and prove she could win slams again, she proved that in 95-96 but we all know Seles was not even at 75% of her past glory after she retuned..I am not convinced she would have won more than 24 slams without parche ( Seles that is) but she would have won more than steffi and that is probably what gulls Martina also I think she knows more about it than we do..( I don't buy this phone call bit from Graf by the way)...
     
  9. Bryguy011

    Bryguy011 New User

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    Your joking right Graf who wouldn't do interviews after losing didn't pay her taxes and had her father cheat coach her from the stands..all this without going into the whole Seles stabbing you come across as a Graf fan who knows she only got what she got ( 22 slams) because the true number one was out of the game for basically three years of her prime...Seles goes down in the history books for being one of most mentally tough competitors out there btw not her grunt...you lose all credibility with that comment..
     
  10. Bryguy011

    Bryguy011 New User

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    I agree that Seles would not have won 24 plus slams but certainly more than 12 ..you are stating that her previous three years dominate play would simply drop to a new low where the evidence shows she was getting better every year ( a early 93 Seles was certainly much better than a 91 version) and back then 19 years of age was just starting her prime years...faulty logic sorry...
     
  11. Bryguy011

    Bryguy011 New User

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    Of course Graf had more shams she was on the tour since 84 a good five to six years before Monica started playing at all which also explains the 6-4 head to head as the younger player always gets beat up at he beginning of a match up..what the poster was saying and you fail to acknowledge is thAt since monca strAted coming into her own she was winning everything except Wimbledon 4 basically three years that ended in an insane moment in Hamburg in 93... Graf fans hate that and try to spin it so many different ways the truth hurts....Serena Williams I hope will beat this inflated record And I hope Monica is there to giver her 23 slam trophy...
     
  12. Thetouch

    Thetouch Rookie

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    It´s really simple:

    Seles, returns after 2.5 years and gets straight to the US Open final against Graf where she loses in 3 sets and still destroys her 6:0 in the 2nd set. Then she goes on to win the AO in 1996.

    Now, what does that tell you about the women´s competiton back then? Seles was nowhere near her best at that time, not physically and certainly not psychologically but she still could kick ass. Actually Graf should have won like every Slam while Seles was absent, but she didn´t. It´s just a shame that this dumb ****** Parche destroyed the only thing that was worth watching in women´s tennis back then.
     
    vive le beau jeu ! likes this.
  13. ScentOfDefeat

    ScentOfDefeat Hall of Fame

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    First of all, the premise is wrong. It is not a universal truth that the younger player always loses at the beginning of a match-up. It is true nowadays, because the new generations are simply incapable of overtaking the older champions. But what in fact was often the case in tennis history is that younger players who would become champions would start beating the older players sooner rather than later. Look at how Connors, Becker, Sampras or even Federer came along - immediately beating champions from the past generation. Second of all, the Graf-Seles rivalry until 1993 goes Graf-Graf-Graf-Seles-Seles-Graf-Graf-Seles-Graf-Seles. This suggests an ongoing rivalry with ups and downs, not the "older player beating up the younger player" and the "Seles-becoming-utterly-dominant" scenarios you're describing.
     
  14. mattosgrant

    mattosgrant Semi-Pro

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    My head hurts just trying to decipher your attempts of the English language.

    I do agree with you on only one thing, or atleast one thing I think you said through all that butchered English. I also hope Serena wins more slams than Graf, but only since Serena is the best.
     
  15. mattosgrant

    mattosgrant Semi-Pro

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    Yes like Graf is the only champion to ever receive some coaching from the stands. I guess you forget Justine Henin, who had Carlos Rodriguez use hand signals on practically every single point she played her whole career. Graf never had anything even close to approaching that.

    Also how do you know exactly what occured with the taxes unless you are a personal friend or family member of Steffi's (which I highly doubt). Her father is a known scumbag who had numerous affairs, been charged with assaults, been charged with money laundering on other instances, etc....To just presume Graf was the one at fault without any evidence is laughable.
     
  16. 97GOAT

    97GOAT New User

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    Do you agree with me that the break was what killed Seles' comeback? To me, it was just too long. No one would have any hope of a return to their best form mentally if they take a 2yr break. The stabbing was a crippling event yes, but seeing as it healed in months and it took her years to come back, it just seems to me she really dwelled on it. And that's what really led to her not being mentally tough anymore.
     
  17. Thetouch

    Thetouch Rookie

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    Yes I remember the medias saying that she was already ok by mid/end of 1993 as far as her stabbing wound went and she was expected to return in late 1993 or early 1994. Maybe she wanted to take a break as long as possible to enjoy her life outside of tennis or she just lost her passion for tennis at that time. Still it would have been the return of the decade if she beat Graf at the US Open 1995, she was close enough anyway.
     
  18. elkwood

    elkwood Rookie

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    A lot of u are forgetting about her fathers illness. I think that would have had a really
    big impact on her slam total in that time period
     
  19. pat200

    pat200 New User

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    she was able to return physically to play by wimbledon. that's how little the physical injury was. the psychological one though, took her quite a long time to deal with it.
     
  20. mattosgrant

    mattosgrant Semi-Pro

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    I agree Monica's fathers illness would have affected her results adversely in the 96-98 period regardless. That she was dealing with the layoff, losing momentum, loss of fitness, and any other aftermath of the stabbing, just made it that much worse.
     
  21. Bryguy011

    Bryguy011 New User

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    I have a feeling from reading your reply that a lot of things would make your head hurt..try to debate without insulting people it makes you look immature and petty...
     
  22. Bryguy011

    Bryguy011 New User

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    Sorry we disagree Seles had won 8 of the last 11 slams she played ..in the last three years she was dominating the sport and had the edge that's why she was number one in fact I really believe she had a shot at winning Wimbledon in 92 if not for the grunt BS.respectively I hear this argument all the time from Graf fans ( btw maybe you are not a fan don't know) but I agree it was a true rivalry and I am sure grAf would have beat Seles but Seles was the better player numbers don't lie ....my point on the head to head was Monica was 15 when they played three times in 89 when she was barely 100 pounds had no serve and was playing part time so of course Graf was better she was the number one and dominating the sport ...it takes time to develop a game ( even back then) so the wins would come later on against the top players if you are good enough...
     

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