Me hitting a few balls (5.5)

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by tennis_pr0, Nov 26, 2011.

  1. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    Me hitting a few balls (5.0-5.5)

    This is the last video I will upload for a while. This is a good quality video, some ground strokes with one of my students and another teaching pro at my club. They are hitting two on one against me. I also played a couple service games. Enjoy and feel free to comment!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFGY3d77gpw&feature=youtu.be

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jVsoviCSfY&list=UU5YkphkE-MHFInR9l68OTqg&index=1&feature=plcp

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Srq1_hxBXAc&feature=youtu.be

    This is the last month of working hard to tighten up a few loose ends with my backhand, the preparation with my left arm, shorter back swing and keeping my elbow in have made a big difference.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_czF1keNP7k&feature=youtu.be

    This is a recent video I took tonight with a friend who is a 4.5. I have two side views. I also have some volleys. I have been working on my backhand for a month, literally a thousand backhands a day, and have fixed a few things with it.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFCyRB2jbC4&feature=youtu.be

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlO99OJulME&feature=youtu.be

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UF1kZcD2h8&feature=youtu.be
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2012
    #1
  2. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    I will put match play up soon
     
    #2
  3. pabletion

    pabletion Professional

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    YOU SUCK! 3.25 AT BEST!


    just kiddin... thanks for posting, I really enjoy watching TTW members playin/hittin. Few are the ones who dare to and dont care about crab comments
     
    #3
  4. Bacterio

    Bacterio Rookie

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    What's up with your backhand? I doubt this is the first time you hear it, so you're probably used to answering this question.

    Is it the takeback? or the way you bring it forward? It just looks really awkward so I'm genuinely wondering what you're doing different.
     
    #4
  5. limitup

    limitup Professional

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    Interesting backhand the way you lay the racquet back as if you're going to hit a slice on every shot ...

    FYI you're going to get creamed in this thread. Good luck! :)
     
    #5
  6. Ballinbob

    Ballinbob Hall of Fame

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    His backhand is interesting, but it obviously works fine. He hits pretty solidly
     
    #6
  7. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    If you watch some pros who have one handed backhand a lot of them bend their wrist back a littls bit, i just do it a little more. I just flex my wrist back by habit on the backswing. I dont care at all about negative comments if i get any, i just thought it would be cool to post a little video. I play open tournaments and have a ntrp of 5.0. I am somewhere in between 5.0-5.5.
     
    #7
  8. Jonny S&V

    Jonny S&V Hall of Fame

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    I'm not going to argue whether you're a 5.5 or not, since that's results based and we don't have those, but I will say that you are trying to mix the old-school with the new-school.

    You hit a WW forehand, but you close your stance off. There's a time an a place for this shot (such as approach-shots and angled forehands) but I can't help but think you could get easier pace/depth by hitting semi-open/open. It's still a very nice forehand.

    My backhand take-back used to be like yours, but when I changed it to a more 'traditional' take-back (strings pointing behind you versus to the sky) I had more flexibility in the spin and pace I was able to produce. Again, still a nice backhand, and if you don't want to change anything, you can still play your high level of tennis and beyond.

    Also, just a pet-peeve, I HATE it when players hold the racquet with their off hand on the strings. Just an irrational observation. ;-)
     
    #8
  9. bad_call

    bad_call Legend

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    could you speed up the ball machine a bit? i mean i downed a beer and had a smoke between ball strikes.
     
    #9
  10. Up&comer

    Up&comer Hall of Fame

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    ^^ what drives me insane is when people are on a ball machine and just run to where the next ball will be before it's shot rather than practice it like an actual shot.

    Your backhand, like you've heard, baffles me. You have you racket so open before you swing, and then you just suddenly whip it around at the last second. Again, baffles me that you time it so well.

    It will be interesting to see you in a match situation.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2011
    #10
  11. maggmaster

    maggmaster Hall of Fame

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    If he has an NTRP of 5.0 then these strokes work to the upper echelons of rec play. What does your playing background look like?
     
    #11
  12. Ducker

    Ducker Rookie

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    Interesting. Cant wait to see some match play. I dont understand why you would run the ball machine so slow if your alternating sides. I assume your looking for opinions on your video since you posted it so ill give you mine. I think its really a waste to shuffle step like you are on the ball machine. You should be hitting, recovering to middle and then reacting to the next ball. It looks really dumb the way your doing it, and as a 5.0-5.5 player I would assume you would know that. You could be practicing so much harder, really. Other than that forehand and backhand look effective. I wanna see how they hold up underpressure. I cant wait to see some real competitive footage because I consider myself a 5.0 and would like to compair. If you lived in san diego id love to play too bad....
     
    #12
  13. Fugazi

    Fugazi Professional

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    Looks more like 5.0 to me. Good racquet head speed on the FH. BH definitely flawed, would like to see how it holds under pressure. Footwork also looks like 5.0 rather than 5.5.
     
    #13
  14. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    Don't take this the wrong way and I mean no offense as this is a simple honest question but...

    Why on earth do you hit your backhand that way? Obviously you've put a lot of time into your strokes and apparently they are effective if you are winning / playing in 5.0 tournaments but... I don't get it. I would think that over the years with lessons, and hitting w/ people and hitting against the wall and playing w/ friends and watching matches on tv and filming yourself and competitive matches and watching youtube vids etc you would have worked on attaining a backhand form that was more conventional.

    It looks like you have that stroke pretty grooved and you're making good contact so I'm sure you've put in tons of time practicing it that way but I'm just curious why you chose to swing like that. I could be wrong but it looks like it would not hold up to pressure. It also seems to cause you to lean over when you hit but that could be unrelated... not sure.

    Also, are you able to hit a deep looping bh with that stroke? And I didnt see you go dtl with it. Can you?

    And I agree w/ others who said that shuffle step with the machine set that way is kind of a waste. Recovering to the middle and reacting would be a more effective use of your practice time.

    Thanks
     
    #14
  15. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    This is probably the biggest thing you can improve. The side to side shuffle
    (w/o a cross over step) is probably the LEAST efficient and slowest
    way to move when covering a longer distance. Use this only once you are
    close to the ball or for moving small a distance to adjust you body to be the right
    distance to the balll. I usually see this from people who learned this footwork as a
    kid at some point and then use it as a primary, rather than a secondary footwork
    movement for some reason, maybe through a misunderstanding in footwork.
    The reason why I think this is a learned way of moving is b/c it is not a
    natural way to move. You'll never see little kids moving like this in a playground
    when they are running after something.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
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  16. guitarplayer

    guitarplayer Guest

    My thoughts.
     
    #16
  17. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    The take back on my backhand does not affect my backhand because it is just the take back part that I open my strings on...just a habit I have I guess. I can hit topspin jusyt as effectively if I had a "straighter" take back.
     
    #17
  18. TennisCoachFLA

    TennisCoachFLA Banned

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    The rating system is flawed and subject to wide interpretation. Tonlars considers himself a 5.5, of course being modest.

    What we have in these videos is a 5.0 forehand and footwork and backhand not at that level. No true 5.5 would ever shuffle like a little girl out for a sunday stroll.
     
    #18
  19. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    #19
  20. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    I just do it a little more than the "average" I guess you could say. It does not mean the stroke is flawed.
     
    #20
  21. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    I was not playing a match, so I was just shuffling along the baseline side to side hitting a few backhands and forehands. Yes the ball machine could have been faster, or doing random feed, yes if I was playing a match I would not "shuffle" along the baseline like that. I was just casually hitting a few forehands and backhands.
     
    #21
  22. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    Actually, yours and Fed's takeback are quite different.

    On yours the hitting side of the racquet faces toward the sky on the
    takeback.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLDtYnttwjE&feature=player_detailpage#t=7s

    Fed's hitting side of the racquet faces toward the left side fence and he has a much bigger shoulder turn.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oX7CcDIkMhE&feature=player_detailpage
     
    #22
  23. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    #23
  24. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    If you pause the video at 7 seconds you will see his take back and my take back are similar. Yes, mine is more extreme, but it is still similar.
     
    #24
  25. Fugazi

    Fugazi Professional

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    I guess I'm not the only one to suggest that you don't quite look like a 5.5. What's your story? (considering that most 5.5s have had a good deal of competitive success).
     
    #25
  26. TennisCoachFLA

    TennisCoachFLA Banned

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    Just teasing a fellow coach a little bit. You obviously know that the footwork shown there is too lazy and not '5.5' footwork.

    I am sure you tell your students "practice as you would play a match...preferably with even more intensity". My students practice less than half the time of the kids on the next court, but with 4 times the intensity.
     
    #26
  27. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    A little more? Not to be combative but your take back doesn't look anything like roger's at all.
    Too bad we dont have hd vid of your swing. It's too fast and i can't see how you even get under the ball like that to hit up on it.
    And your whole swing is ... hmm.... i dont know how to explain it.... it starts on the side of your body and ... like the whole swing takes place in a small constrained area. i can't say what i mean here. Like if you look at just the handle of your racket it doesnt go behind you or in back of you and under the ball and all those locations. Can anyone here say what I'm trying to convey here? haha

    But... you are making good contact it seems and it does have a pop. I just dont understand why you wouldnt put in the hours to get a more fundamentally sound stroke. I think you bh would rly pop if u did that.

    And you didnt answer my Q about hitting down the line.
    thanks
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
    #27
  28. vincent_tennis

    vincent_tennis Professional

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    so what NTRP would you rate him as?
     
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  29. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    I never said it looks like Roger's, I am simply saying that laying the wrist back so the strings are pointing up does not mean the stroke is flawed. Federer clearly does it.
     
    #29
  30. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    Ok. it doesnt look like Roger's.

    I'm just asking 'why' you do it that way. I'm just curious. I'm not saying it sucks or it's bad or you should change. I'm simply asking why you prefer to hit it that way and I'm curious as to why you continued with that form even though I'm sure there have been many ppl telling u to change or not to do that etc etc. I'm just asking that's all. Do you do that because it works effectively enough for you so you didnt want to mess with what was working for you? Or did you not realize what your stroke looked like and that it was a little unconventional until you had it working for you and it was producing results and you decided not to change it? Or do you do it that way because it provides you with some advantage somehow.

    And can you hit it down the line?
     
    #30
  31. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    Top be honest I always knew my racquet face was a bit up on the take back, I just never thought anything of it. I don't do it that way for a specific reason, it is just the way that feels comfortable with me. I never changed it because I never felt it posed a problem. Any yes, I can go dtl with it with ease.
     
    #31
  32. Cheetah

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    Cool. Ok. thanks.

    Would like to see some match vid if u get around to it. Thanks.
     
    #32
  33. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    I will def put a match play video up soon. I took all these videos with my phone, so when I get a chance to borrow my roommates camera I will get some good footage up. Within the next week for sure.
     
    #33
  34. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

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    Yeah, I think you should be looking at the fundamental parts of Federer's stroke rather than using him as example of why yours is somehow similar. There are barely any differences between the two backhands in reality but there are many ways to hit the ball.

    If you really think you have hallmarks of Federer's backhand - I'm not saying you do - you should read the good advice some here will offer. As I and others have said here before, using video to improve is a lesson in how to be objective - having a view of things as they are, as opposed to how you think they are. Without that the whole effort becomes a bit pointless.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
    #34
  35. Cheetah

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    I agree.
    And also you can pick literally any video of any player amateur or pro on youtube and pause it a one second and say it looks similar to roger's bh take back at this second. haha.:)
     
    #35
  36. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    #36
  37. Fugazi

    Fugazi Professional

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    Still waiting for your "credentials" or least an idea of why you consider yourself 5.5... Because you don't quite look like 5.5.
     
    #37
  38. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    I ma not saying my backhand looks like Federer's, I am not saying that at all. I simply used his video as an example to show that players sometimes tilt the string sup on the tack back on the one handed backhand and that it is not a technical flaw to do so.
     
    #38
  39. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    If you could get a hd cam that would b good. i'd like to see what the racket is doing on your bh
     
    #39
  40. Chanto

    Chanto Rookie

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    Is it obvious only to me that NTRP is determined by one's ability to win matches rather than their form? It baffles me how people here can say that you're not a 5.5 when there's no match play here.

    Maybe I'm just stupid.
     
    #40
  41. athiker

    athiker Hall of Fame

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    If you pause at 6 or 7 seconds yes its similar but what happens after than is what is different. Pause it at 8 seconds. Fed drops the racquet almost straight down behind him from 7 to 8 where you seem to start the racquet forward while still in "slice" position and flip the racquet face vertical later in the stroke than Fed. Fed's racquet face is turned vertical and dropped at the end of his takeback and then has a long low to high path. Of course it is easier to see exactly what he is doing in slow-mo vs you in full speed.

    I'm several NTRP levels below you so its not like I'm commenting from a high level. I have eyes and can watch a video though. I don't understand why so many post videos and then spend their time defending against comments. Isn't the point to elicit comments and hope someone makes a useful one so that the player can improve...no matter the level? I'm not really picking on you, but the classic that always gets me is the person that posts a video of them serving only to get comments about using the legs more or more of an archer's bow, etc....then they come back and say, "Oh, I wasn't hitting full out, those were just warmup serves."....Huh? Why the heck post warmup serves if you are expecting any type of useful comments! :grin:

    Anyway, I've been waiting to get that off my chest for a while...I feel better now! Good luck playing, you do seem to make solid contact.
     
    #41
  42. Fugazi

    Fugazi Professional

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    So by your logic you can't tell that an 8 year old is lower than 5.5 unless there is match play or official results? Unless the guy has a HUGE serve, it's highly doubtful that he's 5.5. His BH is flawed (ok it's awkward at best), so we can't just give him the benefit of the doubt. BTW we're still waiting for an explanation of the 5.5 rating... Self-rating? Competitive history please. If there is no significant competitive history, then 5.5 is simply out of the question (even 5.0 is doubtful).
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
    #42
  43. Jonny S&V

    Jonny S&V Hall of Fame

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    Anyone under the age of 18 isn't subject to NTRP rules. There are exceptions (18 year olds in leagues, playing opens, etc...), but your logic doesn't hold.

    His backhand isn't flawed, it's just different. It's very similar to Guga's, albeit with a less-extreme grip. From his video of his form, we can't really say that he is any NTRP, but based on our best judgement, I'm going to venture a guess that he's a 4.5, which means he can hit all the shots. Since 4.5+ is results based, we either have to trust him or ask him to post his results (which he doesn't and shouldn't have to do).
     
    #43
  44. Chanto

    Chanto Rookie

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    By my logic, you can't definitively state his rating unless you see his match play. Though unlikely, it is still possible that there is a 5.5 8 year old, and although doubtful, it is still possible, and you cannot definitively say that an 8 year old will never be a 5.5.

    Bring your logical fallacies elsewhere.
     
    #44
  45. Ballinbob

    Ballinbob Hall of Fame

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    I don't see how his backhand is flawed ....? He hits it just fine and its consistent. Stop hating on him so much
     
    #45
  46. tennis_pr0

    tennis_pr0 Semi-Pro

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeQK3aEBST4

    This is slow motion. You can see I start my take back similar to many pros, with the strings pointing up in the beginning, I just leave them up for a moment longer, but the forward drive to the contact point is the same as any other one handed bh.....
     
    #46
  47. Chanto

    Chanto Rookie

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    your backhand is fine
     
    #47
  48. DavaiMarat

    DavaiMarat Professional

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    Nice vid. Different looking backhand. Wrong? There's no wrong way to hit the ball if it goes where and how you want it to.

    As for the rating, who cares? If the OP want to think he's a 5.5 who are we to tell him different. Whether we agree or not is another story.

    Anything above 5.0 your pedigree talks for itself. Youve probably been ranked in your state and have a competent tourney history. Whether he wants to reveal his name or not is another story or not, I personally respect his right to privacy.

    To the Op, don't get worked up over any comments. There are some in here who just love to argue yet they are the same people who never post anything. Kudos to you.
     
    #48
  49. Ballinbob

    Ballinbob Hall of Fame

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    Listen to this guy. Good post and QFT
     
    #49
  50. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    well i have to admit it looks better in slo mo... or less weird anyway.:)
    still kinda funky at point of contact and just after. it looks like you could improve your backhand considerably and easily w/ some adjustments but i guess u dont wana change.

    It looks like right at contact and after.. your hand/wrist/arm goes back to slice mode. Could be better w/ some more drive thru. I guess.
    I don't know. it's ok but could be a lot better. and by better i mean w/ your skillset and hours logged etc. Doesnt seem like it would take much effort to elliminate the weird stuff and I think you'd have a better bh. Anyway that's my opinion.

    edit: thanks for the post btw
     
    #50

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