More PED Allegations

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Lefty78, Jul 25, 2013.

  1. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Djoko has the 2nd best 5th set record after Rafa among active players and that's careerwise, not since 2011. 5 setters Djoko won before 2011:
    - vs Monfils: USO 2005 (7-5 in the 5th set)
    - vs Garcia-Lopez: W 2005 (6-4 in last set)
    - vs Wawrinka: DC 2006 (6-4 in last set)
    - vs Gonzalez: RG 2006 (6-1 in last set)
    - vs Stepanek: USO 2007 (7-6 in last set)
    - vs Baghdatis: W 2007 (7-5 in last set)
    - vs Patience: RG 2007 (6-3 in last set)
    - vs Robredo: USO 2008 (6-3)
    - vs Troicki: USO 2010 (6-3)
    - vs Rochus: W 2010 (6-2)
    - vs Isner: DC 2010 (6-4)
    - vs Federer: USO 2010 (7-5)

    Djoko has never retired in a 5th set. His health issues were with allergy and breathing, never with stamina.
     
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  2. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Yes, I'm always sinister, I confess, but seriously look at this dog's breakfast of a definition of troll:


    In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people,[1] by posting inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a forum, chat room, or blog), either accidentally[3][4] or with the deliberate intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[5] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[6]


     
    #52
  3. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Again, Haas's "monster level" is not sudden. He's always had it. He's just matured in his 30's and doesn't mentally berate himself on court like he used to, he controls his emotions much better now than he used to.

    BTW, you do realize that stamina increases in your 30's don't you? Most of the best triathletes are in their 30's. When I was a teenager and in my 20's, I couldn't even run a mile without being totally exhausted and usually couldn't even make a mile. In my 30's, I had no problem running 4-5 miles.
     
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  4. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    No he doesn't. He's never retired at USO (but his opponents have retired 3 times against him in the last 2 years :)). His retirements never had anything to do with physical endurance but with breathing issues (which is why most of them happened on clay).
     
    #54
  5. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    That has never been verified in tennis, no. Players usually don't have their best results at 35. He's always had it? No kidding? 2013 was the first time ever Haas reached the quarter at RG. Last time he reached R16 was in 2009. (He'd also lost in the 1st round of W since 2009). Hey it could just be intense training but...one has a right to wonder since we know for a fact that tennis players are involved (Miami based tennis players).
     
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  6. clayqueen

    clayqueen Hall of Fame

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    Players don't retire saying they haven't got the stamina to continue. They always site health reasons.
     
    #56
  7. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Whatever he "cites", he's always had an excellent record in 5 setters, which proves his problem was neither stamina nor endurance.
     
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  8. THE FIGHTER

    THE FIGHTER Professional

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    obviously these are new age trolls. they just dont stack up to the strong field of trolls we've had in the past. the donald youngs, bernard tomics, and milos raonics of trolls.
     
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  9. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Haas is not having his best results at age 35. If he was, he'd be at least #2 in the world again, but he's not currently even in the Top 10.
     
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  10. monfed

    monfed Guest

    Gym boy has done well to keep his unending energy level as seen in AO 09 under wraps.
     
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  11. Gorecki

    Gorecki G.O.A.T.

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    Say hello to my good friend Fuentes!
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2013
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  12. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Fuentes practised his trade in a legal system that did not punish his activities and this was and is not uncommon.
     
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  13. roberttennis54

    roberttennis54 Semi-Pro

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    I like Tommy Haas. Nice game, bad temper interesting to watch, but though he is no where near his best, his performances at 35 are a bit odd. He has had many injuries and not so much mileage, but there is reason for suspicion.

    However, Haas is hardly the most suspicious player on the tour, though he is one of the most likely to be connected with an american clinic.
     
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  14. Chico

    Chico Banned

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    What you are saying is simply not true. He never had endurance problems. He had other problems, like with allergies. He had many long hard matches before 2011. Also he had more retirements in 2011 than in 2010.

    Many other players' breakthrough years are not really different (say McEnroe 1981, Wilander 1988, Sampras 1933, Federer 2004, Djokovic 2011).

    All these false allegations have been disproved many times here, but you people keep repeating lies, hoping to make them truth. Sorry, but it does not work that way.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2013
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  15. RF_fan

    RF_fan Semi-Pro

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    What makes you think there are no more of these clinics around the world? Where there is demand, suppliers will come.
     
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  16. TheNatural

    TheNatural Legend

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    Feds back pain could be caused by long term ped usage or ped withdrawal.
     
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  17. Mainad

    Mainad G.O.A.T.

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    I didn't notice the article stating that the offenders were all Miami-based. It's perfectly possible that many of them came from outside the area. If this clinic had a well-established reputation amongst those sports people inclined to dope then they may well come from far and wide, not just Florida.
     
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  18. ivan_the_terrible

    ivan_the_terrible Hall of Fame

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    Very true, his endurance, powerful serve and fitness over his career has been nothing short of incredible. I'm surprised his PED usage has manifested itself in this way though. I would've expected lower body issues due to the amount of HC tournaments he's played.
     
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  19. LaneMyer

    LaneMyer Rookie

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    back pain isn't a byproduct of PED usage. Knee injuries from carrying unnatural weight, quad tears/strains, oblique strains, increased risk of tendinitis, tendon ruptures and joint pain, palpitations, Cardiomyopathy, Acromegaly (enlarged jaw, brow, skull, hands and feet), and increased dehydration from those that are abusing designer PEDs like HGH are the traditional indicators. I'm talking about visible effects here, and those from designer PEDs, not anabolic. I suspect if Fed is/were on anything it's likely only an EPO type endurance substance. Overt sweating is also a function of HGH use and dude doesn't sweat. His frame is too thin for even low-dose lean muscle builders and he has never really shown indicators of the other byproducts with his injury history. Synthetic testosterone is more difficult to peg visually and has some of the effects of anabolic PEDs and can lead to reduced fertility and birth defects. I think Fed is clear in that department. Most of it's byproducts will be high blood pressure, reduction of good cholesterol levels, and heart disease. It can also cause prostate enlargement, acne, greasy or yellowing skin, and edema (swelling of feet and ankles).
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2013
    #69
  20. LaneMyer

    LaneMyer Rookie

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    Biogenesis was a small hole in the wall operation and if you look at the list of the names released of baseball players, they were either Latin American players that live in Miami in the off-season, or had ties to the University of Miami. I'll be surprised if the list produces more than a couple tennis players although perhaps it could be a big name or two considering one top 2 male player and 2 top 5 female players live in Miami (at least part of the year).
     
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  21. DeShaun

    DeShaun Banned

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    When you woke up today, did you make it your mission to enfeeble an utterly speculative flamer by subjecting him to concrete information?
     
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  22. Federer20042006

    Federer20042006 Banned

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    Steroid taking is associated with back problems, I believe.

    I still say Federer's guilty, less-than-enthusiastic looks last year were the result of guilt over PED use, and the silver lining in that is it implies he was clean during the years he dominated tennis.

    That said, it's kind of hard to believe he was clean in 04-06, given how ridiculous he was those years.
     
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  23. LaneMyer

    LaneMyer Rookie

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    The only PED or stimulant that I've ever seen that has direct ties to back pain is Modafinil (Provigil) which is a stimulant commonly prescribed for sleeping disorders - narcolepsy, sleep apnea etc and back pain is a possible side effect along with about ten other symptoms. If Fed were looking for an edge in the stimulant dept I would suspect he'd head for Adderall before this particular drug.
     
    #73
  24. LotusTang

    LotusTang Rookie

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    In regards to the bio-genesis scandal, so now what? Should one cast a side eye at other American players (since apparently Odesnik is said to be involved) or other players that train in Miami?
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2013
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  25. salsainglesa

    salsainglesa Semi-Pro

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    Well, let me take a guess, a wild one, but maybe... there are more "clinics" like biogenesis!!!

    I don't know... could that be true?!
     
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  26. THUNDERVOLLEY

    THUNDERVOLLEY G.O.A.T.

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    The general pattern of "doping" threads"

    1. Name just about every player, but push the charges in the direction of Nadal and Djokovic. Murray recieves litte attention.

    2. Of all top players, one is spared finger pointing more than others.

    Telling.
     
    #76
  27. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    All those continentals wear too much hair gel so they're clearly too slick for their own good.
     
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  28. LotusTang

    LotusTang Rookie

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    Here:

    Maybe it's because there is more circumstantial evidence (or incidents) surrounding other players. Note that I'm not saying anyone is above suspicion just that some players are clearly more suspicious than others.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2013
    #78
  29. objectivity

    objectivity Banned

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    i think its important to remember that the purpose of PED started as basically to improve explosive strength. hence the sports that really pioneered use of PED are the likes of track and field (especially sprinting) and swimming. cycling, distance running and other endurance sports are very recent additions to the list relatively.

    why is this important? because if suspicion is to be raised in tennis, then i think its probably more plausible that certain players with extraordinary power are PED abusers than players who rely on craft and point construction.

    federer has a more powerful forehand than nadal, no?
     
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  30. the green god

    the green god Semi-Pro

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    Man up, quit hiding.
     
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  31. mellowyellow

    mellowyellow Hall of Fame

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    To my knowledge cycling was evident in the early 80's. Is 30+ years, probably longer, recent to you?
     
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