Murray could be the next GOAT

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Spider, Jan 10, 2009.

?

Murray could be the next GOAT

  1. Agree - he has the complete package and will be the GOAT

    6.9%
  2. Not sure - he could very well be but lets give him time

    26.4%
  3. Disagree - He should first win a slam before thinking about GOAT

    66.7%
  1. Spider

    Spider Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,247
    Location:
    UK
    Murray could be the next GOAT

    Lets see, he is a complete package at the moment with no weakness at all - great first serve, consistent forehand, excellent double handed backhand (with one of the best slices in the game), fantastic mover on the court, has tremendous feel at the net, and has bulked up a lot in the off season.

    It's a matter of time before he starts dominating the complete tour. I'm sure most would agree that that he is the man to beat on the hard courts now and will definitely win lots of slams on them. Wimbledon will be something he should win (multiple times as well) because I don't see a reason why his game can't translate into grass with his variety.

    I think the question is whether he can win the RG, which will be the big question in most people's mind. I would love to see Murray - Nadal face off at the clay events this year to see where exactly is Murray on clay (I wont be surprised if Murray is the man who ends up stopping Nadal's reign at RG). It's exciting times ahead for this extremely talented player, and I would feel honoured to watch his career grow over the years. :)
     
    #1
  2. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,261
    LOL...not being funny but I couldn't disagree more.

    Have you not been watching his 2nd serve? What about when he was self destructing in so many matches not even 6 months ago, I think when the pressure is on he this behaviour will show it's ugly head again.

    How many great players have we seen that have come and gone and not been able to win a slam? Nalbandian anyone??

    Look at Safin people thought once he had won the USO (notice that he had actually won a slam) people thought he would change and dominate the game. He didn't for many reasons...........

    His game will not touch Nadal on clay...or he would have shown more promise on clay before he has always played well on HC but never really showed up on clay at all!

    Plus we have yet to see who is a bad match up for Murray and can consistantly cause him problems....
     
    #2
  3. Spider

    Spider Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,247
    Location:
    UK
    It's scary to think how much he has improved over the last 6 months or so and continues to improve at an alarming rate, so I wouldn't rule that out either.

    On the hard courts I don't think there are many players that could trouble this Murray. He seems to be in his own league at the moment.
     
    #3
  4. Breaker

    Breaker Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    7,725
    Murray bandwagon in full force now..
     
    #4
  5. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,261
    Hell Yeah he has improved but noticed he didn't win the USO and what if he doesn't win A.O what then? The longer he goes on without winning a slam the more pressure will build.

    Plus he is about to have THE most physically and mentally challenging season in his career, how will he deal with it?

    Lots of questions to be answered only time will tell. I'm convinced he will win one slam let alone multiple......but for sure he has the game and skill to win slams....
     
    #5
  6. [​IMG]

    Great player? Yes.
    Is he going to have a great year? Probably.
    Is there any indication that he could be the next GOAT? Not as of yet.
     
    #6
  7. Spider

    Spider Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,247
    Location:
    UK
    That was his first slam final, nerves played a huge part in that loss. This guy seems to be playing at some other level at the moment so these nerves wont bother him this time (should he reach the final).

    The way he treated a player of Roddick's caliber was very similar to how Fed used to play Roddick in his hey days. Thats GOAT stuff!

    Can he beat Nadal on clay? We might get that answer this clay season, and I can't wait for it.
     
    #7
  8. TennezSport

    TennezSport Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    1,885
    Location:
    Northern NJ, USA
    Riding the fence, so far..........

    I am riding the fence on this one but I do believe that Murray has the talent and ability to do it. The biggest question for him is can he keep his composure in the GS tournys.

    He has the best variety of shot selection and great hands at the net. He is very fit, confident and covers the court as well as Rafa. Spin will not hurt him and he has no fear of anyone at the moment. He even has confidence on clay having spent a great deal of time on the dirt.

    Comparing him to Nalbandian and Safin is not fair as both of those talented players lost out due to partying and Andy has so far shown that he is a hard worker; unlike Nalby or Safin.

    Regarding Andys second serve, it is his weakest shot but he is improving it as we saw this week. It's no worse that Rafa's first or second serve on average, so I think he will be a great danger this year. Really depends on his mind. 2K9 will be very interesting.

    Cheers, TennezSport :cool:
     
    #8
  9. NickC

    NickC Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2007
    Messages:
    1,436
    Location:
    East Coast, USA. Formally Tucson, AZ
    Ugh, you're right. 4 wins over Fed and the bandwagon is at full speed. When will it stop? I hope Murray's form dips so this bandwagon has it's wheels cut off.
     
    #9
  10. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,261
    I dont think he was nervous he just got beat easily it wasn't like when Djoko played federer and actually had set points and played them badly and SHOULD have won that final.

    As for the Roddick thing....I think it's safe to say that Roddick is past his best......and every dog has his day to say that is GOAT material, it's just one match?

    Nope he can't beat Nadal on clay....come on he has shown NOTHING on clay are we to believe that he will go from zero to hero in one season on clay?
     
    #10
  11. Telepatic

    Telepatic Legend

    Joined:
    May 5, 2008
    Messages:
    7,167
    Location:
    Serbia, Belgrade
    .............................................

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #11
  12. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2007
    Messages:
    9,164
    Location:
    Caught in No Man's Land
    What about Tsonga? The guys got all the skills.

    What about Safin? One of the most talented players to ever play. What happened to him?
     
    #12
  13. maximo

    maximo Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2008
    Messages:
    3,327
    Location:
    London
    In reality, Murray with the way hes playing should win one GS this year. If he doesnt, i will be very surprised indeed.
     
    #13
  14. Spider

    Spider Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,247
    Location:
    UK
    I think it was nerves and his semi final match with Nadal, which lasted 2 days (and was very physical match), which had its implications for the final. Lets see what happens at this year's AO to know exactly how good can Murray be in the best of 5 scenario.

    Roddick maybe past his prime, but passing him left and right was very similar to Fed (I know that doesnt qualify for GOAT but shows the extreme talent that this kid possesses)

    You're right Nadal on clay may be a very different ball game this year, but considering the way this guy has improved, I would still like to see where exactly he stands and if he takes him to the limit then we can have our answers.
     
    #14
  15. EPaps

    EPaps Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Messages:
    235
    Location:
    Happy Valley
    he needs to win a slam first, but he's going in the right direction.
     
    #15
  16. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,261
    Nerves generally show in a match, double faults, clipping the net alot, missed timed hitting etc etc....He didn't show any of that I think he was just out played. Plus he wasnt tired so I dont think that counts either? But just my opinion.

    Sometimes you just lose to a better player?

    Difference between Fed and Murray was Fed was spanking Roddick when he was on fire...see A.O 05.....but yep I agree he has emense talent but so do about 50 other players on the ATP.

    He needs to convert some of that talent into slams and titles etc....

    Well considering how long the clay season is and how dominant Nadal is over the past 3/4 seasons....I doubt Murray could beat him, he would have to hit insane winners all over the place and to do that for a best of 5 set, not going to happen. Federer, Djoko >>> Murray on clay.
     
    #16
  17. TennezSport

    TennezSport Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    1,885
    Location:
    Northern NJ, USA
    Falling..........

    Ive fallen off the wagon and can't get up :twisted:

    Let him win one or two or more slams first, please, but I believe, I do believe, I do believe :wink:

    Cheers, TennezSport :cool:
     
    #17
  18. Gorecki

    Gorecki G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Messages:
    13,229
    Location:
    Puerto y Galgo....
    #18
  19. edmondsm

    edmondsm Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2005
    Messages:
    6,902
    Location:
    In an in between place.
    Bring this thread back if Murray has won 8 or 9 slams over then next 4 years.
     
    #19
  20. Sentinel

    Sentinel Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2008
    Messages:
    30,233
    Location:
    Somewhere over the rainbow
    band ... wagon .. spider ... LOL
     
    #20
  21. S H O W S T O P P E R !

    S H O W S T O P P E R ! Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,938
    Location:
    In your thredz, stealin ur bukkits
    His second serve is bad and I still think he isn't mentally strong enough to be a possible GOAT.
     
    #21
  22. edmondsm

    edmondsm Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2005
    Messages:
    6,902
    Location:
    In an in between place.
    Also, he has not won any slams or ever been #1 in the rankings. It's tough to be the GOAT when you haven't done either of those things.
     
    #22
  23. GasquetGOAT

    GasquetGOAT Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2007
    Messages:
    3,372
    #23
  24. SirBlend12

    SirBlend12 Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    415
    ALL ABOARD!!! Last call for all ticket holders!
     
    #24
  25. thejoe

    thejoe Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,712
    Location:
    England
    Where is this bandwagon stopping at? Because my ticket only lets me go as far as Dreamland, I couldn't afford the ticket to Unlikely Station.
     
    #25
  26. plain jane

    plain jane Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2007
    Messages:
    531
    these threads are so hiliarious!! wasn't this the same with djokovic last year? Why are some ppl so obsessed with crowning someone GOAT?
     
    #26
  27. tintin

    tintin Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,438
    Location:
    none of your damn business
    GOAT?:rolleyes:
    u have got 2 be kidding,right?
    this guy has won his titles on nothing but hard courts(just like Blake;the only difference is he's won MS and made a slam final unlike Blake:lol:) and you're talking about him being the GOAT?:shock:
    he has yet to win on grass and especially on clay
    Murray thinks he'll drop shot his way out of matches like he did against Nadal who ran them down 1 after the other.
    There are 10's of players out there who can beat Murray on clay
    and until he makes the 2nd week at ALL 4 majors and wins on ALL surfaces and surpasses Federer and Sampras slam record.hell the only thing Nadal surpasses Federer is at being the GCCPOAT(greatest clay court player of all time);Murray ain't horse manure!:roll:
     
    #27
  28. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,261
    I agree....Murray has shown nothing on clay has he even reached a QF of MS on clay.....??

    Nadal is WAY closer to being GOAT and there is a HUGE gulf between him and being considered GOAT candidate. But at least Nadal has won wimbledon and won multiple MS on HC's not to mention his F.O titles.

    People are taking this Murray hype tooooo far!
     
    #28
  29. TennezSport

    TennezSport Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    1,885
    Location:
    Northern NJ, USA
    New KID in town

    Murray is the New KID in town and everyone always loves the New KID in town.

    Sorry, I just had to :twisted:

    Cheers, TennezSport :cool:
     
    #29
  30. S H O W S T O P P E R !

    S H O W S T O P P E R ! Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,938
    Location:
    In your thredz, stealin ur bukkits
    It goes nowhere.... kind of like this thread.
     
    #30
  31. msc886

    msc886 Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2008
    Messages:
    961
    No. Murray got outplayed in that final. Federer at the time was in pretty good form. Compare that to Fed when he won his first slam final.

    Roddick is well past his prime. Fed played Roddick when he was closer to his prime or when he was on fire. e.g USO 06 and 07, AO07, MC 06 etc.

    Beating Nadal on clay. Nadal's 2008 RG form was unstoppable. Murray cannot match that just like Djokovic and Federer has failed in the past.
     
    #31
  32. Oui c'est moi.

    Oui c'est moi. Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2008
    Messages:
    1,812
    Location:
    Liverpool, Leeds or Birmingham
    He certainly looks like a goat.
     
    #32
  33. TheTruth

    TheTruth G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2006
    Messages:
    13,674
    I think nerves played a big part in his final debut. Some people come out like blockbusters and some freeze like a deer caught in headlights. No one knows how they'll react to reaching such a precipice.

    There's also the backlash that often occurs after someone finally snags that big one. It doesn't happen to everyone, but it does to some.

    Murray has a lot to prove at this point. Can he hold his nerve in a grand slam final? He didn't the last time.

    Can he beat the big boys in best of five? He hasn't done that but once.

    Can he go further in all the slams? We don't know that either.

    I'd say we need to see how 2009 goes before even mentioning him and goat in the same sentence.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2009
    #33
  34. thejoe

    thejoe Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,712
    Location:
    England
    I think you've got a point. Before, he was just emerging, and had little pressure on him. No-one expected him to win that US Open final, and he had nothing to lose. Suddenly he is the favourite. I wonder how he will handle it.
     
    #34
  35. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,261
    All this talk of Murray being nervous is nonsense....he simply got outplayed and outclassed....

    When and if Murray becomes a threat on ALL surfaces should we revisit this thread.....for now it's very premature talk.
     
    #35
  36. JeMar

    JeMar Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2008
    Messages:
    6,698
    Well, this is certainly about 5 years too early.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2009
    #36
  37. TheTruth

    TheTruth G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2006
    Messages:
    13,674
    It will be interesting. Although he's been talked about for ages, last year was the first time he actually stepped up to the plate. Now, he's lumped in with the big boys and expected to perform at a very high level week in and week out. Let's see how he handles the pressure. He's got the game and the talent, this year and the next will prove whether or not he has the heart.
     
    #37
  38. thejoe

    thejoe Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,712
    Location:
    England
    He does seem to have the mental toughness required which will help. I hope he isn't the next Nalbandian or Gasquet. Someone with enormous, but sadly unfulfilled potential.
     
    #38
  39. egn

    egn Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2008
    Messages:
    4,973
    Murray is going to be a great player, goat ha far from it. I see Murray falling in Becker territory or Edberg territory. No GOAT vote for me.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2009
    #39
  40. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    Why not? He's already the best slamless GOAT player. All this bandwagon hopping is funny. Last January Joker was going to leapfrog Nadal to #1 and he would stay #2. How funny it turned out in the end huh? Now Joker is not even mentioned in this forum anymore except for Pro Racquets & Gear section with pics of his new Head stick.
     
    #40
  41. SempreSami

    SempreSami Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2007
    Messages:
    3,627
    Location:
    UK
    Imagine what it would've been like if this forum existed in the '80s.

    "Borg is done eh lost to Mac"
    "No u he's still the GOAT"
    "Im srs eh has retired lol"
    "oic kk lol"

    "have you seen this Becker kid? future GOAT"
    "no wai dats gonna be Cash lol"

    "dis Agassi kid dresses liek a gurl, lol at his huge racquet lol Sampras FTW"
    "No wai Sampras is 2 hairee to be GOAT"
     
    #41
  42. Gorecki

    Gorecki G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Messages:
    13,229
    Location:
    Puerto y Galgo....
    what about that talented bum mecir? could be goat? no way... meltdown!
     
    #42
  43. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2007
    Messages:
    9,164
    Location:
    Caught in No Man's Land
    Yea seriously. We need to stop jumping on the bandwagon so easily.

    The only difference I found between Murray and Djoker's hot run was Djoker started earlier, burned out late 07, then used the break well.

    Murray started later, didn't burn out, and is on a hot run.
     
    #43
  44. luckyboy1300

    luckyboy1300 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    1,796
    except that roddick is a far better player he was than he is now. he lacks the firepower of his strokes and has only retained his serve.
     
    #44
  45. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    I think he went for so much on his shots in the early years because he was so young and cocky. He was fearless and then he got older and started to play more consistent. It turned out to be the reason (outside of the serve) why he's still in the top ten all these years. The game he uses now is good enough to beat everyone below him in the rankings but not enough to hurt the guys above him, especially 1-4. He hasn't figured out how to bring back the old game against the top guys. Maybe he just can't anymore.
     
    #45
  46. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    Or "that McEnroe kid ain't gonna amount to anything, he has no groundstrokes."
     
    #46
  47. MichaelNadal

    MichaelNadal Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2007
    Messages:
    29,490
    Location:
    In the middle of tomorrow and yesterday..
    Lol people have such SHORT TERM MEMORIES on here! I hate bandwagons!!
     
    #47
  48. ESP#1

    ESP#1 Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,093
    We have that answer right now, there is no way he beats nadal on clay, thats just blasphemy, youre gettin way ahead of yourself when you say that.
     
    #48
  49. JeMar

    JeMar Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2008
    Messages:
    6,698
    Not if Nadal's healthy.
     
    #49
  50. tacou

    tacou Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Messages:
    7,028
    this is way jumping the gun-- he hasn't even won a slam! and he has only made on final.

    what if he never reaches another? or what if he loses a heart braker to some journeyman in the AO final and he just never recovers from it and by '10 is out of the top 100. people need to settle down and just enjoy Murray's game right now and see how his year goes.

    remember, this is his first year as one of the top guys, let's see how he handles it.
     
    #50

Share This Page