my daugher play video, pointer to improve?

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by ninaz, Jul 3, 2007.

  1. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    #1
  2. fgs

    fgs Hall of Fame

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    congrats, quite a good swing and improvement over one year, as i assume that the vids are taken about one year apart.
    keep her going, she's strinking really nice. i assume you were ballfeeding from the basket, and therefore it would be interesting to see how she moves in a rally, but the stroke mechanics are sound.
    the only thing i'd like to point out is that you should not get her messed up with onehander and twohander. keep her with one for the time being. i guess (at least it looks like) you have her already play a 27" racquet and that gives her some trouble with the onehander because she hits late quite a few times. let her tiny wrists stabilize a little more until you go (if you chose to) for a onehander.
     
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  3. 35ft6

    35ft6 Legend

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    On her forehand, she should stick her left hand on the racket longer during the backswing, and she should make sure to keep her left arm extended out, perhaps pointed at the ball, longer to maintain greater balance, only bringing her arm in around the moment of contact with the ball.

    Watch any pro forehand to see what I mean about the left arm. Right now her left arm is kept tucked in almost the whole motion.

    I'm kind of not crazy about how closed her racket face is on the backhand, but a lot of modern players do hit it that way so it's kind of subjective. If she went to Lansdorp, though, I'm sure he would open up the face a bit and have her drive through the ball more.

    Otherwise, she's on her way to becoming a fantastic player. It seems as if when she gets older and stronger, she can make the move to a great one hander a la Henin. :)
     
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  4. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    sorry, those are my two daughters, one is 6 and one is 7. I will try to take some video of their playing. 6 is using PDR+ and 7 is using PC+. I think you are right about the back hand hitting late problem.
     
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  5. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    thank you for the forehand tip.
     
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  6. fgs

    fgs Hall of Fame

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    ninaz,
    sorry for my confusion which started by the title "daughter .."
    i like the way both swing and they basically have a good timing (even if sometimes late - who doesn't).
    my son is getting 8 in a couple of days, so i have "somewhat" of a comparison.
    i would highly recommend you look out for some junior racquets - 26". you are giving them quite a hard time with those racquets. it has nothing to do with weight, the babs would be o.k. in the 300g range, it has to do with leverage and the stress on the joints. my son (128cm currently) is still playing a 25" which will soon be replaced by a 26". on services he'd constantly hit the ground with a full size racquet. there are really some good racquets out there also in the babolat range (junior roddick i guess it's called) and they are not expensive. i talk about graphite racquets, not those metal ones!
    don't worry about the swing, it will stay there, my son swings o.k. with the 25". it would also teach them racquet acceleration better since it's easier to move around due to better maneuverability.
    besides this, keep on working, you have "material" to work on.
     
    #6
  7. rommil

    rommil Legend

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    Hope to see them in the tour in a few years.
     
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  8. Raiden.Kaminari

    Raiden.Kaminari Semi-Pro

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    There are a couple of things I would suggest:

    1. Games based approach to drills:

    I didn't hear your girls giggling. Your daughters may not last in the sport if they don't have a passion for it, or they lose sight of the fun.

    2. Footwork drills:

    The better the footwork they have at a younger age, the more they're able to compete. Again, make it fun for them.

    3. Switch to foam balls, like the Dunlop Speed Ball, and have your daughters hit with each other.

    This will allow them to develop tracking capabilities, spin, etc.
     
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  9. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    where can i get those drills on the net? thank you very much for the tips.
     
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  10. fgs

    fgs Hall of Fame

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    ninaz,
    there are coaching newsletters available via web, both on the itf-site and the usta. check them out, they are downloadable pdf-files, you will find some valuable information there.
     
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  11. Raiden.Kaminari

    Raiden.Kaminari Semi-Pro

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    Besides the USTA and ITF sites, there are a number of good DVDs that you can purchase.

    They used to carry some good DVDs for training kids at Tennis Warehouse, but I reviewed the page and couldn't find it:

    http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/catthumbs.html?CREF=334

    Since I couldn't find the videos I wanted to recommend, I will refer you to On Court / Off Court, which sells to tennis instructors:

    http://www.oncourtoffcourt.com/c-13-games-and-fitness-for-kids.aspx

    They even sell thefoam ball:

    http://www.oncourtoffcourt.com/pc-41-11-spinners-highest-quality-foam-balls.aspx
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2007
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  12. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    Thank you for all the helps. do you think the Airzone system is good for my daughter right now?
     
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  13. noobplayer

    noobplayer Semi-Pro

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    dude this is in the wrong section, should be in tennis instruction section not adult league, btw the feeds are really high
     
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  14. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    sorry about wrong section. how can i move it? thanks,tom
     
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  15. Raiden.Kaminari

    Raiden.Kaminari Semi-Pro

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    Yes. Learning to hit the ball consistently high above the net is critical to getting good depth consistently.
     
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  16. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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  17. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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  18. Flaming Flamingo

    Flaming Flamingo New User

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    Firstly I would like to comment on how good your daughters footwork is on her backhand she is bouncing alot and looks very prepared. I'm not sure as I hit a 2handed backhand but maybe in a match if she plays better players she seems not to get back into her ready position quick enough maybe a shorter follow through could help achieve this? She seems like a great up and coming player though congratulations!
     
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  19. OrangeOne

    OrangeOne Legend

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    I'd like to be restrained here - but why on earth are you subjecting a 6 year old to one of the most brutal racquets around?

    A pure drive, roddick, PLUS?

    The coach in me is shocked and amazed, and the player in me is shocked and amazed too. I'm 31, 4.5+, big strong guy, and the PDR+ was too heavy for me to drag around. I can't think of any advantage to a 6 year old using it, at all, whatsoever. Other posters have made the point that a 25 or 26 inch frame would be more appropriate. It's so hard for an adult to get any decent racquet-head speed with that frame, let alone a growing young child. That's before even thinking about the injury risk....
     
    #19
  20. mlwgszgao

    mlwgszgao New User

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    I agree with OrangeOne that those rackets are a bit brutal, but I think that your daughters can easily tame those racquets with a 2H backhand until they build up some more muscle. The 1H backhand is an extremely demanding shots that requires impeccable timing and tremendous racquet head acceleration to hit correctly. It looks to me as if your daughter has trouble controlling the follow thru, bit problem! Looks to me as if the 2H backhand is the way to go, or a lighter racquet (recommended because of health issues of youngsters not growing as well when they lift heavy things)
     
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  21. Solat

    Solat Professional

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    she is very good, but that racquet is not suitable for her, she cannot control it, she needs to hold the throat with her left hand to try to stabilise the backswing and the followthru is so obvious how the racquet has a mind of its own and flings right around.

    keep the racquet...in a cupboard until she is ready for it, maybe when she is 11 or 12 there is no need for it at her age.
     
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  22. OrangeOne

    OrangeOne Legend

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    Why should they tame those racquets? It's not like they have to use them! Why not use what would be best for their game & their young, growing bodies, as opposed to 'taming' an inappropriate frame?

    1HBH actually can in many ways require less acceleration than a 2H....
    Those health issues are mostly exaggerated, i'm more concerned about general joint safety, and purely on a tennis level: how much those frames will stuff-up stroke production. Have you used a PDR+? A PD *might* be appropriate for them, a junior PD more appropriate again. Part of the benefit of the whole PD range is the racquet-head speed one can attain with them, the ease of access to spin and the quickness with which one can respond to late shots. I've hit with all 4 of the frames (PD, PD+, PDR, PDR+), and both of the + frames seemed to lose some of the magic, but esp. the PDR+ seemed quite heavy to drag around, and heavy to generate racquet-head-speed with, and as I say, I'm a big tall strong guy, i'm not in kindergarten!
     
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  23. Dave M

    Dave M Hall of Fame

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    I'll echo those comments. The coach in me had to read the PDR+ comments a couple of times to make sure i read it correctly.It's a heavy frame designed for adults with the quality of todays junior rackets esp the babolat ones i'd give them a break and get them hitting with the junior versions.maybe Explains some of the lateness on the backhand.
    Very good job overall though as said above nice mechanics getting grooved there.Hope they continue to enjoy it and they will improve!
     
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  24. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    Hi, all, thanks for all comments and suggestions. my 6 yrs old orginally used Head Junior racket. She tried the Aerodrive and PD+, she could play. I did not let because I concerned about her wrist health and he fore arm is only about as thick as the handle. But this march, I found she just could play well any longer no matter what I tried. But one day she tried the PDR+, Bingo! she stroke the ball much better. so I let her go with it. here is the video of her play. she use 2hback hand.
    http://www.youtube.com/v/QchkjOIaWns

    As for my 8 yrs old, she has been using AD for a while, the she started like PD+. They only practice about 2 hours together a day. do you think that is too long for them?
     
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  25. Flyingpanda

    Flyingpanda Rookie

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    Just make sure they still like tennis after all this practice :)
     
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  26. smoothtennis

    smoothtennis Hall of Fame

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    Great looking strokes for such young kids.

    One thing however...I used to hit two hands, then went to one after years. The setup is different on both, and the main thing...is the contact point is different for both. 1HBH is further out front with closed shoulders, and 2HBH can be closer and more body turn.

    Her two hander looks much smoother, and I would have her stick to just one or the other. That way, she will know 100% where that contact zone is suposed to be and can set up for it properly.
     
    #26
  27. Sakkijarvi

    Sakkijarvi Semi-Pro

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    1 + 1 = > 2

    <and have your daughters hit with each other>

    This is key: I have two daughters, a year apart in age. They play matches all the time and they love to compete -- been doing so since they were tiny tykes. In fact, working on their games has, up to now, been all about beating one another. Now they play doubles together on their high school team. They are both multi-sport athletes and love playing tennis. It's fun.

    Sakki
     
    #27
  28. AceofBase

    AceofBase Rookie

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    Sweet and cute, wish i started playing when i was that young!
     
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  29. OrangeOne

    OrangeOne Legend

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    A. Who coaches them?

    B. I've talked with other players and coaches about your daughter using a PDR+. They have been similarly shocked. Exceptionally shocked.

    You need to think long term, not just short term. Of course a heavy frame will mean someone hits a ball further, but that's not the absolute goal of tennis, now is it? Long term stroke production is being affected NOW by her use of that frame, as is her long term joint safety. 2 Hours a day with that frame is obscene for a 6 year old girl.

    I hope to hell you're not getting it strung at 60+, or with Poly.
     
    #29
  30. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    HI, thank you all for the tips and suggestions.
    Orangone,
    I have been coaching them since 4 years old. I concern about the weight of racket as well. I especially talk to my little daughter after I saw your post about if she like the racket and weather want to use lighter racket, she told she feel very good and comfortable about this racket, much better than that Junior one. I may let use demo some other racket and see what happen. do you have any suggestion on which racket to demo?

    When I first started, they feel like they are pushed, but now they want to play and feel sad if i feed more balls to one than other.

    I will keep you updated on my daughter's progress.
    thanks,
     
    #30
  31. dora_75

    dora_75 New User

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    Nice

    I must say I am impressed. They hit the ball really nice. I was looking at this thread as my daughter is 3. I agree that the most important thing at their young age is having fun on the court. My 2c about stroke mechanics:

    1. be carefull with the mechanics, the 1hbh she drops the left hand way too soon and she does not rotate the shoulders. She is flexible now but with age the ligaments get tighter. On both fh and bh you need to use the pasive arm to balance yourself ( unless you have a 2hbh). This in turn allows to rotate shoulders and balance properly.

    2. On the serve, one looked very good, the other one has a twitch in the mechanics, she changes the racquet face at the last time. She needs a simpler path for the racquet for maximum power.

    I am amazed at the hand-eye coordination very good! I can tell the PDR+ works for her because of the bh mechanics. She does not use the body to step in the ball rather she's using a slink shot: she starts with the arm far from the body and sling shots the head of the racquet.
     
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  32. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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  33. Raiden.Kaminari

    Raiden.Kaminari Semi-Pro

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    I have to agree with OrangeOne regarding using the Babolat. The Prince "Original" Graphite (aka PoG) may be a better choice, especially when considering the impact it has on the arm and shoulder.

    http://www.racquetresearch.com/2002/expertoverall.htm

    I have to disagree with the others regarding using an adult racquet.

    I used to use a Jack Kramer Pro Staff when I was 8 years old. By the time I was a junior I was using a much heavier frame (15oz) because that was what was needed to compete against the other players whose balls were quite heavy.

    I personally can not stand hitting with a junior racket, even when feeding balls. The rackets feel unstable compared to the "adult" versions.

    I can understand using the junior racket when the children are below 7 and have not developed the strength to use an adult racket. At a certain age, if they're able to handle (and prefer) the adult rackets, they should continue to use them while doing strength and flexibility conditioning.

    If I recall correctly, there were many top juniors successfully using the Prince "Original" Graphite OS since they were 6.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2007
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  34. ninaz

    ninaz Rookie

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    http://youtube.com/watch?v=kyCOMpWHN7A


    thanks for all tips and suggestions you kindly gave before. above is a new video of them warmming up. it was very windy so did not shoot too much video.

    please keep the comments and suggestions comming.

    thanks,tom
     
    #34
  35. Raiden.Kaminari

    Raiden.Kaminari Semi-Pro

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    I'm impressed at how much better their footwork is now since you originally posted the video.

    The 6 year old stared at her ball on one shot, but quickly started moving again when she saw her sister retrieve the ball.

    Besides the consistency rally, they need to work a little on coming in and taking balls out of the air (regular or swinging volleys). This will help them develop a more complete game than just "baseline" rallying.
     
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