Nadal: "I lack reaction speed, energy when returning, power in my legs.."

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Rocky89, Feb 11, 2013.

  1. Rocky89

    Rocky89 Professional

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    As per tweets from Nadal's presser:

    https://twitter.com/genny_ss/status/300796790058414080
    https://twitter.com/Rafael_Plaza/status/300795992519897089

    I think he is right on all counts, his movement and stamina is definitely below par, but that's expected for his first tournament back. Interesting that he says he has no energy for ROS.

    What I'm interested to know is, do you guys think he will be able to improve these things throughout the next few tournaments to be a serious contender for slams?
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2013
    #1
  2. Goosehead

    Goosehead Hall of Fame

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    obviously he is going to improve..what did you expect..:confused:

    he hasnt played since last june. :confused::confused:..the vamos will grow louder.
     
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  3. kalyan4fedever

    kalyan4fedever Hall of Fame

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    So is the knee only gonna get worse by playing or its gonna get better what he is implying?
     
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  4. zam88

    zam88 Professional

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    when he came back in '09 he got waxed by premium competition at the USO, had one of the worst WTF's ever, and then struggled at the '10 AO before finally rounding into form several months later to go on an epic clay run.


    I imagine this will be similar.. there's going to be some rough losses before he's back in shape.

    he's got 3 months to iron it out before Roland Garros.. is it possible? You know it. Likely? it's going to be one of Rafa's biggest GS wins ever if he can come back after that type of layoff and win a GS even if it is on his favorite surface that he's the GOAT on.
     
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  5. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    he'll get by with a little help from his friends
     
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  6. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    and of course if he loses, asterisks will abound.
     
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  7. Goosehead

    Goosehead Hall of Fame

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    its going to get better..his doc/medical team said the initial pain will go away after a whole bunch of matches as the knee gets stronger and used to the tennis.
     
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  8. Rocky89

    Rocky89 Professional

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    He was a lot younger then though, it's going to be a lot tougher this time around. Especially since it's his longest layoff, he will improve, but he may also never regain is former agility and movement.
     
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  9. Alchemy-Z

    Alchemy-Z Professional

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    Win or Lose...it's good to see him back on tour I am sure he will Improve over the next few tournaments.

    For 7 months off...I'd call making a final in both doubles and singles a very good start
     
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  10. Steve0904

    Steve0904 G.O.A.T.

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    It's tough to say. Tbh, nobody knows, but I can imagine it's tough to regain the type of stuff Nadal is talking about ever again. He'll get better obviously, but I'm not sure he'll be 100% what he once was, and that could be bad, but we'll have to wait and see.
     
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  11. dudeski

    dudeski Hall of Fame

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    Yep and the MTOs will grow longer.
     
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  12. Fiji

    Fiji Hall of Fame

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    Wilander and Agassi stated that Nadal will not be back to his previous level until next year(2014). That's how long it takes players to get back their rythm. Since he was out for 8 months, he will need 16 months(twice the time he was out) to be a real slam challenger(circa RG 2014). Add to that nobody won slams for 9 years in a row in the open era(men) and it is pretty obvious Nadal will NOT win a slam in 2013. Federer, Borg and Sampras couldn't do it. Nadal won't either. Will Nadal be back after a slamless year? Federer didn't quit despite 2011 was a slamless year. Sampras didn't quit despite 2001 was a titleless year. 2013 could be a titleless year for Nadal like 2001 was for Sampras.
     
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  13. Start da Game

    Start da Game Professional

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    agassi was 1/2 the player nadal is and wilander is 1/4th.......just bitterness and nothing else in those comments........
     
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  14. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    Nadal did suffer in his return game more than anything. He just did not have the same explosiveness on return he has had in the past.

    During the match they showed a bit of when Rafa was 15 and winning his first few titles. I was amazed at the size difference in his arms between then and now.

    Rafa literally used to look like a body builder and was much larger and more defined when he was 15 versus now.
     
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  15. zam88

    zam88 Professional

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    yeah that's the thing..... if he's not 100% there's an asterik

    it's ridiculous.


    Unfortunately one of the skill sets of a tennis player is: "stay healthy" and that's one thing Roger is definitely GOATing on compared to Rafa without question.

    I think it's paid dividends for Roger for sure as well. Roger may have a mode where he could go "harder" but he knows that if he plays that way he leaves himself susceptible to injury.... and there is a lot of success to be had just be being there.
     
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  16. TheF1Bob

    TheF1Bob Banned

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    Rafa getting warned last night was a sight to see. :)
     
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  17. spperry

    spperry Rookie

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    I think he looked very rusty.

    He will know the things he needs to do better and with more matches that will happen.

    It is a big ask to win RG but hopefully he is in much better form by then and can give himself a chance.

    He will only be 27 this year and if he can get back to full fitness he has plenty of time to win more.
     
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  18. Roddick85

    Roddick85 Professional

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    I think it's only natural for Rafa to be a bit rusty. If we as recreational players lose our timing after a few weeks/months off the court, playing only against amateur, it must be even worst at the pro level, where everyone is top shape. However, I wouldn't be so quick to write Rafa off for the french open, he still has 3+ months before the tournament. I would wait to see how he plays in Monte-Carlo. That will have given him a bit more time on court.
     
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  19. TennezSport

    TennezSport Hall of Fame

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    Bigger concern.........

    Of course Rafa is rusty, no one can stay away from the game that long and then play at that old level; timing and reaction are off. However the bigger concern is that he is saying that the knee is still hurting. If you know anything about ligaments and joints they do not get better with play.

    A surgeon from the area here told me that pain in a ligament or joint is telling you that something is not right. It's not like muscle pain from fatigue.
    His only recourse may be an operation, which he does not want to do because he will lose speed; no doubt. He could come back to form but it will be how well he can manage the pain. Can only wait and see at this point.

    Cheers, TennezSport :cool:
     
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  20. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    Exactly.

    Of course, lately we are hearing from camp Nadal (and the Vamos Brigade promptly agrees), that the things will get better and pain will disappear with play.

    I wonder what they mean.
     
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  21. dunlop_fort_knox

    dunlop_fort_knox Semi-Pro

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    not really. especially on clay. that's old for clay.
     
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  22. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    When I watched the Vina del Mar final, it was clear that Nadal's mobility was the biggest problem for him, along with Zeballos playing a fantastic match with a tricky lefty game. Nadal's service returns were a bit of a concern as well.
     
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  23. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    He at least said he's not worried about that as long as his knee stops hurting.

    From Wilander, yes. Agassi has always had good things to say about Nadal.
     
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  24. bluetrain4

    bluetrain4 Legend

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    Interesting question. I guess we'll see.
     
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  25. Sabratha

    Sabratha G.O.A.T.

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    rafa will have a tail end career like hewitt or chang, slowly slipping down the rankings until eventually he just retires.
     
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  26. MG1

    MG1 Professional

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    #26
  27. Mike Sams

    Mike Sams Legend

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    Nadal will forever be a force on clay. Even without speed and legs, he can consistently force errors with the heavy topspin moonballs. That should ensure that he consistently makes semifinals and finals and gets enough points for a top 5-6 ranking.
     
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  28. dafinch

    dafinch Banned

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    "I lack reaction speed, energy when returning, power in my legs.."

    Other than THAT, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the theater?

    As others have noted, constant play is NOT the recipe for curing what supposedly ails him...
     
    #28
  29. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

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    www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eMkth8FWno
     
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  30. big ted

    big ted Hall of Fame

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    connors has said similar things not about nadal, but in general. if you take off 6 months, not only are you 6 months behind but the others are 6 months ahead so youre really a year behind.

    i think nadal seemed a little tentative and seemed to lack intensity except towards the very end but it was too late. he seems to be pacing himself and not putting too much pressure on himself too soon which is good
     
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  31. pound cat

    pound cat G.O.A.T.

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    It will take nadal at least 6 months before he is in conditon. And longer to get his confidence back after no doubt having lost many matches along the way.


    Doubles is a good way to work on his timing and serve, and speed.
     
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  32. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    I agree with the "reaction speed" comment. The timing being off is what struck me the most during the week. The movement itself wasn't bad. He plays short at times but he was doing that sometimes even before the long break. The intensity in tight matches, he has to build up. It can only come back by playing those matches to state the obvious. No amount of practice simulates that type of situation well enough to be efficient. So he's gonna have to go through a few of those matches and hopefully, he will manage to win them again.
     
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  33. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    Yeah, but it's not a mathematical formula either. Though if it was, should we be seeing Delpo right about now beginning to play at the level he was before?.

    Three, four months is really not that much. It may well be that Rafa has come back now even with pain because he doesn't think he can afford any more time out if he wants to try to win RG.

    Agree Vero that his timing being somewhat off was quite clear. His fitness is lacking also... both things one would very much expect after seven months.
     
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  34. Marius_Hancu

    Marius_Hancu G.O.A.T.

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    #34
  35. 90's Clay

    90's Clay Legend

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    Nadal will be fine come French OPen time.

    This is to be expected. He actually looked better then I thought he would have after that 8 month layoff. Clay or not
     
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  36. Smasher08

    Smasher08 Hall of Fame

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  37. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Yes that too. I was amazed at how good he looked right off the bat. Not many adjustments to make technically at least.
     
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  38. escii_35

    escii_35 Rookie

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    Last edited: Feb 11, 2013
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  39. crazyups

    crazyups Semi-Pro

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    It takes 3 months to reach top physical condition. You can research conditioning programs. As for the skill part it may take longer to get right timing etc., but Nadal should be fine by then.
     
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  40. vernonbc

    vernonbc Hall of Fame

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    Except it's not a ligament that has given him grief through the years - it's a tendon, which is quite different and also can't be easily repaired with surgery. A tendon is made up of many many ropey fibers unlike a ligament which is like a rubber band. The pain was expected but is supposed to lessen as he plays and builds up competition strength.
     
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  41. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    What EXACTLY was ****'s injury, that you are talking about?

    Give us the diagnose!

    Then the fun can start.
     
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  42. TennezSport

    TennezSport Hall of Fame

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    Understand but..........

    What you state is true but from what the Rafa team reported is that he suffers from Hoffa's Syndrone (which I believe is only part of the problem) which is described as:
    We also know that he has had issues with the patella tear which can also happen again due to scar tissue with heavy stress. No amount of playing is going to cure this issue, especially if he re-injures the knee which has already happened twice before last year. So pain management or/and operation is the only other avenue. The test will come when he has to play a tough 5 setter against the top ten or if he overplays. Only time will tell now.

    Cheers, TennezSport :cool:
     
    #42
  43. vernonbc

    vernonbc Hall of Fame

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    Google is your friend. Rafa's doctors had several press conferences where they gave detailed information about his knee problems.
     
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  44. vernonbc

    vernonbc Hall of Fame

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    You're right that pain management is important but I disagree that surgery is the only other avenue. He has rested it and rehabbed it with several different kinds of therapy and the MRI's show it has healed quite nicely. This article explains the pain he is experiencing as he gets back to competition. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/21309064
     
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  45. Cup8489

    Cup8489 Legend

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    I'm not sure the purpose of this post; are you simply stating that you agree with Tennezsport that ligaments and tendons do not recover as easily as muscle tissue?

    If so, you must realize that in certain situations in which multiple tears have occurred, rest does not guarantee even partial recovery, but that surgery is often necessary beyond a certain point of damage?
     
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  46. OddJack

    OddJack Legend

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    Lack reaction, speed, energy, power in legs, and pain in knee....

    But.... " It's a joy coming back and playing tennis...."

    Never before words have sounded so empty.
     
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  47. Newland Archer

    Newland Archer Banned

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    If it wasn't a joy, why would he be playing through pain and ridicule? Surely he doesn't need the money.
     
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  48. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    THAT is your answer?

    It appears, that Nadal camp has done a great job of "informing".

    :lol:
     
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  49. TennezSport

    TennezSport Hall of Fame

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    Understand but..........

    The article is superficial at best because it does not fully explain what the real problem is (this is more than Hoffa syndrome). Rafa had rested for 7 months and tried every therapy and still says he feels pain. Soreness and stiffness is one thing, but pain is your body telling you to stop, especially with joints; something is not operating correctly.

    Now he is going back to playing with the same style that put him in this state, and he says it will get better??? Playing on a softer surface because every time you tried on HC the pain was worse, but then you go and play singles and doubles where the sliding motion puts excessive stress on joints. The doctor that we work with does not like the way this all sounds. So not saying that Raf cannot recover, just that what he/his camp is saying is not the whole story; something is not right.

    Cheers, TennezSport :cool:
     
    #49
  50. Djoker

    Djoker Rookie

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    Has there ever been a professional tennis player who constantly whines about his health/injuries, the court surface, the 25 second rule, the off season, etc, etc. ?

    Last couple years he was complaining about the drug testing people wanting to always know his whereabouts and how pervasive and inconvenient that was, now it's an about turn with "the more testing the better, no?"

    First the injury is bad, then it needs rest, then it's manageable but still painful, then it's getting better and responding nicely, then it's still quite painful again, then blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

    Shut the f... up and play!
     
    #50

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