Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Attila the tennis Bum, Jul 10, 2007.
And soon to be the first.
I'd say he still needs to improve a bit (serve for instance)...and try to win in 3 sets
atilla, we get it. Nadal will be #1 and win all the slams.
Don't need to make so many threads about it.
Ok as long as you understand that.
there's no such thing as second best.
second is just first loser.... just ask Ricky Bobby
It's not 100% certain that Rafa would have gotten past Djokovic if his body would've held up.
"atilla, we get it. Nadal will be #1 and win all the slams."
"Don't need to make so many threads about it. "
It's pretty funny on this board sometimes. I often feel like I waste way too much time posting on this board, and this is only my 68th post since I joined in Nov'05. Some of these folks need to go outside and get a life.
Nadal's biggest problem on grass court seems to be his consistency. When he is on form, he can take on any player in the ATP tour. However, he has also proven during this grass court season that there are many players ranked lower than him that have a chance of defeating him if he is not at his best.
Of course, should we call it grass after sunday?Maybe red grass?
He is pretty consistent. He has played in two finals in three attempts. Thats better than Roddick.
And he almost beat the "greatest" grass court player of all time.
Trolls cannot help themselves.
Sadly to many of us feed them by responding to their threads/posts to keep them coming back for more.
maybe if you gave nadal just an ounce of respect instead of pure hatred you would not see these polls as trollish behavior while on the other hand completely endorsing "butt picking" troll posts.
Federer will lose to Nadal in upcoming years on grass.... If Fed is so strong on grass than why was it so difficult for him to win? It was a close match but in my opinion Fed didnt show that he was that much better on grass.
Then why does everyone say "Federer is the second best clay courter in the world"?
Well Federer has made the finals of practically all the other clay tournaments, losing only to Nadal; he has won clay MS titles, with a win over Nadal at Hamburg, something the entire tour couldn't do for 81 matches.
Do not be mistaken; I think Nadal CAN play on grass and has made intelligent adjustments while still maximizing his strengths. However, the fact that he still gets pushed to 5 sets by journeymen, and the fact that he did not win his Wimby warmup without Fed around does not suggest that he is the second best grasscourter around. He MAY be; I'm just saying that not all the evidence suggests so.
I think it's more appropriate to say Nadal is the 2nd best player on all surfaces other than clay. Right now tennis surfaces have separated into clay and hardcourt. Wimbledon grass is playing like a medium pace hard court. Any good hardcourt player can easily transition to grass now.
So basically we have Fed as the best hardcourt player and 2nd best clay while Nadal is the best claycourt player and 2nd best harcoourt.
p.s. this raises another interesting point. if 3 of the grandslams were played on clay, we might have nadal with close to 10 grand slams and fed with 3 or 4.
well lets see what happens at the open this summer...nadal is very hungry.
He has beaten fed twice on hard courts. If he somehow makes it to the final I really believe that Nadal will beat Fed.
Nadal will beat Fed on almost any surface.....even grass.
Nadal wont do much at the U.S Open because the surface hasnt changed.Someone said that wimbledon is playing medium pace?Thats a laugh, this is playing like clay,
Lets look at it this way
I think that Nadal has greatly improved on grass as apposed to last year (the court has helped a little). He has adjusted to the bounce, volleying better and is standing a little closer to the baseline, along with being more aggressive. In doing so, he also made more errors that he usually does, but he can improve that.
Having said that, he was pushed to the edge by Soderling and if Soderling had not blinked, we would not be having this conversation now. Then Rafa was manhandled by Youzsny until Youzsny hurt his back, if he had not had the injury we would not be having this conversation now. With Berdych, I think Rafa played a very smart game by being overly agressive and keeping Berdych off balance. Finally with Djokovic even though he was tired and injured he still took the first set from Rafa easily. He then ran out of gas and also restrained the leg and aggravated the foot injury (Rafa got lucky).
Now as I said before, Rafa has made some major headway to becoming a better grass court player, but there are still other players out there that will give him trouble that Fed manhandles.
I am beginning to think you have no knowledge of what others post or think and just spout off at the mouth. I do not have the time or effort to waste explaining things to you as it has been a failure in the past. However if you took the time to read my other posts you would see that I give Nadal credit on many occasions. Furthermore, your improper use of the word "hate" just goes to show what your posts/threads are typically about (i.e. being a troll )
Wait.....read this again "if he somehow makes it to the final" So, Nads can't handle the rest of the field? How in the hell does that make him greatest on tour? LMAO
Yeah, almost any surface that's red and in Europe. Whoops, there was the Hamburg thing.
How can you completely discount the fact that Federer has made the last 9 Grand Slam finals in a row? Not only that, he's played in 13 of the last 17 Grand Slam finals! Yeah, Nads is a record breaker alright. He's got Federer's number he's beat him...granted, but record wise Nads isn't worthy of carrying Federer's jock. Post something else for once.
AFAIK, US Open courts have been also slowed, just not as drastically as
Wimbledon's. All surfaces are converging to one medium speed.
People have been saying this all these years since 2003.
Where the hell were you guys ?
As what Federer said post-match, Nadal has improved his game on faster courts.
Last year, he has tried to adjust on faster courts by just hitting it
harder. But now he knows how and when to go aggressive.
Nadal will improve vastly his record on this year's hard court seasons.
I would like to think if Nadal is doing so well on grass he would do that well on hard courts. However reality probably is hard courts are even alot faster then grass right now. Fastdunn is incorrect on the U.S Open hard courts. They have not been slowed at all are and lightning fast. The Austraian Open hard courts have also been sped up. Wimbledon is probably closer to a clay court now then it is to them.
I think in future years Nadals results on hard courts could improve, but not sure if it will be this year.
Well, compared to when ? AFAIK, they added a bit more sand on the surface
and it is slower than mid-90's.
I believe this was a part of coordinated efforts to slow down the game since
late 90's. They initially slowed down carpets and eventually shorten
the indoor carpet seasons to an almost non factor.
They slowed down all non-clay surfaces and started to use heavier, slightly
bigger balls (which roddick refered as "water melon" balls) to slow down the game even further.
Ironically, clays are quickening making all surfaces kinda converging to
a medium speed (which way slower than before)
This is an era of slow court players (compared to past).
Changes in Wimbledon was drastic and happened quickly between 2001-2003
but the effort has been made on the whole tour since late 90's.
Average height of top 20 players is smaller now and you need strong defense game
to succeed in tour now (compared to strong offense game in 90's).
Nadal is a same type of power baseliner with strong defense
as Federer( in the grand scheme of a thing.).
Actually the U.S Open hard courts are faster then ever. It is why Roddick does so well at the U.S Open still with his huge serve. It is why Nadal has never been past the quarters there, and does so well at Wimbledon instead. I think Nadal will eventually do better on hard courts because of his talent and determination. However hard courts are now the fastest surface, much faster then grass. Grass is basically green clay now.
ah that lovely red grass, i want to play on that, thats one of the only surfaces i will never get to play on...
anyway... many have said it, i will say it again, wimbledon needs to switch back to the good ole, REAL grass, that fast stuff, then i would like to see nadal make it past the quarters...
A post every 8 days and you sometimes feel like you post too much? Are you "sometimes" strung out on coke?
Grass is much faster than green clay. The comparisons are ludicrous. Grass is about the same speed as the US Open now. Nadal just moves better on grass than most other players.
Thats a laugh, the U.S Open is much faster then wimbledon, thats how sad the grass has gotten.Wimbledon plays like the FO now.
25 aces. I doubt you'll see much more like that at the US Open.
Another thing is that grass is an organic surface with somewhat uncertain
bounce. In a way, you need large margin of errors in ground strokes swing.
(like Borg, Federer, Nadal) unless you deal with it before the ball bounces
(Laver, McEnroe, Sampras, in a way).
Hard courts have truer bounce which helps you time your stroke and go for a
winner. I think Nadal has finally learned how to be aggressive on faster
surfaces. His records on hard courts should improve this year.
It doesnt affect the serve but look at the damn groundstrokes.Its ridiculous how slow the pace is.
Hey Attila... do you consider Bartoli the second best female grass court player in the world?
Well summarized, I think. Rafa is a fine player and a great competitor, but still has plenty to learn to be able to truly challenge Fed for the #1 ranking. CC
Nadal didn't get to play Roddick, Gasquet or Baghdatis 3 great grass court players. Once we see him defeat them on a regular basis like Federer, then we can say second best on grass. Not yet though...
Nadal whooped Baghdatis in the Wimbledon semis last year.
yea nadal is definately the 2nd best grass courter now, but he wasnt last year.
At the moment Nadal is "2nd best" on grass, but something that everyone is failing to mention.
How much closer Nadal has gotten to Federer on Grass, than Federer still has gotten much closer to him at Roland Garros?
great point. Gilbert ,pmac , cahill all agree that rafa will win wimby before fed wins the fo.
Rafa still hasn't beaten him on grass. Roger has beaten him on clay and has had a match point in another match. Sure, it's not RG, but it's better speculation than basing everything off of this last wimbledon final.
Neither will happen.
I don't know, it doesn't make much sense either. Fact is, Fed can't be beat on grass and hard court, Nadal can't be beat on clay.
OP is very true
Have any of his wins on hard court against Fed been best of 5 setters? (it is an honest question and I didn't feel like doing the research) While I do give Nadal his due credit for being an incredible talent I think Fed has the advantage in any best of 5 setters not on clay against Nadal.
Give it time...Nadal is only getting better while Fed just gets older.
wow, this is news to me. i was under the impression that i was 2nd best?
Its sad when players like nadal can get to the finals of wimbledon. Bring back the classic serve and volley that made wimbledon so exciting.
Federer by no means was at his "greatest" after 2007 Australian Open. Nadal, from the final, played nearly, if not at his best while Federer played some played under his standard. BTW, why don't you mention Nadal nearly got beaten by Soderling And Youzney the nobodies and luckily skipped Dijokovic after the poor guy withdrew from injury?
What kind of idiotic point are you making there? You're just saying something that will never occur and is meaningless. How bout I just say if Nadal was the only player on the tour he would win all the titles in the world for the next 20 years?
ugh I'm tired of these threads. Just something to think about.
we all know Nadal has Federers number and that he troubles him.
BUT, heres the difference between them. The difference between Federer and the rest of the field is huge with Nadal not as much. The only player Federer has trouble with is Nadal its just how there games match up. With Nadal I can name a bunch of people who give him trouble and hes not exactly a sure lock to win any tournament Federer doesn't enter either.
Hes still the 2nd best tennis player right now but lets not overstate his dominance.
btw, stop trolling we all know u want Nadal unfortunately I don't think he goes that way.
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