Organix 10 325 Review

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by TennisMaverick, Oct 22, 2011.

  1. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    There have been a few new postings regarding this stick, so I decided to post a comprehensive review, extrapolated from some of my other posts and new observations:

    My racquet is strung with Gripper at 63M/60C. The 50/50 method was used to maximize the string bed response. Just as with the original DNX sticks and the PB sticks, the Organix stiffened-up the crosses, and having it in all four poles, stiffens the mains as well. Hence, string the crosses looser and be mindful that the stick strings up tight.

    This is a great upgrade to the PB 10 MP. It plays as precise, but gives the response and spin of 16 mains with more plow though. It is also the most stable frame that I have ever hit with, including the 6.1 and Nadal's stick, while being far less stiff--the printed stiffness rating on most online sites are far stiffer than what Volkl states it to be in-house. Any ball contact off-center, near 3/9/12, still has a good response, without any vibration being delivered to the hand--both qualities which are very unique. It is possible that many players will not need any mods, and with the addition of the Organix at 12:00, lead tape could make the stick cumbersome.

    This is a very different Volkl, just as the BB 11 was a different BB stick. As other posted reviews from numerous 6.5 players stated, it feels like a 6.1 with the feel of a Volkl, but, you will not have arm problems like many do who use the 6.1. There is no vibration, even though the whole hoop is so solid, that it feels like a continuous, unbending ring is plowing through the ball, sending the ball like a flashlight in the direction that it is pointing. It moves through the air very fast for its weight, as the WHOLE head feels quick, and it feels that way both leaded and unleaded.

    At contact, there is no vibration transferred to the hand. As soon as the ball leaves the frame, you only feel the racquet moving through the air, as opposed to feeling the frame wobble between contact and follow-through. For some, this is the Volkl feel/feedback, because what you just did, is still resonating from the frame, to your hand, and up to your brain. The Organix at 12:00, and the Organix material at all four poles, completely changes the feel and dynamics of the ball response off of the string bed. It's a completely new feel. Be prepared to spend a little time to adjust, because the first time you hit a ball, "what the frak?" will be your first and only thought. The stick is crazy precise, whether you drive the ball or use spin, You can feel the ball on the string bed long enough to know exactly what adjustment to make on the following shot, but it very quick and crisp. The dwell time is not as long as the London's, but C 10 Pro users will feel the relationship, once they get over the feel of the stiffer hoop. PB 10 Mid users who need the bigger more forgiving head, will make the switch very easily. Leading it up does increase the dwell time considerably. After play-testing it stock, I customized it to my personal specs, which with this stick, came to 380 grams. It feels like a larger PB 10 Mid, but without the hoop flexibility that normally occurs when stick models are blown up to a larger size.

    When hitting flat with the the X10, and swinging slowly, you will feel the ball come off the frame very quickly as you would expect, with the famous soft Volkl feel. However, as you increase the pressure on the ball, you feel the WHOLE STRING BED MOVE in unison, backwards, due to impact, holding the ball; it's quite exhilarating. This allows you to hit a short-angle CC with a slow swing at 10mph, and the same shot with a fast swing at 50mph, to the same part of the court, with the same amount of control--I could do this on my weaker BH side. That is not what happens with a traditional graphite frame, as stiffness and flex work in tandem with dwell time. That brings a different element to the game. When hitting with spin, again, the WHOLE STRING BED reacts, but it bites the ball. It does not have the dwell time of the PB 10 Mid, nor the cupping of the Melbourne, but the dwell time increases substantially when fully leaded. You cannot have the power of a 98in2--which by definition has less plow thru than a 93in2--and still have the same dwell time without the extra weight to do so. Thus, the soft, precise, feel in the hand, is coming from either the beam shape, the Organix material, the new grip system, or the combination of any of the three. And do not confuse this soft feel with the cushioned feel of the BB 11; it can only be described as soft, cushioned, and scalpel like precise.

    The X10 325 really serves well, with a ton of spin. Making directional adjustments, is also great, which I attribute to the response from the Organix at 12:00. Off the ground, when you are stretched wide, the extra power coming from a stiffer head, if not also because of the cellulose in the DNX mix, allows the ball to rebound off the string a little easier. Perhaps, this will provide you with a few more SAVES--shots hit into the court just to stay in the point which have no other specific purpose--rewarding you more points or games, since, at the lower levels of the game, getting one more ball over can often elicit an error, although at the higher levels, it's just a set-up for your opponents winner. The X10 325 also performs well on low balls and short-hopped balls, which is expected due to the larger head. However, applying curved topspin or sidespin, is amazing with the X10, which I attribute to the Organix material at 12:00 as well, since you are swinging from the inside of the ball to the outside for the former, and from outside the ball to inside the ball for the latter, forcing you to lead with the tip of the head.

    Lastly, the word is that many Wilson 6.1 and Head Prestige users have switched to the X10 325. Many new sales have come from those players.
     
    #1
  2. Cesare

    Cesare Semi-Pro

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    This is just great, thanks Mav!
     
    #2
  3. Hominator

    Hominator Hall of Fame

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    After play testing the frame earlier this spring, I've made the switch from my Head Speeds to the X10 325. The stability and soft feel were the main reasons why I switched to the X10 325.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2011
    #3
  4. Murray_fan1

    Murray_fan1 Professional

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    Hominator,

    As a fellow Volkl user happy to hear you are back with the brand!! So does the X10 325 trump the PB 10 Mid as your favorite Volkl. I have actually decided to go back to the X10 325 myself after a short test with some of the lighter option in the Organix line up. I thought i could lead up my X295 to play similar but i just can't seem to the the balance right. This stick in stock form I would argue needs very little in customization. Volkl seemed to get the balance just right..

    IMO the Organix line has something for everyone. The thing about the X10 325 is that it is a players stick but I think it fits a broader range of styles as long as you possess enough skill to use it.
     
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  5. Hominator

    Hominator Hall of Fame

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    I use the X10 stock, except for a couple of athletic tape strips on each side of the pallet to square it out a bit. I may install some Attiva pallets like I have on my PB10mids, but at this point, the athletic tape does the job.

    The stick performs so well for me stock, and I can do some things with it that I can't with my PB10mids, maybe because of the new material, but probably because of the bigger head size. My X10s come in at about 12 ounces even, and I find that it's more than enough against big hitters. I just really love the clean feel of this frame when hitting out.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2011
    #5
  6. APG

    APG Rookie

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    I also play with this frame stock. I have played with Head rackets for years and prestige in particular. This racket is everything TM describes.
    I needed a racket easy on my elbow after a ten month layoff from GE.
    There is absolutely no shock to the arm. Yes, the balance is sweet and plays much lighter than it's 12oz static weight. I agree hitting the ball out offers a very smooth and clean hit.
     
    #6
  7. 6-2/6-4/6-0

    6-2/6-4/6-0 Semi-Pro

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    I played with the x10 325 and the c10 last week. While I haven't played with the PB10 or its mid version to understand the evolution of the design (played a bit with the Tour 10, but not extensively), I felt the c10 suited me better than the x10. I seemed to be hitting more precisely with the c10 and moving the ball better. The x10 seemed like it was strung slightly lower, but with the string damper in the stringbed (as it was with both frames) it didn't seem like either stringbed was 'too soft' to offer good control.

    The thing that really threw me with the x10 was the muted feel of the frame. Maybe if I was used to playing with more modern sticks this would have felt more normal, but to me it felt like it filtered out too much; where T-Mav felt that it imparted a very clean feel that let you mentally move on to the next shot more quickly, I felt that if left me waiting to see what happened for an extra split second because I didn't have the feeling transmitted through the racket that I was used to getting to tell me how well I had hit the ball. As I said, I haven't played with the PB10 to know if this is a function of the Organix cellulose, or whether this is a more gradual transition, but the c10 told me right where the ball was going - the x10 made me look for it.

    Where I was really impressed, was with the spin I was getting. It was actually too much for me. The racket was so capable that I was getting ridiculous with my shot selection, and a bit lazy because I didn't have to swing through or prepare like I do with my old Dunlops and Heads. The racket made late and off center shots so much more effective that I kept holding for a split second longer before attacking the ball - it made my shots a bit more disguised and gave me a fraction longer to see what my opponent was doing or to see the ball bounce.

    Whether groundstrokes or volleys the racket really has exceptional precision and solidness, but with less sensation than I was looking for. If you are someone who is used to a 98" racket and more modern racket feel, I found the x10 incredibly capable, and borderline juvenile-y fun to play with. It's not a racket for me but, more than anything, the demos made me interested in other Völkl rackets like the BB London Tour.
     
    #7
  8. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    What other reviews, and which NTRP 6.5 rated players?
     
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  9. Pneumated1

    Pneumated1 Professional

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    Looks the trio is together again and at it again! You guys need a new song, considering that your identity attacks against one poster don't contribute to the gear discussion, and it gets a little old. And you demand objectivity? Even apart from Maverick's perspective, I count four other opinions about the frame that no doubt transmit as objectively valuable, several from players who have played the frame since its release, and one that I know is at least a 5.0-5.5, former college player. And you know what? They're all saying pretty close to the same thing, whether they like the frame or not. I call that a validation of objective aspects of the frame, apart from the OP. And that's not even considering the other posts from the Organix thread.

    What did you guys think of the X-325? Have you even touched the frame?
     
    #9
  10. Hominator

    Hominator Hall of Fame

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    The lack of feel was my initial impression, too. After hitting with the X10 325 for a few weeks, I started get used to the unique feel. The feel is there, but it was certainly different from what I was used to.

    And I agree that this racquet offers tremendous access to spin, especially on serves.
     
    #10
  11. The Djoker

    The Djoker Semi-Pro

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    think he meant to type 6.1

    maybe you knew that, i don't know...
     
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  12. Cesare

    Cesare Semi-Pro

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    #12
  13. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    'This is a great upgrade to the PB 10 MP. It plays as precise, but gives the response and spin of 16 mains with more plow though'

    - The TW review suggests whtat you lose in control you gain in spin but the plow through is lacking and hence power is difficult to come by:

    ' The open string pattern of this racquet made it more forgiving than its predecessor. For whatever reason, this racquet felt faster, too. Because I was able to swing it faster I was able to get more spin, and the open pattern made finding depth an effortless affair. Compared to my Powerbridge 10 Mid, I didn't get the same amount of plow through and my shots didn't seem to be as penetrating.'

    'The problem for me with a lower swingweight (in this case 317) is that there's a lack of plow through. I felt as though I was having to over-exert myself to generate ample power and depth on my shots, and I was sacrificing fluidity on my groundstrokes. Towards the end of the playtest I tampered with the balance by adding lead tape to the 3 and 9 o'clock positions of the racquet head. The swingweight increased to about 330 and I found better plow though and access to power from the baseline.'

    The reality is that the weight to swingweight equation is wrong, which is a problem on the stock prestige mp.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2011
    #13
  14. sphinx780

    sphinx780 Professional

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    two different sticks chief...
     
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  15. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Five grams different in weight, but 20 points different in swingweight ... that's why the comparison and that's why the critique.

    The O325 lacks swingweight given its weight.



     
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  16. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

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    Oh yes, quite a while ago, in fact. The weight is beastly, and it has no feel. I was not impressed.

    I've actually said as much before, but it's easy to overlook my observations when I'm being [wrongfully] accused of not even playing tennis.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2011
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  17. Pneumated1

    Pneumated1 Professional

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    If you look at the X-325, PB-10 MP, and C-10 Pro, you find sticks a little over 12 oz. with a swingweight in the 320's. You can throw the Melbourne, Bio. 200, Prestiges into that mix as well. The one knock on the 200 Tour, Legend, and Radical Tour is the swingweight for those who can't handle it. I personally like the fact that there are 12oz. sticks with manageable swingweights that can be modified if need be. I could hit the Melbourne or X-325 stock personally.
     
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  18. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    The fact is as well that the OP reviewed two versions of the stick:

    - 343g version
    - 380g version

    A TW reviewer also did a

    - 317 sw
    - 330 sw
     
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  19. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    I have a prestige mp and it doesn't work as well with the stock sw as compared to the addition of around 10 sw points.



     
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  20. Pneumated1

    Pneumated1 Professional

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    The only time I've ever been stood up on any "date" in my life was the one night that I had a chance to demo the X-325. My opponent totally mixed up his days (yeah, he's young) and was away from his phone. So my experience was limited to about a half an hour against a backboard and twenty minutes of serving. I thought the weight of the frame was more than manageable, as one of its best features. And I personally could "feel" the ball fine, but much better players than me claim the opposite. I want to hit it again and the Melbourne, considering that I have my Londons jacked to about the weight of these stock anyway.

    But hey, if you don't like a stick you don't like it; plain and simple. Why didn't you just say that in the first place?
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2011
    #20
  21. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    There's certainly something odd about the Volkl brand as there used to be another poster who was a tireless promoter of the product and then he disappeared and then some time later this new one emerged.

    I can't think of anything comaparable with any other brand.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 24, 2011
    #21
  22. sphinx780

    sphinx780 Professional

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    I guess I'm not entirely following your critique as the O325 and the PB 10 MP spec wise show a sw of 317 and 320. Depending on the characteristics of the frame, either or could have more plow through.

    The PB mid with a sw of 337, would have more plow through most likely. So I can see why TW would state they didn't think the 0325 had plowthrough yet TM stated in comparison to the MP that the 0325 did have plowthrough.

    I haven't hit with any of these so I can only gauge by specs, which aren't always indicative of on court play to a degree. I guess I just take all reviews with a grain of salt, knowing that the experience and the feel I'm looking for will determine what stick I ultimately use so I don't bother attempting to pick a review apart, good or bad.
     
    #22
  23. Pneumated1

    Pneumated1 Professional

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    I love the Prestiges. In fact, my favorite was the Microgel version, but many found it underpowered. I thought Head did well to offer the stock weight a little under 12oz. to give the option of, as you say, a few added weight options. I almost pulled the trigger several times on a Prestige, but it just never happened for some reason.
     
    #23
  24. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

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    Like I said, I did say so. I've also said nice things about other BB/Volkl sticks, but once again, my criticisms - for better or for worse - are universally panned as 'Volkl hate.'
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2011
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  25. Pneumated1

    Pneumated1 Professional

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    My bad; I must have missed it. Although, it's quite obvious that your attraction to Volkl/BB threads seems to be more motivated against a certain poster than any appreciation that you have for the product. That's just an objective observation.:)
     
    #25
  26. sphinx780

    sphinx780 Professional

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    Dude, not sure if you have the time but if you try out a stick for a while, put up a review and compare to your game style, current racquet pref's. That's the best part of these boards!
     
    #26
  27. Pneumated1

    Pneumated1 Professional

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    Well said and a good philosophy.
     
    #27
  28. bngnhal

    bngnhal New User

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    coming from the pb10 mid and looking for a racket with a tad more stiffness, i found this racket suited me well. i use a full poly and string it 56/53 and find that works best for me...i really miss by pb10, i miss the flex and the whip i could get with that racket. i would sting it in the 40's and loved the way the ball would get sucked into the string bed and then fly off the strings, but the x325 for me volleys better, i can pick up the short hops easier and give me a bit more room for error.........but i really do miss my pb10
     
    #28
  29. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    Thanks! Would you be willing to contact them on my behalf?
     
    #29
  30. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    But that's the case with other non-Volkl racquets I've tried that are a similar spec. Once the ball's left the strings, and the racquet's moving through the air, the only thing I feel is the racquet moving through the air....
     
    #30
  31. Hominator

    Hominator Hall of Fame

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    I think he's referring to the lack of residual wobble, flutter, or flex that some sticks have after you hit the ball, such as a stock PB10mid.
     
    #31
  32. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    Just strung-up a brand new one of these with Xcel 17@53.5M/50C. This string suits this stick well, since, strung at this tension, a very soft pocket with a lot of bite is created. It was strung for a damaged arm, so I am really interested in its arm saver feedback.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2011
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  33. Cesare

    Cesare Semi-Pro

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    Did you play a brand new stock version of the frame, or with lead?Thanks
     
    #33
  34. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    I've played with both. I tested it for what it is off the rack, my objective review, and then, weighted and balanced to my personal specs, including grip size/shape, for a more subjective review. Stock, it plays like a Wilson 6.1 and Prestige, with the Volkl feel and with a better response off-center without the vibration. The X10 325 is also easier on the arm than its competitor frames, IMPO. Fully loaded, it plays like a 98in2 PB 10 Mid with more bite but less plow.
     
    #34
  35. Cesare

    Cesare Semi-Pro

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    i'll string mine next saturday for the first time, and i'm thinkin' of a full nat gut bed @ 62/60 with 8 grams( 4+4) at 2 and 10 o'clock. or an hybrid gut and soft co-poly @60/57. as a side note,i'm very lucky because i've just found a brand new 10 gen 1 midplus, great price too, a great substitute for my fatigued old one! the seller he's a crazy man,he doesn't really know what he's missing! :)
     
    #35
  36. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    The strength of this stick IMPO is the head shape. It is a modified Volkl head shape, similar to the PB 10 Mid. Putting lead at 2/10 only, will definitely change its feel. If you want it to feel more oval/round, go for it. Otherwise, I would suggest lead from 1:30-4, and the same on the other side for a fairly standard mod. My mod is very personal to me, which I have been using for close to 20 years-plus, so it is much more radical.

    Full gut with a 2 lb drop should be OK, but a 3 lb drop with co-poly in the crosses is not enough. 60G M/52P C would be more like it.

    Where did you find the T10 Tour?
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2011
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  37. Cesare

    Cesare Semi-Pro

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    Thanks for the suggestions! That brand new Tour 10 tour was in a market far from my smalltown here in Italy, in the discontinued racquets departement. very lucky because it was the last one. 60 euro, nice price as it's still ma favourite frame ever. The seller just doesn't mind. he's in the business now with the Wilson blx blade, he's selling a lot this one. I just don't know the reason why..
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2011
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  38. Cesare

    Cesare Semi-Pro

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    I've never tried the combo natural gut/ head rip control. maybe i should try it out. on of my friends he's absolutely in love whit it on an old Prince original graphite mid
     
    #38
  39. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    No problem....lucky you! Keep us apprised.
     
    #39
  40. HIT MAN

    HIT MAN New User

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    how does it feel?

    TM hello , my frame has been collecting dust , can not find the "perfect
    string tension" let us know how the xcel 17 works out , I have been stringing
    at the 59/57 , 57/55 range it just feels way tight , the 53.5/50 is what I
    string my pb10 mids and london tours at ,they play sweet also with the xcel 17, hate to give up on the frame .
     
    #40
  41. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    I strung it for Hominator. He is supposed to play on Saturday. He felt that my 53.5/50 was tight, but I string tight. Contact him.

    If you like the PB 10 Mid's dwell time and the London Tour's ball compression, you won't get that with the same string bed tension--approx 3 lbs tighter--with the X10 because the stick is all X, and the response off the face is quick and crisp, but, it has far more bite than the other two frames. Use more spin with the X10, which is why you go up in size anyway because you will lose plow thru unless you make it heavier than the mid which you moved from, or, lead your X10 to mimic your PB 10 and string with a deader multi like Gripper or NXT Tour so that the X-head will force the strings to sink and cup the ball. My X10 325 is now 380 grams, and the dwell is similar to the PB 10 Mid's.
     
    #41
  42. Hominator

    Hominator Hall of Fame

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    I'll be hitting with this stick on Sunday and will report back later this weekend.
     
    #42
  43. richie65

    richie65 Rookie

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    Hey I just purchased one of these from another member and when i opened the box I was surprised..............it looked like a black Babolat! The beam is roundish and big like the Pure Drive. WTF! Is this a Volkl 10 series? I compared it to my other Volkl 10s and it's way different.............it almost appears to be 100sq.in.

    I am WAY less excited to even put this into play despite the great condition of the racquet and strings from the previous owner.

    After years of playing Volkl, lately, I have gravitated away from Volkl, moving to the Head YTPP and Prince Diablo Mid as my main playing sticks. However, elbow issues are leading me back to Volkl. The other night I played with my C10 Pros and had a lack of control/stability compared to my Diablos had me getting killed on the court. More comfort sure, but balls going every direction and no stability.

    I need comfort, control and stability, I hope this thing plays better than it looks.
     
    #43
  44. farkus

    farkus New User

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    I remember having the same thoughts about my first wife.....(sigh).
     
    #44
  45. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

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    How it looks? You don't club the ball with looks!

    Put a bag over its head....
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2011
    #45
  46. HIT MAN

    HIT MAN New User

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    now thats more like it

    TM, took your advice , strung up some gosen 17 at 63/60 babolat 50/50 pattern, ( our friend Sam at vol-tec always said to use 50/50 on 10 series frames ) leaded up to about 375 grms ,and now its a beast,no more muted sound and very solid everywhere with the volkl feel , may try my 2nd frame with VS 17 for the ultimate ride !! Thanks for the tech review .
     
    #46
  47. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

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    Have you considered PK? The BA and Redondo series are both super arm friendly, and stellar with respect to the individual traits you're looking for. Also considerably cheaper than the newer Volkl offerings.
     
    #47
  48. samster

    samster Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2005
    Messages:
    5,017
    What does 50/50 pattern mean?
     
    #48
  49. TennisMaverick

    TennisMaverick Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,293
    That's some coincidence! My X10 325 is strung using the 50/50 method, with power pads between the 5th/6th mains! I strung it to be stock tested at 57/54 with Gripper, and once I loaded it up, it is obviously too loose and I would string it closer to what you did.
     
    #49
  50. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,364
    Location:
    Riverside, CA
    I've read a lot of reviews filled with this kind of 'Volkl is better than anything else' rhetoric. Certain people would have you believe that the Volkl 8 series is strictly better than any of Babolat's comparable offerings, or that the 10 series is a better 6.1, and without so much as a positive word about any other brand. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, so long as people have the ability to make up their minds for themselves, and not take everything on blind faith because a cloistered few have chosen to deify one poster. Take things with a grain of salt, if you will. There are phrases that should definitely raise some red flags for a discerning reader, such as the one that Torres quoted, but I think they're obvious enough that I don't need to enumerate them all.

    The truth is that there are a lot of good frames out there. One brand may be better suited to a particular person than another, but there isn't one company that is inherently superior to all others in every facet. Is Volkl a good brand? Certainly, but it isn't the be all, end all of performance athletic equipment.

    I know people will assume I'm bashing a particular poster, but that's not the case. I just want other posters - especially the newer ones, who might be convinced that Volkl is the best based on volume of threads alone - to know that there are a lot of great frames out there, and not to take one glowing review as gospel.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2011
    #50

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