Penn State Sanctions

Discussion in 'Odds & Ends' started by Fearsome Forehand, Jul 23, 2012.

  1. Kevin T

    Kevin T Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,417
    Location:
    Too far from the Blue Ridge
    Yes, 10 scholarships/year. It was misreported earlier in the day on many news outlets. You say it's nowhere near the death penalty/no comparison but that's arguing semantics. SMU lost 55 scholarships in 4 years and PSU loses 40 in 4 years. SMU lost a full season plus home games the next season (and volunteered to completely sit out the next full season) and PSU gets a 60 million dollar fine, equal to one season of football-related income. SMU got nothing close to 60 million (actually 60 million less). With the Internets/social media/exponentially more $$ in college football these days, the financial implications (current and future) for PSU are likely far greater. I'm not arguing that the program should be shut down or not but the penalty is pretty darn close to the death penalty, IMHO. How about a 1/2 death penalty? In addition, the students were involved in the infractions at SMU. Penn State's football team had nothing to do with it.

    A short comparison on foxsports:

    http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefoo...e-ncaa-penalties-to-southern-methodist-072312

    PSU's non-conference schedule next year is Ohio, UVA, Navy and Temple, then 'Cuse, UVA, Eastern Michigan and Kent State in '13. They should certainly win a few of those but none are 1AA like so many other top 25 schools schedule.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2012
    #51
  2. volleygirl

    volleygirl Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Messages:
    404


    Kevin, I wanted to ask someone about this. The $60 mill penalty is a pretty big amount but couldnt some big alumni just pop off a check to cover that if they wanted to? I am sure they have some big donor like OK St has in T Boone Pickens and he writes off checks like its Monopoly money.
     
    #52
  3. Kevin T

    Kevin T Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,417
    Location:
    Too far from the Blue Ridge
    Absolutely that can and likely will happen. That was the topic this morning on my local sports radio show. Apparently a lot of big PSU donors are saying they will substantially increase their giving. Honestly, I'm torn on how to approach the punishment issue. I would have been fine with the death penalty but at the same time, it's been a very clean program (in terms of NCAA violations) and the players seem to be without fault. You could fine PSU until doomsday but as you said, there will probably be someone to bail them out. Throw the book at the perv, Paterno (his assets now that he is deceased), the administrators, coaches involved and the university itself. I think I'm ok with the punishment that was handed out. Maybe along with the fine, forbid any alumni donations to the football program for a few years? I did see that the Big 10 will not share post-season/bowl revenue with PSU during their bowl ban, which = tens of millions.
     
    #53
  4. hollywood9826

    hollywood9826 Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2008
    Messages:
    507
    Location:
    Havre de Grace, MD
    Yea somebody could step in and help with that. But its still a penalty. and its 12 mil a year for 5 years.

    plus the los of 4 years of Bowl revenue (~13 mil).

    There are also speculation that after the civil cases they will lose sponsporships, and thier credit rating could be downgraded.

    PSU prifted over 50mil last year on football alone. Total revune for footbal was 72mil and other atletic department sales were close to 25 mil.

    The fines aint as big of an issues as will be lower TV ratings and merchandise sales.
     
    #54
  5. Kevin T

    Kevin T Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,417
    Location:
    Too far from the Blue Ridge
    Yep. A reporter from Altoon, PA was saying that ticket sales had already dropped off late last season and apparently season tickets now get a $400 per seat charge tacked on. It's easy to imagine that there will be a large drop in season ticket sales.
     
    #55
  6. volleygirl

    volleygirl Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Messages:
    404


    They get an extra $400 added onto their season tickets for supporting the scumbags who ran this university? Who thought of this idiotic idea? Amazing how the costs always get pssed down the line.
     
    #56
  7. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2007
    Messages:
    5,688
    I think the Orwellian changing of the school's wins to losses is absurd. As I understand it, the school is being punished for the bad behavior of the coaches covering up child molestation, not for cheating. How did child molestation help the team win games?
     
    #57
  8. adventure

    adventure Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2011
    Messages:
    509
    Trying to make sense of NCAA rulings is like trying to find meaning in a Pauly Shore movie.
     
    #58
  9. michael_1265

    michael_1265 Professional

    Joined:
    May 8, 2007
    Messages:
    960
    Location:
    Richmond, VA
    I'm not sure about Orwellian, but I am sure the NCAA was trying to hit PSU where it hurt: Paterno's legacy. I don't know how much sense it makes, or what it will change, though.
     
    #59
  10. Fearsome Forehand

    Fearsome Forehand Professional

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    1,183
    Location:
    USA
    ^ It sets a precedent NOT to do what PSU did because if you get caught, all the wins will be vacated.

    Big 10 will also nix the usual bowl revenue sharing for a period.

    PSU Football will be messed up for quite some time. They really deserve all this and worse IMHO.
     
    #60
  11. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2007
    Messages:
    5,688
    But it doesn't change his legacy. Now everyone will say, Paterno is the most winning coach but they changed his wins to losses because of Sandusky.

    It's not like the old USSR, everyone knows Paterno won more games. You can't actually change history, and Paterno has not been accused of cheating in those games. That's why I use the term Orwellian.
     
    #61
  12. r2473

    r2473 Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    Messages:
    6,949
    perfect term
     
    #62
  13. West Coast Ace

    West Coast Ace G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2005
    Messages:
    13,190
    Location:
    So Cal
    And you left out: 'they don't think they'll get caught because of their arrogance.'

    Why? Those behind the coverup are being dealt with by the criminal and civil court system? Why does the NCAA have to get involved? Because they're reputation was injured? The NCAA is a joke: the 'student/athlete' is the biggest charade known to man (see @jamesblakefan#1's comments) - it's ALL about the cash! They only caved in with the 4 team playoff because TV ratings and ticket sales for the bowls tanked - people were fed up.

    Note: grew up in PA but was no fan of Joe and PSU - they played a candy *ss schedule (before they joined the Big 10), then wonder why they weren't respected. But 'vacating' the wins is stupid and does nothing to help the victims or deter others in positions of power who will turn their back instead of doing the right thing.
     
    #63
  14. jamesblakefan#1

    jamesblakefan#1 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2007
    Messages:
    15,689
    Location:
    VA Beach
    Do you know who won the 2004 BCS Championship? Exactly, nobody. ;)
     
    #64
  15. maleyoyo

    maleyoyo Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    333
    I struggle to follow your reasoning here. According to you if Paterno had used his power to cheat to win games, then it would have been justified to change his wins to losses. Paterno did abuse his powers putting his football program and winning football games above those victims. If Paterno and his cronies have their way, Sandusky is still molesting children up to this day.
    Considering the magnitude of the offense, it makes sense to me to wipe out Paterno’s legacy.
    It seems odd to me that people is saying how PS’s punishments are unfair to those not involved, but if the offense is cheating instead, would people still be complaining ?
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2012
    #65
  16. r2473

    r2473 Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    Messages:
    6,949
    #66
  17. pinky42

    pinky42 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2004
    Messages:
    100
    If the NCAA had learned about PSU's and Paterno's actions (or lack of them) sooner do you think the NCAA would have punished them? For example, let's say that this is 1998 instead of 2012 and the Sandusky story breaks. Do you think Paterno would have been allowed to continue coaching? If the answer is no then it wouldn't be unreasonable to vacate those wins.

    Now, there's a question of whether the NCAA should have punished PSU at all or if they should have left it as purely a criminal and civil matter. However, PSU seems to have agreed to the punishment so that ship has sailed.
     
    #67
  18. volleygirl

    volleygirl Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Messages:
    404

    You could argue that them keeping the child molesting a secret helped them recruit a lot of the players they got over the last decade which in turn hel[ed them win games. Taking wins away from JoePa is great to me because its obvious all he cared about was having the most wins in history. It just shows you can do this and its something baseball should do with the roiders so they dont hold every record in that sport. Make Hank Aaron the HR king again, Maris the single season holder, and Gehrig the Grand Slam holder instead of Afraud.
     
    #68
  19. volleygirl

    volleygirl Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Messages:
    404
    Agree totally, cant believe so many people feel so sorry for Paterno after what he did
     
    #69
  20. jamesblakefan#1

    jamesblakefan#1 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2007
    Messages:
    15,689
    Location:
    VA Beach
    #70
  21. Crispvolley

    Crispvolley New User

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    13
    I also agree. Further, if he was willing to cover for a pedophile i don't think its a huge stretch to think that he might have been very comfortable covering up more typical violations. Its interesting to watch this OTL episode now that perceptions of Paterno have changed.

    http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=7229980
     
    #71
  22. Avles

    Avles Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,505
    Location:
    The Peak of Good Living
    Orwellian was the term I thought of too. For me vacating the wins seems like a way of trying to cleanse the record, to pretend that somehow all that dirty business wasn't really part of college football. But of course it was. I see no reason to let the NCAA avoid the embarrassment of having their winningest coach be associated with the scandal.

    I don't care much what they do to the PSU program going forward, but I think the wins and Paterno's record should stay intact-- in part as a reminder that there are more important things than wins and records.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2012
    #72
  23. mightyrick

    mightyrick Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    4,611
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    There needs to be no reminder and his record should be vacated. Believe me, this situation will be remembered for decades to come. His name or record should not even be remotely on the same list as other reputable coaches who earned their wins without having to hide such atrocities.

    Vacating the record communicates the message strongly.
     
    #73
  24. Fearsome Forehand

    Fearsome Forehand Professional

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    1,183
    Location:
    USA
    Vacating the wins was strictly punitive. Paterno is no longer the winningest
    coach. That is the whole point. That and the precedent. It won't do you any good to cover up criminality because when we find out about it, all your wins will become losses.
     
    #74

Share This Page