People who posted videos

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by Shroud, Jul 26, 2013.

  1. Shroud

    Shroud Hall of Fame

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    did the feed back help you?

    To do a video I will need to spend some money on equipment if figure it is around $400+ to get slow motion shots.

    Anyhow would you buy a camera and post the vid or just spend the dough on lessons or ball machines, etc.?
     
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  2. TomT

    TomT Hall of Fame

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    Yes, the feedback definitely helps.

    You don't need to spend anywhere near $400 just to do slow motion. But if you want the sort of slow motion that is sufficient for the experts here to effectively analyze, then I guess so. Still, even without that, their comments and suggestions can help a lot. I just use a relatively inexpensive Sony CyberShot for my vids and have gotten some very helpful feedback from many TTW contributors.

    Regarding the choice you pose, I'd get the camera first, then the ball machine, then if you feel you need in-person instruction some lessons.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2013
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  3. josofo

    josofo Semi-Pro

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    i would guess no. its kind of fun to talk about your tennis game though.
     
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  4. mr_eko

    mr_eko Professional

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    If you are going to spend $400, invest that in some private one on one lessons with a teaching pro near your area. Will be a lot more beneficial.
     
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  5. BMC9670

    BMC9670 Hall of Fame

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    I use video in coaching my son and it has helped tremendously. Here is what I use:

    iPhone $0 (I say $0 because I'd have it regardless of tennis)

    CoachMVideo App - $0 (great app lets you go slo-mo frame by frame, repeat, draw, zoom, and extract stills)

    Tripod $10 (lifts the iPhone up to 5 ft, steady, and level)

    iPhone Tripod Adapter $6

    My son's improved backhand - priceless.
     
    #5
  6. tennis_balla

    tennis_balla Hall of Fame

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    $400? Dude, I've used my smart phone to record during lessons, imported it into my computer and then used Quicktime to go frame by frame and show players their faults. Just pause the video and use the right and left arrow, all the slow mo you'll ever need.
     
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  7. newpball

    newpball Legend

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    For slow motion I would recommend a camera that can do at least 60fps.

    For instance a GoPro Hero3 is nice, the white edition can do 720p at 60fps and you should be able to get it for under $200. The black edition is really cool with wifi remote and can do 1080p at 60fps.

    http://gopro.com/hd-hero3-cameras

    Only minus is the wide angle lens.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2013
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  8. shazbot

    shazbot Semi-Pro

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    I'm guessing you don't have a smartphone?

    Cause really, any newer droid or iphone will take video as good as many video camera's.
     
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  9. Raul_SJ

    Raul_SJ Professional

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    If you record with a 60fps camera and then upload to YouTube, does
    YouTube reduce the frame rate to 30fps?
     
    #9
  10. NE1for10is?

    NE1for10is? Semi-Pro

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    If you're planning on getting a camera for tips from people on here, you're probably better off spending the money on private lessons IMHO. However, if you want to get a camera to analyze your patterns or strokes for yourself and/or your coach it is money well spent. I learned a lot when I put up a camera and recorded a few matches.
     
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  11. GBplayer

    GBplayer Semi-Pro

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    Find a well recommended coach and get one to one lessons.
     
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  12. newpball

    newpball Legend

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    Perhaps, but that is not a problem, just slow motion the video 2x and you have 30fps slow motion. :)
     
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  13. BIGJ98

    BIGJ98 Rookie

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    Find a private coach for lessons. It will help you a lot more.
     
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  14. Chas Tennis

    Chas Tennis Hall of Fame

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    Recent Threads on Video Cameras

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=405536

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=431983

    60p fps is slow for the fastest tennis motions, especially on the serve. One frame every 17 milliseconds. If the shutter is fast, so that the motion blur is small, 60 fps will show a lot. New DSLRs with 60 fps and fast manual shutters (1/4000 sec) would have almost no motion blur. But 60 fps is misleading on the serve because it takes only one frame every 17 milliseconds and things change too much in 17 ms. Jello Effect distortion, for example, showing false bending of golf clubs, is unknown without testing. For informative 60 fps videos, view the serve from behind in bright sunlight.

    60p fps AUTO exposure control in late sunlight with an OK shutter speed. Examine stop action -
    https://vimeo.com/46427326

    [Vimeo does not play on my Samsung Galaxy S2 Epic smartphone. The best way to do stop-action single-frame on Vimeo is to click the play-pause button as fast as possible.]

    Another 60p fps AUTO in brighter sunlight showing less motion blur. Some Jello Effect distortion makes the racket falsely appear to bend at impact.
    https://vimeo.com/46427230

    240 fps with a very fast shutter is very good. A frame every 4 milliseconds. Near impact on the serve the racket face angle still changes several degrees between frames. 240 fps shows nearly everything but it is not fast enough to watch the ball interact on the strings. Example videos of serves taken with a Casio FH100 and fast shutter speeds. https://vimeo.com/user6237669/videos

    Toly has been displaying some very informative composite pictures on TW from high speed video lately.
    http://www.kinovea.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?id=692

    Excellent cameras with full manual exposure control and very fast shutters (1/40,000 sec): Casio Ex F1 (2008], FH20, FH25 and the FH100 (2010). These models are discontinued, available used at higher prices.

    Probably all affordable cameras with high speed video modes now available have automatic exposure control and the fastest shutter speed is slower (1/1000 or 1/2000 sec) and unknown. Shutter speed usually depends on the level of available light. Smartphones have fast shutter speeds in direct sunlight so that you can see the racket without too much motion blur. I can't be sure what the AUTO cameras will do - what shutter speed their software will select for given light levels.

    If anyone has a Canon Powershot, check to see if your model has a high speed video mode. The 110 HS does and many other also. For many Powershot models resolution is only 320 X 240 at 240 fps and recording time is probably limited to only around 30 seconds. Shutter speed probably around 1/2000 sec in bright sunlight, but who knows without testing.

    The Canon Powershot 110 HS is a big compromise for HSV, down from the Casio FH100 in many capabilities, but it might give you very useful information on the serve. $150 refurbished.
    http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/catalog/powershot-elph-110-hs-red-refurbished
    I don't own this camera so I can't be certain of its performance in high speed video mode.

    (Careful finding cameras at very low prices as some sellers seem to advertise, take the order and then make no attempt to deliver a camera. ?? Check the company on the internet and in Az customer reviews.)

    For any camera that you are interested in search - Youtube + camera model + high speed video + golf or similar Youtube searches. Look carefully at the motion blur.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2013
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  15. newpball

    newpball Legend

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  16. Bagumbawalla

    Bagumbawalla Hall of Fame

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    1. I would suggest borrowing a camera- or have afriend/relative (with a camera of their own) take charge of the photography- for now.

    2. Be prepared to sort through the various suggestions and cull out those that are actually helpful.

    3. If you are able to do 2 (above) then it's possible you don't need much help in the first place.

    4. Unless you are fairly good, be prepared with a thick skin.

    5. Also, simply getting information or opinions on what you need to improve- does not improve you, in itself. You may need to get out there and do a lot of practicing and reworking of your strokes.

    6. If, indeed, you do find the video (and the criticism) helpful- and you have the determination to do what it takes to improve your game- then, consider buying a video camera.
     
    #16
  17. Greg G

    Greg G Professional

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    I'm probably one of the most prolific video posters here, at least for the past year or so. I'd say it's been quite helpful for my particular situation- limited court time, no good coaches in the area. It helps me maximize the gains from my practice sessions. Yes, you do need to have a thick skin, but it's not really all that bad. Work on one thing at a time, you can get overwhelmed by all the suggestions that come your way.

    Good luck!
     
    #17
  18. tennis_balla

    tennis_balla Hall of Fame

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    Asking for tennis advice on TT is quite possibly the worst decision you can make :)
     
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  19. directionals

    directionals Rookie

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    There are knowledgeable members here who give out good advices. If you're new to TT though, you may need to spend a couple months reading to know whose advices more sound than others'. Speaking from my experience.
     
    #19
  20. BMC9670

    BMC9670 Hall of Fame

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    To add to my post: use video by all means (I'm getting a lot of use from the above $16 set-up). However, DON'T post it online. Too many unqualified opinions and ego. Use the video to compare your strokes to reputable video instruction and videos of pro players.
     
    #20
  21. Chas Tennis

    Chas Tennis Hall of Fame

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    Last edited: Jul 30, 2013
    #21
  22. corbind

    corbind Professional

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    You are a wise man.
     
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  23. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    Really? Imo that is far from true. We have several outstanding guys like you and
    Ash and many others that, while I might not agree with some of what they say,
    they are generally giving the traditional party line info like "hit deep"...... so how
    is that going to be any worse than your avg instructor down the way. Imo on here
    you have the chance to compare and contrast instruction, looking for what you
    feel you can put to work in your game. :)
    I rarely see real bad advice and it is usually pretty clear they are off a bit.
     
    #23

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