Petition against Wilson

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by tennis4losers, Jun 10, 2008.

  1. tennis4losers

    tennis4losers Semi-Pro

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    While I enjoy using Wilson frames, I propose a petition against them due to their poor quality control on their products. Those who agree, please say something (for example how a racket's spec was way off) and hopefully someone at Wilson Headquarter sees this and does something.
     
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  2. feyya

    feyya Banned

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    Wilsons headquarters ,unfortunatly, would not give a sh1t what this message boards has to say.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2008
    #2
  3. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    They're mass produced in China. If you want matched sticks, you're going to have to ask for them and/or pay the small labor fees.
     
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  4. meowmix

    meowmix Hall of Fame

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    Matey, good luck with this. It's going to fail miserably, but good luck anyways.
     
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  5. Nitro

    Nitro Rookie

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    You are wasting your time.
     
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  6. netman

    netman Hall of Fame

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    Yep. Good old Chinese manufacturing. Labor is so cheap, the mindset is to make 100, figure that 40 are poor quality and they are coming back because its cheaper to make 40 more than it is to get all 100 right the first time. And who knows, maybe the customer is too stupid to know any of those 40 are bad. Sounds kind of like Detroit in the 50s and 60s, doesn't it?

    -k-
     
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  7. tennisguy7482

    tennisguy7482 Rookie

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    i actually thought wilson has decent quality control at +/- 7 grams......now prince on the other hand..........

    nobody wants 7 grams difference, but thats why there is lead tape for fine tuning for those of us that can feel those differences in weight.
     
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  8. obnoxious2

    obnoxious2 Semi-Pro

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    It's mindsets like these 2 which continue to allow companies feeling like they can get away with it. Keep thinking this way and they'll treat you like shiit even more. Get enough petitions, I guarantee you will see results.
     
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  9. meowmix

    meowmix Hall of Fame

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    Look. Statistically speaking, TW members make up maybe .05% of the tennis market. MAYBE. Even if everybody on this board signed this petition, you'd have .05% of the market petitioning against Wilson goods. Do you REALLY think that Wilson's going to care? If it were something like a quarter million people signed it, then Wilson would be forced to do something. But the problem is, the members of this board represent 90% of the people that know the grommets from the throat of a racket. The companies will completely glaze over a petition like this. Sorry, but stats are stats.
     
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  10. Syfo-Dias

    Syfo-Dias Semi-Pro

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    You're actually satisfied with a +/- 7 gram variance? I can't believe what people put up with from Wilson and some other companies. I've never seen more than a 1 or 2 grams difference with Yonex. In Japan some shops would actually check the weight and balance themselves and label each racquet with their exact specs. I was amazed that so many were exactly the same in weight and balance and some were only off by a gram or two. The last two Yonex sticks that I've owned have been exactly on spec; not even off by 1 gram. And yet Yonex is still able to pay their workers real world wages and keep their prices competitive with Wilson. Kind of makes you wonder.
     
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  11. justacityboy

    justacityboy Rookie

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    do you think most wilson frames fall within the +/- of 7 grams?? i don't pretend to know enough about rackets so if you guys could shed some light, that would be fantastic
     
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  12. 2nd_Serve

    2nd_Serve Professional

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    You have got to be kidding me. Mine was 17 grams off, and 4mm difference in length. Also, the balance point was off by 3 points. Luckily, I'm pretty close with my pro shop so they fixed everything up for me.
     
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  13. superstition

    superstition Hall of Fame

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    I bought a Prostaff 85 that felt too light. It was a mistake.
     
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  14. spkyEngrish

    spkyEngrish Rookie

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    Aaahhh yes, Yonex QC. Peeled the plastic off my RDS001 at the pro shop when I bought it, threw it on the scale they have there, and it read "325g" - exactly what was painted on the side of the racquet :) Something so cozy about knowing that you're getting exactly what you paid for.
     
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  15. Snuh

    Snuh Rookie

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    Thats why Im happy I switched from Wilsons to Yonex's myself. Althogh I do like the Wilson paint jobs.
     
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  16. Dark_Angel85

    Dark_Angel85 Rookie

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    I just recently bought 2 frames myself... besides the HL differences (which i fixed with just 3 grammes of tape at the butt cap), they're perfectly fine.

    ... So, I don't follow. Or maybe I'm just lucky?
    :)
     
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  17. RKsemiwestern

    RKsemiwestern New User

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    omg this happens? i had no idea lol im just dumb i guess.... i have 2 aerogels ones a 500 the others a 500 tour.... should i weigh and check the balance of them?
     
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  18. 0d1n

    0d1n Hall of Fame

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    Besides being "easily pleased" you are also not very good at mathematics. If the tolerance is +/- 7 grams that means you can have a 14 grams difference between two frames.
    For anybody that's any good anything over 10 grams difference between 2 rackets that are supposed to play alike is RIDICULOUS and UNACCEPTABLE.
    And trust me ... Wilson doesn't even respect that ridiculously "wide" tolerance.
    Fischer frames usually have (had ... before the No Tolerance stuff) a +/- 6 grams tolerance, but I've never found any of their frames to be EVEN CLOSE to the limits of that tolerance (i.e they are within 1-3 grams of each other and of the spec ... EVERY TIME).
    Seems to me that anybody who pays a big price (bigger than most Yonex/Fischer ...etc frames) for a "K-Factor" and doesn't get the seller to match it to spec is getting screwed.
     
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  19. PimpMyGame

    PimpMyGame Hall of Fame

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    Wilson make their money on spoilt 14 year-olds demanding 6 Fed rackets, and wide-body ultra light granny sticks. Both sets of demographics would not care about quality control with regard to weight and balance. I admire what you plan to do, but it's doomed from the start.
     
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  20. kalic

    kalic Professional

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    Who cares quality control ? They can make all plastic racquets, and it will be the best sellers. The most important thing (for most consumers) is that Fed uses it.
     
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  21. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, so why should they even bother with printing the specs on the frames? It's definitely a waste of paint if you ask me. :roll:
     
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  22. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    What bothers me even more are the differences in grip sizes which you notice right away. You can buy six identical racquets all marked 4 1/2 but they will feel like they're anywhere from 4 3/8 to 4 5/8.
     
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  23. tennisguy7482

    tennisguy7482 Rookie

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    yes, i realize that you can have 14 grams of difference........but thanks captain obvious........they are not the worst in this area.......most good pro shops should screen racquets to customers buying more than 1.

    i was just giving my 2 cents.......lighten up, were all friendly here
     
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  24. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    haha funny sig tennisguy
     
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  25. obnoxious2

    obnoxious2 Semi-Pro

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    Did I ever say limit it to just this board? Have you been to any sports stores lately? They don't or barely carry any player sticks at all. It's all 9 oz tweener racquets. So the majority of this world who's looking for player sticks are forced to go online such at TW. And you know most people will read the reviews and look on forums to find out other peoples' opinions.

    And where the hell are you getting your "statisical #'s" from? You sir are underestimating the power of the internet. Few weeks ago, some BMW dealership shafted some guy who won an auction on a brand new m3 because it hadn't met their bid requirement even though they didn't set a reserve. I'm not going to go into the details since you can look it up yourself but short story, he posted his problem on a BMW forum and it spread like wildfire from there. In the end he got the car at that price.
     
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  26. Serpententacle

    Serpententacle Hall of Fame

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    My wife's wilson racquet had one side with polished finish, and the other half was rough. And YES... it IS a real Wilson. We decided not to raise a stink about it, though. The distributer (who will remain unnamed), sent us a $20 gift certificate b/c we thought it was too much of a hassle to return the racquet for an exchange.

    Despite this defect, the racquet plays as it should.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2008
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  27. Syfo-Dias

    Syfo-Dias Semi-Pro

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    Yikes, that's pretty bad even for Wilson. :shock:
     
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  28. Snuh

    Snuh Rookie

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    Its as if someone at the factory licked the polish off one side of the frame! :shock:
     
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  29. Dark_Angel85

    Dark_Angel85 Rookie

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    To me though, if it's that big of a difference... I wouldn't buy it in the first place...

    Always double check... whatever brand
     
    #29
  30. YULitle

    YULitle Hall of Fame

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    OP: How is it that when people are dissatisfied with a companies product, they immediately resort to petitions or other forms of protest? Why don't you just NOT BUY THE PRODUCT. Companies don't get a crap about protest, for the most part. But, if they see it affecting their bottom line, they'll change in a heart beat. So just STOP BUYING THEIR PRODUCTS. That's the most powerful tool in your arsenal.
     
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  31. rooski

    rooski Professional

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    All racket companies have some degree of QC issues when it comes to weight tolerances. It's not just Wilson. Some companies do a little better job of culling the extreme variance rackets but they still have +-5-7 grams of variance. I have been playing Wilson rackets for the better part of 30 years and I have always found the weight variances within reason and easily corrected by small amounts of lead tape if necessary. I have 5 nBlades and stock unstrung they were amazingly close in weight.

    If you perfectionists need your rackets matched when buying from TW, then just ask them to do it for you. No big deal. If you buy individually of course they can't help you so you'll have to use a little lead.

    For those that mentioned length discrepencies you might want to consider the fact that this has a lot to do with stringing. Some frames that are strung significantly higher on the cross strings than on the mains can become elongated on the head and therefore appear to be a few mm's long compared to stock (or shortened if the clamps weren't tight on the stringing machine). Also, if you use full poly in one identical frame and put a poly hybrid in the other it makes a difference in balance. So many variables.

    Grip diameter discrepencies. In my experience...99% of this comes from the way the grip is put on at the factory. This is done by a machine but if the overlap at the bottom is a little over the line it makes the grip feel big. This of course is also easily fixed by removing the grip and reinstalling it your self. More variables.

    Some of you guys are spoiled. Back in the days of wood rackets they could vary +- 1 full ounce. They grouped them into "light", "medium", and "heavy" categories but even within those groups the variances were significant. I used to take a stack of unstrung "medium" frames and feel each of them so I could pick 3 or 4 of the ones that felt right to me. Ahhh...the good old days.
     
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  32. 0d1n

    0d1n Hall of Fame

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    Agree completely...and that's exactly what I did. I haven't bought a Wilson racquet in about 1000 years, and I'm very happy with my decision.
    I stay with Fischers, Dunlops, Volkls generally. Some Head, Vantage and recently bought a TF.
    That's enough options for me...and all those options have been better in the QA department than Wilson.

    You mean ... the "bad old days" don't you ?? I am aware that one can customize slightly different sticks. However, some differences are just IMPOSSIBLE to compensate. Also ... it takes time and effort to do ... and I for one am only going to do it if I have no choice, or at least I have a damn good reason to do it (i.e ...it's the only stick I can play decent tennis with, or is significantly cheaper than other options).
    Given the fact that's not the case (i.e I have plenty of options, Wilson generally asks for BIGGER prices than most other companies for their "flagship" models...and STILL don't get their QA fixed ... I see no reason to change my mind about them).
     
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  33. TripleB

    TripleB Hall of Fame

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    If you order a pair (or three or four) from T-W, it doesn't matter how bad Wilson's quality control is.

    You can have T-W 'match' two/three/etc. racquets to have the exact same specs.

    I did this with the two nCode nPro Open racquets I just ordered. Both came to me at 10.7 ounces, 12 5/8" balance point, and a swingweight of 295. Unstrung with plastic on wrap and a vibration dampener. Since I had both strung with different strings they made sure the specs matched before stringing. Obviously the specs don't match exactly now but when I decide on a string they will.

    I even ordered a third nCode nPro Open racquet yesterday and they are going to make sure the unstrung specs of it matches those of my other two.

    Tennis-Warehouse is incredible when it comes to making sure racquets are exactly the same...making up for manufacturer mistakes!!

    TripleB
     
    #33
  34. nickb

    nickb Banned

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    Thats the point.

    TW shouldnt have to do that and people shouldnt have to pay extra to have them matched.
     
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  35. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Actually, the ones that I have/had with differences in grip sizes, it was the handle underneath the grip itself and not the way the grip was wrapped. I removed the grips completely and the bare handles still felt like they were noticeably different in grip size even though they all had the same grip size number molded right onto the handles. All I can conclude is that their handle molds are inconsistent in size.
     
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  36. rooski

    rooski Professional

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    Wow...That's pretty wierd Breakpoint. So you are saying that on an exact same model (not generations before of the same model) you have seen/felt bare handles and they were different diameters? I know some of the Wilson models have slightly different grip shapes (i.e., n6195 vs nBlade) but if you are saying you have seen, for example, two brand new K6195's of the same marked grip size with different pallet diameters then that is news to me. Never seen or felt that in my 35 years with Wilson frames....and I'm pretty picky about my rackets. Maybe I have been lucky.
     
    #36
  37. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Yes, and it's not just Wilson. I've had this issue with many other brands as well.

    Exact same model, exact same brand, exact same marked grip size, exact same month's/year's production, all purchased at exactly the same time, yet the grip sizes can run as much as 1/8 too small or too big from each other.

    I now think the grips sizes can vary as much and as often as the variances in weight and balance between frames of the same model.
     
    #37
  38. nickb

    nickb Banned

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    ^ Strange. Never, ever heard of that happening. I string for a pro that uses stock nsix-one 95s...he has had over 30 of him from wilson...not heard any complaints. I also have owned over 30 wilson frames and never felt a difference. The grips are made/moulded by hi-tec machinery...dont see how they could make mistakes like you mention.

    In your head?
     
    #38
  39. Rafael_Nadal_6257

    Rafael_Nadal_6257 Semi-Pro

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    How exactly do you get racquets matched by TennisWarehouse? Is there a link or something you have to click when you purchase them?
     
    #39
  40. KerryJ

    KerryJ Semi-Pro

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    My friend has two of the Wilson K95 X. They're both real, but one is more headlight than another. And it's painted on there, I'll get some pictures of them if I can.
     
    #40
  41. PBODY99

    PBODY99 Hall of Fame

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    My doubles partner had the Original Wilson 6.3 95 which I tried to match with over 50 frames that came through the shop I worked at in the early 1990. He tried for over five years to find one to match the weight and balance with no luck.
     
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  42. Octavianus

    Octavianus Rookie

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    They are made in China, anything that is made in China IS crap. Unfortunately just about everything is made in China these days and we do not have a choice in the matter. If we want to play with Wilson racquets we are stuck with an inferior product that is Made in China. That is why knowing how to balance racquets and how to use touch up paint for when the racquets chip is so very important.

    O
     
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  43. beedlejuice22

    beedlejuice22 Semi-Pro

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    I got an N6.2 a couple years ago and then a couple months later I got another one. The second one was so far off. It was probably .5 of an ounce different. The balance point was mainly the problem. But you would think such a big brand would have better quality control
     
    #43
  44. ndtennis

    ndtennis Rookie

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    Big companies like Wilson know their position and they know they can get away with their horrible quality.... but yet people still buy
     
    #44
  45. Rafael_Nadal_6257

    Rafael_Nadal_6257 Semi-Pro

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    Again:

    How exactly do you get racquets matched by TennisWarehouse? Is there a link or something you have to click when you purchase them?


    So basically, since everything is made in China, and everything made in China is crap, everything is crap...okay, I got your point.
     
    #45
  46. geesechops

    geesechops Semi-Pro

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    The grip size discrepancy drives me nuts because with my set up I can feel the differences immensely. I might just shave all of them down to match the smallest one.
     
    #46
  47. ollinger

    ollinger Legend

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    It's odd that Wilson always leads polls on this board for favorite racquet or favorite racquet company. If they're such garbage, why are so many people here (the congnoscenti) buying them?
     
    #47
  48. Syfo-Dias

    Syfo-Dias Semi-Pro

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    Or you could choose not to accept that and buy some quality stuff not made in China. For example my Yonex racquets were made in Japan, my Nokia cell phone was made in Finland, and my New Balance running shoes were made in the USA. Of course, it's not possible for everything, but a lot of non-Chinese products can still be found.
     
    #48
  49. Dark_Angel85

    Dark_Angel85 Rookie

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    I second that

    I've been buying racquets for quite some time now... never once have i encountered a problem that couldn't be fixed with really minor tweaks.

    and most of the time... there aren't any real problems
     
    #49
  50. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    No, not in my head. They all look identical so I don't know which one it is when I pick it up until I feel the grip, and the ones that are big are always big and ones that are small are always small. This is why most pros get their handles custom molded so that that are more consistent in size.

    Perhaps you just don't notice the grip size differences as much as some others do?
     
    #50

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