Plant based/ Vegan...

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by rk_sports, Oct 25, 2013.

  1. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    I think that it is possible to get a good athlete's diet while being a vegetarian who consumes milk or eggs, but people are rightly suspicious about the claims of vegans.

    From what I've heard, many ex-vegans are shunned by their friends if they admit to eating meat. In fact, some nut had a web-site devoted to attacking people who used to be vegan and gave it up. A lot of the women who strip down for those PETA ads are seen eating steaks and the like in public. For many people, vegan is a pose to show how much better they are than other people.

    And some people like Carl Lewis switched over very late in their careers while they had grown up eating animal protein and fats.
     
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  2. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    Lol, I hear you WildVolley. Everything in moderation, even being Vegan. That's going way overboard in my opinion when you try and force it on others. It's up to each individual and family. For me, I like ice cream, melted cheese, etc. and I drink protein milk just because I think it helps me stay healthy. I never liked sour cream or yogurt for whatever reason.
     
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  3. LuckyR

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    Going vegetarian is no guarantee of a healthful (or unhealthful for that matter) diet. Given the amount and quality of vegetarian meat substitutes as well as supplements, no one should fear going vegetarian for any reason.

    Going vegan, though while theoretically totally safe and possible to do well, actually takes some work to do correctly.
     
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  4. Posture Guy

    Posture Guy Professional

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    Lucky....i agree, but my core point is that even if "done correctly", one can "do vegan" as well as it can be done and you'll still be missing certain micro nutrients that are essential for health.

    And that doesn't speak to the macro nutrient level. There's long been a belief that fat is bad, and saturated fat is especially bad. Turns out there's no strong evidence for such a belief, and a growing body of evidence that the opposite is true provided the saturated fat is from clean sources and doesn't have the wrong omega 6/3 ratio. Most vegan diets are woefully short of fat, especially nutrient rich saturated fats. The brain simply needs these nutrients to function properly. As does your immune system, lymphatic system, reproductive systems and on.
     
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  5. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    We can never really overestimate the importance of bacon in a balanced diet.
     
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  6. LuckyR

    LuckyR Legend

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    Your post implies (though doesn't say explicitly) that vegan equals low fat. That is simply an out and out falsehood. There are no shortage of various types of plant based fats. Under the "myth" of the benefit of low fat diets, many assume that going vegetarian/vegan will therefore equal a healthful diet automatically. Neither assumption is true, necessarily.

    In my experience new converts to vegetarianism have very high fat diets since their previous exposure to "vegetables" consists of junk like french fries.
     
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  7. Posture Guy

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    Lucky....i agree. Junk food vegetarians tend to eat a LOT of pasta, flour and junky fats.

    Those who do it more competently either eat pretty low fat diets, or get their fats from sources like avocados and nuts. Nuts seem to be ok in small doses but in large quantities can have an inflammatory effect on the body. And none of these fats have the micronutrient density or profile of things like grassfed butter.
     
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  8. Sentinel

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    That Indian wrestler who won a medal in the OG (2008 i think) said he was a vegetarian. The one who said he spent many hours praying to some God (i presume Hanuman). But unlike the vegan diets, milk and milk products would be a major part of his diet.
     
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  9. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    That's interesting and doesn't surprise me in the least Sentinel. I have worked out at some gyms in Kerala, India (during some family trips there as a teenager). MANY of the gym rats there are vegetarian and believe me many are very strong and "ripped" too. All in all, one thing that is clear that in many industrialized countries especially, generally speaking lower red meat consumption especially in favor of more fruits/vegetables is a simple diet tweak that can lead to significant health benefits. With more research completed in the last few decades especially, that's where the populations are headed. Fast food influence will also be tempered, as we've seen in the U.S. in terms of marketing and understanding, but also behavior. So many people eat impulsively without really considering the direct effects of diet.
     
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  10. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    That is interesting. I thought the akhada people with their Lord Hanuman would be all eating meat.

    What category was that? I doubt anyone in the heavyweight categories would be a vegetarian. I am sure the late Dara Singh was not a veggie.
     
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  11. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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  12. OTMPut

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    Funny, if a meat eating standard American dieter blamed meat for his troubles.

    A Vegan diet ought to include lots of different vegetables and fruits, preferably fresh.

    Btw, there can also be standard aMercian diet vegans and they abuse processed sh1t and end up blaming veganism for their ills.

    Make sure you transition intelligently. Scott Jurek has some interesting information in his book.
     
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  13. Shroud

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    Ok, I watched that vid twice. Man all the crap oil in all kind of places.

    I cut out all the bad oils and added ground flax seed and B12 to my diet.

    Its strange because ever since I did that, I have noticed something strange.

    I used to have to have my alarm wake me. Now I ALWAYS wake up 5-10 minutes before the alarm!! This has been happening for a couple of months now, and the only time this didnt happen was the few times I didnt set the alarm.

    Is it possible that the omega 3/6 ratio and B12 are helping my sleep cycle?
     
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  14. OTMPut

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    B12 remains an enigma.

    The methyl cobalamine form delivered as a jab on the butt is far more effective than the cynocobalamine pill version.
     
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  15. rk_sports

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    Interesting...I would've guessed of no connection.. but looks like there is..
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9108574
     
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  16. Posture Guy

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    First, cutting out the 'bad' oils like vegetable oils is going to significantly reduce inflammation. And that will help almost EVERY metabolic process.

    Second, the post above about oral versus injected B12 is right on. Oral b complex supplements are a complete waste of money. Virtually none of the nutrients gets through the digestive track.

    I work with a neuro-immunologist, really interesting guy. Having sufficient levels of methylated b vitamins in the system is ESSENTIAL for repairing damaged neural tissue (for example, old head traumas like I had from a car accident and severe concussion many years ago), maintaining sufficient myelin in the brain (critical for those with MS), and on. In his research on how to elevate usable b-complex levels, he discovered a few things:

    - white people of european descent have something like a 65% chance of genetically impaired methylation. In his studies, he found that african american football players had, per capita, significantly lower rates of post concussion syndrome and healed much faster compared to white athletes. And he referenced a number of other studies with comparable results.

    So, he set about trying to find a way to elevate these levels, especially in those with such a genetic impairment. The gold standard is injectables. Doesn't have to be intra-muscular, can be just under the skin and the tissue will absorb and disperse it pretty well. But he also developed a topical cream that is absorbed trans-dermally that also works pretty well, and it's over the counter. I use it 5 days a week, and then 2 days a week I do an injection of a b-complex solution. Has definitely helped my health, particularly improving my immune markers.

    Here's a video of him talking about this issue and the cream:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0796E1G0QU

    and this is the product page where one can order it, if desired:

    http://www.neurobiologix.com/Neuro-Immune-Stabilizer-B12-B6-Vitamin-D-Cream-p/46.htm

    I have no financial interest in this product, just a patient of the guy. He's helped me a lot and I think this topic is a really interesting one. Just passing on some stuff.
     
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  17. OTMPut

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    ^^^ thanks for the ref. I need to try the cream.
     
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  18. Posture Guy

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    You're welcome. It's definitely helped me and my wife.
     
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