Players with 8 Slams or More and Tough Losses

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by McEnroeisanartist, Oct 23, 2012.

  1. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,197
    I thought it would be interesting to compare the number of tough losses (5 set losses in Grand Slam quarterfinals, semifinals and finals) of players with at least 8 grand slams. I have always said that Federer has suffered more tough losses than any player in history.

    Roger Federer
    41 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 1 5 Set loss
    32 Grand Slam semifinals - 3 5 Set Losses
    24 Grand Slam finals - 3 5 Set Losses
    7 tough losses out of 97 matches = 7%

    Pete Sampras
    29 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 0 5 Set losses
    23 Grand Slam semifinals - 2 5 Set Losses
    18 Grand Slam finals - 0 5 set Losses
    2 tough losses out of 70 matches = 3%

    Bjorn Borg
    21 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 1 5 Set Loss
    17 Grand Slam semifinals - 0 5 Set Losses
    16 Grand Slam finals - 1 5 Set Loss
    2 tough losses out of 54 matches = 4%

    Rafael Nadal
    23 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 0 5 Set losses
    19 Grand Slam semifinals - 0 5 Set Losses
    16 Grand Slam finals - 2 5 Set losses
    2 tough losses out of 58 matches = 3%

    Jimmy Connors
    41 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 2 5 Set losses
    31 Grand Slam semifinals - 4 5 Set Losses
    15 Grand Slam finals - 1 5 Set Loss
    7 tough losses out of 87 matches = 8%

    Ivan Lendl
    34 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 3 5 Set Losses
    28 Grand Slam semifinals - 3 5 Set Losses
    19 Grand Slam finals - 2 5 Set Losses
    8 tough losses out of 81 matches = 9.9%

    Andre Agassi
    36 Grand Slam quarterfinals - 3 5 Set Losses
    26 Grand Slam semifinals - 4 5 Set Losses
    15 Grand Slam finals - 1 5 Set Loss
    8 tough losses out of 77 matches = 10.4%
     
    #1
  2. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2012
    Messages:
    3,897
    Nadal W 2012 2R wasn't tough loss?
     
    #2
  3. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,197
    Not for the purposes of this analysis. I think any player would rather lose a 5 set match earlier in a tournament than later in the tournament.
     
    #3
  4. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2012
    Messages:
    3,897
    I don't think so. Players outside the top 20 would have been happier for a lot more money and ATP points.
     
    #4
  5. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,197
    Okay, I should have said of the all time great players listed above, they would rather lose earlier in a tournament than later in a tournament.
     
    #5
  6. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    35,058
    Proves yet again that Nadal is better than Federer
     
    #6
  7. Steve0904

    Steve0904 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2012
    Messages:
    10,910
    Location:
    NL, Canada
    By that logic, it also proves that Nadal is better than Borg, or that Federer is worse than everyone on this list bar Connors, Lendl, and Agassi, and that's debatable. It also proves that Nadal has played less such matches because he's younger. His percentage in a category like this is very likely to rise if he keeps playing into his 30's unless of course he just loses a lot of 3 or 4 set matches or doesn't make a lot of QF's, in which case it won't really matter because a loss is a loss no matter if it's in 4 or 5 sets and/or comes before the QF's.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
    #7
  8. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,197
    Thanks for the compliment about the stats being fascinating. I thought so too.
     
    #8
  9. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    35,058
    Agassi has the Olympics gold which Fed does not have. And many say that he was lucky to be in a weak era.
     
    #9
  10. Steve0904

    Steve0904 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2012
    Messages:
    10,910
    Location:
    NL, Canada
    Federer also has 17 slams, 9 more than Agassi, and countless other records that Agassi does not have. By that logic I could say Agassi was better than Sampras as well, or for that matter anybody on this list excluding Nadal, and if was going to be really picky I could say Federer has an Olympic Gold. People also say that Fed was so good that he didn't let anybody else win many slams.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
    #10
  11. jokinla

    jokinla Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    2,705
    Fed of course has the most slams, and he lost another 3 in 5 sets, he could very easily have 20 slams, UNBELIEVABLE.
     
    #11
  12. elpolaco84

    elpolaco84 Guest

    Really? or just another stat that proves federer consistency? and not giving up till the end? or maybe he just needed to lose in 3 or 4 sets to have lower percentaje on

    Matter of perspective i guess
     
    #12
  13. tacou

    tacou Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Messages:
    7,036
    I don't think this statistic says anything about who is "better," nor is it supposed to.

    Very interesting stuff, however
     
    #13
  14. smoledman

    smoledman Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2012
    Messages:
    5,410
    Location:
    USA
    BS stat, it just proves Nadal gets blown out in QF/SF/F more often!
     
    #14
  15. 90's Clay

    90's Clay Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2012
    Messages:
    7,335
    The Pistol- 2 tough loses out of 70 matches? Thats damn efficient on the big stage. Pete didn't lose much on the biggest stage of them all.

    Also undefeated in night matches at the USO his entire career.
     
    #15
  16. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

    Joined:
    May 17, 2011
    Messages:
    9,496
    That means he didn't lose that many matches that went to 5 sets, but he was beaten easier than that many times

    Night matches at the US Open - one of the most pointless and desperate stats. What next? Someone has never lost a match at 3pm on a Wednesday afternoon :lol:

    And I thought some Fed fans and commentators came up with pointless stats these days..
     
    #16
  17. roundiesee

    roundiesee Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    Messages:
    2,861
    Never mind about the percentages; Federer played 97 matches in grand slams from the quarter finals onwards?? That itself is an astounding record, :)
     
    #17
  18. RAFA2005RG

    RAFA2005RG Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    2,250
    This analysis is wrong if you call Federer's 2009 AO final loss "tough". It was a cakewalk 5th set, 6-2.
     
    #18
  19. RAFA2005RG

    RAFA2005RG Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    2,250
    I know, more astounding than anything Lance Armstrong ever did.
     
    #19
  20. The Bawss

    The Bawss Banned

    Joined:
    May 8, 2011
    Messages:
    2,829
    Location:
    Lyon, France.
    No, he was lucky to push the mighty Rosol to 5 sets.
     
    #20
  21. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,197
    By that same logic, Nadal losing to Federer 6-2 in the fifth set of their 2007 Wimbledon final wasn't tough.
     
    #21
  22. RAFA2005RG

    RAFA2005RG Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    2,250
    Exactly. I agree. A lot of 5 setters aren't "tough losses". Del Potro won a lopsided 5th set over Federer at the US Open too.
     
    #22
  23. tacou

    tacou Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Messages:
    7,036
    isn't that the point? how many times has the player been in a 5th set deep in a slam and how many times did the player lose. how does the 5th set score matter?
     
    #23
  24. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,197
    I think it is very subjective to describe what is a tough loss for a player. Federer was clearly devastated after losing the 2008 Wimbledon final and 2009 Australian Open final, but much less so losing the 2009 U.S. Open final.

    Similarly, I remember reading that Nadal sobbed after losing the 2007 Wimbledon final, but felt that he was getting closer to Djokovic after losing the much closer 2012 Australian Open final.
     
    #24
  25. jokinla

    jokinla Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    2,705
    Losing a fifth set in the final of a slam is a tough loss no matter the score, have you guys never played tennis, losing in the final of the boys 14 sectional final 6-1 in the third was crushing, can't imagine losing a slam in the fifth.
     
    #25
  26. Steve0904

    Steve0904 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2012
    Messages:
    10,910
    Location:
    NL, Canada
    If you work that hard to get to a 5th set, and lose, it doesn't matter what the score is. Come on people. Seriously.
     
    #26

Share This Page