Pro One-Handed Backhands

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by RoddickRook, Apr 16, 2009.

  1. RoddickRook

    RoddickRook New User

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    I know everyone says Gasquet's or even Wawrinka's one-handed backhand is better than Federers.

    But I would like to know how, in the fullest details possible if anyone can explain. I haven't really understood this as of yet.

    Videos, in-depth analysis', etc would be helpful.

    Thanks.
     
    #1
  2. kungfusmkim

    kungfusmkim Professional

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    Um the thing with Gasquet's is he takes alot longer to prepare his backhand which can be good. This time allows him to be more accurate and shank less. However, federer's backhand is a very quick fast racquet head speed motion. He doesn't have a huge take back swing like gasquet so instead he has to make that up by swining alot faster meaning alot more errors. Thats how i interpret it anyway.
     
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  3. The_Steak

    The_Steak Rookie

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    Federer's back hand is not worse. Federer's backhand is great, just because of a mental breakdown does not mean in any way Fed's backhand is bad.

    Gasquet on the other hand has the best backhand in the world. I think that it is his best because he works on it more.
     
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  4. RoddickRook

    RoddickRook New User

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    Well I didn't really relate it to mental breakdown or say that it is worse (I personally believe Federer's is better, but I really can't say why).
     
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  5. The_Steak

    The_Steak Rookie

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    I think you may believe that Fed's backhand is the best because of the amazing passing shots he can pull off. For Fed, its mostly a consistency issue. Especially now.
     
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  6. DunlopDood

    DunlopDood Semi-Pro

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    Yawn..........
     
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  7. saram

    saram Legend

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    Sorry--Fed has the best one-hander out there....

    Gasquet's is prettier--but Roger's is more effective and produces more results.

    Look at their rankings.
     
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  8. icedevil0289

    icedevil0289 Legend

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    It could have something to do with fed's forehand being one of the best and gasquet's forehand being horrible.
     
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  9. saram

    saram Legend

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    Good point.
     
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  10. nhat8121

    nhat8121 Semi-Pro

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    i think fed has one of the best backhands...
     
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  11. msc886

    msc886 Professional

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    Fed's backhand is a good attacking backhand but it looks like when it comes to solidity like hitting topspin backhand to backhand rallies, he'll lose to quite a few pros. But as mentioned he attacks with his backhands quite well.
     
    #11
  12. prosealster

    prosealster Professional

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    fed's backhand might not be as good as gasquet's but certainly better than stan's...
     
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  13. thetennistimes

    thetennistimes New User

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    Federer has a great backhand because he prepares early and then he can generate so much racquet head speed without looking like he is trying to hit it too hard.
     
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  14. Magnificent!

    Magnificent! New User

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    Fed's b/h is good but not agressive enough or rivals wouldn't keep attacking it. I would like to see him make a bigger takeback and hit through it with more body rotation. I'm suprised that Fed' hasn't done this already, he must know he needs to make some changes quick.
     
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  15. Tempest344

    Tempest344 Professional

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    Federer seems too passive of his backhand side at the moment
     
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  16. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    I am sorry, I don't agree at all. Federer's onehander is flawed. Look at how Nadal and Murray can pound it and he will start making error after error.

    Wawrinka's backhand would not break down like that. Just think of the Nadal-Wawrinka match two weeks ago.

    To the OP:

    The reason for Wawrinka's backhand being superior to Federer's is quite simple:Wawrinka hits his backhand with a straight arm. His movement is an example of how simple it really is to hit a good onehander. You set up the racquet in a sort of smiling mouth trajectory (like in this emoticon: :cool: ) and then release it with a blocked elbow.

    Federer bends his elbow and has to compensate with a lot of wrist action, making his backhand very error-prone. The strange thing is, he hits his forehand virtually with a straight arm, so why does he bend his arm for the backhand?
     
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  17. federmann

    federmann Rookie

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    like i've said before in the following thread:

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=253418&highlight=how+come+stan

    "Federer's backhand is technically wrong. Wawrinka's is not. A backhand shouldn't be hit by dropping the wrist and turning it up again. But that's what Federer does.
    It's as simple as that! There's no way to handle a heavy topspin on a consistent basis by making such a basic error."

    I know it's hard to believe for some of you out there, but it's true. When you're under pressure and you need to come up with some great passing shots it's necessary to use your wrist, otherwise you couldn't hit some shots. But playing a simple topspin or drive backhand back to your opponent when he stays at the baseline, it's quite simply wrong to use your wrist.

    I really don't know what there is more to discuss about Fed's backhand.
     
    #17
  18. Nadalfan89

    Nadalfan89 Hall of Fame

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    I think he should try and use a 2HBH against Nadal's moonballs. Could help a lot...
     
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  19. deltox

    deltox Hall of Fame

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    you dont change your strokes at the end of your career. it would be more detremental than helpful for sure.


    , its weird but you guys do realize roddick has massive spin on his non drive forehands, maybe not quite as much as nadal but alot none the less and fed handles it easily.

    for fed v nadal its all about confidence which he is seriously lacking
     
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  20. nyc

    nyc Hall of Fame

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    funny how you can find like a gazillion slo-mo Federer backhands on youtube and not a single one of Wawrinka's.
     
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  21. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    I could not agree more with your analysis. There is at technical flaw at the basis of Fed's BH, it is as simple as that.

    As I indicated above, he hits it with a bent arm, and as you indeed add, that means he has to compensate with his wrist. That might work on some flick of the wrist shots and produce some spectacular passings, but it will break down on deep and consistent topspin shot.

    Compare that to Wawrinka's BH. Straight arm, firm wrist. Off course there is some wrist action, but no more than necessary. Wawrinka's BH is solid and he is able to drive it deep consistently.

    Federer's backhand can come up with ingenious shots and then again with the most stupid shanks.

    BTW, Sampras had the same flaw: bent arm.

    Fed's BH is still better than Pete's and at a time it was a great shotmaking wing, but he has to correct his technique if he wants to resist the constant BH bombing Nadal and Murray too are implementing against him.
     
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  22. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. It's really as simple as that. Federer does not have an active wrist during his one handed backhand.
     
    #22
  23. federmann

    federmann Rookie

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    I'm sorry but you don't have no clue at all. If you say Fed doesn't have an active wrist during his backhand then you simply do not, or cannot see it. Either way he does use his wrist!
     
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  24. federmann

    federmann Rookie

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    Nice to see that someone agrees :)
    but I don't think he hits it with a bent arm:

    [​IMG]

    Have a look at the following picture. Starting the stroke the way he does (I mean grip and turned up wrist), there is no chance to hit the backhand correct and without wrist action.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2009
    #24
  25. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    So what is this?

    [​IMG]
     
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  26. federmann

    federmann Rookie

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    ok, this stroke looks like it doesn't work anyway. And the arm is bent, yes.
     
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  27. jmjmkim

    jmjmkim Semi-Pro

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    Your backhand is only as good as results. In the end, who wins . . . that's all that matters.
     
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  28. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    Now, compare with this:

    [​IMG]

    And this:

    [​IMG]
     
    #28
  29. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    Look at the supination of Wawrinka's wrist, compare that to Fed and you will see that as the previous poster mentions Federer bends his wrist downwards, not the way to hit a good onehander.
     
    #29
  30. nousername

    nousername Rookie

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    absolutely right. and it should be noted that the reason for this is compensation for the grip used. wawrinka, gasquet, kuerten, et al use more of a western backhand grip suitable for higher bouncing balls. whereas fed uses a more traditional grip better for low balls. so when balls go high on fed, he had to bend his wrist down to compensate.

    with all that is it no surprise fed's backhand looks so bad against nadal and on clay. (use guys were right that sampras suffered the exact same problem. also no wonder those guys excelled on grass)

    so, on the other hand, if the grass season was 3 months long and the clay season was only 1/2 month, we would all be talking about how ineffective wawrinka's and gasquet's backhand are and why fed's is so good.
     
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  31. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Take a look at Feds Backhand in 06 and 07 (after he regained form after mono).

    I would defaintly rate his backhand overall better (ie. More consistently effective) than Gasquets.
     
    #31
  32. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    How could you possibly know this?
     
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  33. thejoe

    thejoe Hall of Fame

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CNiWdu4kLw
    Wrist doesn't look too active to me.

    You don't really know what you are talking about. And in the technique section, I've seen Wawrinka's backhand referred to as somewhat of a Windshiled Wiper backhand, so his wrist is likely to be more active than Roger's.
     
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  34. yellowoctopus

    yellowoctopus Professional

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    It looks like Federer is trying to adjust for the ball that came in too close to his body by bending the arm.

    I don't have a transcript on this, but last year Federer mentioned that one of the things Higuera was working with him on was to get him to 'turn over' his backhand. I believe it's not about straight or bent arms with Federer's backhand, but it is really about his tendency to brush up on the ball more than hitting through and producing penetrating shots--as we see in Wawrinka's. Federer can and do hit penetrating shots at times, but it is that tendency to favor brushing up (creating spins) on the backhand that makes his backhand vulnerable.

    To be fair, Nadal picks on Federer's backhand more than he does with other players, due to the fact that Federer's forehand is that dangerous. When one is forced to hit that many backhands, your 'bad tendency' will show up eventually--the opponent then move in to take advantage. Nadal has executed this tactic, along with other tactics he employs on Federer, very well--better than any players right now.
     
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  35. RoddickRook

    RoddickRook New User

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    Some pretty good information guys...but I fail to see an active wrist as well?
     
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  36. Cloudy

    Cloudy Semi-Pro

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    Gasquets backhand is better than Federer's it has to be because his forehand most of the time is one of the worst in the top 40. Federer though has a killer forehand and (except against Nadal) on the whole a far better mental attitude which explains his much higher ranking).
     
    #36
  37. P_Agony

    P_Agony Banned

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    Federer's backhand is much worse than Gasquet's and Wawrinka's. That's why he won 57 titles with it...
     
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  38. jamesblakefan#1

    jamesblakefan#1 G.O.A.T.

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    Fed didn't have mono until 08. Or was he just born with it?
     
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  39. Cesc Fabregas

    Cesc Fabregas Legend

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    He won in spite of his weak backhand the reason he has won all those titles is because he has the best forehand off all time.
     
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  40. P_Agony

    P_Agony Banned

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    Wrong. His backhand has won him plenty of points. His variation, his ability to defend well with it, his backhand slice is IMO the best of all time, his ability to hit BH winners out of nowhere, and best of all - his BH passing shots, which are downright brilliant and are a joy to watch.

    Plus, if you watched the match vs. Wawrinka, you should know that it was his backhand making the less erros and winning him points. When the two were exchagning backhands, it was Federer who more often than not won the point. It's his forehand and serve which were letting him down and losing him the match.
     
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  41. nousername

    nousername Rookie

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    windshield wiper motion does NOT imply wrist action. actually the opposite is true. good "windshield wiper" motion involves a firm wrist, the "wiping" motion comes from rotation of the forearm and shoulder, not the wrist.

    look at nalbandian here:
    http://www.hi-techtennis.com/

    soo ... you are correct that wawrinka has a windshield wiper backhand, but that does not mean "wrist action".
     
    #41
  42. defrule

    defrule Professional

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    Look at that. Federer staring at the ball while Wawrinka is looking at the target.
     
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  43. dugger5688

    dugger5688 New User

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    Precisely, his backhand lately has been the more reliable shot. And again, Federer came out on top in the backhand-backhand rallies. I think Higueras really helped him hit through that shot, definitely a marked improvement. Even against Nadal in the 08 AO final his backhand didn't let him down. Something behind his eyes let him down.
     
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  44. defrule

    defrule Professional

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    I jumped down his throat to make him choke in the AO final.
     
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  45. Bassus

    Bassus Rookie

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    Well you did a good job because he definitely choked.
     
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  46. maverick66

    maverick66 Hall of Fame

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    if you want a good one handed backhand look up guga kuerten. thats the best one ive ever seen. better than gasquet, warinka, and federer.
     
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  47. NamRanger

    NamRanger G.O.A.T.

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    His backhand looked much better than it really was because his movement was there to make his backhand appear better. Federer before was able to consistently keep the ball in play and deep, and occasionally force a short ball with his slice BH.


    However, even during Federer's prime, there were moments when his BH was exposed greatly. Safin did it at the AO, Nadal did it at the FO, Gasquet at Monte Carlo, etc. Federer's BH during his prime was a 7.5 (on a scale of 10) at best.




    Federer's backhand isn't technically wrong; however, he is using the wrong shot for his court positioning. The problem is that he keeps his wrist too loose, and he turns his arm too early, resulting in a backhand with marginal amounts of spin, and mild amounts of pace. Couple that with the fact that he generally likes to take the ball early and on the rise, you can see why his BH has been exposed greatly as of late, and why it is so awfully inconsistent.



    When Federer kept his wrist firm and hit flat, he was much more consistent off this side; although it still wasn't enough for him to beat Nadal on the clay. Thus why he made a change to add more spin for consistency on clay, but as you see, his results overall have deteriorated. He essentially ran into the same problem as Roddick; he changed his game to beat one guy, but that actually made him worse.
     
    #47
  48. saram

    saram Legend

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    Guga's was sublime and then some.
     
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  49. NamRanger

    NamRanger G.O.A.T.

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    Guga's backhand was also very unorthodox, and extremely difficult to replicate. It also probably contributed to the end of his career, due to how violent his hip rotation was (on his BH and FH).
     
    #49
  50. maverick66

    maverick66 Hall of Fame

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    very true but it was the best one ive ever seen. no one went down the line better than guga. i wish he had stayed healthy so we could have seen him play nadal at the french.
     
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