PS85 vs. K90. argh!

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by onehandbh, Apr 27, 2008.

  1. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    Been using the K90 for the last 6+ months. Was using the
    PS85 and looking for something with a little bigger
    sweetspot and more power. After not using the PS85 for
    a long time, I tried it again a couple weeks ago. Had been
    playing very sparingly for a couple months and was *REALLY*
    sucky a couple weeks ago. So I decided to use the PS85.
    Instant improvement. Used it once more and then yesterday.
    The conclusion I'm beginning to arrive at is this:
    I play better with the PS85. Not for every shot, but overall
    it's better.

    FH: K90 for angles. PS85 for depth and control.
    BH: PS85 hands down.
    volleys: K90 b/c it has a bigger sweetspot and also for
    reaction volleys. Touch goes to the PS85 and control goes
    to the PS85.
    Overheads. about a tie.
    1st serve: PS85.
    2nd serve: K90
    dropshots: PS85.
    half-volley: about the same.

    But man I just hit my groundstrokes better w/the PS85.
    Not sure why. Don't shank more often either.
    The sucky thing is that I've sold most of my PS85's and
    am down to just a few + 1 st. vincent and it doesn't appear
    I can purchase any more at a reasonable price.
     
    #1
  2. Nitro

    Nitro Rookie

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    What string have you been using with the k90? I'm thinking that maybe if you went with a stiffer string in the k90 you might have some of the control you had with the ps85. Just a thought. You could also just try and buy up as many ps85's as possible.
     
    #2
  3. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    The only option is to wait for the new Sampras frame! :)
     
    #3
  4. Zhou

    Zhou Hall of Fame

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    If it ever comes out... But another thing is the new frame still might be different for the better or worse compared to the PS85.
     
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  5. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    Like I said earlier..
     
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  6. m1stuhxsp4rk5

    m1stuhxsp4rk5 Professional

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    hopefully it will come out by this years us open. maybe since the head size is smaller you focus more so you dont shank as much with the ps85
     
    #6
  7. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    I had the same revelation recently. I pulled out my PS 6.0 95 which I haven't used in a very long time. Well, I played better with it than any other racquet that I own. Why did I ever stop using it? :confused: It was better for just about everything and just so much easier to use for both offense and defense. They really need to bring this stick back. I guess it was a mistake selling 9 of my 10 PS 6.0 95's as I only have one left. :(
     
    #7
  8. HeadPrestige

    HeadPrestige Professional

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    so BP are you going back to the 6.0?
     
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  9. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Probably not as I only have one and I don't want to have to shell out any more money right now scrounging around for any more. I think I will just wait for the Sampras racquet and see how that goes.
     
    #9
  10. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    Yes, I agree. This is a sensible comment on the "Sampras" stick.

    Last I checked it's still in the RUMOUR stage. Until the stick becomes a known fact, we're just waiting on an assumption. Assumptions aren't things to hang your hat on.
     
    #10
  11. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    RE: the original post, I too played the K90 for about 4 months having come from the PS85. Started playing the 85 again, and much prefer it overall to the K90. I just play better with it despite the smaller head. It just swings nicer. Less spin and power, but sooo much more control and feel. JMO, and the K90 is still a nice stick.
     
    #11
  12. RoddickistheMan

    RoddickistheMan Professional

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    im in the same dilemna. I went back to my 6.0 85 after my prue drive and went back to my straight arm forehand. My explosiveness is back. However I tried the k90 and the thing is like a log the sw is way too high and it feels chunky. I have been messing around with the microgel prestige mid and it has the same maneuverability as a 6.0 however the feel is a lil muted similar to the ncodes but a lil bit better. I higly recommend that you try it out. Also keep in mind the new sampras stick is coming out this soon and that will sure to be a hit with us 6.0 85 users.
     
    #12
  13. tennisee

    tennisee Rookie

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    Hey BP I'll swap you my 6.0 95 for a K90 or something - (Hit with it last week for fun, doesn't suit my game as much my regular stick)
     
    #13
  14. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Thanks for the offer but right now I'm just going to wait for the new Sampras stick.
     
    #14
  15. leonidas1982

    leonidas1982 Hall of Fame

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    I wonder how the new stick will play; hopefully it has a good amount of swingweight to it.
     
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  16. m1stuhxsp4rk5

    m1stuhxsp4rk5 Professional

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    just the thought of sampras racket is awesome makes the k90 sound lame haha they should call its pro staff 90 type s
     
    #16
  17. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Well you're not under the impression that Wilson won't replace the K90 are you? They're obviously coming out with something new, and it appears that Sampras is helping them with it. The only question that remains is what 'technology' will be associated with it and what annoying paint job will be sprayed on.
     
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  18. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    Are you assuming that it's an assumption?

    Well done. http://www.amny.com/sports/am-tennis0312,0,4895406.story
     
    #18
  19. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    ^^^
    Exactly. ALL of what's said before fact is known is speculation. That's what these kinds of threads specialize in. To admit that speculation is speculation or assumption or whatever is one thing. To purport that speculation is fact is quite another. Better to talk about hopes, wonders, and desires for the next generation 90 as many do. That can be fun!
     
    #19
  20. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Oh I see. You're implying that I'm just repeating what's already known.

    Is it speculation that there will be a replacement for the K90? Is that what you call speculation? We know Sampras is working on a new model with Wilson. That's a fact, not speculation. We know that they release a new Tour 90 frame every couple of years. That's a fact.

    I didn't say anything more than that, and those are facts. How much will Sampras influence the new frame? I don't know. I speculate that he'll have a lot of influence. Why not? It's not like the N90 was a huge hit. They might as well go with a playtester with clout and experience.

    Either way, there is a new Tour 90 coming out. Are you doubting this? Or is this considered speculation?
     
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  21. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    Riiight, and what exactly does this thread specialize in?

    FYI, the production of the Sampras racket isn't speculation; Wilson is actually making one for the public. Try clicking on the provided link, before yapping about "hopes, wonders and desires."
     
    #21
  22. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    Sorry Stormholloway, wasn't really referring to your post, but rather Alpine Cadet's. You got caught in the crossfire since you were quoted in it. Everything you say here is well reasoned. In addition, you don't seem to be calling it the "Sampras stick", but rather seem to be suggesting that what we're waiting for is another Tour 90.
     
    #22
  23. WeaponX

    WeaponX New User

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    Ok maybe it will be a new raquet of wilson, but the raquet in the excibition match in the U.S between Fed and Sampras, Was an Ncode Lead Taped, just with a pj all in black.
     
    #23
  24. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    Is Wilson releasing a Sampras signature edition? Or will it be the next generation Tour 90? Healthy dose of marketing hype?
     
    #24
  25. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Incorrect. The racquet that Sampras used in the exo against Federer in New York was NOT from the PS/nCode/K Tour 90 mold and painted black. It was a completely different racquet from a different mold. These are the pics of the exact racquet that Sampras used in New York. Take a look at the throat. It is flat with a semicircle cutout just like on the PS 6.0 85/95 and not the sharp angled indented cutouts like on the Tour 90's.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #25
  26. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Could be one and the same. This could be the next Tour 90 model that Sampras is testing prototypes of. Or it could be a separate model from the next Tour 90. Only Wilson knows what their plans are.
     
    #26
  27. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    I wouldn't count out a Sampras Signature racquet. If it was merely a new Tour 90 I don't see why they would go back to the PS85 beam construction. It seems tailored for Sampras and those who liked the PS85.

    I know we're wishful for a PS90, but I don't think that's really that big of a stretch considering the evidence.
     
    #27
  28. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    But most K90 users are people who liked the PS 6.0 85. If this was the next Tour 90, they will sell tons of them to former PS 6.0 85/95 users, probably even more than they've sold of the K90. Even Federer will likely switch since he's also a former PS 6.0 85 user. :)
     
    #28
  29. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    Agreed. They don't share the same mold, but they might probably share the same grommets if the head sizes are the same. I hope the cosmetics will be comparable to the PST90, that stick was a beauty.
     
    #29
  30. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Of course PS85 users like the K90. It's still in the same vein as the 85. I don't think they're THAT similar as so many seem to think, the K and the 85, but the K90 is still a Pro Staff and 85 users will of course like it.

    If so, why doesn't Sampras play with it, or Courier? I thought the Tour 90, as far as weight distribution went, was closest to the 85. The only problem was the Tour 90 was so hefty. It was a club.

    I love the K90 but I don't think it's that similar to the 85. It has its own thing going on.
     
    #30
  31. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Agreed here. I still have a PST90. It was the first racquet I bought when I started playing tennis again. I don't know why I ever left it.
     
    #31
  32. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Exactly! That's what I'm saying. If they made this new "Sampras" racquet the next "Tour 90", they will sell even more of them to former PS 6.0 85 users than the K90 because this new racquet should be even more similar to the PS 6.0 85/95 than the K90 is.
     
    #32
  33. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    But to my knowledge it's the tech gimmicks that sell racquets. Also Federer seems to sell a lot of racquets. I don't know if Sampras can sell more sticks than Federer. Maybe they'll both "play" with the new Tour 90. That would help.
     
    #33
  34. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    I don't think most PS 6.0 85/95 users care much about tech gimmicks. They don't even have to put either Sampras' nor Federer's name on this new racquet. Just call it the "X Tour 90", and say that it plays and feels just like a PS 6.0 85 but with a 90 sq. in. head and the PS 6.0 85/95 users will buy it. This is a claim that they've never made before regarding any previous versions of the Tour 90.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2008
    #34
  35. Salsa_Lover

    Salsa_Lover Rookie

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    Yes, but from the marketing point of view something isn't right.

    The K90 is the Federer's racket, it has his signature on it.

    From a marketing point of view he'll not switch to the sampras model, nor to another model.

    Remember, the sales pitch for the K90 is that it was designed to Federer's personal specs.

    From a purely marketing point of view, they need to keep this going on while Federer is on top and then when he steps down and a new dominant #1 comes on top they could sell a new signature racket.

    Think about it for a moment.

    Federer on an slump during the AO, and they had at the final Djokovich and Tsonga playing with K Blades ( or PJs ).

    This was the golden oportunity for a sales pitch and marketing for wilson.

    Can you imagine how many K Blades have been sold for that event alone ? ( and how much $$$$ made ).

    I could even stretch it to suspect it was all a marketing scheme :)

    No, I think Federer will stay with the K90 and maybe Wilson is hoping Djoker will step to the #1 spot on the near future and then he'll be the one wielding the newest technological breakthrough. Call it "X" technology or whatever.
     
    #35
  36. WeaponX

    WeaponX New User

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    You are right, my bad.
     
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  37. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Yes, but Wilson introduces a new Tour 90 models about every 2.5 years so what will Wilson come out with as the next Tour 90 after the K90, which is only about a year away? It could be this racquet that Sampras is playtesting. For all we know, Federer could be playtesting this racquet as well but it's just not made public. It was never made pubic that Federer was playtesting prototypes of the K90, either. I can definitely see Federer using this new racquet as his next "Tour 90" since he is also a former PS 6.0 85 user, just like Sampras is.
     
    #37
  38. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    Awesome pics! Something about those matte black racquets.
     
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  39. 80'stennis

    80'stennis Rookie

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    How did the US PST90 compare with the PS85 in the feel department? I never played that USPST90, but I do have an Asian PST90 and the feel in my opinion is not there. Most significantly less solid, more muted, and stiffer.

    There's still stock for the USPST90 in some other online stores, right? Maybe you can pick up a couple.:)
     
    #39
  40. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

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    If there is indeed a 90 sq in version of the PS85 coming, I'd
    defintely be interested in giving it a hit. Played a set w/the
    PS85 tonight for the first time in ages. For some reason,
    serves are easier for me to control w/ the PS85. Maybe it
    was because my toss was less sucky than usual today.
     
    #40
  41. m1stuhxsp4rk5

    m1stuhxsp4rk5 Professional

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    i seem to be able to get more control with the ps85 because i seem to be able to get more aces then the k90 but the k90 has that awesome spin for my kick serve. if the sampras racket has teh control of the ps85 adn the spin of the k90 it would be a dream. also the same or similar weight distribution of the ps85.
     
    #41
  42. AlpineCadet

    AlpineCadet Hall of Fame

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    Probably also because you were playing against a total noob (me,) and you didn't feel any pressure, whatsoever.
     
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  43. roundiesee

    roundiesee Hall of Fame

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    Good thread! I'm quite amazed that after after all the Wilson hype re the Tour 90, then Ncode90, now the K90, so many Wilson users still prefer and play better with the older 6.0 85/95. Let hope the new Sampras racket will satisfy every one.
     
    #43
  44. Salsa_Lover

    Salsa_Lover Rookie

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    How long was the PS85 the flagship model until they decided to phase it out in favor of the newer PST 90 ? more than 2.5 years I think. It was during the long period of Sampras dominance isn't it ? In the same way I think they could maybe keep the K90 ( or PJs ) going on as long as Federer is on top.
     
    #44
  45. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Don't worry, they will be replacing the retail K90 soon just like they replaced the retail nCode 90 in 2.5 years and the PS Tour 90 after only a year. The reason why they kept the PS 6.0 85 around as long as they did was because Sampras refused to use paintjobs. Federer has no such aversion to paintjobs, as he has proven before. There will soon be a new Tour 90 model. Whether Federer will actually switch to it is a completely different issue. He could choose to continue to use his current K90 but with the new model's paintjob over it.
     
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  46. Salsa_Lover

    Salsa_Lover Rookie

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    BP I agree with that

    The problem is the marketing pitch.

    How can Federer switch to a newer model 90 ( PJ or not ) when the K90 IS the Federer model.

    It is simply not logical as a sales argument.

    The only logical alternatives

    1. A new Federer signature 90 version phasing out the K90 ( improbable, the K90 was made to Federer's personal specs, you had to buy it to be like him, If Federer switches to a new one then this will tell the market then that the K90 was wrong so anyone that bought the K90 to be like Federer would have been misled )

    2. A new dominant player with a new and improved racket that is superior to Federer's and hence that was the weapon who helped him to dethrone Federer and so it'll improve also your game ( improbable, as the ones that they have on their rooster to take Feds place Djoker and Tsonga are using a K Blade that is 93 sqinches not 90 ). And also maybe Federer will not be dethroned yet. Let's wait one more year and see.

    3. A PS90 Sampras signature, for sampras fans and classic players... I don't think this would be a good sales pitch too. They need to see the dominant player wielding the new and improved racket, not a glory from the past.




    ... and maybe one probable and that goes along with the AO low point for Federer

    4. The new K90 mk 2, the improved K90 still Federer signature, that helped Federer to come back after his mono/slump and now he is dominating again.... a bit late for the market though, he is already showing that with the current K90 alas with a black buttcap.
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2008
    #46
  47. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Huh? Wasn't the nCode 90 THE "Federer model" as well? It was even painted for him in red and white just like his Swiss flag. Yet, he still switched to the K90. Don't worry, Wilson WILL come out with a new Tour 90 soon and Federer will switch to the new model's paintjob. The only question is if he'll stay with the K90 underneath the new paintjob or actually switch to the new model.
     
    #47
  48. Lendl and Federer Fan

    Lendl and Federer Fan Hall of Fame

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    1HBH, actually I think you serve pretty well with PS85.
     
    #48
  49. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    More BreakPoint pretending like the K90 is undoubtedly the actual racquet that Federer plays with.

    Let's put the fact that there's no hard evidence of this in perspective. He's been using the same racquet since his stint with the PS Tour 90, and there's no evidence that it's been the K90 all along, nor is there evidence he suddenly switched to the K90.
     
    #49
  50. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    And you pretending you know something about racquets. :-?

    Evidence: The K90 has the same composition as the PS 6.0 85 (80% Graphite and 20% Kevlar). The only difference is that the Graphite in the K90 is "nCoded". Both use Single Braided construction.

    When the nCode 90 came out, Federer is quoted as saying that his new racquet "is better by way of nanotechnology" (I think it's even on his website). He makes no mention of HyperCarbon nor Double Braiding, both of which are in the nCode 90 but not in the K90. He doesn't mention them because he is using a K90 underneath that nCode 90 paintjob.

    Wilson has stated publicly numerous times that "the K90 sold in the stores is the same exact racquet that Federer plays with". They also said that this is "one of the few times in history that has ever happened". There would be no reason for them to make such clear and specific claims and risk multi-million dollar lawsuits when they were able to sell millions of nCode 90's by merely stating that "Federer plays with the nCode 90" without ever mentioning what it is that is actually being sold in the stores.

    The difference between you and me is that I know things and/or am smart enough to figure things out, whereas, you think everything in this world is a conspiracy.
     
    #50

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