Roger : best ever, The four of us? That’s a really difficult call.

Discussion in 'Former Pro Player Talk' started by tennissportsrog, Sep 2, 2012.

  1. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Golden era posters in former pro section
    Dull era posters in current pro section
     
  2. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, some posters of this section would rather fit for the current section ;-)
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  3. Feather

    Feather Hall of Fame

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    I meant Nadal is excellent on clay. He has won 43% return games on clay. Due to that high percentage in clay he has an edge over Federer in career stats. I said the stats are skewed by clay.

    Again return and return games won are different. It's tough to play Nadal on clay and he breaks serves a lot, that has got more to do with his general game than return as a stroke.

    Djokovic has a losing record against Roddick. Much of these matches were when Roddick was past his prime. Peak Roddick had a poor record against Federer.

    I don't intend to say Federer is better than Djokovic in return but Federer is not bad
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  4. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    Feather, Thanks for this serious post.
     
  5. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    much less than me or many of the others here .... how can you judge that well when you haven't seen that much including matches where he struggled vs good serving ?

    besides it wasn't just those 2 matches ... I mentioned other things as well

    his record vs roddick, some struggles vs the tsonga serve on occasions

    etc etc.

    you didn't respond to any of that.

    yes, in 2012, well past his peak. Djokovic lost to isner in his peak year in 2012 ...
     
  6. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    lo and behold. This is the guy whining about people "attacking" him ....

    The irony of it all ..........:)
     
  7. Feather

    Feather Hall of Fame

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    No need of thanks. Nothing is personal. I respect you for your tremendous knowledge about past Tennis and I have expressed my disagreement with you regarding issues that I don't agree with. Please accept my apologies if anything crossed the border while debating

    I won't be around for sometime. It was nice discussing with you all. Catch you all later after few weeks.
     
  8. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    abmk I'm sorry that my harmless joke insulted you.
     
  9. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    Feather, Thanks for your words! I also apologize for some bad words I have written.

    By the way, You are not on my ignore list ;-)

    Have a good time!
     
  10. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    rest assured, the only feeling I felt on reading that post was laughter .......
     
  11. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    abmk, Fine, then my joke has worked well ;-)
     
  12. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    I wish I was a multislam poster as Kodes
     
  13. Flash O'Groove

    Flash O'Groove Hall of Fame

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    That's a convincing explanation, except that Natf and Krosero have given an even more convincing explanation you did not address. They provided stats that show that the serving game hold is increasing, with a theory to explain it.

    You are right that our discussion involve subjectivity. Howeither, some position are better backed up than others. I think there is less subjectivity in ranking Nadal as an all time top 10 than Hoad, for example.
     
  14. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    If the service hold numbers have increased over time, I would submit that the advantages of serving with modern tech vs. old tech have outweighed the return advantages. The primary style of play has changed over time of course. Then, that would account for some part of the big gap between Borg's percentages for return games won versus Federer and others. Even so, you are left to make a subjective assessment as to each player. As to Nadal and Hoad, you could objectively assert that Nadal won more of certain titles for example, but you can't then avoid an subjective assessment as to peak level of play for example, with is an important criterion.
     
  15. Flash O'Groove

    Flash O'Groove Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for your answer. Don't you think that winning titles is a good indicator of peak play, or at least a better indicator that the subjective impression from a spectator or an opponent?
     
  16. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    Sure, then you also have to compare the player's opponents and surface versatility as well. You should definitely look at winning titles, absolutely, but context is a must as well. Thanks.
     
  17. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

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    I wish I was Shevchenko
     
  18. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Bayern is next euro dominator
     
  19. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    Kiki, here are some Kodes pics! Go Kodes!

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  20. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Great pics buddy
    Last time I watched Kodes it was about 79 or 80
     
  21. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

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    Agree...now they bought Goetze from Borussia...these guys will have a historic great time...the events from last two days are earth shattering

    Ich mag Deutschland!
     
  22. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    Cool, you obviously admired him. I've only seen a bit of Kodes on old tennis films. He strikes me as a gritty, crafty player.
     
  23. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    A lion on court great all round game
     
  24. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Like Hewitt Kodes overachieved a little bit
    He was funnier to watch
    I normally watch tennis for fun, shall I add
     
  25. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, I respect Kodes as a great player. The problem with him might be that his peak or even prime was relatively short, about five years only.
     
  26. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    yes, from 70 till 75, that makes no more than 6 years.He relied on his body and that may explain a bit.His last big result was winning Madrid on cc over the likes of Borg,Nastase,Vilas,Panatta,orantes and ramirez
     
  27. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Merkel will be still more unbearable...or as Don Silvio said, un...
     
  28. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, "Don" Silvio is more unbearable than even "Angie". ;-)
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  29. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

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    We should hit up one of his parties one of these days
     
  30. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Bunga Bunga

    I am dazzed and confused
     
  31. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    HAIDER at least was funny...
     
  32. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    Yes, he once even played tennis with Ken Rosewall at Pörtschach, Austria...
     
  33. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Good¡¡ I didn´t know.

    I think the best ever politician tennis player was jimmy Carter or Giscard D´estaing?
     
  34. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, It was of course a pro/am fun match. I don't remember their opponents.

    If you include even monarchs maybe king Gustav V of Sweden was the best politician tennis player.
     
  35. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, a friend told me that two sons of George Bush sen,Marvin and Jeb, beat Chris Evert and Pam Shriver in a doubles match. Shriver had a shoulder injury though.
     
  36. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Yes he even had the stockholm indoor named after him
     
  37. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    At least a win for the Bushes...
     
  38. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    Thus they were more successful than their brother...
     
  39. tennissportsrog

    tennissportsrog Rookie

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    Neither Nadal nor a Murrey mother agrees.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2013
  40. tennissportsrog

    tennissportsrog Rookie

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    Roger is classy as usual. wise and modest.
     
  41. MachiA.

    MachiA. Banned

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    Maybe Tony Godsick was holding his hand and whispered in his ear the answers?

    KR
     
  42. tennissportsrog

    tennissportsrog Rookie

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    Oh, Sampras era was not true tennis, no? by Nabull.

    hilarious.
     
  43. tennissportsrog

    tennissportsrog Rookie

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    [​IMG]
     

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