Rosewall > Laver

Discussion in 'Former Pro Player Talk' started by Prisoner of Birth, Jan 3, 2013.

  1. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    1980´s...Australia second and Britain solid??? in which planet did it happen???
     
  2. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,573
    WhAt? TMF is banned? What did he do?
     
  3. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    didn´t pass his geography and history exam...
     
  4. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,573
    Should have asked me for tutoring
     
  5. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    Dear Moderator,

    I don't know why TMF has been banned.

    I would say that he has not insulted anyone too much. Other posters have done more insults.

    TMF is stubborn sometimes but not really nasty.

    Let's give him a new chance!
     
  6. mightyrick

    mightyrick Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    4,877
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    When mods do things, you can be sure there's a good reason.

    I honestly wish everyone would stop with the personal attacks and heated exchange when people disagree.

    I think the mods are very tolerant here. If I were a mod, I'd have banned a lot more people, I'm sure of it.
     
  7. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    mightyrick, You probably are right regarding bans.
     
  8. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    21,384
    My point still stand. Australia would never dominated tennis like they did in the 60s given that tennis has evolves.
     
  9. NatF

    NatF G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    May 10, 2012
    Messages:
    14,449
    Location:
    On the road from would of to would have
    America dominated tennis in the 90's, Couier, Sampras, Chang, Agassi etc...Spain is fairly dominant now compared to most other nations.
     
  10. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,573
    yes! the man is back!
     
  11. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2009
    Messages:
    25,115
    Location:
    Cwmbran, Wales
    Complete nonsense. Australia dominated in the 1960s because they were that dominant at the time, not because other countries were handicapped in some way. And don't forget the vital point is that what was the Soviet Union, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia in the 1960s, is now Russia, Ukraine, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Belarus, Moldova, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Kazahstan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Serbia, Croatia, Kosovo, Montenegro, FYR Macedonia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Slovenia, Czech Republic and Slovakia. What was 3 countries in the 1960s is now 24 countries.
     
  12. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    21,384
    You just don't get it, do you? Tennis doesn't stood still but evolves. Sure, the Soviet Union was split up into many countries, but their more number of players combined, more facilities to access. The market is much bigger which attracts wider audiences, encourages young talent to play tennis. Don't forget many old-timers in here argue that it's a money driven business, which was non-existent during the 60s(the establishment of the ATP is the beginning of a rapid growth). There's NO WAY Australian can dominate the sport had the they face the modern ATP. They would be just another country like one in Europe.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2013
  13. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    1970´s countries as opposed to today.

    Italy: Panatta,Barazutti,Bertolucci,Zugarelli
    India: Vijay Amritraj and Krishan
    Czeckoslovakia: kodes,Smid,Lendl ( other than Berdych?)
    Netherlands: Okker
    SAF: kriek,Curren,Hewitt,Mc Millan,Drisdale,Moore
    Mexico:Ramirez
    N Zealand:parun,Lewis
    Romania:Nastase, Tiriac
    Hungary: Taroczy,Gulyas
    Poland:Fibak
    Egypt:El Shaffei
    Isarel:Glickestein
    Ecuador:Andres Gomez, Viver ( world´s best junior in 1979)
    Peru: Ycaza,Arraya
    USA:Connors,Mc Enroe,Smith,Ashe,Gerulaitis,Lutz,Gottfried,Tanner,Stockton,Dibbs,Solomon,Mayer,Riessen,Gorman,Richey...
    Sweden:Borg ( not counting their 80´s players)
    Paraguay: Pecci

    Spain,France and Argentina had also a few top ten players which almost all posters here know of, such as Gimeno,Orantes,Higueras,Noah,Proisy,Vilas,Clerc...

    yugoslavia had no Djokovic but a stronger team with Pilic and Franulovic.Germany had Pinner,Meiler,Bungert,Ghering before Becker and later on Stich left their mark in the 80´s...

    Is tennis more international now?????



    End of debate.
     
  14. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    and forgot Britain ( LLoyd,Cox,Taylor,Mottram opposed to the lonely Murray) and, of course, Australia, with Rosewall,Laver,Newcombe,Roche,Alexander,Dent,Edmondson before Cash arrived in the early 80´s...
     
  15. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    kiki, Marvellous answer to The Mighty Federer.

    At the Australians you also could have mentioned Bowrey, Ruffels, Stone, Carmichael, Case, and Masters...
     
  16. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Thanks

    Also consider four aussies who reached the AO finals: Crealy in 1970, Mal Anderson in 1972 ( he also won the US title 15 yrs before), Marks, runner up in 1978 and, the talented Kim Warwick, who lost the 81 finals.

    I think it was Ted Tingling who said, after Kim beat Clerc and Noah at the 1982 US Open ( lost to Lendl in the quarters) something like: " I feel like I was at an Art Gallery looking Kim play that well"
     
  17. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    You are right. There were more Aussie tennis players then than grains of sand at the Copa Cabana...

    I possess a video showing the second set of the 1979 Brisbane tournament, the QF encounter Rosewall vs. Warwick. Rosewall won that match 6-3,6-4 and reached his last ATP SF at 45...
     
  18. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2009
    Messages:
    25,115
    Location:
    Cwmbran, Wales
    Mal Anderson had the tournament of his life at the 1959 Wembley Pro. A brilliant 5-set win over Pancho Segura in the final.
     
  19. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    Yes and he had beaten Sedgman and Rosewall before the final. And still a few posters doubt Anderson's strength...
     
  20. Chopin

    Chopin Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    4,110
    Location:
    St. John, USVI
    God save the Queen.
     
  21. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Absolutely
    Remember seeing Rosewall' s name in the list of 79 GP semis
    A few years later I watched him demolish opposition at a senior event
    Of course he was by far the oldest guy in field
    Yes Australia is BY FAR the best in titles per capita in general sports and not only in tennis
    They had akso top class car racers, golfers,cycle and bike racers,swimmers,golfers,athlets except soccer where the greatest title per capita country is another of my faves: Uruguayç
     
  22. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2007
    Messages:
    12,771
    Location:
    Bierlandt
    It's the culture.

    Or maybe a way off that prison-island.
     
  23. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    kiki, Gonzalez shared with Rosewall the honour of reaching a SF at 45. Two old giants.

    It was curious: Rosewall won the junior veteran title (35 plus) of 1979 when being almost 45. Muscles defeated players like Laver, Riessen, Drysdale and Okker. Okker had reached the Wimbledon QFs a few months earlier...
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2013
  24. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    21,384
    Yes, tennis and other sports are play more across the globe. As I've mentioned above...better marketing, more facilities, money driven, and of course greater number of athletes pursuing the game. Trying to argue sports in 70s is more global is like trying to argue the population in the 70s is greater than the present day.

    Your list above prove nothing. Any generation has top players coming from certain countries(randomly), but that doesn't anything about the size of the pool.

    The Celtics dominated basketball in the 60s just like the Australian dominated tennis. However, you put that Celtics of the 60s and compete against the NBA today, they win nothing.
     
  25. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    Mighty Federer, In the competition " ignorant posters" you have good chances to gain the first prize.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2013
  26. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Or maybe the neighbourhood of sharks
    That makes them fast torpedos as it also happens with SAF swimmers who almost exclusively run short distances
     
  27. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Bird,Mc Hale,Parish and Walton is the greatest front line ever assembled
    It happened in 86 and the team was Boston
     
  28. mightyrick

    mightyrick Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    4,877
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    I dunno. 95 Bulls were pretty good, too. Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, Harper, Kerr.
     
  29. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    I meant inside game
    No team could have contained it and they played in the Golden Era of NBA when teams had great and decissive front courts
    Houston had two of the most talented big men ever PLAYING TOGETHER that yr and got steamrolled by those Celtics Fab Four in the final play off
    Houston had beaten the mighty LAL in semis and that LA team had Jabbar,Worthy, Lucas and AC Green in their front court
     
  30. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,573
    That frontline is incredible. Bird's the man, underrated too.
     
  31. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Bird is an aoll timer, but Mc Hale was the real factor as well as the year Bill Walton had...
     
  32. forzamilan90

    forzamilan90 Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,573
    did you ever see Chamberlain play?
     
  33. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Hey man¡¡ I am not that old¡¡ ask Bobbyone

    But I certainly saw the best ever english football team.1978-1980 Nottingham Forrest
     
  34. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    kiki, I might be older than you (not much though) but I'm not an expert in basketball...
     
  35. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    Shilton,Andersin,Burns,Mills,Jardine,Bowyer,Gray,Birtles,Francis,Woodcock and Robertson with Sir Brian Clough in the bench
    Few teams have played a better football in history
     
  36. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    21,384
    You can argue the 87 Lakers are better than the Celtics because they beat them in the final with the same rosters.

    Walton was a shadow of himself by the time he join the Celtics. His best years were in Portland and after that he suffered nagging injuries. He became a supporting role by playing backup center for Robert Parish. The only three trios that year was Bird, McHale and Parish.
     
  37. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    The big red was instrumental in the 86 title.

    His text book defense on Olajuwon carried the Celts to final victory

    As I said, and I don´t think we will ever see such a front line, Mc Hale was the key.

    Bird would keep on his numbers - all time great numbers-, Parish is one of the most underrated centers, but he was a superb player.Walton, well, when I think about post up moves, I just cannot think of any player better than hi.

    Kevin would fight with a Barkley, a Cartwright, a Lucas, a Sampson ( much taller than him), a Bowie, Cooper,Nance,Carr,Vandenveghe and so on...he was just as much dependable on one side of the court as he was in the other.One of the greatest players to understand the concept of number 4.

    ..and Ainge,Dennis Johnson and Jerry Sichting added up a valuable back court.johnson and Ainge were terrific defenders and knew how to clutch up a match.

    The 86 Celtics and the 85 Lakers are the greatest teams ever assembled in the NBA...and, still, I just cannot froget the Sixers with Cheeks, Toney,Erving,Mc Adoo and Mo Malone rounded up in the bench with guys like Bobby Jones,Chuck Barkley,Earl Cureton, Leo Rautins and Leon Wood...those were times...
     
  38. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    kiki, A friend of mine has seen Chamberlain playing and told me that Wilt was probably the greatest rebounder, with a strong body, 7'1" high.

    It is said that Chamberlain slept with 20 000 women...

    In comparison, Nastase lived rather abstinently with his only 2500 women.
     
  39. kiki

    kiki Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    18,714
    you old dirty mind¡¡¡

    Vitas Gerulaitis ranks in the top tier as far as those records are concerned.

    and the most important thing, remember, is if they didn´t fel asleep after the first five minutes...

    BTW, never watched the great Chamberlin vs Russell duels...
     
  40. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,773
    kiki, I'm just reporting not doing...
     
  41. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2007
    Messages:
    12,771
    Location:
    Bierlandt
    Chamberlain ≈ Gonzales
     
  42. Srinivas

    Srinivas New User

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    Messages:
    24
    During the course of time some players whose records are irrelevant are underrated and some players whose records still considered important are overrated that is the main difference between Overrated Laver and underrated Rosewall.
     
  43. Srinivas

    Srinivas New User

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    Messages:
    24
    Rosewall won majors from 1953 to 1972
    Laver won majors from 1960 to 1969
    Gonzales won majors from 1948 to 1961
    I don't understand why people overrate Laver.
     
  44. KG1965

    KG1965 Professional

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2015
    Messages:
    803
    2 Grand Slam, only 2 GS !
     

Share This Page