SEC Tennis

Discussion in 'College Tennis Talk' started by TopDawg, Mar 3, 2012.

  1. DaveKB

    DaveKB Rookie

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    Good point and the rest of this post is not directed at you becuase you already know all of what I am about to say.

    UVA's men's tennis success has been getting at least one top 5 American and frequently the #1 HS player evry year for some years now. My memory may be incorrect, but Jarmere Jenkins and Alex Domijan were consensus #1's and Mitchell Frank was close to that. Our top two have each won the All American twice! I think Thai Son Kwiatkowski was similarly ranked. Boland has also recruited some very solid other Americans like the current Shane brothers and Styslinger.

    He has also built the program by being able to produce guys good enough to play in the pros (albeit only Devarmann had made it to the top 100 in singles, but Huey and Inglot are now a top 10 doubles team).

    I have looked at the ATP rankings and UVA has by far the most pros currently playing in the top 500 (Michael Shabaz, Teddy Angelinos (played one year at UVA at #6 as a senior transfer) Singh, Jenkins, Devarmann in singles and then Huey and Inglot in doubles). UGA has Isner and he graduated in 2007. USC has Steve Johnson. Stanford has Bradley Klahn. OSU has Balz Rola. UCLA has maybe none, but I am not sure. Maybe they all have some lower ranked guys, but not very many, but feel free to post them as a response.

    Boland has also been able to convince many recruits that training daily against other top players for 4 years is better than playing at the top of a lineup at other schools where the difference between #1 and #2 compared to #5 and #6 is huge. The theory is that if you have pro tennis as a a goal you better be playing top guys with different styles every day in practice. For example, who can play with Kobelt at OSU and who does he practice against? At UVA all of its current top 10 can "play" and IMO our #3 through #7 or #8 would be playing a maybe 1 or at 2 or 3 at all 11 to 20 ranked schools.

    UVA once had very good success with international players and two were from India (Somdev Devarrman 2 time NCAA champ and Sanam Singh occasional #1, but mostly a #2) and one was from the UK (Dominic Inglot mostly #1 or #2, but never a dominant NCAA singles player). Boland recruited Julen Uriguen from Guatemala, who was a top 5 ranked ITF junior, but rarely played above #6 at UVA. The rest are two from the Netherlands and our two current foreign players were/are really never factors and rarely played singles. Early on on Boland recruited a guy from Poland who played 3 or 4. I think that is the complete list of Boland's foreign players. The seemingly college tennis view is that he has built his program on foreign players. IMO that is largely incorrect and completely wrong at the present.

    There are two other important factors in Boland's success and they are somewhat related. There is a high end tennis training facility located in the DC area and all of the top junior tennis players from Northern Virginia, DC, and MD train there. He has successfully recruited nearly of all of the top players coming out this including Huey, Shabaz, Frank, and the Shane brothers. With only 4.5 scholarships available on the men's side, I think the fact that these guys (all lived in Virginia) qualified for lower in state tuition and that allows a lot of flexibility in spreading the limited scholarship money around. IMO private schools are at huge disadvantage on the men's side with only 4.5 scholarships. I have no idea how USC has managed to stay at the top being a private school. All of the other big 4 schools can recruit in state players and have flexibility in allocating scholarship money.

    Lastly UVA has been the #2 ranked public university for a long time only behind Cal and I think since so many tennis players are also good academically that has been a huge draw.

    Boland happens to be a great person and incredibly personable. He just relates to people extremely well and that also helps him get great players.

    UVA has also spent money on tennis including the adding 6 indoor courts to the existing 6 at Boars Head, a fantastic private resort type tennis club but owned by a UVA Foundation, which is badly needed in the winter months in Charlottesville.

    As far as an actual training ground for the pros (other than Isner and Anderson) college tennis has produced very few top 25 or even 100 players. If you are top 5 or maybe 10 NCAA player, you might have shot in the pros. Other than that it just is not going to happen.

    College tennis has become the minor league of tennis, because it is a better alternative money wise than slogging around the Futures tour just trying to make a main draw or playing the USTA pro tour where prize money is low and expenses are high and if you lose you go home. While the you rarely get a full scholarship in men's tennis you get free coaching, free facilities, quality competition, free travel to matches, an education, and at least a chance to get better. Not a bad deal IMO. The women with 8 full scholarships really have it made as everything is free.

    I am not knocking any program, but just trying to explain the reasons for UVA success, which all started when Boland was hired. Until then we were basically a nobody in tennis. I have read that some think Boland must be "cheating", because how could UVA get so good after being average to awful before. The fact is he is not "cheating" and I have tried to explain why he has been successful.
     
  2. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Ted Angelinos is the No.1 in our mens tennis team in my new club. Maybe i should ask him in summer sth about Brian Boland and his training and personal education.

    I think many people do not like UVA, cause of their success, there will allways be haters. But hey Boland did it with homeborn talent, and talent recruits new talent. That it is. It will change some days, the teams on top allways change for decades. Only USC and UCLA seem to be there 4ever.

    To win with talent is not much, the players are there, but Boland can recruit them and seems to get them ready on every day, and what he really did for this players..he made them Pros. And thats huge.

    Thats right, players like Isner / Anderson are special . Even Devin Britton seem to quit his Pro Career.
     
  3. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    Welcome to the boards! Looking forward to reading your contributions. Especially if you know how the German and other Euro guys play.
     
  4. tennis_tater

    tennis_tater Semi-Pro

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    I understand what you are saying, but OSU did just beat UVA, so maybe Kobelt has some pretty good guys he can practice against everyday as well.
     
  5. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    Yes I don't think Dave's comment applies to the other members of the big 4. They also have great depth and the guys even below 6 can play serious ball.
     
  6. TopDawg

    TopDawg Legend

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    We need to move all this stuff over to the ACC or D1 thread. It's good conversation but some people may miss it by not looking in the SEC thread.

    Don't you know you need to keep the SEC thread open for me to channel my inner Vik and to pick the league and my Dawgs apart after my rage from the NTIs :)
     
  7. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    Clark needs to start a Virginia thread. Or just keep in the NCAA's since their talk is usually nationally relevant.
     
  8. Vicious Vik

    Vicious Vik Semi-Pro

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    You should. Embarrassing performance from Georgia. If I was a Dawgie fan I would hide for a long time
     
  9. Jadoc

    Jadoc New User

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    I can guarantee....

    None of the coaches want to draw UGA this year in NCAA's Vik...


    your dislike for Georgia is comical, thus much of what you say doesn't stick.


    Did you lose a lot to them or your team? Manny didn't recruit someone you like?

    Just curious why you always troll UGA posts
     
  10. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    UGA is a tough opponent for everyone, right now thru rankings they would meet Oklahoma in Sweet 16..tough for both.
     
  11. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Weekend:
    Auburn, Alabama, MSU are all at the Blue-and-Gray Tennis-classic
    LSU plays an interesting road game at Michigan on Friday
    Arkansas plays a tough Okla State squad
    Ole Miss plays @ Baylor vs SMU on Saturday and a very tough Baylor game on Sunday
    Vanderbilt plays @ Indiana on Friday, should be a win AND @ Michigan on Saturday, this is not too easy
    Kentucky is @ Oklahoma on Friday..wow
    Gamecocks vs USF on Friday AND vs San Diego on Sunday
    Texas A&M has a trip to Oklahoma, Friday @ Tulsa and Sunday @ Oklahoma (should be a great match)
     
  12. Court_Gamecocks

    Court_Gamecocks New User

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    You are over rating Vanderbilt and under rating South Carolina.
     
  13. floridatennisdude

    floridatennisdude Hall of Fame

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    SC hasn't done anything to prove they are any higher than low-mid of the SEC.
     
  14. TopDawg

    TopDawg Legend

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    Alabama probably is around 7 or 8.

    Mihov and Koch need to win a few for SC - they are 3-9 so far in duals. If they can't get a split up top they'll lose to most others especially if their doubles doesn't come around. They've got 2 tough ones this weekend against South Florida and San Diego…losing both wouldn't be a shock but they should be able to get past USF.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2014
  15. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    Ole Miss stands out. Might be 2 spots lower.

    Vanderbilt if they stay healthy may be a spot or two higher.
     
  16. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    SEC will be interesting, nice discussions here. I am long-time Ole Miss fan, so i ll overrate them, but i could change it very soon.
     
  17. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    Ole Miss is really going to miss Lutjen at #2 singles this year.
    #6 Singles and #3 Doubles will also be their main issue.
    Hopefully they have no further injuries or else it will be a very loooonggg season
     
  18. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    do not know what happened to Ole Miss
    with another injury season would be over
    also cannot understand their scheduling..they ve only played 3 games. :shock:

    They missed out on a couple recruits in the last years, maybe people are missing.
    Harry Fowler played 1 season there.
    Vazquez-Catoira was a bust.
    Rogers and Wilder were not as good as hoped.
    Britton went pro too early.
    Otto Sauer were only one season there.
     
  19. TopDawg

    TopDawg Legend

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    They assumed they'd be able to qualify for the National Indoors on their home courts which would have been 3 more matches.
     
  20. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    Hopefully Kallberg gets back to himself but he did not look himself at Indoors and Gowda was iced up as was Wilder. They can not afford to be injured already tough enough, at least Backstrom is healthy as he looked like a beast at Indoors
     
  21. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Ole Miss had a real great time in the 2000s
    with guys like Eric Claesson, Jonas Berg, ten Berge, Poole, Cat Gard and Erling Tveit were really good. Also Kalle norberg, they d a real great team some years ago. (even without a player like Devin Britton) And also guys like the germans, thiemann twins, lutjen and wellermann were really outstanding.
     
  22. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    Madregallejo has been a huge disappointment thus far.
     
  23. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Alabama was crushed today by an awful boise team...
     
  24. TopDawg

    TopDawg Legend

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    Yep as I said earlier not going to be a banner year for the SEC
     
  25. TopDawg

    TopDawg Legend

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    Cocks about to take the dubs point over USF.
     
  26. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    think its amazing how fast this went
    before 1 or 2 years the SEC was the best in the country
    many really classy teams
    and now even your Bulldogs have their problems
    MSU is not good
    Ole Miss is even worse
    Kentucky has its problems
    Vols played only a mediocre indoors
    alabama??? today was really awful
    vandy is not so good
    usc..auburn...hmm
     
  27. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    MSU and Alabama not making the SEC look good in Montgomery. Vanderbilt nearly avoiding disaster (not that losing to Indiana is a disaster Jaggy haha)
     
  28. jaggy

    jaggy G.O.A.T.

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    No it would have been bad, 18 Vandy were played down to the wire by late 50 something Indiana but the better team won in the end.
     
  29. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Another bad day for sec. Lsu also lost @ Michigan. Usc won i think. Msu and Auburn but also Bama really disappointed. Could it happen that sec only will send up to 6 or 7 teams to ncaas?
     
  30. TopDawg

    TopDawg Legend

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    Ole Miss found a new player - per their twitter: Ricardo Jorge wins his debut 5, 2 at No. 5 singles to clinch a 4-0 Rebel victory!
     
  31. ClarkC

    ClarkC Hall of Fame

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    Maybe they were waiting for the NCAA Clearinghouse to declare him eligible.
     
  32. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Msu is not good. Auburn is better. Ole miss could beat them. Arkansas played close to okla state
     
  33. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    They were. JLyon had mentioned they had a guy (this player) waiting to clear. Maybe was it a Swede who won't play until next year? Regardless he looks like he will help. Bet he likes playing dubs with Sholtz.
     
  34. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    Hey SEC tennis faithful,

    Cool thing y'all have going with the blue gray.

    Can you answer something? I know this is complex...even for me, a guy who played div 1 tennis and also likes college sports in general.

    Can you tell us about the love hate relationship and intense rivalries, but also sense of belonging and of loyalty to one's conference?

    This is evident in the ivies, the big xii, the big ten, pac ten/12, acc and sec. Maybe also the big east. Conf usa? Yankee conf? Mid american? I am reaching at this point, but...can you guys explain it? Is it rooted in football and basketball?
     
  35. SECFAN

    SECFAN Rookie

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    Ole Miss

    Ricardo just got cleared last week I believe. He's a game-changer. Played five against SMU and clinched. Was in a third set today against Baylor and won doubles with Scholtz. He allows them to play Gowda where he needs to be. Still though, doubles is a question mark at three.
     
  36. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    Wow that is huge and cleans up their #6 spot, Gowda will do well at #6, I imagine Ricardo will move up to #3-4 range an move Kallberg and Backy down
     
  37. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    'Ole Miss fought really well vs Baylor, the 0-4 end result was not the real thing
    Backstrom had multiple matchpoints and lost it
    Rebels lead 1st doubles 6-2 and lost it...
    they had Baylor on the ropes..also Baylor played without Lenz. 5 Singles went to 3rd sets. Ricardo can give the rebels a chance to be Top7 in SEC play.
     
  38. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    My new rankings after some games this weekend.

    1) UGA was idle..the MSU loss looks even worse, but UGA still only played with only 4 players...so nothing to change here

    2) Texas A&M, see Vols, they just lost, also a loss at Oklahoma is nothing you can make bad out of it.

    3) Vols, i wanted to jump them up over Texas A&M, only cause Texas lost, but Aggies still won the game in between them

    4) UK also played @ Oklahoma, this is just a tough place to play, but nothing to change here.

    5) Florida clearly right now, they were idle.

    After this, a lot of teams are coming..which i do not know really what do with them

    6) Vanderbilt right now, beating _Indiana, losing to Michigan, nothing great, but i give Michigan some credits here, as a better-looking team, where you just can lose to. (Ole Miss also lost at home vs them)

    7) MSU just have to put them down one place and i really have no idea what to do about them, after the real-bad Blue-and-Gray, i ve my real doubts putting them ahead of Auburn and Alabama right now. But i did not want to Put Ole Miss behind Alabama / Auburn right now , plus i do not want to put Ole Miss ahead of MSU..MSU has a lots of decent wins, they ve beaten Memphis and Harvard. The 5-2 win over Rice just not looks good anymore, Rice lost badly yesterday at home vs Louisana LaFayette...

    8.) Ole Miss, see a little bit on my MSU point of view. The Rebels still have not beaten anyone good, but they completely killed SMU (okay SMU is bad this year) and gave a good fight vs Baylor. The addition of Ricardo Jorge looks good. (I would ve dropped them a little bit..but Auburn and Bama dissappointed at Blue-and Gray)

    9) Alabama , cause of there win yesterday, i did not loved the way the how they lost vs Boise State in first place, but look on, BSU won the whole thing, and Alabama then took the consolations. Give credit to them.

    10) Auburn , had them above Ole Miss, until losing big at Clemson, this was my analysis last week..and nothing has changed , 1 win 2 losses at Blue-and-Gray does not help. Texas Tech loss...ouch...good win vs MSU...(but MSU is fading and fading..) I would ve put them up on 7 over even MSU but then they lost easily to Alabama.

    11) USC, got 2 solid wins this weekend at home vs decent opponents. just not enough to jump them up right now.

    12) LSU, also lost at Michigain (Michigan now has 3 wins vs SEC teams...questions?)

    13) Arkansas , lost to Okla 'State on Friday and beat an overmatched opponent in a doubleheader. This is nothing to jump them up from last place. just not yet.
     
  39. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    SEC Fight starts this weekend, I know Auburn/Bama travel to Oxford will be interesting to see how Ole Miss does with their new found depth
     
  40. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Will u be there?

    This both games will also clear my rankings i think.
    I think both have to play MSU on same weekend?
     
  41. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    I will see one of the matches next weekend.
    :)

    Yes Bama plays State Friday and Auburn plays State on Sunday since they are travel partners
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2014
  42. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    Thinking about it, if Ole Miss had their new guy for Kick-off weekend, I think they beat MI and give ILL a run for their money, but would fall short 4-3 or so. With the addition I think they now can make a run for Top 16 ranking. Looking at Baylor/SMU match appears Kallberg is getting it back together as well after poor start kick-off weekend
     
  43. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    So the Gamecocks were really really excited to beat #44 San Diego.


    "This weekend (of matches) was great; everything about it was great," - Josh Goffi

    "There is nothing to compare this feeling to. I'm 19, and I've never felt an emotion like that. I'm just happy that I'm doing it for this school, the University of South Carolina. As they say, `The name on the front of the jersey is more important than the one on the back.' That's says it all."- Andrew Schafer

    Inagine the emotion if they actually best a team ranked above them.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2014
  44. jaggy

    jaggy G.O.A.T.

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    When I was living out there n the 90s I could walk to the USD courts, although I went to San Diego State as an ugrad I watched more Torero tennis.
     
  45. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    SEC takes a big hit in the computer rankings:

    11 Tennessee
    13 Texas A&M
    14 Vanderbilt
    16 Mississippi State
    22 Florida
    25 Kentucky
    31 Auburn
    33 South Carolina
    35 Georgia
    37 Alabama
    66 Arkansas
    73 LSU
    Ole Miss
     
  46. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    Thats funny. Msu ranked too high. Uga too low. Uf and uk too low. Ole miss unranked is a joke but for the computers it makes sense. They ve no wins vs a ranked team. Problem for sec: the nonconference is nearly over and they can get wins vs each other.
     
  47. SECFAN

    SECFAN Rookie

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    Ole Miss

    It is comical that Ole Miss is not ranked, and that Georgia is that low, but we know by season's end that very well may change.
     
  48. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

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    It will but all the SEC teams except Vanderbilt and Tennessee took a hit in the rankings and that will not be good for the SEC teams looking to boost their ranking. A win over Ole Miss and LSU is almost meaningless at this point for a rankings boost. It will be tougher for SEC teams to jump significantly this season.
     
  49. SECFAN

    SECFAN Rookie

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    True. There are still a few non-conference matches that the SEC could win to make it interesting, but right now hard to see that happening.
     
  50. chris-swede

    chris-swede Hall of Fame

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    That is what i meant. There are no real top teams anymore to beat here. Vandy and msu will not hold this ranking. Beat uga is so tough and it will be worth less as a win vs boise michigan columbia. And beat lsu arkansas ole miss will be worth nothing. Never seen sec so down
     

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