Should the receiver be expected to hold one (of the 3) balls?

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by 8F93W5, Oct 15, 2013.

  1. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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    I like your version better. :)
     
    #51
  2. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    The op should def read Brad Gilbert's book.....

    Sensitive folks are not usually very happy on a tennis court.
     
    #52
  3. VaththalKuzhambu

    VaththalKuzhambu Rookie

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    In singles, I refuse to hold the 3rd ball. It impedes my movement. I wear short shorts and the ball would ride up my pocket during the point and even gives friction rash on my rather hairy thighs. Sometimes the 3rd ball would even fall out during the point and create a serious safety risk. OP is trying to gain an unfair advantage by trying to slow down his opponent.

    I doubles, I will agree to hold the 3rd ball when my partner is serving but only when he asks me to.
     
    #53
  4. Bdarb

    Bdarb Hall of Fame

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    WHO WEARS SHORT SHORTSSSS

    VaththalKuzhambu WEARS SHORT SHORTSSSS


    Sorry, had to..:razz:
     
    #54
  5. tennis tom

    tennis tom Hall of Fame

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    Another annoying thing you can do with the 3rd. ball in doubles, is to always return it to the server and not to his net man. This buys you time when you're taking the long walk to the far corner retrieving their wide miss. They're in a hurry to serve, (and miss all over again). I'm still getting back to the baseline to set-up to receive. He's chaffing at the bit to serve and (miss again). I'll hold his 3rd. ball until I'm getting into my return stance, AND then I'll moon-ball it to the server and NOT to his net man. You can see the annoyance on the server's face, his service motion interrupted, catching it and rolling it to his net man--clueless that in reality, it's a courtesy to him letting him see all three balls to choose from before serving his mighty serve. There's not much they can say or do about it--I'm just giving him back the ball. I've seen fights break out by servers wanting to hold all three ballls and the other player not obliging them the ball when asked for it--literally players swinging at each other with rackets and fists over this, with blood flying, pretty exciting stuff for a tennis match.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2013
    #55
  6. Bdarb

    Bdarb Hall of Fame

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    I've never seen someone refuse to give the server the third ball.
     
    #56
  7. tennis tom

    tennis tom Hall of Fame

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    I was there at a Senior Tournament, heard some commotion unusual for a tournament, looked over and saw them swinging away with the lady ump trying unsuccessfully to break up the brawling. The club pro who was good sized had to get between them to stop it. Blood splattered shirts, one guy broke his hand. It was an old grudge, that was triggered when the server wanted the third ball and the receiver refused him. When the server walked over to the receiver's side to get it for himself--fight on! That's why you shouldn't go over to the other side of the net. Another good example of why not is when Martina Hingis did it at the Roland Garos finals against Steffi to point out a mark in the clay. Conners did it a little more amusingly. Don't go over into enemy territory, no good will come of it, you may be captured by the enemy, break your hand or be made to cry.
     
    #57
  8. BlueB

    BlueB Hall of Fame

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    There is one women in our club that always asks opponent to hold the 3rd in his pocket, when playing the matches, even when all 3 returned to her. Part of her little mind games. Annoying. I don't like balls in my pockets when receiving. However, when serving, I like all 3 on my side. Sometimes I hold 2 in the pocket and 1 in hand, sometimes the 3rd is against the back fence.
     
    #58
  9. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    Ha ha great one! Your sig is spot on too!

    Probably as many matches are won with the well placed shoe tie as with the well placed groundie or serve!!!
     
    #59
  10. Bdarb

    Bdarb Hall of Fame

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    haha funny ending but the point stands, you never go on an opponents side, and you never walk over the net. I'm not sure these two things go together but I learned them from a very old pro (guys USTA # is below 100! hahah) and I trust his rules on etiquette as they've been working for him for about 60+ years ha
     
    #60
  11. tennis tom

    tennis tom Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for the comments folks. :cool:
     
    #61
  12. Joeyg

    Joeyg Semi-Pro

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    What a completely bizarre thread. Reading this, I feel like I have gone back a few years to some of the discussions I had with my old buddy.
     
    #62
  13. swizzy

    swizzy Semi-Pro

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    I hold two balls on my first serve with the third in my pocket or behind me at the fenceline. the second ball has never impacted my toss and i'm ready if I need it. when I land my first serve I discard the extra ball behind me to the fence as I prepare for the return. I prefer my opponent feed me the third as I do when they are serving..speeds things up.
     
    #63
  14. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    Not if you played me you wouldn't. You can keep it in your pocket, at the fence, or in your hand ... but you start throwing it somewhere in the middle of a point and I'm calling a hindrance on you (after first asking you not to do it of course).
     
    #64
  15. Attila_the_gorilla

    Attila_the_gorilla Professional

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    I wouldn't ask my opponent to hold a ball, but he can help me hold my service game.
     
    #65
  16. TimeSpiral

    TimeSpiral Professional

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    Wow. That is bizarre! I've never encountered anything like that before. I can imagine I would not appreciate my opponent tossing a dead tennis ball around while I was attempting a return of serve. You might want to reconsider that practice. If you don't want to play with the second ball in your pocket, just keep them both by the fence and if you need a second serve, just go grab one.
     
    #66
  17. Mongolmike

    Mongolmike Professional

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    Like has been said, eventually you are going to be called on this. I think your opponent can call a let every time you do it. Not sure it is a hinderance... does a hinderance call then take the point?

    Anytime a not-in-play ball falls out of your pocket or you toss it away from your hand, or your cap falls off onto the court, etc.... a let can be called.
     
    #67
  18. TimeSpiral

    TimeSpiral Professional

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    In an officiated match there is a warning, and a let call, and then the loss of a point for each subsequent infraction.

    In a rec match, with no official, you have to issue the warning and initial let call yourself, and suggest that according to the rules it's a loss of a point if it continues.

    The player who loses the item cannot/should not call the let. The opponent should. You cannot finish the point then call the let, it has to be immediate. On subsequent occurrences, you have to stop play immediately and call a hindrance. This is somewhat "hard core" for a casual match, but in a league play I would do it.
     
    #68
  19. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    Not exactly..

    The is no requirement to suggest anything. It's a loss of point after the receiver ask the server to stop discarding a second ball. Official or no official makes no difference. Either an official or the receiver can ask the server to stop discarding the second ball.

    USTA Comment 26.5: Can the server’s discarding of a second ball constitute a hindrance? Yes. If the receiver or an official asks the server to stop discarding the ball, then the server shall stop. Any continued discarding of the ball constitutes a deliberate hindrance, and the server
    loses the point.
     
    #69
  20. TimeSpiral

    TimeSpiral Professional

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    My use of the word suggest was colloquial, really. Since there is no official, and your opponent could resist your authority, I say suggest--even though you're communicating a rule of tennis.
     
    #70
  21. Mongolmike

    Mongolmike Professional

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    Thanks g4driver and TimeSpiral. I knew it was a let, did not know it could morph into a hinderance and loss of point.

    I can't see pressing the point in social play, but its good to know for league or tourneys if needed.

    I hold two in my left/toss hand when I serve (3rd in pocket) and I have a 1HBH... so I just keep holding the 2nd in my left through the point... but I do know a couple of friends who toss the 2nd in social play. Can't see calling it on friends tho.
     
    #71
  22. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    Exactly right, why should I have to deal with the distraction of a ball rolling back to the fence behind the server every time I'm returning serve? At the very least it is just discourteous and borderline gamesmanship. I'd give this behavior one warning and then call a hindrance every time after that.
     
    #72
  23. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    Yep, any opponent could resist.

    They could insist on discarding a ball in their hand after they serve. Then after the point ends, the receiver could inform the server of the rule and request not to do it again. If the server "resists", the receiver could simply move to the other side of the court and escalate the "resistance". :twisted:

    Then the receiver could break out a knife, or crossbow (neatly packed in that 12 Pack bag with one frame), or any of these cool gadgets and scream "Fight's On". lol I don't see that happening either, that's why we have the NHL. :wink:

    http://www.weapons-universe.com/Martial_Arts/Nunchaku.shtml

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SncapPrTusA Bruce Lee rocks at Ping Pong

    The server could also resist if they hit a ball so out that hits the fence, after the receiver says "Out". What's your point? ??? Really? I actually laughed at your post. You are a funny guy. But in reality, the rule is very clear. When normal players are presented with the rules in a polite manner, they follow them. The lack of knowledge or application of rules doesn't give the player an option to pick and choose which rules apply to them.

    I'm on the same page with beernutz and gmathesis. Tell the server the rule after the first occurrence, then call hinderance after the second occurrence.
     
    #73
  24. TimeSpiral

    TimeSpiral Professional

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    You're welcome.

    I would also strongly encourage that you don't hold a ball with your off hand during play. If it bothers you to hold an extra in your pocket, deposit it safely behind you by the backstop. If you can imagine tiny changes in routine messing you up, or being undesirable, you can assume that for your opponent, it could be distracting to see a dead ball in the hand's of your opponent during play.

    Plus, the chance that you drop the ball during play is higher than 0%, so why take the chance?
     
    #74
  25. TimeSpiral

    TimeSpiral Professional

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    At first, I was all like ...

    [​IMG]

    But then I was like ...

    [​IMG]
     
    #75
  26. chatt_town

    chatt_town Hall of Fame

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    O hell no...I have had to tell a couple of guys that the third ball will be on their fence when they need it. I don't hold any balls when I'm not serving. That is too much work. When I'm serving I take all three because that also saves time. What's wrong with putting one ball in one pocket and one in the other pocket?

    Also, too much can go wrong. The ball could fall out of my pocket as I'm putting away an over head. I can handle that happening when I'm serving but if you are serving and that happens I would be ticked off. So it's just best if you keep all three on your side as long as you are serving.

    p.s...if this is a man...you might wanna invest in one of the little ball clips the ladies wear in the back of their lil skirts....<snicker>


     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2013
    #76
  27. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    Sounds like.
     
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  28. Rjtennis

    Rjtennis Hall of Fame

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    Agreed, why would the returner hold a ball? That's just an opportunity for it to fall out.
     
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  29. Baxter

    Baxter Professional

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    I'm sorry, I'm old, but you must be truly ancient. People stopped doing that half a century ago. I've only seen that in black and white films from the the fifties or before. I would call a let the first time you did it and a hindrance from then on. Seriously, people just don't do that anymore, and I'm amazed your opponents put up with it.

    As to the original question, holding the third ball is a non-obligatory courtesy to the server, plain and simple. My friends know I prefer the returner (or my doubles partner) to hold the third, but with people who don't know me I don't even bother to ask any more. I do the one in the pocket and one by the fence thing. And to the folks who think one ball in your pocket is going to negatively affect their precise yet oh so fragile game, well, I just find that laughable.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2013
    #79
  30. richw56

    richw56 New User

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    Thanks for this post - it literally had me laughing out loud.
     
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  31. VaththalKuzhambu

    VaththalKuzhambu Rookie

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    Based on your preference for the returner (or your doubles partner) to hold the third, your logic seems to be that holding two balls in the pocket will negatively effect your precise yet oh so fragile game but one ball won't.

    Looks like you have a higher threshold than the rest of us.
     
    #81
  32. Baxter

    Baxter Professional

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    Correct, one ball is no big deal but two is one too many. Most servers usually have one in their pocket during play anyway, so it's normal to be playing with one.
     
    #82
  33. VaththalKuzhambu

    VaththalKuzhambu Rookie

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    #83
  34. struggle

    struggle Hall of Fame

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    I'll hold it sometimes, but don't feel required too, EVER.

    I'll put at my fence or the servers, do as i feel (courteously).
     
    #84
  35. KoaUka

    KoaUka Rookie

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    I on the other hand cannot stand just having 1 in the pocket. If I am forced to hold one ball in my pocket, I must have another in the opposite pocket as well. A tennis ball weighs 2 ounces, failing to counterbalance the weight can seriously affect your SW and thus will cause your game to go to sh*t.
     
    #85
  36. Toons

    Toons New User

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    Where has OP gone ?

    have not seen any more replies . . .

    Perhaps got a clue ?
     
    #86
  37. Mrnoital

    Mrnoital Banned

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    A metaphor for life.
     
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  38. AtomicForehand

    AtomicForehand Hall of Fame

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    I have a slight preference for holding all three balls--one in my hand, one in each pocket. I am not anal about this, but I really don't see why my partner or opponent needs to hold one for me. I mean, I'm about to serve with the one in my hand. Garments come with two pockets. What is the big deal?
     
    #88
  39. mikekelley

    mikekelley New User

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    Just do whatever moves the game along at the best pace

    I don't know why this is so hard for so many players to comprehend. If your opponent has two balls and is ready to serve, just hold the damn third ball and get up to the line to receive.
     
    #89
  40. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    This was not the issue. What would you do if as you were ready to receive serve at the baseline the server tells you to go to the back fence and get the ball and put it in your pocket? That is the issue.
     
    #90
  41. corbind

    corbind Professional

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    "No thanks" would be my response while getting feet set up to return serve.
     
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