Silent Bans - A Real thing?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by BrooklynNY, Feb 5, 2013.

  1. BrooklynNY

    BrooklynNY Hall of Fame

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    http://footfault.net/2013/02/05/spo...involved-in-silently-banning-a-female-player/


    It’s strange to think that just a few months ago, about the only real coverage or mere mention of doping in tennis came via the long-standing website Tennis Has A Steroid Problem. Though I certainly didn’t agree with everything in it, the site was a must-read because it asked the questions that desperately needed to be asked and discussed what needed to be discussed.

    Suddenly, in this unfamiliar post-Armstrong and post-Fuentes world, such questions and discussion on doping have conversely become difficult to avoid. Most recently in the form of tennis consultant/manager Alan Moore – currently affiliated with WTA players Vitalia Diatchenko, Marta Sirokina and Anastasia Rodionova – who interestingly claims that six years ago an unnamed Croatian WTA player represented by his former management company was silently banned for six months after failing a drugs test.

    Doctor Luis Garcia del Moral is best known for setting up the doping system for the US Postal cycling team, he also had more than a decade of guiding tennis players at the Spanish TenisVal Academy. A tennis player my former company managed went to train at TenisVal some years ago – breaking her contract to do so. She returned to Croatia leaner, stronger and with notable skin irritations. It came as no surprise that a random drugs test found her to have taken anabolic steroids, amongst other banned drugs. She received a 6 month ban and went back on tour. The governing body of tennis, the ITF, were informed fully of what had happened, yet in the 6 years that have passed nothing has happened.

    Naturally, I automatically put on my imaginary detective hat and began perusing t’Internet for Croatian players absent from the tour somewhere around mid-2006 or 2007. The only 2006 year-end top 500 player to fall into this category was actually the one whose name immediately sprung to mind due to the 10 month (initially estimated 6 months) injury break she took in April 2007; everyone’s favourite ball-pummeler (and Marcos Baghdatis’ wife), Karolina Sprem. Still, there is no available information that links Sprem to the TennisVal academy or Moore’s old company, so the player in question could possibly be a non-Croatian national.

    Of course, the identity of the player in question is largely irrelevant. What is relevant is that someone involved with women’s players and the women’s tour has disclosed an actual example of the ITF allegedly being actively involved in the much-discussed concept of silently banning a player, or else being aware of player(s) banned for doping and refusing to disclose such information. Interesting indeed.
     
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  2. natalia

    natalia Semi-Pro

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    Thanks for posting this, very interesting times are upon us, it seems...
     
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  3. ivan_the_terrible

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    OP - interesting article in light of the fact that exhibit number 1 is back & showing no signs of career-threatening injuries as feared by his adoring fans.
     
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  4. SLD76

    SLD76 Legend

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    Le wow

    10shocks
     
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  5. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    Never in doubt.
     
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  6. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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  7. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

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  8. *Sparkle*

    *Sparkle* Professional

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    I could believe that ATP/WTA/ITP might be involved with silent bans, but once WADA is involved, it's a non-starter. ATP/WTA/ITP would be taking a big risk trying to keep that sort of thing from WADA now they have signed up to their policies.
     
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  9. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    There are certainly enough deluded people on this here website! :lol::twisted:
     
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  10. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

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    When it comes to the doping topic there certainly are! :)
     
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  11. MasturB

    MasturB Hall of Fame

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    Best part of that news headline was the fact that his name is DICK POUND.
     
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  12. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    You've never heard of Dick Pound?
     
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  13. KineticChain

    KineticChain Professional

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    and he's the head of something
     
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  14. JustBob

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    Considering his username, that's hard to believe! :)
     
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  15. OddJack

    OddJack Legend

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    Makes for good stories, but things like this cant be kept silent. Too many things involved at too many levels.
     
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  16. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    Dick Pound wanted Rio Ferdinand banned for years for forgetting a drugs test because he was preoccupied with moving house and going shopping. I wouldn't pay much attention to what he says. Ferdinand was later banned for 8 months! Not for failing a test, merely for forgetting an appointment to have a test done at a particular time.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2013
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  17. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    Of course you wouldn't. Why would anyone pay attention to someone who headed WADA and was vice prez of the IOC? Clearly he knows nothing about doping in sports. :rolleyes:
     
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  18. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    That sounds like a silent ban to me.
     
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  19. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    An 8 month ban for forgetting a doping test appointment. Pound wanted years. You think that's fair? Ferdinand was treated as if he was guilty of taking drugs, just for having a lot on his mind. I'm sorry, but that Ferdinand episode, and the reaction of people like Dick Pound and Sebastian Coe, left a very bitter taste.
     
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  20. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    Like I said, it was probably a silent ban. They wouldn't expose him as it would be bad for the sport so they disguise it as a lesser infraction. But you know if a tennis player misses 3 OOC tests in an 18 month period they are supposed to be suspended? Why does this surprise you? How else can you ensure they get tested? I still think that's too lenient.
     
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  21. frinton

    frinton Semi-Pro

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    Maybe silent bans are mainly sourced by silent little voices that speak inside the heads of many fellow tt-posters? For me it sounds too much like urban legends & conspiracy theories...
     
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  22. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    It isn't a silent ban. Other players have described that day in their autobiographies. Ryan Giggs also had a drug test that day not long after training, and was asked by the tester if he had seen Rio. Giggs said that he hadn't. Soon afterwards, there was controversy all over the media about it, and it dragged on and on and on and on, with people like Dick Pound wanting a draconian sentence. 4 months after the missed test, Ferdinand had to serve an 8 month ban.

    As for the testing system in tennis, I personally advocate blood tests for every single player during all tournaments. Why isn't this done? The almighty dollar/pound/euro, that's why.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2013
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  23. coloskier

    coloskier Legend

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    If one of the big 4 HAD gotten a positive test and it got out, the damage done to tennis in general would be 10 times the damage that Lance brought to the cycling world. Sponsors pulling out, tournaments getting cancelled, etc. That is why I believe that this is Nadal's 2ND silent ban.
     
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  24. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    :roll:

    You do not know much about doping, do you?

    And, where is the evidence, that that is the reason for the lack of testing?
     
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  25. raging

    raging Professional

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    I am trying to learn more about blood doping in sports.

    1.Murray has indicated that cost is the problem!(He has volunteered to pay some of the costs himself, not sure if his fellow players will be well pleased)

    2.Dr Stuart Miller from the ITF has also discussed the insufficient budget of the ITF for Drug Testing.In other words they are trying to get more money to extend the programme. Where from?

    3. Richard Ings, ex-ATP(Corruption & Drug Testing) & Australian Sports Drug Testing Agency has highlighted the difficulties & high costs
    of a Drug Testing Program.

    With regard to these 3 as sources & all the possibilities of a silent ban/conspiracy amongst ATP/WTA?ITF:

    Does anyone know what a single Blood Test for EPO<HGH< etc costs?
    I get figures from $100US-$500US depending on whether the test is on site at a tournament OR out of competition testing where Anti Doping Officials have to fly/travel to a players home to carry out the test: COST UNKNOWN?

    Anyone?
     
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  26. Goosehead

    Goosehead Hall of Fame

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    DICK POUND..it sounds like a made up name for a porn star :twisted::)
     
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  27. SLD76

    SLD76 Legend

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    mustard is a doping apologist extraordinaire.

    he also dislikes big govt and bureacracy.
     
    #27
  28. marc45

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    we all need to believe in something
     
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  29. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    If cycling, a sport, that generates less revenue, can do doping tests regularly, sure tennis can as well.

    It is a matter of will and intention.
     
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  30. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    yes but as coloskier said, they simply have no desire to catch anyone. If someone gets a silent ban then they must have been very very naughty indeed. Like by winning a grand slam dirty. A six month time out in the corner should teach them a lesson but it doesn't because they know they can get away with it again and again and their reputation will remain unsullied.
     
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  31. Hood_Man

    Hood_Man Legend

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    This thread became a lot more interesting when Dick Pound came on board. Sound like the arch enemy of Orgasmo the Superhero.
     
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  32. raging

    raging Professional

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    Not a matter of money?
     
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  33. Goosehead

    Goosehead Hall of Fame

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    like He-man and Skeletor :)...

    hahahahahhehehehehha soooooooo Heeee maan..we meet again..?, not so fast Skeletor..:)

    yes DICK POUND vs ORGASMO THE SUPERHERO..:) the outfits they wear are gonna be interesting :-|
     
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  34. CMM

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    Am I the only one who can't find the silent ban part? It only says the player received a six month ban.
     
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  35. citybert

    citybert Professional

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    When Michael Jordan retired for 2 years, many people were convinced that it was a silent ban for his gambling problems maybe even him betting on his own team. It's possible and I believe there is even a book written about this. There is some evidence of this but no smoking gun, only he knows and David Stern.
     
    #35
  36. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

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    It was apparently a six month ban which was never announced by the ITF. The ITF had the information and never did anything about it.
     
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  37. CMM

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    Maybe but that piece of text doesn't mention that. It only says the player was banned.
    When it says the ITF had the information and did nothing I think he's talking about Del Moral and the tennis academy from Valencia.
     
    #37
  38. Murrayfan31

    Murrayfan31 Hall of Fame

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    The answer is yes. Nadal is living proof that is exist.
     
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  39. Vrad

    Vrad Semi-Pro

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    Amazing that someone can actually believe what you are saying after the whole Lance Armstrong scandal.

    And unlike cycling, which is a team sport, tennis is an individual one, where everyone sticks to their own schedules and stuff. If Armstrong could have kept it silent for so long, it is laughable to believe that a tennis player could not.
     
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  40. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

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    No it doesn't. It says this:

    "She received a 6 month ban and went back on tour. The governing body of tennis, the ITF, were informed fully of what had happened, yet in the 6 years that have passed nothing has happened."

    That means the ITF never announced that this player was banned. She probably went off of tour announcing some sort of injury and nothing was ever mentioned about any ban.
     
    #40
  41. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

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    +1...........
     
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  42. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    If Armstrong was a pro tennis player, he can stay away from tennis for 7 months. :)
     
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  43. gsharma

    gsharma Professional

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    And you like big government and bureaucracy? Just had to ask.

    Why would ANYONE like bureaucracy and big government is beyond me.

    Btw, nice job making an ad hominem attack on someone you dislike and straying from objective arguments.

    OP, interesting tidbit, thanks for the info.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2013
    #43
  44. single_handed_champion

    single_handed_champion Professional

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    Umm.. what? The ITF did not ban her? I thought the ITF headed the anti-doping programme.

    Anyway, this page has no mention of Sprem. http://www.itftennis.com/antidoping/news/decisions.asp
     
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  45. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    This I certainly agree with!!! :lol: :p
     
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  46. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    I'm not. I want blood tests at every tournament, for every single player.

    I'm a Marxist.
     
    #46
  47. mariecon

    mariecon Hall of Fame

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    I vote for a blood passport for every player.[​IMG]
     
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  48. Hood_Man

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    I vote Dick Pound for President!
     
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  49. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    Capitalism = Making corporate profit for shareholders at society's expense is the main aim of society
    Regular doping tests = Eating into corporate profits

    Cycling has been compelled into stricter doping tests because so many cyclists have tested positive or been found guilty of taking banned substances, scandals which have damaged business. How many Tour de France podium finishers since the 1990s have tested positive or been found guilty? A clear majority, so cyclists at the elite of the sport have been caught in the scandals, with Lance Armstrong being by far the biggest of all. What's the biggest case in tennis? Probably Mariano Puerta, because Puerta tested positive on two seperate occasions, at 2003 Vina del Mar and at the 2005 French Open. Puerta is also the only player to have tested positive for a banned substance after a major tennis final, i.e. at the 2005 French Open. And then there's Petr Korda testing positive at 1998 Wimbledon, just 5 months after winning the Australian Open (where he had tested negative after beating Rios). But tennis is nowhere near the doping scandals like that we've seen in sports like cycling and athletics, and the ITF seems to maintain a lot of control over the anti-doping policies inside tennis.

    Now, as the ITF and the ATP are both very strongly connected to the profit making that goes with tennis as a business, there's a clear conflict of interest. Causing a doping scandal = Loss of corporate profit, so there's a clear incentive to bury positive tests to safeguard future business, if they can get away with it due to a lack of transparency. The only solution is to give control of anti-doping matters to a non-profit organisation that is completely unconnected to the profit making side of a sport, and to blood test every single player at every single tournament.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2013
    #49
  50. CMM

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    You skipped the first part. I can also quote only this
    Which, in my opinion, means the ITF were informed that Del Moral and TennisVal had something to do with the doping case and nothing happened to them.
     
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