Spaghetti String Racquets need to be made legal to counter the power game

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by The Pusher Terminator, Feb 5, 2005.

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Should Spaghetti strings be made legal to comat todays power game?

  1. Yes

    2 vote(s)
    33.3%
  2. No

    4 vote(s)
    66.7%
  1. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    Spaghetti strings were outlawed because they allowed lower ranked players to beat higher ranked players. But things have changed today with the advent of the power game (bigger racquets, stiffer materials etc). The spaghetti string although hit with huge spin , had very little power. Serves were only like 50 mph. Therefore I feel it would make tennis really intersting today. You would have power players versus spin players. Instead we have the same old "boleteri" factory players banging it out all day long. I think Spaghetti strings would make things a lot more interesting and the unfair advantage that existed in the old days will be greatly diminished. Roddicks serve is still a monster and a spaghetti will not help you. Agassi has booming groundstrokes and a spagheti will not give you an unfair adavntage against it.

    For those of you Youngsters out there, be advised that there used to be a racquet called the Spaghetti string. It was outlawed after Nastase used it to snap Vilas' world record of like 72 wins in a row or something. Stan Smith also lost to Fisbach ranked 200 or something in the world. The Spaghetti string was the first racquet ever banned in the history of tennis (and its a long history my friends). Before the Spaghettiyou could play with a shot-gun.....there were no rules! Personally, I think it was banned for political reasons. Vilas was a very popular player and his whining coach Tiriac had a lot of power. Anyway, what do you guys think?
     
    #1
  2. R-U-BUSY?

    R-U-BUSY? Banned

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    Spaghetti strings were outlawed because they changed the character of the game. They were absolutely right to ban the racquets and they should never be brought back again!
     
    #2
  3. big ted

    big ted Hall of Fame

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    i dunno none of the top players would start playing with one only some of the journeyman pros would try them who are always losing 1st round to the top seeds and beating federer or roddick in the 1st round like that would turn the tour into a circus
     
    #3
  4. Serve and Volley

    Serve and Volley Banned

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    Big Ted,

    I disagree. I think top players would absolutely use them. In fact I believe that tennis would become more like golf. In golf you use different clubs for different situations. If Spaghettis were made legal , Pro's would use them in different situations and against different opponents. For example, on a first serve players would use the modern power racquets...but on a second serve they would switch to the spaghetti for a big spin serve! Also, many would definitely go with the spaghetti over a power racquet at the French open. Finally, against Coria I would use the Spaghetti, because you are not going to overpower Coria...he can get to anything, so you have to try something else. Spin may be your only hope.
     
    #4
  5. Sonic Srve

    Sonic Srve Banned

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    Serve & volley,

    I have an even better idea. Players could use the blackburne racquet. You know, that racquet with two seperate stringbeds on each side of the racquet ( www.blackburneds.com ) , and you could string one side the conventional way and the other side with spaghetti ! That way a pro could switch off which side he will use even in the middle of a rally.
     
    #5
  6. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    Push, Your polls are going downhill. I am pretty sure your a young guy and were not around when the Spaghetti Racquet was first used on tour and then banned. The spin you get from the Spaghetti set-up is so severe that a heavy topsin FH could be bounced over your head or the back fence with reletive ease. Also the ball striking the strings made very little to no noise thus making it very hard to judge the pace an spin of the shot. I'll give you an "A" for creativity,"A" for effort, "F" for reality. While it's a creative thought in the end that's all it is and it will never happen.

    Since you like to think in terms of odd I'll handicap it for you.
    The odds of the ITF, ATP, USTA or any self-respecting governing body of tennis approving Spaghetti string racquets in our lifetime. 1,000,000,000,000,000,000, to 1.
     
    #6
  7. chicagohpch

    chicagohpch Rookie

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    Snic srve, are you talking about table tennis?
     
    #7
  8. LittleMAC

    LittleMAC New User

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    Can someone post a picture of this racquet?
     
    #8
  9. kv581

    kv581 Semi-Pro

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    It is illegal to change racquets but every other game (during a changeover).
     
    #9
  10. AAUS

    AAUS Rookie

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    nope, some spanish player brought 2 racquet with him and served with one racquet then switched when he was returning
     
    #10
  11. Shaolin

    Shaolin Hall of Fame

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    They should ban Pure Drive+s and trucker hats
     
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  12. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    I think that requirements on stringing patterns should be relaxed to let stringers produce higher density patterns using double and triple mains and/or crosses and to allow the use of tremlings which were thinner strings used to make stringbed patterns like in the old lawn tennis days. I would not mind it they even allowed speghetti variants. I also believe that any such rackets would not be able to compete with the open level players today even though many posters will point out the old results of the wooden era where fishburn and nastase upset won some matches that would not have been possible without the freaky rackets.
     
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  13. silverwyvern4

    silverwyvern4 New User

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    These spaghetti racquets sound like fun! What is the name of them and do you think I could get some from ****?
     
    #13
  14. gmlasam

    gmlasam Hall of Fame

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    You don't need a "spaghetti racquet". Spaghetti stringing is technique or a pattern on how you string the racquet. You can you use your racquet and string it with spaghetti stringing.
     
    #14
  15. Morpheus

    Morpheus Professional

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    Wasn't it Hank Pfister that first used the spaghetti string job?
     
    #15
  16. Aykhan Mammadov

    Aykhan Mammadov Hall of Fame

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    Can you explain for us those who never heard about what is Spaghetti racquet in details? How string were strung and etc. Any picture ? Is it used with sause ?
     
    #16
  17. Aykhan Mammadov

    Aykhan Mammadov Hall of Fame

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    Can you explain for those who never heard about what is Spaghetti racquet in details? How string was strung ? Is it used with sauce ?
     
    #17
  18. gmlasam

    gmlasam Hall of Fame

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    Mwhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahha!!!!

    Here is a link, http://www.itftennis.com/technical/equipment/strings/stringing/
     
    #18
  19. gmlasam

    gmlasam Hall of Fame

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    There is a published scientific journal study regarding the effects of the tennis ball using spaghetti stringing. You can find it HERE in .pdf format. You must have acrobat reader to view this file or some kind of program that can read pdf files.
     
    #19
  20. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    Aykan,

    Yes I can explain it but I only have seen one picture of the "real" spaghetti strung racquet. There are imitations of it on the web and people who say they can do it....but its not the "real deal."

    The Spaghetti strung racquet I think was strung with the normal amount of vertical strings but only like 4 strings horizontally. So the measurements were like 16 x 4 !! It was also strung insanely loosely...something like 25 pounds. It made absolutely no sound when you hit the ball and drove your opponents timing completely off. It also had some plastic pieces woven into it as well. The spin that it created was huge but it had very little power. Serve were only like 50 mph but you never knew how they would bounce.
     
    #20
  21. Kirko

    Kirko Hall of Fame

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    I think it was Mike Fishbach something with Fish in front.
     
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  22. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    And for,

    For once I agree with your odds; however, that does not make it right. You should be able to play with any type of racquet you want to play with. There should be no restrictions. You can use any type of golf club you want why can't you do the same in tennis. For centuries you could use whatever type of racquet you wanted to. A former USTA president once was quoted as saying you could play with a can for all I care. So why was the spaghetti outlawed?...Politics, Politics, Politics...in the end the sport loses. Finally, I heard that the effects of the Spaghetti were not quite as severe as you claim....it really was not that big of a deal. If it were, then why didnt anyone win a grandslam using it?
     
    #22
  23. gmlasam

    gmlasam Hall of Fame

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    Here are some pics of spaghetti stringing from woodtennis.com

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #23
  24. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    OK you want to argue? Let's go.

    First, golf does have equipment limitations. Look it up. You made the golf statement defend it.

    Second, Who was the USTA President who said, "you could play with a can for all I care."? That guy was an idiot who ever he was. The ITF sets the rules and regs so his words where irrelevent anyway.

    Third, "Finally, I heard that the effects of the Spaghetti were not quite as severe as you claim....it really was not that big of a deal." 1. Who told you the effects were not quite as severe? One of your teenage buddies who was not even born when it was around. 2. The guys who used them never won a GS because they all sucked, that's why no one ever won a GS with it.

    It's your topic so you defend it. I could but I am not going to give you anymore hard data for facts as I have done numberous times for you before only to have you ignore it, again. LOL
     
    #24
  25. spinbalz

    spinbalz Hall of Fame

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    Aykhan Mammadov wrote : "How string was strung"

    1/ Buy the best brand of spaghetti you can find in your area (Barilla is not bad, but if an italian guy can give us advices, welcome)

    2/ you have to cook your spaghettis, otherwise they will break while you string the racquet, if you want a firm string bed, cook them "al dente", if you want maximum comfort cook them 4 or 5 minutes longer than "al dente". AND DON'T BREAK THE SPAGHETTIS BEFORE TO PUT THEM IN THE SAUCEPAN, IT WOULD BE PURE HERESY

    3/ Once your spaghettis are cooked, drain them off, and use them to string your racquet, you don't need to prestretch your spaghetti strings. don't forget to tube your spaghettis on all their length before to string, otherwise your stringjob would break at the first ball hit.

    4/ Stringing takes slightly more time than average, because the spaghettis are to short for a 2 or 4 knots stringjob, so you have to use one different spaghetti for each main string and one different spaghetti for each cross string, so for a 18X20 string patterned racquet, you need 38 spaghettis, and it will make a 76 knots stringjob. proceed slowly, be patient

    5/ Don't add sauce or parmesan cheese if you are an ambitious tennis player, who wants to stay fit and wants to keep a low bodyfat.

    6/ Your are allowed to eat the excedent of spaghettis to recover from your efforts to string the racquet.

    *Last tip : you can make hybrid spaghetti stringjobs, by installing different brands of spaghettis in the mains and cross string, the classic one is Barilla in the mains, and "El cheapo" basic spaghetti in the crosses.

    Good Luck
     
    #25
  26. raftermania

    raftermania Banned

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    Damn I didn't know spaghetti stringing could be so tasty!
     
    #26
  27. Deuce

    Deuce Banned

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    The only pro who'd use it would be Santoro. It might add a couple of years to his career.

    Apart from Santoro (and perhaps Federer and Arazi), other pros would be handicapped by spaghetti stringing, and so would not use it. It is simply not conducive to the style they play.
     
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  28. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    And for,

    Its good to have you back. I truly missed you...this is not going to be near as good as Fed having the odds against him at the French...but lets see. Ok here are your answers...not in order:.

    1. The person who told me the Spaghetti was not all that big of a deal was a gentleman by the name of Chris Mayotte...former #82 in the world. Chris comes from a well established tennis family...his brother is Tim Mayotte former #8 in the world and has beaten players such as Agassi , Wilander...you name it.

    2. You say that the guys who used a spaghetti all sucked and thats why no one won a grand slam with it? I guess you think that Ilie nastase former #1 in the world and winner of a few grand slams sucked. Sheesh you have high standards

    3. As to the name of the USTA president, I have to take the time to look it up...or feel free to do so yourself...its in Bill Scanlons new book "bad news for Mcenroe". By the way, Bill Scanlon, was also a top ten player and he also felt that the spaghetti string being made illegal was purely political. In fact this should really be his thread not mine. He devotes quite a few pages just on this topic.

    4. You say that golf clubs have regulations? Well I am not talking about racial issues...I am talking about the sticks that golfers play with not the places they belong to...lol. Seriously,What are the regulations on a golf club? You can use any type of club that you want. In fact Tiger woods has complained about it and says that other players are catching up to him because there are no regulations with golf clubs.

    Its so nice beating you again...lol.
     
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  29. Serve and Volley

    Serve and Volley Banned

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    Thats why the balckburne double sided racquet would work. As someone suggested, you could have a conventional stringing system on one side and the spaghetti on the other...viola...no need to change racquets. By the way, Blackburne has a cool free video game on their site. I just tried it. Its called sudden death tennis.... www.blackburneds.com
     
    #29
  30. R-U-BUSY?

    R-U-BUSY? Banned

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    After reading what happened to Vilas , I would have been pretty pissed too. I can see why he made such a commotion over the Spaghetti and why politically it had to be made illegal. This racquet will drive any clay courter crazy...Coria would be dead! Check out what I got off the web:

    "Vilas,.... His 1977 was a monumental year in the game's history: he won 17 of 33 tournaments (tying Rod Laver's record) on a record of 145 match wins against 14 losses. Among his souvenirs were an open-era winning streak record of 50 matches and the French and U.S. titles. His streak, begun after Wimbledon, was stopped at Aix-en-Provence in September by Ilie Nastase, who used one of the controversial "spaghetti" rackets that produced weird strokes and bounces. Vilas quit in disgust; such rackets were shortly banned."
     
    #30
  31. Dedans Penthouse

    Dedans Penthouse Hall of Fame

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    Technically (to be picayune), it involves a "double hit" on the ball. If you've ever "mishit" a shot (i.e. double hit or a "carry" if you will) and saw the distorted spin that resulted, that will give you an idea of what the spaghetti stringing pattern will produce.
     
    #31
  32. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    1. Chris Mayotte, one man's opinion. Big deal.

    2. When Nastse use the spaghetti strings he was in the twilight of his career. That's why he did not win a GS with one. Fisburn and the rest of them were not very good.

    3. The name of the USTA president who said you can play with whatever, he was clearly short-sighted and not thinking straight.

    4. Golf has equipment regulations for clubs and balls. How much more clearer can I get. You look up the rules. When did regulations and race ever have anything to do with what we are talking about?

    I'll tell you what. You go to the ITF and USTA and propogate your ideas. You be the champion with a cause and fix all that's wrong with the game tennis you hate so much. When you get it done we'll all put you up on a pedestal and thank you.

    You don't win any discussions of ideas because you never listen to anyone. You think because you are the last man typing you are winning. Read the above again before you respond.

    I like your ideas and polls but if you feel so strongly about it take it to the governing bodies who can act. Let us know how they respond.
     
    #32
  33. Camilio Pascual

    Camilio Pascual Hall of Fame

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    Because it was banned as soon as it became apparent that could happen and that the reason could be the racquet and not the player wielding it. It would have been bad for tennis if they had let this happen.
     
    #33
  34. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    Wise words Camilio. Our friend Push should go to the ITF or USTA Archives and read the decision and then summerize their findings for us. That means Push would have to do his own research, I bet he doesn't like that idea. Maybe then he would not say it was only political.
     
    #34
  35. joehight

    joehight New User

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    Still laughing

     
    #35
  36. Camilio Pascual

    Camilio Pascual Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for the prop, Andfor. I thought it was an interesting and fun topic for Pusher to bring up, because I am a big Vilas fan who can't stand Nasty. Speaking of which, if you two guys get into another disagreement, may I call the lines? LOL
     
    #36
  37. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    Yea, I like Pusher's polls and I like giving him a hard time. I think he's OK with my ribbing even though I try to push him to the edge a little. It's all in fun and I hope he takes it well. You can ref., our matches anytime. He has offered to play me in XBOX tennis on-line and while that's tempting an would be fun I only have a PS2 at home, it's not networked. I would play him or anyone on the boards in a real tennis match for that matter. Now that would be a blast and fun to post about afterwards.

    Hey wasn't Vitas Gerulitis the one who left the court in tears after losing to one of the spaghetti stringjobs guys like Fishburn or Nastase back at the USO in 1976 or 77?
     
    #37
  38. Tenny

    Tenny Professional

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    Crazy Spin, how?

    What's the science behind the crazy amount of spin it generates? There gotta be something in addition to low tension and enhanced friction.

    Tenny.
     
    #38
  39. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    Your arguements are really going downhill. I don't even need to respond to that because you really made no points. In any event you really need to get XBOX just for the Topspin game it is absolutely awesome. I am currently ranked 1,421 in the world. Its truly an awesome game. You can create a player that looks just like you or anyone else for that matter. I played one guy that looked like John Mcenroe. You can hit different serves,spins, on different types of surfaces. You get a microphoe and can play with anyone around the world, create tornaments and leagues. HEY LETS START A TENNISWAREHOUSE LEAGUE!!!!
     
    #39
  40. R-U-BUSY?

    R-U-BUSY? Banned

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    I think there was an article in Popular science on it. Also a book by Kuebler talks about it as well. But basically, since there are very few cross strings the vertical ones therefore move around quite a bit because there is nothing to really hold them in place. This movement of the strings creates some huge spin. But you are right....it is not as unbelievable as people make it out to be. I just think that back in the pre-graphite and conventional sized racquet days, the Spaghetti caused a big stir. I believe that such a racquet would be a failure today. Except for that guy who thought of putting it on the doublesided Blackburne racquet. Thats really scary....I mean your opponent would not know what is coming at him....spin or power! Wow!!!!
     
    #40
  41. R-U-BUSY?

    R-U-BUSY? Banned

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    and for,

    No it was Vilas who lost to nastase. This was a cut & paste frome the web. Here it is again:

    "Vilas,.... His 1977 was a monumental year in the game's history: he won 17 of 33 tournaments (tying Rod Laver's record) on a record of 145 match wins against 14 losses. Among his souvenirs were an open-era winning streak record of 50 matches and the French and U.S. titles. His streak, begun after Wimbledon, was stopped at Aix-en-Provence in September by Ilie Nastase, who used one of the controversial "spaghetti" rackets that produced weird strokes and bounces. Vilas quit in disgust; such rackets were shortly banned."

    Coincidence that they were shortly banned after that? I wonder?
     
    #41
  42. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    It's very difficult to argue with the insane and incoherent. LOL
     
    #42
  43. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    and for,

    Yes it is very hard arguing with you.
     
    #43
  44. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    Oooooo, good one you got me.
     
    #44
  45. bc-05

    bc-05 Semi-Pro

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    hmm.. this racquet can be useful.. when i play against my biggest fear.. hotties ;)
     
    #45
  46. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    AND FOR,

    The xbox challenge is still very much open. I suggest you practice I am ranked in the top 1400 in the world....LOL. better practice my friend! See you on the virtual court. By the way...I will not play you at the French because the odds would be against me...lol
     
    #46
  47. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    Those odds are bad as they are for all of us. I will play on clay, hardcourt or whatever.

    XBOX, I am to old for that. Our best bet is to play for real. I can be found in Memphis anytime and occasionally on the road for business in random cities around the US. I'll be in New Orleans next week. Kansas City in April or March, who knows from there.

    When I am in KC I am going to hook up for doubles with TCJackson and some other old aquaintances. I would like to try to play with some of you on the boards this year during my travels. Now that would be something worth posting!

    Spaghetti strings are for those who can't play the game as it was intended or for the hungry.
     
    #47
  48. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    And For,

    No offense...but we are on the internet and Therefore I am not sure what you mean by "play" with me...LOL. Therefore, without knowing who you are I think it would be far safer to limit any tennis matches to virtual matches on the Xbox.

    On another note, I have been trying to get my hands on a Spaghetti racquet for quite some time, but I cannot find one anywhere. Does anyone know where I can get one?
     
    #48
  49. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

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    That's fine and even though you used the LOL I am somewhat offended. I understand being on the internet can be a weird and dangerous place. Better to error on the side of safety if that's how your feel. For all anyone knows you could be 9 years old. The last thing I want is for anyone to be uncomfortable with anything I've written. Your interpretation of my use of the word "play" other than what I was clearly talking about, "play tennis", is a low blow (no pun intended). However, I can not fault anyone's interpretation given we not know who anyone really is here. I would hope it was obvious to all I meant "play tennis". I should not have been so conversational and have been more clear for those who read into every word. I will not encourage the idea "playing tennis" with anyone other than those I already personally know here on the board. Furthermore since your clearly are not comfortable with what I wrote I will not respond to your posts anylonger.
     
    #49
  50. The Pusher Terminator

    The Pusher Terminator Banned

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    and for,

    Sheesh! I was only kidding. You need to get some thicker skin. I knew you only meant "playing tennis" ...I was just teasing you. RELAX DUDE! No offense intended...REALLY!

    So far you have called me a whacko, and ignorant...I forget what else. I did not take any offense. In fact I have enjoyed our banter. Seriously, I am truly sorry if I hurt your feelings. OK? Just please don't say that we have to stop insulting each other...LOL .
     
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