Statistics taken further re. Rafael vs Novak

Discussion in 'Pro Match Results and Discussion' started by Speranza, Sep 9, 2013.

  1. Speranza

    Speranza Hall of Fame

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    #1
  2. zam88

    zam88 Professional

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    12 break points faced in 6 matches is really remarkable.

    Nole certainly has to play better than he did against Stan.


    If Nole were to lose this match.. meaning that he was able to win the AO, but then lost the final (or virtual final - '13 FO) in 4 of the last 5 slams... that's beginning to ask yourself "what's up"
     
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  3. tipsa...don'tlikehim!

    tipsa...don'tlikehim! G.O.A.T.

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    Thanx for that.


    I don't know if you saw that this morning on ATP webssite, i was checking H2H and they put this:


    2013 US Open
    NY, U.S.A. Hard F Nadal, Rafael
    Stats

    2013 ATP World Tour Masters 1000 Canada
    Montreal, Canada Hard S Nadal, Rafael
    6-4, 3-6, 7-6(2) Stats


    So basically they put Nadal as a winner but didn't write the score (of course :D), they removed it since, but it was like that this morning... quite funny! Do they know the results before us ?
     
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  4. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    Good stats. Thanks for posting.

    I'm a bit surprised they put in the unreturned serves % stat. A very useful, but often missing stat.
     
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  5. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    Those stats tell me that Cvac has been the better player throughout this tournament, and will have no trouble winning today.
     
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  6. Ballinbob

    Ballinbob Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for the stats, very insightful. Pulling for Nole today
     
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  7. djokovicisananimal

    djokovicisananimal Professional

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    Nadal 99% of serves hold, that % will be knocked down a lot after tonight:)
     
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  8. FreeBird

    FreeBird Legend

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    Novak Djokovic foundation receives 50 million from Tio toni, no?
     
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  9. tipsa...don'tlikehim!

    tipsa...don'tlikehim! G.O.A.T.

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    hahah i don't know but that was weird :lol:
     
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  10. sillymonkey

    sillymonkey Hall of Fame

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    great stats, thx. Vamos Rafa!
     
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  11. cucio

    cucio Legend

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    Interesting stat compilation, thanks. Rather evened out. This is the real final, hoping for a 5 set classic and may the best man win.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2013
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  12. cucio

    cucio Legend

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    It is interesting also how stats don't tell the full story. For instance Nole has many more aces and overall better serve stats, but he has been broken more times. Thinks like serve placement, heaviness or clutch are difficult to quantify.
     
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  13. Tomxc

    Tomxc Semi-Pro

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    Well actually if they put the letter F next to Nadal's name, that means he was the runner-up... Winners have W next to the name. So if Djokovic wins today........................
     
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  14. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    if Nadalwins and gets broken less than 4 times he will have the record for least service breaks as well as joint second, both at the USO. For a clay GOAT who has struggled on HC sometimes (relative to his overall greatness) that would be a weird record for him to hold.
     
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  15. President

    President Legend

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    When he is confident, Nadal's service game has always been exceptionally strong, certainly far above the likes of Djokovic and Murray. When he is unconfident, it's a different story. This goes all the way back to 2006, when Nadal held something like 80 service games in a row at Wimbledon. His surprisingly good first serve sets up his huge forehand and he has great footwork to get in position for it, which makes him almost impossible to break when he is playing well. Djokovic is really the only player who was ever be able to return Nadal's serve with confidence on the big stages.
     
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  16. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Exactly the same # of winners?? That's incredible. What's gonna lose Novak the match is that 10 times broken vs 1 stat. His serve is way too vulnerable right now to fend off Rafa's assault on the return. (which is already what caused his downfall in Montreal, getting broken so early in the match). I could see a 2010-type scenario unfolding.

    ETA: and for all the whiners and complainers, their time on court has been about the same. So, whatever the outcome, NO EXCUSE!
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2013
    #16
  17. KillerServe

    KillerServe Banned

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    Wow, wow, wow, wow. The most telling differences are the FH winners and BH UE's. If Djoker does not clean up those BH's, it's lights out.
     
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  18. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Also he plays the big points so well, whenever you get a break point and he'sin this frame of mind, you really have to earn the break, cos he's gonna defend that bp with his life!
     
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  19. tipsa...don'tlikehim!

    tipsa...don'tlikehim! G.O.A.T.

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    What is the record ? i won't be surprised if it is Federer at the AO 2007, do you have the stat ? how many times did he get broken?
     
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  20. tipsa...don'tlikehim!

    tipsa...don'tlikehim! G.O.A.T.

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    they hit 206 winners each
    Djokovic hit 37 UE more than Nadal
     
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  21. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    No the record is Roddick in 2003 at the USO and Nadal at the 2010 US Open, both broken 5 times in the whole event.

    So nadal can beat this and have the joint second too.
     
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  22. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    I don't care that much about the UEs stat due to my theory that winning matches has little to do with being flawless throughout and more about playing superlative on the crucial points but sure Nadal has been very consistent recently and his consistency has been helped by his high confidence level.
     
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  23. tipsa...don'tlikehim!

    tipsa...don'tlikehim! G.O.A.T.

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    Ok i was about to mention this one too ;)
     
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  24. mcenroefan

    mcenroefan Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for the stats.

    I don't think that they have much bearing either way on this match. Rafa is perhaps in best ever HC form while Nole is probably playing his B game. Nole didn't play great against Stan but, then again, Stan was playing better than anyone in the tourney not named Nole or Rafa. If Nole plays aggressively, I think he'll win. If he plays passively, I think he will lose.
     
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  25. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    ok i was looking through Fed's slams on the atpwebsite where you can look at the match stats for each match played and see how many bp the oppoenent converted just to see what his best serve defense was in a slam he won.But when I got to Wimbledon 2006 I counted only 4 service breaks which has to be wrong, I'm sure Nadal broke about 4 times in the final alone (probably more) so as a result i can't trust the atp's stats
     
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  26. tipsa...don'tlikehim!

    tipsa...don'tlikehim! G.O.A.T.

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    Maybe he didn' get broken until the final:

    Federer R. - Bjorkman J. SF 6-2, 6-0, 6-2
    Federer R. - Ancic M. QF 6-4, 6-4, 6-4
    Federer R. - Berdych T. R16 6-3, 6-3, 6-4
    Federer R. - Mahut N. 3R 6-3, 7-6, 6-4
    Federer R. - Henman T. 2R 6-4, 6-0, 6-2
    Federer R. - Gasquet R. 1R 6-3, 6-2, 6-2
     
    #26
  27. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    it says he got broken once vs Mahut, once vs ancic and twice vs Nadal.

    So I'm not sure, I thought the record for any slam was 5 breaks which Roddick held and Nadal tied. Maybe that was just the US Open? But I'm almost sure nadal had more than 2 breaks in the final in 2006 wimbledon
     
    #27
  28. dudeski

    dudeski Hall of Fame

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    I only remember two breaks in that final. One at the start of 2nd set and another one when Fed served for the match the first time. He won the 1st set 6-0 so no breaks there. 3rd set he lost 7-6 so possible some breaks there. 2nd set I am pretty sure he only got broken once and then broke back and won the tiebreak. 4th sets I am pretty sure Nadal got only one double break back. So question is did Fed got broken in the 3rd?
     
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  29. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    May be the record is only for USO. How many times did Nadal get broken in FO 08?
     
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  30. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    Could you please post the link where we can check the slam stats?
     
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  31. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    according to the atp stats, Nadal got broken 9 times during RG 2008, the match vs Almagro was the only one where he didn't get broken.
     
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  32. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    http://www.atpworldtour.com

    go here, find the player you want, go the playing activity, find the year you want and each match has some stats if you click on "stats"
     
    #32
  33. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Yeah you might be right there.
     
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  34. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    So the record did get broken After all! Won the slam dropping serve only 4 times!!

    But I don't see the journos notice this fact?
     
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  35. firepanda

    firepanda Professional

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    Since the ATP World Tour began keeping track of match statistics in 1991, the fewest breaks of serve of a Grand Slam champion during the tournament was two by Pete Sampras at Wimbledon in 1997. Nadal has held serve 89 of 91 games going into the final. Of Nadal’s eight Grand Slam titles, the fewest times he’s been broken was five times at Wimbledon in 2008. Andy Roddick lost serve five times en route to the US Open title in 2003 (the fewest breaks of serve on record).


    Taken from a weathered ATP article. Not sure how to interpret it though. Does Sampras have the record at 2, or has Nadal just broken Roddick's record with 4?
     
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  36. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    The article doesn't look very credible. Nadal was broken only once till the final, while it says two.

    But it would be no surprise if Pete holds the record. A server like Nadal with thus record is almost unbelievable!
     
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  37. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    no, fed didn't get broken in the 3rd.

    It was just two breaks, start of the 2nd and while serving for it in the 4th
     
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