T Fight 315?

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by Bubbagumptennis, Jan 14, 2013.

  1. ae1222

    ae1222 Semi-Pro

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    I would say their leather is pretty good, just a little softer than babolat. Not quite head or fairway but a decent substitute. I kept the TF grip on mine and liked it.
     
  2. anubis

    anubis Hall of Fame

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    What would be the difference between adding weight at 11 and 1 (4 grams total) and adding weight as you suggested? 6 grams @ 3, 9 and 12? Just curious, thanks.

    That's great! I love mine too. I just ordered another one yesterday, have a big tournament coming up this weekend and will spend some time matching my two frames.

    What kind of strings and tension are you putting in it?
     
  3. Carefree

    Carefree Rookie

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    Thanks guys. I don't plan on replacing mine, just curious as I don't see a lot of chatter about the Tec leather grip
     
  4. cmendez79

    cmendez79 Semi-Pro

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    I put Pro Line II @53 lbs....it felt great but if you ask me, I think the feeling of the strings were OK, I think I might go down, I felt a little low powered so I might go to 51 the next time
     
  5. Carefree

    Carefree Rookie

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    Do you think that Tecnifibre will continue to release this racquet year after year (or every 2 years like most manufacturers)? Generally, the rest of their line doesn't seem to change much spec wise, just the "new technologies".

    Considering that this is pretty much always sold out on TW and TWE, do you think other manufacturers will take this as a sign to produce more "rec stock" racquets?
     
  6. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    Gentlemen,

    Have any of you tried adding lead immediately above the handle? Wow, so very, very impressive. :shock:
     
  7. JGads

    JGads Hall of Fame

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    More detail needed (where exactly, and how much?) I've long been a fan of this mod but haven't tried it on this frame.

    For me, the 'Yonex setup' - a gram at the four corners and 1/2 gram at 12 - is still proving so sweet.
     
  8. mad dog1

    mad dog1 Hall of Fame

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    i can confirm the yonex setup is indeed very, very sweet. hit w/ JG's stick tonight and the swingweight is very manageable now. love the feel, spin and heaviness this stick is capable of generating.
     
  9. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Probably not, since its a "LTD" (limited edition)
     
  10. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    Hi, JGads have to try the Yonex setup. As to my referenced setup, I went 4 grams at 11 and 1 respectively, with head guard from 9 to 3. Then went 4 grams (2 on each flat side) right above the handle. Still need to perfect the balance, almost certainly by reducing the weight at 11/1, but I was very impressed (the bite on the spin was amazing) with the addition of lead above the handle.
     
  11. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    Definitely need to check this out!
     
  12. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Just wanted to round up the thoughts on people's lead positioning on these sticks..

    JGads: 1,1,1,1,0.5g @ 10, 2, 4, 8 and 12. (Total 4.5g)
    PPlayer: 2g @ 10-11, 2g @ 1-2 (total 4g)
    Cmendez: 2g each at 3,9,12 (total 6g)
    Amir75: 2g each at 3,9,12 + 4g in throat (total 10g)
    A Gerst: 6g above buttcap, 11g @ 10, 11g @ 2 (total 28g)
    badmice: 2g each @ 3, 9 + 1.5g in throat (total 5.5g)
    dgoran: 10g @ top of handle (total 10g)
    mykoh: 5, 5 @ 10, 2 + 9g in butt cap (total 19g)
    mykoh: 7, 7 @ 10, 2 + 9g in butt cap (total 23g)
    spinliferafa: 3g each @ 3,9 (6g total)
    sunshine22: 2g each @ 3,9,12 (6g total)
    anubis: 2g each @ 11, 1 (4g total)
    skeeter: 2g each @ 10,2 (4g total)

    Is that correct?
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2013
  13. JGads

    JGads Hall of Fame

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    Can simplify mine by just saying 1,1,1,1,.5 @ 10, 2, 4, 8 and 12. (Total 4.5g)

    Mine's really just at the corners now, and just a half gram at 12.

    Fantastic idea, btw, to round them all up into one post. Much easier.

    These 315s are so sweet. I have a decent little collection of pro stocks now that hit different balls, but in terms of pure feel on contact, these are my favorite. Pure butterscotch.
     
  14. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    Hey, JGads

    At those amounts, have you thought about using head tape instead of lead? While it might be aesthetically ugly, might give you the same result with an even softer feel.
     
  15. aimr75

    aimr75 Hall of Fame

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    the 315's are sweet frames

    How did you go with those other .2's?
     
  16. JGads

    JGads Hall of Fame

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    Wouldn't even want a softer feel, to be honest. The current setup feels perfect, no reason to change it for now.

    Just having my initial hits the last couple of nights. Solid. Not as sweet feeling as the 315s but most certainly more powerful. They fall right in line with my other .2s but they're lighter and standard length so there's more room for me to do some lead experimenting, unlike the others. Will most likely eventually lengthen the frame to 27.25, which is where my favorite sticks are all at right now. (My fave Tec is curiously about 27.2, longer than the other).

    All good in my racquet world. Between these Tecs and my pro stocks, the bag is loaded with heavenly frames.
     
  17. Carefree

    Carefree Rookie

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    That's what I was afraid of. However, I thought that maybe, since it was proving to be so popular, that they would possibly keep it as part of their line.
     
  18. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    I wouldn't worry. They will always have a TF315 model of some sort.
     
  19. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    That's what a lot of us Dunlop fans thought about the 200 series.

    Even that product line is being warped towards a Babolat APD clone. :(
     
  20. MAXXply

    MAXXply Hall of Fame

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    I'm puzzled as to why, after 900+ posts in this thread, next to no-one has posted their opinions about the 315 in the racket feedback section?
     
  21. JGads

    JGads Hall of Fame

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    The 315 Club is made up of distinguished gentlemen who feel no need to gloat in the 'customer feedback' section of TW. This thread will do, where we can talk amongst ourselves about our pro-stockian dandy. Our own knowledge is enough. No need to shout from the rafters. Time can be better spent on a post-victory Scotch.
     
  22. Power Player

    Power Player Talk Tennis Guru

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    Reading this post brought me great joy. Especially since I love Scotch.
     
  23. cmendez79

    cmendez79 Semi-Pro

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    I already had 3 of these , how many are you planning to stock up?

    Im planning to get 2 more of this , for me they are close to those classic raquects
     
  24. mykoh

    mykoh Rookie

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    changed my lead setup for SW 340, 32.2cm balance, 21.1 MGr/i

    JGads: 1,1,1,1,.5 @ 10, 2, 4, 8 and 12. (Total 4.5g)
    PPlayer: 2g @ 10-11, 2g @ 1-2 (total 4g)
    Cmendez: 2g each at 3,9,12 (total 6g)
    Amir75: 2g each at 3,9,12 + 4g in throat (total 10g)
    A Gerst: 6g above buttcap, 11g @ 10, 11g @ 2 (total 28g)
    badmice: 2g each @ 3, 9 + 1.5g in throat (total 5.5g)
    dgoran: 10g @ top of handle (total 10g)
    mykoh: 7, 7 @ 10, 2 + 9g in butt cap (total 23g)
    spinliferafa: 3g each @ 3,9 (6g total)
    sunshine22: 2g each @ 3,9,12 (6g total)
    anubis: 2g each @ 11, 1 (4g total)
    skeeter: 2g each @ 10,2 (4g total)
     
  25. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Had a good 2 hours of hitting with this stick yesterday in stock form with / without OG.

    Difficult to know where to begin but some initial thoughts:
    • Very direct feedback through the stick when striking the ball. It lets you know exactly what you're doing, how cleanly you're striking the ball, where in the stringbed you're hitting the ball etc. The feel reminds me a bit of the YT Prestige/MP/Pro but without the brassiness, or the Amplifeel Wilson 6.1s or even the Amplifeel Blades, but without the vibrations/wobble. Very direct feel - either you'll like that or you won't. I'm not sure I'd describe it as plush, though I wouldn't say its necessarily harsh either. Direct.
    • Doesn't feel like a flexy stick at all. Certainly not RA59. Maybe I've got one from a stiffer batch, but it feels more like a RA64/65 stiffness stick. Definitely not flexy, though not necessarily stiff either. Stiffness to me feels like that of BLX Juice Pro ~ RA65(?) The 315 does feel like a solid one piece construction though, again like the BLX Juice Pro which also has a solid one piece construction type feel (though a heavier, slightly clunkier feel). The 315 doesn't feel 'buttery' to me. We're in the realms of subjectivity, but buttery to me means butter smooth, butter soft, ie plush, something like the Dunlop Rev Tour Pro 2 with its internal carbon rods. Very clean, direct response through the racquet though.
    • Unusual stick to hit with in stock form. It doesn't entirely feel complete to me. It feels like a stick that you have to really work to get the best results from. Very much a 'you get out what you put in' type stick. I found that I having to hit through the ball much more, concentrating on extension through the hitting zone, follow through, finish etc. This stick seems to play better you up/out/after the ball. It's a very adjustable and controlled orientated. Some of the variation you can produce with this stick is just crazy. It's perfectly playable in stock form but it really does lack mass. That said, strike the ball perfectly in the sweetspot and you will hit through the court. But you're talking striking the ball perfectly everytime. Against a big hitter, you're having to work overtime.
    • Sweetspot is in the area below the 10th cross ie slightly lower than the middle of the stringbed. Reminds me a bit of the old Tecnifibre VO2 320(?) though not quite as extreme as the Dunlop 4D 300T. It seems to be particular Tecnifbre quirk or the mold they used. If you want maximum power from the string, you're going to have to hit in the lower part of the stringbed. The upper part of the string is precise and still usable, but it doesn't have the same amount of power. It's a bit of a strange quick, because who's so precise that they can centre the ball in the lower of the stringbed when they want to drive down the court, and then typically use the upper half when hitting angles? I see why people are adding lead in the upper part of the hoop.
    • SW still feels too low though. There's simply no substitute for mass IMO. It's not a light racquet but it doesn't feel like it has enough weight to it in the right areas. Needs some adjustment to the weight distribution for my tastes with more weight in the handle and tip of the racquet. Really liked the way this racquet served though. Easy to serve with due to its lower weight and it was very precise on flat serves. Again it was a case of staying as loose as you can because there's no free power here.
    • Stick played well even with a synthetic gut. In fact, the extra power of the synthetic gut was useful given how relatively low powered the stick is.
    • Hoop doesn't feel like a 98 to me. Feels more like a 95/96 that's longer in length. The usable stringbed area doesn't feel any bigger than my Juice Pro (96/16x20) and feels smaller than the usable stringbed area on the Prestige MP.
    • Grip size seems to run small. That Technibre leather is particularly thin and I'm no fan of the rectangular grip shape which makes the grip even narrower on the forehand grip. I'd want a TK82S pallet on this.
    • From being fairly pleased with the way the stick played yesterday, I'm not so happy today as for some reason my wrist is absolutely killing me today having hit with this stick yesterday. I played a guy from my club's 2nd team yesterday and I had to work the stick so hard to maintain pace and finish points. Against heavy balls the stick felt that it was losing the battle of mass and getting pushed back in my hand which may explain why I've got wrist pain today.
    • String choice. This will be an interesting but in anything close to storm, I can't see a stiff, dead, low powered poly being a good match for this stick. A lively string with some feel might well suit this stick, Ashaway ZX perhaps, or a multi/nylon, or maybe a poly hyrbrid provided the poly isn't too low powered. All of that may change if the stick is weighted up.
    Based on initial impressions, the 315 Ltd is interesting, intriguing players stick but it needs customisation and alot more mass in the handle and upper hoop (and a TK82S). I suspect that this stick isn't going to play at its best until its been taken into the 345g+ range, which makes it quite different to how it was weighted in stock form. Couldn't they have got the weighting more in the right ball park in the first place? I just hope this stick doesn't turn out to be another Prestige MP - something that has elements of the sublime but no amount of tweaking gets it feeling quite right unless you reach some stratospherically high weight (managed it with YT PMP @ 352g but never with the IG PMP).

    Update

    Had an initial experimentation with lead, and like everyone else, this stick undoubtedly feels and plays better with some extra weight. 4g at 10/2, 4g at 10/2 and 2g at 12, 4g at 10/2 and 2g in the throat......they all work to varying degrees depending on what you're after. This is going long summer of fiddling with lead tape placements and amounts with this stick as the permutations are endless. For me, it certainly feels as if it improves with some additional lead in the upper hoop, possibly the throat, and possibly the handle. In what amounts, and precisely where, remains to be seen.....

    The easiest way I've found of experimenting with lead tape placement is to cut 1g strips of lead tape and then sandwich them between two strips of electrical tape until you settle on something more permanent. That way you can stick 'n peel as much or as little as you want, easily changing positions or amounts without damaging the paint or ending up with poisonous fingers. Obviously, you can lay down a baselayer of electrical tape across the upper hoop if you really want to be careful but I've found that its not strictly necessary.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Lead strips of various weights, pressed between a triple layer of electrical tape. Used some wax paper from a replacement grip to keep them sticky. Should make it easier to stick / peel / move / adjust between sets etc before hopefully settling on a more permanent placement....

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2013
  26. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    Spot on.

    All very true. Mass issue depends on opposition. Had no problem against softer hitters in stock form. Did not enjoy facing first serves from former college player in stock form

    Definitely an issue in stock form.

    Yup, accurate observation.

    Definitely true.

    And once you begin to add that mass it's absolutely amazing. I've added about 4+ grams in the head and about 4 grams under the grip directly under my hand. I also trimmed the grip to fit my one hand backhand to save some mass and keep the static weight to 340g.

    Currently playing with it at 340g, 320 SW, 7 HL balance. Seems almost perfect but I have another 3-6 grams static weight and 10 points of SW before I start reaching my personal maximums. So, still room to customize if need be.
     
  27. anubis

    anubis Hall of Fame

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    Lessons learned!

    OK, so I got a 2nd one of these babies in a couple of days ago. My biggest mistake thus far was to treat it exactly the same as my other one. Can you guess what that was?

    I took this stick out today to play my first match in a local tournament. I had a bye in the round of 16, so this was the quarterfinals.

    Needless to say, everything went long. Couldn't keep anything in play, didn't know what to do. So I switched back to the other one and went on to win the match.

    I went home and weighed both sticks. The new one, as it turns out, is exactly 4 grams heavier than the other one! So I took off the 4g of lead that I put in the hoop and presto! Same exact weight as the other: 12 oz precisely.

    I guess this one will have to play with no lead until I get a balance board to figure out where the extra weight is.

    So lesson learned for me: measure twice, cut once!

    (still a great stick though)
     
  28. Carefree

    Carefree Rookie

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    Plus, it's not like there's a huge stock of these. Don't want everyone buying one before we all decide how many to get.
     
  29. MAXXply

    MAXXply Hall of Fame

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    Torres - or anyone else: I use size 1/4 for HEAD rackets with the standard TK82 pallet/gripshape. Does the 315 grip, including the leather, run significantly smaller so that a 3/8 in the 315 would be closer to a HEAD 1/4 ??
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2013
  30. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    No, sizing should be the same as they both use what appear to be Head pallets. As to the thickness of the leather, I don't believe it's that significant even if such differentiation exists.
     
  31. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    Only danger here is that the experiment's results will be misleading given the weight of the electrical tape.

    8" of vinyl electrical tape weighs 1g.

    So if you use two 4" segments to sandwich 4" (or 1g) of lead tape you've actually doubled the weight you're testing to 2g. If you've only used one piece of vinyl tape you've still increased the mass by a whopping 50%.

    One solution is to increase the amount of lead tape used when implementing your final configuration. Or just use vinyl tape alone and forget the lead tape.

    A key advantage of vinyl over lead is that you can spread the mass over a very large surface area almost like adding another layer of graphite to the frame. This has a more even effect on the sweet spot compared to concentrated areas of lead. Vinyl also works great under the grip by providing some extra cushioning.

    OTOH, concentrated lead can pull the sweet spot in a given direction very precisely.

    For my matched 315s I used vinyl tape under the grip and, for one frame, spread 1/4" vinyl tape all around the hoop to match SW, mass, and balance with the other frame (one frame had stock SW of only 298 while the other was ~312 stock).

    Once fully matched I ended up using 1/4" lead tape from 7th main to 7th cross to bring SW up to 320 and some more vinyl tape under the grip to get a 7pt HL balance. Final static weight is 340g.

    I tried using vinyl tape for the final mod in the hoop but it proved too mushy in feel at the end. The concentrated lead felt crisper and more stable. Since the 315 is already soft this worked out just fine.
     
  32. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    As far as I aware they're the same size

    ie. Head TK82 L3 = TF TK82 L3
     
  33. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    You just weigh the strips after you've put them together. If they're 2g and you only want 1g, you just cut it in half.....
     
  34. Sunshine22

    Sunshine22 New User

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    Update on me. As I mentioned earlier on, I'm so happy with how the racquet plays with the 2g+2g+2g set up, I have not messed around at all with the lead. I also still have the original Wilson 16g natural gut mains/Lux 4G crosses and have been happy with that set up as well. However, once I break a string, I'll likely try alu power in a full bed, since that has always been my go to string.

    I just received my 3rd one which is going to stay unstrung with plastic on handle until I need it. Will likely pick up a couple more to do the same.

    For me personally, this racquet does it all - easy power, easy spin, very predictable and supremely comfortable without being muted or noodley.
     
  35. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    Haven't used a Volkl PB10 in quite awhile, although I remember enjoying it quite a bit. While I await receipt of my 315 Ltds., and given that their somewhat comparable to this Babolat guy, would appreciate the thoughts of anyone with significant experience with both.
     
  36. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    It plays like a spinnier, more forgiving version of the PB 10 Mid when modified with extra mass. Just as plush and solid. Not quite as precise as the scalpel-like PB 10 but definitely control oriented.

    The other night I managed several very delicate drop shots from just behind the service line that just cleared the net and sank like rocks. Those and DTL backhand slices are among my favorite shots and I'm having no problems. The BH down the line from the ad court is my benchmark for control with a frame and this one passes the test (one handed backhand).

    If you enjoyed the PB10 Mid then you won't be displeased with the 315 once you beef it up a little at the very least. That extra weight is crucial for stable precision.
     
  37. P.Floyd

    P.Floyd Rookie

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    Thank you, Timothy, that was a great comparison of the two.
     
  38. MAXXply

    MAXXply Hall of Fame

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    I think Torres has been the only one here to comment *against* the widely trumpeted softness of the 315. Certainly in the sense that he doesn't think it's anywhere near that nirvanic sub-60RA some of us crave. A bummer for me, as I was rather hoping it would deliver somewhere in that 56-59 ballpark.
    As Torres describes it, is your experience of the true flex of the 315 to be more in the 63 range, the rating that is pretty much found imprinted on every Dunlop 200/300 these days?
     
  39. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    ^ Maybe some weight in the 'tip and tail' will make it flex across the throat that bit more on contact with ball, but in stock form, it doesn't feel to me like a flexy stick, certainly not RA59. I wouldn't say its stiff either though. Direct and clean feeling feedback is how I'd describe it.
     
  40. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    In stock form it felt ridiculously flexible to me in the throat. Against heavy serves (vs. 6' 5" former HS/college player) the frame felt like a giant shock absorber. I couldn't get anything back since the entire upper half of the frame just bent backwards absorbing the blow and rebounding the ball off to my right when returning on the FH side. This was with my 315 with a stock SW of 298.

    Only when I started adding mass to the upper hoop and under my hand did I get enough "oomph" to actually resist some of that flex.

    My favorite frames have been those with lower RAs such as the PB 10 Mid and the Dunlop 200 series (I also own 2x AG 4D 200 Tours, 2x AG 4D 200s, and 2x Bio 200 Lites). I also have a sensitive arm due to fencing and strongly dislike anything that resembles a board-like feel.

    The 315 is definitely a soft, comfortable frame. That being said, in stock form the SW is really low. That may be the cause of any discomfort one feels regardless of flex rating. With a paper SW of ~300 anything with decent pace is going to knock your arm around due to insufficient plow.

    There are frames that play well stock and which can be customized (eg the PSGT). IMO the 315 really needs to be customized to shine.
     
  41. ART ART

    ART ART Semi-Pro

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    The flex might be +-4 RA points, it's all about QC, this can happen in all rackets.

    There's a user here in one post that said his racket was 57RA.
    So you can allways get a 315-16x19 from 56 to 63RA I guess...
     
  42. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    Excellent point Art.

    My 315s had a difference of 5g in static weight and one was SW 298 while the other was SW 312. Lots of potential there for variations in materials.
     
  43. anubis

    anubis Hall of Fame

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    Hmm. i may be doing it wrong, but in attempting to calculate the swingweight of my two frames, I came up with 349 and 343 (pendulum method). that seems a bit high. I ran the calculations 3 separate times, each with three passes that were averaged.

    Frame 1
    weight: 345g
    balance point: 12 3/4" (6 points HL)
    length: 27"
    time average: 13.83 sec
    SW = 349

    Frame 2
    weight: 345g
    balance point: 12 11/16" (4.5 points HL)
    length: 27"
    time avg: 18.86
    SW = 343

    Frame 1 has: strings, overgrip, button dampener, 4g lead
    Frame 2 has: strings, overgrip, button dampener

    Seems rather bulky. Prestige, watch out! :)
     
  44. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    ....except that racquets don't vary by 8 RA points.
     
  45. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    How many frames have you examined in an RDC machine? 315s specifically?

    Don't forget, an RDC only measures flex at the throat.

    And, of course, distribution of mass influences perceived flex. For example, some feel that extra mass in the upper hoop makes a frame play stiffer. If a frame can vary as much as 6g then they can certainly feel different with respect to perceived flex depending on distribution of mass. Check out the YouTube video on how frames are made. There's a ton of handwork involved. Significant variation is certainly possible.
     
  46. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Racquets don't vary by 8 RA points.
     
  47. JGads

    JGads Hall of Fame

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    Those are weird numbers. Much too high. Have you measured other sticks that come close to what they're supposed to be?
     
  48. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    Messages:
    3,600
    Location:
    Baseline
    So, you've not meaured them on an RDC or understand the difference between flex spec and functional flex.

    Thx for clarification.
     
  49. Jocke

    Jocke New User

    Joined:
    May 5, 2011
    Messages:
    97
    I'm not an expert on RDC-machines, but I've had my stringer measured a lot of frames for me. He tells me that there's a screw on the machine that you tighten before the actual measurement. Depending on how much you tighten this screw, the machine vary on the stiffness-rating by a couple of points.
     
  50. ART ART

    ART ART Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2004
    Messages:
    644
    @ TORRES :

    Just check this post from dr325i ...

    58 points RA UNSTRUNG !! So, strung should be around 55 points RA !!

    ...
     

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