Ten Greatest Of Allll Times

Discussion in 'Former Pro Player Talk' started by halbrikj, Jan 30, 2014.

  1. halbrikj

    halbrikj Rookie

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    The irony of sarcasm followed by a wise man quote appears to be lost on you. :confused:
     
  2. Day Tripper

    Day Tripper Semi-Pro

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    There is no doubt that as physical specimens todays players are far superior to those of 20/30/40 years ago. They are bigger/stronger/faster and have superior movement. You are going to be hard pressed to find many who work in my profession (sports science) who will disagree with this view.

    Whether they are more skillful is debatable. Generally I would say that the top players of the 1990's would beat the top players of the 1960's. Similarly I would say that the top players of the 2000's would beat the top players of the 1970's. 25+ years would generally ensure a relatively large gap between the players in regard to their key performance markers - speed strength, etc

    This is of course why there are very few Olympic records from the 1960's 1970's still standing ( the east german drugs aided records withstanding)

    I believe that Rosewall, Laver & Gonzales would really struggle against Federer and Nadal. They just wouldn't be able to compete on a physical level regardless of how skillful they were.
     
  3. Manus Domini

    Manus Domini Hall of Fame

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    Oh, really? I thought he started off back court, so I assumed CC. Wasn't he really good on clay? Did he have to develop that surface?

    I never meant to insult! :( His serve was extremely accurate. But I thought it was really that slow. McEnroe's was really slow, too, right? Which is why he complained about the speed monitors?

    As I said, I got my information too much of Wikipedia and this forum (as well as the few matches and clips I find on YouTube). Unfortunately, my ability to know how great Muscles was is limited :(

    Fair enough :)

    I agree :)
     
  4. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    The turning point being 1964, although I think Laver´s clear dominance was 1965-1970.In 1971 Newcombe and Rosewall were ahead of him.In 1972 Nastase and Smith were ahead of him.
     
  5. Flash O'Groove

    Flash O'Groove Hall of Fame

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    Wikipedia allows to know that Rosewall won more majors than Laver. That's a good clue of how great he was.
     
  6. Manus Domini

    Manus Domini Hall of Fame

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    I've known that for a while, actually. 4 in amatuer, 15 pro slams (the record) and 4 in Open Era.

    But it's one thing seeing the stats, another thing watching him live, at the time.
     
  7. DMP

    DMP Semi-Pro

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    I'd be interested in your views therefore on this

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=482610

    in particular on the speed calculation (btw Laver was 34, Djokovic is 26).

    Also on my posts #8 and #21 in this thread

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=484174

    Also, do you believe that players reflexes now are better than they were in the past, and what evolutionary pressures there might be to make them quicker. Or is it possible that, as we move into increasingly becoming divorced from nature, evolutionary pressures might actually be driving us the other way? And how important are characteristics such as reflexes and anticipation in a sport like tennis?

    FWIW I think players now are probably slightly stronger than they were in the past, because modern rackets reward power more than the past, but the difference is slight and virtually all the differences with the past are technology-driven (including PEDs).
     
  8. lima

    lima New User

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    I don't think that the game has changed so much but players did. They have never been so physically powerfull as now, I mean, not just in tennis, almost in every sport.

    And yes, Roger Federer is the greatest tennis player ever
     
  9. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Irony? Moi?

    Sarcasm? Never.

    Now, on the other hand if you were being ironic or sarcastic, then yes, it was lost.
     
  10. SamprasisGOAT

    SamprasisGOAT Semi-Pro

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    1.pete sampras

    2.rafael nadal

    3.roger federer

    4.bjorn borg

    5.john mcenroe

    6.andre agassi

    7.novak djokovic

    8.ivan Lendl

    9.jimmy connors

    10.stefan edberg

    Just missing out
    Becker and wilander
     
  11. halbrikj

    halbrikj Rookie

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    Try to stay with me, hoodjem. Again, I was referring to your "unimaginably original" post, which you later said was to show the "ubiquity" :? of my topic. Thus, your post was not meant to be taken literally, i.e. not complimentary, thus was... sarcastic. Because sarcasm is generally not a quality associated with wise men, and because your sarcasm was followed by a "wise man" quote, your post is ironic.
     
  12. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    Manus Domini, You are right that Rosewall was very strong on clay very early as he won the 1953 French Championships as well. It's also correct that he improved his serve and volley game only in the course of the years but as early as in the 1954 Wimbledon final the reporter marvelled about Ken's "remarkable Rosewall volleys".

    Rosewall never came to the net as often as f. i. Laver but still is regarded as one of the all-time greatest volleyers alongside Laver, Gonzalez, Newcombe, Roche, McEnroe and Edberg.
     
  13. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, You are growing older...

    Which facts show that Laver clearly dominated in 1970? None.
     
  14. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    lima, Maybe for people of Lima...
     
  15. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Ahh, Sensei, I am most sorry you did not appreciate my use of irony. (It is not one of my most practiced traits.)
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2014
  16. halbrikj

    halbrikj Rookie

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    no worries, mate. ;)
     
  17. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    ^^^Thanks.
     
  18. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    We are crazy.

    Each is different.

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=483009&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=261831&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=457860&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=466554&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=455579&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=446845&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=444207&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=444415&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=439384&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=409940&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=265984&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=303216&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=318548&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=337342&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=262080&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=298502&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=298502&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=240169&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=274950&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=274950&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=262065&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=252830&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=130694&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=257793&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=246744&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=235026&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=152289&highlight=GOAT

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=157158&highlight=GOAT
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2014
  19. Valdez737

    Valdez737 Rookie

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    Super Fail list Djok at 3 yea right nice try kid djok not even top ten
     
  20. CyBorg

    CyBorg Legend

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    Luckily we're talking tennis and not weighlifting. Yes, they stronger. That's about it.
     
  21. BorisBeckerFan

    BorisBeckerFan Professional

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    I like your list because I am biased but would swap in Becker for Edberg because I am biased.
     
  22. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    world series?

    On mere slam results, it´s got to be Rosewall with Newcombe close.
     
  23. SamprasisGOAT

    SamprasisGOAT Semi-Pro

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  24. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    kiki, It's true that Laver dominated Rosewall in pro tournaments but altogether Rosewall was al least as good then than Laver. Bud Collins ranked the Rocket (his nearest friend among the players) only at No.4. I rank Rosewall, Newcombe and Laver tied No.1 for 1970.
     
  25. kiki

    kiki Banned

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    Yes, it is pretty fair.
     
  26. SamprasisGOAT

    SamprasisGOAT Semi-Pro

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    My GOAT list has been changing daily but I'm sticking with this one and I think it takes some beating.

    1. Sampras

    2. Nadal

    3. Borg

    4. Federer

    5. Lendl

    6. Agassi

    7. Djokovic

    8. Connors

    9. McEnroe

    10. Becker

    11. Edberg

    12. Wilander
     
  27. Anti-Fedal

    Anti-Fedal Professional

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    That moronic tennis channel list is still better than your one.
     
  28. SamprasisGOAT

    SamprasisGOAT Semi-Pro

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    I base a lot on peak level and I think Sampras nadal and Borg are above federer. I'm sorry
     
  29. Anti-Fedal

    Anti-Fedal Professional

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    Any list without Laver, Gonzales or Tilden in the top 10 has no credibility.
     
  30. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    Anti-Fedal, You forgot Rosewall. He is often forgotten but I don't know why...
     
  31. SamprasisGOAT

    SamprasisGOAT Semi-Pro

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    Its an open era list
     
  32. Flash O'Groove

    Flash O'Groove Hall of Fame

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    Here is my list based on peak level of play.

    1. Sam Querrey
    2. Samuel Groth
    3. John McEnroe
     
  33. Anti-Fedal

    Anti-Fedal Professional

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    Oh my bad, well either way Agassi has no business being above Connors or Mac.
     
  34. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Ouch! That's rather damning.
     
  35. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne Banned

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    hoodjem, Yes but the true scandal of the Tennis Channel list is the fact that it was compiled by "experts", not by erring posters or fans...
     
  36. Vensai

    Vensai Professional

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    The tennis channel rankings were pretty ridiculous. Emerson over Gonzales? :confused:
     
  37. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Yes, absurdly ridiculous.

    Choosing addition over calculus--Emerson over Gonzales.
     
  38. poofytail

    poofytail Banned

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    Sampras might be the GOAT on grass, fast hard courts, and carpet, but even if he is, he still is nowhere near being the GOAT. Simply put you cant be totally incompetent on a major surface ( clay) and ever be GOAT.
     
  39. Blocker

    Blocker Semi-Pro

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    The Italian Open says hello.
     

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