The Dark Knight Rises stuff (spoilers)

Discussion in 'Odds & Ends' started by TheLambsheadrep, Jul 21, 2012.

  1. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    Just got back from seeing TDKR. Since there is no IMAX theaters, I thought seeing it at a drive in for the first time would be better than a regular theater. Not so sure I made the right decision in regards to feeling "sucked in to" the movie, but it was still an epic film. Before I see it again though (hopefully soon), I wanted to see if people could talk about these topics/answer these questions.

    The IGN review of the movie said there were "a few big leaps of faith required," im assuming to keep the story flowing. What, in anyone who saw TDKR's opinion, were these leaps? For me, all i can think of now was how Batman and Bane, right after the fight in the sewers, ended up in South America and then right away Bane is back in Gotham. Did I miss something/is it just me, or did they travel very far in very little time?

    Did anyone else think everything after the explosion over the bay was rushed? What I remember was the burial, the will, the batman statue, Fox learning there was auto-pilot, Blake finding the bat cave, and alfread living out his hope for bruce (and bruce ending up with kyle, not 100% on board with that for now), and whatever i missed here happening in what felt like 10 minutes. Also, I think the time of us being told that Tate was really Talia to her death was kinda short to be a big impact on the film, but her story was cool and it makes the 3 movies come full circle. And Blake said that the people of Gotham wouldn't know the real hero, but wouldn't people put two and two together with bruce? and didn't Gordon not know bruce was batman, but was at his burial? I can see where maybe bruce had been so secluded that people may not have noticed, but wouldnt that fall under a big leap of faith?

    Anyway, its late, and thats all I can think of off the top of my head. Dont get me wrong, I loved the movie, so when 99% of something is good, the 1% of whats left over sticks out like a sore thumb. And its not that I didnt like the 1%, i just want to understand it better, and seeing TDKR again should help with that. I felt that this was an epic film by definition --> TDKR was more about a bigger picture, where TDK was focused primarily around the Joker (but thats what makes TDK the best of the 3, for now)

    So what was in your 1% ? Let me know, and comment on what I brought up above please. I may make changes to these questions, it is 3am and what im asking makes sense (for now), and ill prob have more later. Im staying on TTW for a bit longer, so I hope to read a few things before I go to bed.
     
    #1
  2. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    Please, only comments regarding the movie itself
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 21, 2012
    #2
  3. TMCW140

    TMCW140 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2007
    Messages:
    1,971
    Saw it last night and was blown away, truly spectacular.
    In regards to your questions...
    -The travel thing- I don't think this is too significant as Bruce is consigned to the pit for quite a while, so Bane's return back to Gotham actually does take time, its just not shown (as is Bruce's full recovery)
    -I loved the ending, seemed to bring everything together in a great way, tying everything together. I see what you're getting at with the Talia thing, as this was thrown in quite late, but as you said, it links it all together, although I felt it devalued Bane slightly as he then becomes an accomplice.
    I think Bruce's 'death' is put down to the riots- easy to lose someone within something like that, so a suitable alibi.
    Gordon doesn't realise who Batman is until he flies off at the end, having made the reference to the 'hero who put a blanket on a young boy's shoulders'- ie. when his parents were killed, so by the funeral, he is aware.
    Hope that clears some of that up, I've got a load of questions, but my mind is still buzzing. Epic, epic film
     
    #3
  4. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    I def need to see it again, it just seemed like bane took bruce to the prison, told him "When Gotham burns, you have my permission to die," then in the next scene of bane (i believe the actual next scene after the prison in the movie) he is back in gotham. im not sure how much time has passed, but if it was the next scene, i can't imagine it was that much. AH! I need to see this movie again.

    Bruce Wayne could have def died in the riots, especially since you saw the scenes of the rich people being raided. I just don't remember if they gave an actual cause of death in the movie or left it open to interpretation like that. And I guess I didn't pick up on what batman was saying about cape on the young boy's shoulders, because I remember the flash back to scene with bruce as a boy and gordon in the police station. chalk it up to the drive in, i really need to see this in theaters.

    The ending was great, just speedy. I would have loved to see alfred and bruce embrace at the end, since alfred was so vividly upset over bruce's "death." even though that wouldnt have been alfred's "fantasy," given what alfred thought happened, i know thats what I wouldve done in alfreds shoes.

    Also, regarding the auto pilot thing - the auto pilot on the bat initially not working, then bruce fixed it in a way that the bat wouldnt show that it had been fixed until Fox discovered it, right? And the movie didn't show batman getting out of the bat (thus utilizing the auto pilot), right? it's just assumed that he did at some point?

    And I understand the purpose of Wayne Enterprise's free green energy machine, but I didn't pick up on why it failed (especially if half of bruce's $ went into it). again, blaming it on the drive in haha.

    And did anyone else think it was kinda weird (but not wrong/bad) that right off the bat John Blake knew bruce was the batman? I understand he approved of the batman (im assuming the main reason he didn't investigate in such a way to turn bruce in), but wouldnt you say he's the only person who isnt very close to bruce that knows? and just to start off blake's character like that seemed kinda brash (or something, idk haha).


    Thanks for the input!
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2012
    #4
  5. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,364
    Location:
    Riverside, CA
    The machine didn't fail, Bruce canned it when he learned that someone could turn it into a neutron bomb. Failure was the excuse he fed everyone else.

    Overall I thought it was a good film, but not a great film like the last one was. My major beefs:

    - Catwoman was not a very well developed character. They never explained why she kept flipping her magical shades up and down (though they were clearly meant to resemble cat ears).

    - Bane went out like a chump, very anticlimactic. I think this was the most disappointing part for me.

    - Tate/Talia's death scene. Cotillard can act better than that, I'm not sure why they let that particular take make it into the final cut. Now that I think about it, the whole final chase seemed kind of silly.

    - Oldman's voice seemed to creep back and forth between Gordon and something out of a Harry Potter film.

    - The passage of time from the beginning of the siege until the last few hours is poorly represented. They could have done a better job of making it feel like 5 months had passed.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 21, 2012
    #5
  6. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    Im assuming that's in the movie? and if so, couldn't that still be considered a failure (in bruce's own mind), since he could not use the free green energy machine even though it existed?


    It was kind of weird, more anticlimactic than Banes imo. like i said, it was nice that she was there to make the story come full circle with batman begins, but her relieving was so late into the movie, id like to know how many minutes in the movie she was actually Talia.


    I agree, I dont think there was a solid pattern for the way time passed when being in and then out of Gotham. and outside of the "people's court," you couldn't see much in the way of a revolution for the betterment of the citizens. I understand that's prob bc the plan was to actually blow up gotham, not change it for the people, but still
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 21, 2012
    #6
  7. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,364
    Location:
    Riverside, CA
    It is in the movie, when they take Tate down to see the device.
     
    #7
  8. diredesire

    diredesire Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    6,723
    please keep thread on topic, this isn't the place for politics/rants&raves style posts.

    (A few edits added for continuity and to prevent unnecessary deletions)
     
    #8
  9. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    Thank you diredesire for removing the other non-movie related posts, and for not deleting the thread entirely :) . have you seen TDKR yet?
     
    #9
  10. kimbahpnam

    kimbahpnam Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2007
    Messages:
    2,675
    +1

    At the end of the chase scene when the truck fell like 50 ft head first and Talia was about dead....out pops Gordon from back of the truck just fine and dandy! LOL people in the audience were laughing just like I was.....how was he just fine in there with that bomb in the back of the truck? Not to mention he's all old and hurt from being shot earlier.

    I didn't like the new plane....it was a little overboard for my taste. Thus the ending was predictable...

    Robin's line at the end was a little corny...

    No backstory to Catwoman....we need that!

    I wish there was a flashback to joker somewhere in the movie.

    verdict.......TDK > TDKR
     
    #10
  11. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    All of this is true. I remember thinking how is Gordon ok? So that was def a big stretch. If anything, the way he looked half dead in the hospital at the beginning of the movie should have been applied to this crash.

    I really liked the bat, until I saw it had that massive horizontal propeller on the bottom. I thought it would be jet powered or something, the propeller made it look clunky and outdated imo. still, i thought that the action chases with the bat made it look good enough.

    Yes the line was cheesy, but didnt Nolan say he didnt want to add any of the actual comic book character renditions of Robin in any of his movies? it was kinda the one last-second way to confirm what everyone was thinking. I loved how he discovered the batcave, and when the platform lifted him up at the very end was awesome (idk if it was the camera angle or what, but it was). I literally just found this http://gotchamovies.com/news/john-blake-character-origins-in-batman so Nolan did keep the real names for the character Robin out of his movies, but this James Blake character seems more like an Easter Egg than a legit reason to make him batman. Anyway, it was good closure for the movie.

    When Selina was talking to Daggett and i think was being set up, I had to go tell an idiot to turn off his car lights (which had been on the screen for at least 10 min), and i say "think" was being set up bc i had to leave. I kinda pieced together Daggett's character purpose right before Bane killed him, but I didn't get the relationship between Daggett and Selina. I think Catwomen was a very "in the moment" character (no past, not a guaranteed future with bruce), and read somewhere else that she could have been subbed out for almost any other female hero/villain character and it wouldn't have mattered. Im not 100% with that statement, but it does make one think... Anyway, the fight scenes with Catwomen were pretty darn good imo, but where was the whip?! haha

    A flash back/tie in to joker would've been cool, or what about something like an audio clip not used in the final cut of TDK? wouldn't that have given you chills? I did like that Scarecrow was brought back, and the way they made him look so ragged was great.

    Yes, I agree that the dark knight was the best of the 3 (bc I love psychological movies, which the Joker made TDK into), but i think one of the best ways to see the trilogy is that the best role of Batman was in “Batman Begins,” the best role of a villain was in “The Dark Knight Rises” and for a complete emotional must-see ending, “The Dark Knight Rises” is it (http://www.thecultjar.com/2012/07/2...s&utm_campaign=the-dark-knight-rises-reviewed)
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2012
    #11
  12. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    #12
  13. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    And to me, the overall movie didn't feel rushed, but at the same time it does seem like some things were left out (even for a 2hr45min movie). In my life experiences, that kinda compares to when someone's writing an essay for an exam sometimes - you're so wrapped up in the essay and it's the best thing you've ever written, then when you get ready to start the conclusion, you see you have 15min left. So the conclusion suffers, and you don't have time to go back and review/correct the small things scattered in the great writing of the body.

    Like I said, i liked the ending, but it did kinda feel hurried to get all the loose ends tied. and then there are the little things we can find right or wring in the body of the movie, all opinion based.

    NEED TO SEE THIS AGAIN SOON!
     
    #13
  14. anhuynh16

    anhuynh16 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2011
    Messages:
    1,930
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Great movie.

    What happened to Bane? His ending should of been important.

    So did Bruce Wayne come back?

    Biggest hint is possibly a another movie with a new Batman and ROBIN?
     
    #14
  15. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    If you are asking and not just saying it disappointingly, Bane got shot by a bat pod missile by Catwomen

    There is debate over if bruce is alive, and even though nolan loves the "is he/is he not" endings, i think he was being straight forward with us this time. bruce wayne is 99%, if not 100%, alive



    Another thing I thought of, how did Bane know bruce was batman right off the bat (no pun intended)? was this mentioned in the movie? and from then on out, selina knows that bruce is batman, correct?
     
    #15
  16. Nostradamus

    Nostradamus G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2011
    Messages:
    13,258
    Location:
    In the future
    Rotten Tomatoes gave this a Poor rating. Is this movie any good ?
     
    #16
  17. diredesire

    diredesire Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    6,723
    Yep, I saw a pre-release showing. I enjoyed it, was surprised by Anne Hathaway's character, but agree with below, could have used a better backstory.

    Supposedly the Joker was never mentioned in the film out of respect for the death of Heath Ledger.

    I thought the plane was fine, but the auto-pilot story was silly. Like you said... you know what's going to happen before it even takes off.
     
    #17
  18. NickC

    NickC Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2007
    Messages:
    1,436
    Location:
    East Coast, USA. Formally Tucson, AZ
    Re-watch the first one, and you'll understand. Bruce was a member of the League of Shadows, and once he decided to leave and fight the league in their quest to fall Gotham, Once Bruce left, Ra's decided to take the protector of his daughter into the League and train him. Bane knew Bruce's identity because Ra's told him.



    Regarding my view of the film, while it was great, I thought it felt rushed and while it would have taken 4+ hours to tell the film's full story, I would have much rather sat through something like that rather than coming out of TDKR with many questions still unanswered. The whole side-story about Daggert and Bruce's wealth just kind of vanished. I was also kind of disappointed that we didn't hear the snap when Bane broke Batman's back and there wasn't an aura around the whole thing, because in the comics it's the focal point of the entire Knightfall storyline, which is what the movie was based off of.

    Further, Bane's voice in the first scene also sucked; having heard the original audio from a scene that featured his voice over a year ago, I was disappointed that the original way Nolan wanted him to sound didn't make it into the final cut, the FX chain (talkbox, EQ, distortion, pitcher, EQ) sounded much wetter in the teaser scene than it did in the final cut. The first time I heard his original voice, it sounded dark, menacing and 200% badass. In the final cut of the film his voice sounded like a cross between a Rastafarian accent and a English accent with a bunch of marbles in his mouth, and then sent to a flanger FX turned to 100% wet and then pitched up a ton. Whoever mixed the film's audio down also did a poor job; whenever Bane spoke the audio of the scene is completely inaudible, and his voice is too overbearing and takes up too much room.
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2012
    #18
  19. grimmbomb21

    grimmbomb21 Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2005
    Messages:
    1,084
    Location:
    CA
    How is there debate over bruce wayne surviving? It shows him at the end.:-?
     
    #19
  20. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    I guess what people are considering is that alfred imagines it since that's what he wanted for bruce. but i dont think so, i think people who truly believe this to have happened are over-thinking it
     
    #20
  21. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    Did anyone notice if Nolan answered the "5 dead, 2 of them cops" debate from TDK in TDKR?
     
    #21
  22. Bhagi Katbamna

    Bhagi Katbamna Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    3,079
    Great movie. Saw it in IMAX. Super picture and sound. Great story.
     
    #22
  23. kimbahpnam

    kimbahpnam Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2007
    Messages:
    2,675
    I was thinking that too, but catwoman was there so it had to be real because I don't think Alfred would've imagined Bruce to be there with her
     
    #23
  24. scotus

    scotus Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    7,709
    Filmmakers can have some freedom with comic book characters but with Bruce Wayne who has probably had more adventures than can be fit in one's lifetime and has appeared in comic books as an old man many times, I doubt anyone can kill him off convincingly.
     
    #24
  25. Imaster

    Imaster New User

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Messages:
    50
    How come the US military, army, navy, president were doing nothing for a period of 4 months is beyond my understanding. Wayne Enterprise could have atleast conveyed to them that the bomb is actually a time bomb.

    The fear of getting the bomb triggered could have kept them quiet for around 3 months 29 days, but wouldn't the military just go in for a swat operation atleast on the last day.

    What no government spies, secret agents, swat teams running inside trying to put a signal blocker (something which batman could think of) a long time ago. If Wayne could get inside gotham after his prison rescue, it is safe to assume others could too...

    Or am I missing something?
     
    #25
  26. frunk

    frunk Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2010
    Messages:
    780
    I absolutely LOVED the movie. our theater did a batman marathon thursday afternoon and culminated with a midnight showing of TDKR. I rewatched it saturday night as well.

    Yes, there were total loopholes in the timing, but you've just gotta overlook them. I feel like this was the perfect ending to the trilogy. People tend to overlook the fact that this was about Ra's al'Ghul and the League of Shadows' plan to destroy Gotham. Batman Returns introduced the League and showed it's first attempt to destroy Gotham - Scarecrow. TDK WAS NOT about the Joker. I repeat, the Joker was a SIDE CHARACTER. TDK was about Harvey Dent and his corruption, but Heath's stellar performance, and, I'd say Nolan's emphasis on the Joker's persona made us remember the Joker more than Harvey/Two-Face.

    TDK returns to the main idea - The League of Shadows' attempts to destroy Gotham, this time through Talia/Bane.

    I LOVED the ending, despite the corniness with Batman leading the bomb off onto the bay, etc. However it tied up all loose ends regarding Christian Bale and the Waynes, but opened up the possibilities of Joseph-G.L. as the new Batman.
     
    #26
  27. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,364
    Location:
    Riverside, CA
    I'm generally inclined to suspend disbelief for the betterment of my movie going experience, my previous gripes notwithstanding. You make a fair point, though. Modern intelligence being what it is, it wouldn't be difficult in the least to track a handful of trucks, perhaps destroying them simultaneously with coordinated drone strikes. Heck, I'm pretty sure that's how our president spends his weekends, but that's neither here nor there.

    I'm still pretty galled by Bane's death. Catwoman destroys an enormous stack of cars with the bat-bike, then casually shoots Bane off of Batman with the same weapon? Nevermind the fact that Batman should have finished him off, that gun/missile would have made him look like the cow from The Watch trailer.
     
    #27
  28. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    I felt that TDK was at least evenly focused between the struggle to keep justice incorruptible (2 face) and how crime could take over again now that the batman changed things (the gangs bringing in the joker). in fact, since batman begins ends with the joker card, i would have to say it leans toward the joker. corrupting the incorruptible led batman to take the fall for dent to preserve the appearance of true justice - that way, he was able to redeem himself for the last movie, and i believe thats what nolan had planned.
     
    #28
  29. jorel

    jorel Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    Messages:
    2,489
    i liked that the ends and the means matter..lying about Harvey was wrong even for the eventual good and i liked how they resolved it in TDKR
     
    #29
  30. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    Ya, even though there was the line from Gordon "it means we're alone" or something like that, in a real world setting (like nolan tries to focus on) there is no way the rest of the US, or maybe even the world, would sit back and say "crap, cant do anything, sorry" for 5 months.

    It wouldve been epic if batman came back and finished off bane, but he did beat the crap out of bane before talia stabbed him, and idk how far he could go with the "no killing" mindset. id say he came pretty close to as far as he would go, and it may have been cheesy to reenact a "i wont kill you, but i dont have to save you" scenario again (yes, another full circle effect, but at the same time, it would have had to be amazing to not have people hating on it).
     
    #30
  31. Fed Kennedy

    Fed Kennedy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2008
    Messages:
    4,797
    Location:
    With Roger
    Did Bane sound like scooby doo doing an adam sandler impression?
     
    #31
  32. TheLambsheadrep

    TheLambsheadrep Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,113
    #32
  33. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2006
    Messages:
    9,186
    Location:
    tennis courts
    its is basically the best movie of all time. yes it has loopholes, but given what it did and the constraints you cant really complain.
     
    #33
  34. sapient007

    sapient007 Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Messages:
    591
    zap. this forum is made for all the complaining.. wha ya talkin about willis.
     
    #34
  35. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2006
    Messages:
    9,186
    Location:
    tennis courts
    lol my bad sappy
     
    #35
  36. Nostradamus

    Nostradamus G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2011
    Messages:
    13,258
    Location:
    In the future
    What rating would you guys give this movie ? if 5 stars is perfect rating.
     
    #36
  37. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2006
    Messages:
    9,186
    Location:
    tennis courts
    5 for me maybe 5.5
     
    #37
  38. HellBunni

    HellBunni Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    291
    there were a few plotholes, or things hard to overlook

    1.) in the beginning we are told Bruce's knee had no cartilage left, and we see him use some improvised enhanced knee brace. But we then see him running and everything fine without the knee brace. Maybe he had an implant? but it was not mentioned or shown. And there didn't seem to be enough time for him to get an implant, till the first time batman reappears.

    2.) regarding travel, Bane traveling is fine, because he has the resources (planes and minions). But how did Bruce travel back to Gotham at the end? He had no money left, he has no allies (not outside at least).

    3.) seemed like climbing out of the prison really only boiled down to that 1 leap. They had ropes and stuff, use them to cross that leap!

    4.) what's so scary about the "new energy" that Bruce and Fox developed?? "The world is not ready for this technology..." It's really no worst than a nuclear power plant (minus the mobility).
     
    #38
  39. spaceman_spiff

    spaceman_spiff Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2005
    Messages:
    1,516
    Location:
    The crappest town in Britain
    Didn't the movie show quite clearly what happened when the government tried to send in special forces soldiers to gather intelligence? They all got blown away.

    That said, I'm not sure why you'd send in special forces rather than less conspicous intelligence agents.
     
    #39
  40. Agent Orynge

    Agent Orynge Professional

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    1,364
    Location:
    Riverside, CA
    If TDK was a 5 (and it was, in my estimation), TDKR is a 3, maybe 3.5.

    We have satellites that can see the fleas on a dog's @$$, what the heck do they need hum-int for in this circumstance? Between drones, satellites, and whatever other technology our government has up it's sleeve (which I bet includes something capable of detecting, oh, I don't know, a decaying neutron bomb...), I'm sure there'd be no trouble tracking and destroying a few trucks.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2012
    #40
  41. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949


    Regarding the passage of time-they show the changing of seasons, stuff on tv, cchange of life in the city, for example marital law, people living in houses, the Wayne enterprises people hiding out , messages being passed, police tuck underground for months, replacing food stuff in empty stores by relief trucks, etc.


    Regarding the ending in Paris, it was more appropriate for this scene than an embrace. If you may recall, when Alfred decides to leave he gives Bruce a speech about when his was missing for 7 years, he hoped Bruce had never returned because he hoped that Bruce was off somwhere with a wife and kids. Alfred recounts that every year while Bruce was missing he took a trip to europe and sat a cafe imaginig that he would see Bruce with a girlfriend or wife at the cafe ant another table and that his and Bruce's eyes would meet and they would never say a word to each other because it would not be necessary but they would glance at each other and Alfred would know that Bruce had a happy life. He said if Bruce returned which he did it woul just lead to tragedy. Guess what? the final film of the movie is the exact scene that Alfred imagined-Alfred is sitting in the cafe overseas and sees Bruce with Selina enjoying each other's company and Alfred and Bruce's eyes meet exactly the way Alfred imagined. A happy ending!!! consistent with Alfred's hope for the child he raised as a surrogate father after Buce's parents were murdered.

    Regarding Blake confronting Bruce as being the Batman. The way this is explained is that Blake suspects Bruce is the Batman based on their similar experiences as orphans. Blake claims to have figured it out because he can emphatize with Bruce and channeling the anger he feels losing his parents, etc. Blake was a good detective. Perhaps he was not sure that Bruce was Batman but guessed and hoped.

    Intersting how Nolan also rebooted the origin of Robin. Never explored on screen but could lead to a series of spinoffs with Robin. It should be noted however, that Nolan said this is his last Batman film.

    Other stuff has been answered previously.
     
    #41
  42. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    Reducing Bane to the status as an accomplice was brillant in the sense of the emergence of Miranda as R-aul's daughter is supposed to be a shock although you can guess that was the case as Nolan provided all sort of clues throughout the movie. You just had to pay attention to all the details! I realized that Miranda was Talia before it was revealed. Interestingly, there was banter on the internet that Miranda Tate was Talia for a long-time before the movie was released.

    Bane also didn't just go out as a chump. Batman had beaten him when Talia comes to Bane;s rescue by giving him more pain medicine. Selina coming to Batman's rescue with shooting him with the cannon from the bat cycle in the face shows just how difficult it was to finally kill him.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2012
    #42
  43. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    There were references to Selina's origins but leaving her as somewhat mysterious was effective since her motivations and actions were somewhat unpredictable. She discussed her origins somewhat with Bruce/Batman and his investigation of her as well as helping the orhan during marita law. BTW, Selina was never referred to as Catwoman in the movie. Regarding flipping the shades, it was sort of like googles.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2012
    #43
  44. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    It wasn't a plane. More like a very advanced hi-tech manueverable souped up helicopter in the vein of airwolf (80s tv show with the late Ernest Borgeneine and Jan Michael Vincent). It was referred to by fox as "the bat" since it flied somewhat like a bat.

    I think it was cool how Bane used Batman's extra "batmobiles" aganist them, although how he found out about them may be somewhat of a mystery. The only explanation I have is that Bane and Talia were from the league of sheadows and R'haul knew Bruce was Batman from the time of when he unsucessfuly tried to destroy Gotham at the end of Batman begins.

    Regarding the backstory to Catwoman see my pther post.

    Thereason why there was no reference to the Joker in the movie was explained in various interviews by Christopher Nolan. In sum, it was out of respect to his deceased good friend Heath Ledger, the actor who played the Joker.

    BTW, Blake had not become Robin in the end of the movie. You can read between the lines. Nolan has said this is the last Batman movie but this leaves open the possibility of Robin spinoffs, etc. The potential origin story is different than the original Robin, whose parents were circus trapeze artists killed while performing.
     
    #44
  45. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    I mostly agree with your assessment of the 3 movies and there are really more ties ins with BB than TDK. BB is the best superheore orgin story ever. Ledger's portrayal of the Joker was brilliant in TDK and can't be matched but Bale did a terrific job in the last installment. Awesome cast.

    It was intersting the way Nolan left it up to us to determine if Blake was going to become Robin and go on his own adventures or become the next Batman.
     
    #45
  46. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    There is supposed to a new reboot in a few years without Nolan. So anythting could happen. Just hope its not another origin story. BB was the best origin story ever!

    see otehr posts for answers to your other questions.
     
    #46
  47. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    I explained my speculation as to how Bane and Miranda/Talia (Ra's Al Ghul's daughter) knew that Bruce was Batman. They were members of the League of Shadows, etc.


    Now thinking about it. Bruce seemd to be alive but what if this relates to Inception and seeing Bruce and Selina in the cafe was merely a dream. LOL!
     
    #47
  48. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    Incorrect. It gave it a very strong rating.

    The Dark Knight Rises (2012)
    tomatometer
    |All Critics|Top Critics87% Average Rating: 8/10
    Reviews Counted: 248
    Fresh: 215 | Rotten: 33
    The Dark Knight Rises is an ambitious, thoughtful, and potent action film that concludes Christopher Nolan's franchise in spectacular fashion, even if it doesn't quite meet the high standard set by its predecessor.
     
    #48
  49. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    As I said in another post, Shades of Inception!!!! LOL!!!
     
    #49
  50. EKnee08

    EKnee08 Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    ...or Robin in a spin-off. Could be either.

    I completely agree with your entire post!!! My take as well.
     
    #50

Share This Page