The "Gutpoly High" Club

Discussion in 'Strings' started by JackB1, Mar 24, 2011.

  1. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Thought I would start a "club" for all us natural gut / poly hybrid users to compare notes.

    I am playing with a Becker London with Head Natural gut mains and am testing copoly crosses now. So far I have tried:

    1) PF Black Venom - very nice. soft and low powered
    2) Volkl V-Pro - also soft and a little more pop

    I think the ideal cross for nat gut mains is a round, smooth poly that will slide easily along the gut. Also the round shape will not wear out the gut too fast.
     
    #1
  2. dadozen

    dadozen Hall of Fame

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    Count me in. Currently using VS Team/ Scorpion 1.22

    Scorpion seems to be a very nice poly to be used as a cross for gut, but I'm still making some tests to improve the durability.

    I already have VS Touch 16( both Black and Natural ) to try, along with Scorpion 1.28.

    Also, I have VS Toch 15( agian, both Black and natural ) and Scorpion 1.33 sets to try. The one that gives me the best durabiltiy will be the chosen one. But if the difference between VS Touch 16/Scorpion 1.28 and VS Touch 15/Scorpion 1.33 isn't too big, I'll stick with VS Touch 16/Scorpion 1.28.
     
    #2
  3. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Welcome!

    Yes, Scorpion is a good mix with gut because it gives it some crispness and is about medium powered I would guess.
     
    #3
  4. rudester

    rudester Professional

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    Maybe i can be a part time member as i am always experimenting with strings. However, currently i am really excited about the performance of Genesis Natural Gut Mains/Luxiilon Savage Lime in crosses. This combo tested side by side in identical racquet strung with full poly has just as much spin as the full poly, more available power and unreal touch and feel.
    I agree that round poly in the crosses is best option. I am more and more convinced that textured strings are just marketing.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2011
    #4
  5. Tennis100

    Tennis100 Rookie

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    Count me in. poor man's Federer setup. gaucho/tourna big hitter blue rough. actually amazing setup, worth a try
     
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  6. olliess

    olliess Semi-Pro

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    I'm fond of the Babolat combo with VS Gut/Pro Hurricane Tour. Despite the shape of the PHT, the VS Gut mains lasted about 6 times longer than Xcel/PHT with very little visible notching until near the end (when the gut frayed and fell apart completely). Noticeably better feel and spin to boot.
     
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  7. Ash_Smith

    Ash_Smith Hall of Fame

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    I've got RAB Gut mains and Genesis Spin-X crosses in one of my Prestige's at the moment - like it a lot, although the tension maintenence of the Spin-X leaves alot to be desired!!!

    Cheers

    Ash
     
    #7
  8. Maui19

    Maui19 Hall of Fame

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    I have tried a couple setups:

    1. Klip Natural Gut 16 w/ WC Silverstring 17
    2. Klip w/MSV Hepta-Twist 17
    3. Pacific Classic Natural Gut 16 w/MSV Hepta-Twist 17

    Number 3 is now my permanent setup. I liked the way the Klip played, but didn't like the way it frayed so much. The Pacific doesn't fray and lasts longer. All three setups played well, but the MSV does produce more spin. I was worried about durability with the shaped Hepta-Twist, but surprisingly it lasted longer than the Silverstring. I think this is due to the fact that it has less contact surface area with the cross strings due to its shape. I believe this is the reason the Hepta-Twist produces such good (low) friction scores in the TW testing.

    There are a lot of great strings out there.
     
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  9. neesun

    neesun New User

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    Read my sig for my normal set up.

    Trying poly/gut for a change, Alu Power @ 53 and Gut @ 56.
     
    #9
  10. dadozen

    dadozen Hall of Fame

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    Maui, I wish I could get some Pacific gut to try, but the webstore I usually buy from doesn't sell it.

    You could try Pacific Gut/WC SS, to check if your theory about MSV's shaped profile really gives a better durability or not. Maybe you're right, and all of us thinking that round polys are better are actually wrong.

    I also found out that gut/poly setups are very tension sensitive.

    The racquets strung at 53/50 and 52/49 last a lot longer than the ones strung at 55/52 and 56/53. I had three racquets strung at the last two tension setups and they didn't last longer than 1h30 each. That was quite frustrating.
     
    #10
  11. Lambsscroll

    Lambsscroll Professional

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    Count me in. I like my Titan NG 16g / Eagnas Poly Nova 17g setup. Once I run out of the reel of poly nova I'll be testing polys at TW. I rather give money to TW than Eagnas.
     
    #11
  12. Lambsscroll

    Lambsscroll Professional

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    I'm definitely going to try your number 3. I have always wanted to try Pacific Classic and the Hepta-Twist sounds good not only for added durability throughout the string-bed but also for some added spin.
     
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  13. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    I just looked at the pic of Hepta Twist and I think u are right. The edges are diagonal and they dont sit perpendicular to the gut mains so they may not "dig in" so much. My only concern is that all 3 reviews I read mentioned that this string loses tension quickly after about 4 hours of play. Did u find this?


    Does anyone have the link for TW's friction testing?
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2011
    #13
  14. dadozen

    dadozen Hall of Fame

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    #14
  15. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Thanks bud! Don't get rid of the Scorpion until u try it! Scorpion is a great string too!
     
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  16. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Can anyone explain the diff's in all the Pacific guts?
    There's Prime, Tough, & Classic.
     
    #16
  17. Maui19

    Maui19 Hall of Fame

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    Hepta loses tension quickly? I thought it held tension well! To be honest, I've researched so many strings that I can't keep them straight any more. :?

    I haven't noticed it losing tension particularly fast. The strings go a little flat before breaking, but that's after 20+ hours of play.
     
    #17
  18. dadozen

    dadozen Hall of Fame

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    Relax Jack, Scorpion is my go to string and I just bought the 1.28 reel because it seems to give a better durability over the 1.22 gauge.;)

    But I really want to try MSV Hepta Twist as well:D
     
    #18
  19. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    then just grab a pack or 2 to try out?

    It also comes in black and red :)
     
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  20. JT_2eighty

    JT_2eighty Hall of Fame

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    #20
  21. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Thanks! Maybe I'll try some Pacific when my current supply of Head gut runs out. I think I am the only one on these boards using Head Natural Gut? I found a store that was clearing them out and I got them for $25 a set, so I bought about 10 sets :) It's a nice gut and not too powerful with a bit of a crisp feel. Seems pretty durable so far too. I have over 15 hours in one set and it only shows a little bit of fraying.
     
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  22. dadozen

    dadozen Hall of Fame

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    Jack, I'll do that, but the problem is if I like Hepta Twist better than Scorpion:D
     
    #22
  23. tennis_nut

    tennis_nut Rookie

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    I'd like to be part of the club! VS Team mains with Hepta Twist 17 crosses in an EXO3 Tour (16 X 18)= ridiculous amounts of spin. I don't feel like the Hepta Twist loses tension fast though. I am breaking the mains at around 12-15 hours before I notice any drop in performance from tension loss. I have never been able to hit the kind of angles I've been hitting with any other string setup.
     
    #23
  24. tennis_nut

    tennis_nut Rookie

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    Oh, I forgot to mention that I get 12-15 hours playing but that is playing about half doubles and half singles. This setup only lasts me about 6-8 sets of singles. I'm thinking of trying the Pacific Tough gut like some have mentioned but am hesitant because VS Team feels oh so good.
     
    #24
  25. neesun

    neesun New User

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    Tried the poly/gut (alu power @53 & VS team @56) today. Played just as well as my normal set up (VS team @55 & Alu Power @52).

    Lets face it, once you try Natty Gut, you won't want to try anything else.
     
    #25
  26. alidisperanza

    alidisperanza Hall of Fame

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    +1 here

    Spider Silk/Silverstring.

    I'm looking to give Klip Legend a shot for the mains and black5edge for the crosses-- what do you guys think
     
    #26
  27. Sardines

    Sardines Rookie

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    I use K90 with RPM 17 mains (35-43lbs) with either VS Team 17 (42-48lbs), Klip Legend 17 (40-45lbs), Performaxx Whisper Touch 17L (40-45lbs) crosses.
    I like the RPM at lower tension but most of the natural gut are too powerful @ 40lbs or less. The Klip Legend is lower power (stiffer) and handles lower tension stringing better. The VS and WT are quite powerful and with my skills (or lack thereof), I find it harder balance power and control. That said, on a heavier day, that power comes in handy.
    I'd put the Performaxx whisper touch in the same power zone as the VS Team. Since I'm using the 17L (1.2mm) WT, it's thinner than the VS Team 17 so it is that bit more powerful and has a bit more bite. Feels great too.
     
    #27
  28. Bahama Scott

    Bahama Scott New User

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    Just noticed this thread after I started another just above.
    "Recently got 2 Babolat 112 Aero's with Babolat VS Natural gut 16 mains and RPM Blast 17 in cross in one and Volkl V-fuse in second. Really love the VS/RPM Blast set up best but....after about 20 hours of heavy spin hitting balls are starting sail long and having a lot of trouble controlling power.

    Kick was great but fading a little. Thinking of switching to the VS gut 16 in crosses at 58 and RPM Blast 17 in Mains at 60.

    Goal is to increase spin and control and lower the power while maintaining the comfort and also get some duration out of it....hoepfully a couple of months (I play 4 times per week at level 3 but pretty heavy spin hitter). My current set up is holding up real well after about 4 weeks (although the V-fuse is starting to show some pretty serious wear.

    Looking for feedback on thoughts regarding spin, control, power and durability." and also what tensions would you suggest. (Just a side note to the setup Im using, I NEVER have to adjust my strings...they always return...may be function of low coefficient of friction.)
     
    #28
  29. Lambsscroll

    Lambsscroll Professional

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    If thats a true 20 hours of awesome playability thats great. For me thats like a month and a half of exceptional playability.
     
    #29
  30. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    Tornado vs. Hyperion

    I too will join the club with these comments:
    1. I first used a gutM/polyX two years ago out of curiousity thanks to a Swiss dude with 16 majors. I tried the Fed setup side by side with the pre-packaged VS/PHT hybrid. Hands down winner was the Fed.
    2. I lucked into discovering Signum Pro Tornado last year and now have almost all my poly players using it, so much so that I hate cutting off of the stock reel for my own racquets. Ergo, my promise to string up my next stick with the Hyperion as X's and let you know if a smooth poly X works out better than the heptagonal textured Tornado. Should have feedback in less than two weeks. I will say I believe the texture helps the gut retain tension a little better as proven in the disappointing tests I've had with RPM and PHT, both of which are marshmellow soft after 10 hours play. ALU Rough and especially Tornado lock in on the tension after the first day and play well into 20-30 hour range. After that, if it ain't broke it's gonna break your arm or your game as it is time to cut it out.
    3. I love Bow Brand gut. So clean and clear vs. all the rest. It now only comes in 20' lengths (sold 2 to a pack in case you go all-gut). US price is $34 so that is a plus too.
    Will string up the Hyperion and report back soon.
     
    #30
  31. Lambsscroll

    Lambsscroll Professional

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    Dude, you got me wanting to try ALU rough as a cross now. ty
     
    #31
  32. Lambsscroll

    Lambsscroll Professional

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    Whats kinda funny to me is cheap gut mains/cheap poly cross works well too. I mean really well. The better gut/poly strings are just an added bonus.
     
    #32
  33. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    I am also curious about nat guy w/ Hyperion crosses. I am a little reluctant to try Hyperion as a cross with gut since it's such a powerful poly, but I gues I can up the tension to 58/56 from my usual 58/54?
     
    #33
  34. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    Less tension variance with Signum Pro Blackline

    Yeah, I used to have 3-4 # difference with ALU Rough and PHT but adjusted a bit with Tornado. Will do same w/Hyperion after it stops raining here in Central Fla. (tomorrow?)
     
    #34
  35. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    Feedback on Tornado vs. Hyperion as Cross-string for Nattie Gut

    I finally got a chance to string up a couple of frames for playtesting Signum Pro's two Blackline polys as part of a nattie gut/poly hybrid.

    First, the background facts: I play Head YTPP, six months of year in FL winters @ 56/54#. When warmer weather comes, I boost tension by one pound each way per 10 degrees above 70F. I had recently strung a frame (3/23) @ 57/55 with Bow Champ. 16 gut/Tornado 17. My Beers ERT 1000 tensometer reading was 64 units with a dynamic tension of 39. Overnight, before play, the stringbed had settled to 61 units with DT of 38.

    I strung a second frame subbing Hyperion 17 for the Tornado 17. I also boosted tension to 59/57, due to warmer weather and a reasonable expectation the smooth poly would not "grab" the gut a la Tornado and retain tension as well.

    I also strung a third frame with another smooth poly I'm considering stocking: Tecnifibre X-Code 17. My experience with the X-Code led me to believe a little extra tension was in order so it was done @ 60/58.

    The next day (4/4), my readings confirmed my hunches. In fact, over the next 3 days (approx. 6 hrs. play per frame) the stringbeds settled in to within 5% of each other. Even the older, lower-tensioned gut/Tornado had high 50's unit readings and mid-30's DT #s. The texture and the extra extrusion process makes the Tornado stabilize better and longer.

    All of the above is data-oriented. Here's the non-scientific scoop: I love the Tornado's feel vs. either of the smooth polys. The extra spin on serves is visually noticeable. The ability to drop a hard-hit service return near the baseline is very common and the sweetspot responsiveness on volley exchanges at net in doubles is astounding. I enjoy all three set-ups but the Tornado is #1 and the Hyperion comes in as 2A with the X-Code a close 2B. Both the "smoothies" are a little more "mellow" on off-center hits and pocket well on touch shots.

    The oddest unscientific reaction I have about the experiment is the "ping" test. Despite a slightly lower current reading on my tensometer, the Tornado bed has a slightly higher pitch when "pinged". I did a double-take on my last readings because of this. While they are within that 5% range of each other, the Tornado bed is reading the lowest (as it should from more play & more time in and lower setting), it actually sounds tighter. Odd, eh?

    I will continue reporting if any express interest in the next weeks. This thread has "deadened" since I offered feedback, so if you're interested, please let me know.
     
    #35
  36. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    I've got B5E/Perfomaxx 17g nat gut in two of my racquets right now. I have not had a chance to hit with it yet, because of the weather. Maybe today?

    Another nice one was Kirschbaum Pro Line II 1.15 and Klip Legend 18g: crisp but gobs of feel, with very good power and lots of spin.




    As long as the poly does not "eat up" the gut, these poly/gut hybrids are winners.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2011
    #36
  37. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Nice write up! Let me know how the Tornado lasts with the gut. Since it's an "edged" poly, you would think it would eat into the gut faster than the Hyperion or XCode. The XCode by the way, it supposed to be a poy/multi in one string, so it's not your typical choice for a cross with gut, but might work just fine. It's probably a little livelier and softer than the other two.
     
    #37
  38. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    hey Jack!

    Great idea for a thread!

    My standard has been VS mains and Hurricane Feel crosses. But since I love tinkering I'm experimenting with some alternatives.

    TONIC / HEPTA 18 @ 49 / 45
    Yesterday and today I tried Tonic + Ball Feel mains and Hepta Twist 17 crosses. Played three hours yesterday and two hours today. Comfort was perfect (a giant pillow cushion), spin just dandy, control ok. Way too overpowered! Even with topspin I had trouble keeping shots in and found myself holding back.

    TONIC / RPM 17 @ 51 / 47
    The racquet is back at the stringers this afternoon to replace the tonic/hepta with tonic/RPM at a slightly higher tension. Hopefully the stiffer RPM will provide a better foundation for the Tonic and reduce the string bed's power significantly. I recently tried VS Black with RPM and found the Black too stiff and too sticky. I believe the Tonic Ball Feel will play very differently with RPM. Will know Monday night! :)
     
    #38
  39. utmiken

    utmiken New User

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    Normally full bed RPM 17 that gets restrung every 4 hours of play.

    But when the TE kicks in I go a few weeks with RPM 17 mains and VS 16 crosses (+4lbs). This setup lasts longer in terms of tension maintenance than the full poly.
     
    #39
  40. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Timo, I can't believe u string your gut mains so low! No wonder it was too powerful. I do 58/54 with my London
     
    #40
  41. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    The PSLGT has a very dense string pattern (18 mains) with 95 sq. in. I tried mid 50s at one point and it was just too stiff for me coming from other racquets with open patterns. Thus I dropped it down. The frame is also very soft and very low powered which mitigates any power derived from the low tension.

    Low 50s/high 40s worked fine with the stiffer VS/Hurricane Feel Hybrid but it was way too low for the very soft Tonic/Hepta Twist. Even so, I've bumped it back to 51 for the tonic mains. Can't wait to try it on Monday!
     
    #41
  42. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    OK...that makes more sense. You think the power came from the Hepta? I have a package of Hepta that I havent tried yet.

    p.s. I am trying to find a game today...any interest in playing around 6 pm? I could head up your way?
     
    #42
  43. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    Hepta17 is down around 214 so 18 must be even softer. Haven't used omething tht soft in the crosses since xcel!

    can't hit this evening. wife expects dinner after her ALTA match! :)
     
    #43
  44. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    So Far So Good

    I don't think durability due to Tornado's shape & texture will be an issue. I've got almost 10 hours on that bed with no "hairing up" yet. If I can get to 15 hours without a sweetspot horsetail, that's gravy! I don't want 20+ hours durability coz I get crazy about cutting gut out.

    Re: X-Code playing properties. I did a full-bed X-Code 17 and may return to it as my "rainsuit". It plays very comfortably without an outright sacrifice of control. It does move around so I might try the 16 to solve that issue. As the cross with nattie, as well as a cross for traditional polys, it's great for the feel but it seems to leak tension more than the Hyperion.
     
    #44
  45. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    What do u mean by "rainsuit"?
     
    #45
  46. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    Wet Weather Gear

    Safe way to play in the drizzles here in FL. Full X-Code is about as close a feel as any alternative to gut/poly. So the next time the liquid sunshine invades my court space, I'll slide my first stick in the bag and pull out the X-Code.
     
    #46
  47. TimothyO

    TimothyO Hall of Fame

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    back in college raincoat had a different connotation.

    :)
     
    #47
  48. JackB1

    JackB1 G.O.A.T.

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    Ahh..gotcha. Here in Atlanta, I have the same issues, especially in the summer.
    I have been using Gamma Proff/Copoly hybrid as my wet weather setup, but maybe I'll try full X-Code if you say it does a good job mimicking nat gut/coply.
    You think it's closer to gut/copoly than multi/copoly?
     
    #48
  49. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    Not a Fan of Multis as Main in Hybrids

    As a spare for the rain, I'm looking for something that holds tension better than multis generally do. I have one backup now with Tornado Mains/Addiction X's that is OK for singles but not forgiving enough for doubles-style quick reaction non-sweetspot exchanges. That stick was done several months ago and the DT read is only 12% off original. If I reversed the setup, I know from previous similar experiences, that number would be closer to 20% after only a month. The X-Code was closer to the polyM/multiX in read but a lot more forgiving when pressed for time at net. It does move a bit due to its softer construction.
     
    #49
  50. franks

    franks New User

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    I have been using the following conbinations:
    Natural Gut with Topspin Cyber Blue 125

    Natural Gut with Weisscannon Scorpion 122
    For both setups the tension maintenance is very good - excellent
     
    #50

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