The Official Lead Tape Placement+Racket Customization Thread

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by xFullCourtTenniSx, Jan 29, 2010.

  1. Orion3

    Orion3 Semi-Pro

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    I've got a couple of tour 100's 16x18 and recently have been playing around with lead.

    Started of with lead at 3 & 9 - 3g total. Result was stability but less access to spin on forehand and kick serve.

    Moved weights to 12 and added another 1.5g. Result was better spin on forehand and kicker and a slight increase in pace.

    Yesterday I added another 1.5g to 12 - now 6g total. Early days but the depth and spin on my forehand was fantastic. However, I had difficulty hitting my kick serve???:shock:

    I also noticed a definate 'slowness' in my ability to get to and hit volleys. When I made contact the shots were excellent but I was struggling against quick passing shots.
     
  2. Nikae

    Nikae Rookie

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    Wawrinka in polarized setup group? I think he only uses lead tape at 3 and 9 positions (according from pictures i found)...unless he has hidden lead tape at 12 position.
     
  3. tennis11

    tennis11 New User

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    if i put lead at 12 would adding a leather grip counter balance fine or should i add lead under grip. if i add lead under the grip should i put it at top of handle or bottom?
    Thanks
     
  4. Fireball

    Fireball New User

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    First of all, thaks for a very good and interesting thread!

    Q: Is the reduced Spin of the depolarized setup only true for ground strokes? Sampras had a lot of spin on his serves, Roddick had one of the best kick serves in his prime and so did Edberg. Is this just exceptions due to their fenomenal talents or might it be that the depolarized setup actually helped them generate more spin on their serves?
     
  5. Power Player

    Power Player Talk Tennis Guru

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    6 grams at 12 is 18 swing weight points. You just increased your swing weight severely which is not recommended. It is better to start again and start with 2-3 grams at 12 and add from there.
     
  6. Orion3

    Orion3 Semi-Pro

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    I played with 6g at 12 for a while, then reduced it to 3g. Preferred the 6g setup so added 1g at a time...ended up at 6g again. Tried 7g but hated it instantly.

    I've now played a fair number of matches and spent a lot of time on the court - I got my kicker back and volleying is much easier now. I may play around again in he summer but for now I'm quite happy.

    Thanks for the advice.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2012
  7. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    I need my racquet to have a lot more stability and plow-through, so I guess I should add weight at 3 and 9 and counterbalance it by adding weight to the bottom of the handle. Can someone tell me how much I should add to the head and handle, currently :I use a 12oz vantage with a 7 pts head light balance and it has a 95 head size. What are the drawbacks besides the extra weight making it less maneuverable?
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2012
  8. esky_lid

    esky_lid New User

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    Hey guys,

    good to see this thread go up. But there is a lot of false information floating around here/misleading. There is, on the other hand, some great information too, and im not taking away from anybody (nor saying im 100% correct).

    I run a customising and stringing business here in sydney australia. Ive been doing numerous batches of frames for guys currently on the tour, top australian ranked players, juniours (ranked and unranked) and ex pros and coaches. i also have a lot of pros frames floating around my workshop. So i get a pretty good idea of what they are using. and more importantly, i see what the top 500 in the world are using, as they are pretty much just as good.

    What i am trying to say here, is that there is no set method to doing any racquet. Every racquet i get is different. a 295g racquet from one brand will be balanced or weight placed differently to a 295g racquet of another brand. (let alone difference in quality control, i regularly get batches of racquets with the lightest and heaviest frames being out by 8 or 9 even up to 10 grams!)
    Basically, customisation is a very, very fine art. And yes it is an art. it is like piecing together a see saw (i think americans call it teeter totter or something). Imagine it being completely out of balance. sure, you can just add weight to one part and it may balance. Problem: Racquets have a swingweight, and unless you are getting a professional to do the work, you have no idea what this could be. So to add to the puzzle, you need to perfectly place the lead in order to not only weigh and balance the frame, but get the swingweight spot on. but what swingweight is perfect for you? and what weight and balance? thats where a good professional (who also has played and coached at the highest level and therefore knows the ins/outs of your game) will be able to solve this puzzle and create your racquets into fine pieces of art. it is very important the customiser can take a look at how you play, or even see video footage, to piece together what they will strive to achieve for your racquets. ive had numerous guys come to me and ask me to do a frame exactly how they want it, only for me to recommend my way (seeing how they play etc - which will be very different to what they want ) and them then telling me how its the best frame they've ever used. (it does help that i have studied biomechanics at university too haha! helps me analyse technique and strength alot!)

    Anyhow I suggest to get your frames done by a professional. When you spend thousands on your tennis every year, shoes, racquets, strings, clothes, balls, tournament entries, coaches, accomodation for tournaments, flights etc, it is worth the slight bit more money to get a frame customised professionally. And that doesnt just mean the big companies.

    Also, ive never seen a pros frame not polarised. Fair enough, some players have their frames with more lead through the centre. But to add to that, there is plenty of lead/silicone still at top and bottom. Including novaks, as i have his frames lying around here too. The lead down the sides is just a bit extra for torsional stability. they are still extremely polarised frames.

    i dont want people to come on here and ask me questions, because there is way too much depth and detail for me to go into on here. And i also tend to keep my information and secrets to the people who actually invest the time and money to coming to see me. i dont have a website, only an email. so nothing to promote on here. so please, enjoy your customising (the most important piece of work done to any racquet!) and please, i insist, see a professional.

    thanks!
     
  9. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    anybody:confused:
     
  10. Fuji

    Fuji Legend

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    Start with 2 grams at both 3 and 9, and then put 4 grams 7 inches from the butt cap. If that doesn't seem to help, add more with the same ratio until you get the desired result. A little lead goes a long way!

    Or you could just attempt to match my MegaStaff 6.1. It has the most plow of any racket I've ever played. (14.0oz and 6 points HL, over and oz between 3 and 9.) ;)

    -Fuji
     
  11. Champs990411

    Champs990411 Rookie

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    Posted in the EXO thread but didn't get help.

    Question: My three EXO Tours are currently different weights: 11.3 oz, 11.3 oz, and 11.1 oz. I managed to hackily match one in weight and balance to my heaviest one by just guessing at placing 2g at 12:00. The third stick is where I have a question. A friendly guy at a racket store gave me the proper amount (6.75g) of lead to match the static weight to the first two. Since all three frames are equally balanced, he said to just add the 6.75g to the two upper insides of the throat, the neutral position, and I would be good to go. Should I do that?

    Or should I add some at 12:00 (like I did with the frame I matched myself) and the corresponding proper amount at a counterbalance point, say, under the grip? If so, where? And what's the ratio to retain the racket's current balance?

    THANKS!
     
  12. Orion3

    Orion3 Semi-Pro

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    Suggest you find the correct balance point before adding the lead.

    A little lead at 12 can make more of a difference to the balance than slightly late at 3&9.

    Putting it around the throat may well make it weigh the same, but may not make it balance the same. It could even be that you need to add it closer to the handle.

    Play around with it before deciding exactly where it needs to be situated.
     
  13. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    Oh I just saw this so thanks.

    I asked my stringer to do it, and he said it's better to go with 3 grams at both 2 and 10. He said I will get stability, as well as more power and plow through, makes sense. He also said it will raise the sweetspot, so it will be very effective on serves. He said it is better not to counter balance it because it will be too heavy. So with lead tape 346g.

    I can't believe you have a 14.0z racquet, how do you even swing that without being exhausted.

    Anyways, if you are ever in the Mississauga/Toronto area we should play a match but "The winner will be..........................me!"
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2012
  14. netguy

    netguy Semi-Pro

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    I agree, adding lead tape at 2 & 10 gives more stability than at 3 & 9. It also raises the sweet spot, and gives more power and plow through.
     
  15. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    nice post. thanks. too bad you can't field questions but i understand. I wish i knew where to take my sticks to a pro customizer that knows their stuff like this.
     
  16. ZeroSkid

    ZeroSkid Banned

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    ah 2 and 10 is terrible, 3 and 9 is so much better
     
  17. ChicagoJack

    ChicagoJack Hall of Fame

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    Amen my brother. Quoted for truth.

    Only thing I can add to that is, if you attempt to do it yourself, understand it's one thing to customize just ONE frame and like it. I think THAT is entirely possible for us amateur tweak freaks as long as he or she is willing to put in the time and effort. But it's a whole nuther can o' worms to customize 3 or 4 frames and have them match each other perfectly in terms of SW, Balance, and Mass when you are done. If you are feeling up to the task, understand the bare bones stock weights are often way off to begin with, so you have to solve that puzzle first. Then do the handle mods next then the lead in the hoop last. That is what Nate Ferguson at Priority 1 means when he says that you need to get the weight in the handle right first, or nothing else will work. (See video, at 43 seconds)

    Nate Ferguson about customizing tennis rackets
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmkbmYqhUzY&feature=related

    More Nate
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSon-gazvKo&feature=related

    -Jack
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2012
  18. Fuji

    Fuji Legend

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    Hey bud! No worries at all!

    14.0oz isn't a lot for a serve and volley player. I normally used it for doubles before I "retired" it from the throat getting some strain cracks.

    I will definitely let you know if I'm ever in the area! ;)

    -Fuji
     
  19. vChRiSv

    vChRiSv New User

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    Hi all,

    I want to add mass to my racquet in order to increase it's stability and power, but I want to make sure that the effects on the swingweight are minimized and that the balanced is unchanged.

    From what I've been reading in this thread, it seems like I should add lead tape at 3 and 9, and then wrap tape around the handle 7 inches from the butt cap. Would this give me my desired effect? Does anyone know what kind of ratio this should be done at (i.e. how many grams to add at 3/9 : how many grams to add 7 inches from the buttcup)?

    My racquet is a Yonex RDIS 300 Midplus...
    Length: 27 inches
    Strung Weight: 315g
    Balance: 4pts Head Light
    Swingweight: 319
    Stiffness: 62
     
  20. xeros

    xeros Rookie

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    I research more plowtrought on my wilson blx pro open 2012.
    Do you think put a leather grip and 3 grams of lead et 3 And 9 it's à good idea?
     
  21. hewittmetfan

    hewittmetfan New User

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    Hey guys I need a little help with a customization issue. I just switched to the Head IG Speed 18x20 racquet and love the way it plays. HOWEVER, it seems to have a lack of stability, probably because of its swingweight. So I was wondering if I should add lead tape to the 3 and 9 o'clock parts of the racquet or do you guys suggest another spot. I really prefer not to make the racquet weigh over 12 oz. I am turning 16 in 10 days and I am ranked top 200 in the nation on Tennis Recruiting. I need some help you guys. Thanks!!! (y)
     
  22. Larrysümmers

    Larrysümmers Hall of Fame

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    idk how much the racket already weighs. id either say the 3 and 9 or a little at the 10 and 2
     
  23. Remioli

    Remioli New User

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    If I buy a racquet at 4 3/8 grip size, and add over grips to it until it's 4 5/8 of 1/2 will it effect the weight of the racquet much? Or anything else?
     
  24. Larrysümmers

    Larrysümmers Hall of Fame

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    yeah. it will be more HL. you could add 4 grams at the 3+9 and you'll be golden
     
  25. kgeonz

    kgeonz New User

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    So a polarized racket is usually head-heavy unless the player wants a HL balance right?
     
  26. LeithaL

    LeithaL New User

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    how would you guys recommend polarizing an aero pro drive gt? what would be a good depolarizing setup? what string tension is good for a polarized set up and for a depolarized set up? Thanks!
     
  27. Larrysümmers

    Larrysümmers Hall of Fame

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    4 grams total at the 3 and 9 plus 4g right above the handle is a pretty solid setup. for depoloar

    try 4 grams at the 12 and 2 in the butt, thats a decent polarized setup
     
  28. LeithaL

    LeithaL New User

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    thanks! i'll try that tomorrow. quick question. I'm assuming that i would want to retain the racquets original balance of 4 points headlight, or do i want to change that? if i want to keep it, i'm assuming that if i put lead tape at 3 or 9, or if i put it on 12, should i put the same amount in grams at the handle? Why is it that for the polarized setup that there is more weight at 12 than at the handle, which is the same for the nadal setup which is 9.5 at 12 and 2.5 at the bottom? Does an overgrip tamper with the weigh at the bottom whatsoever? Also 8 grams doesn't seem that substantial for such a light racquet, should i put more? Thanks for any responses
     
  29. TennisCJC

    TennisCJC Legend

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    You could try the Djoko setup and put huge strips of lead down the sides center just below 3/9 o'clock and huge strips under the bumper at 1:30 and 10:30. And, he probably loads the handle to counter balance.

    Try adding 1.5 g at 3 o'c 1.5 g at 9 o'c and 2 g at noon. Counter with 2 g under the replacement grip wrapped around the handle pallet just above where the plastic butt cap ends (about 1.5 inches from butt end) and 3 grams wrapped around the handle pallet 7" from the butt end.

    Assuming 1/4" wide lead tape, then one 4" strip of lead tape weighs approx 1 gram. to apply 1.5 g at 3 o'c, place two 3" strips center on R side of head with 1 strip on each side on string grommet. Put the strips on the interior side of the frame and not on the outside.

    This will add approximately 10.5 g of swing weight to the frame. With a vibration dampener, your frame should be around 330 g swing weight which is good. And, I don't want to hear how this is too much weight for you and it will slow down your swing speed because that's a bunch of BS. If you are 16 yo top 200 junior you can handle this easily. I play 335 g SW and I'm 55 yo average size male. My wife plays 330 g swing weight and she is 54 yo small woman.

    If you like this and want more power and stability, increase all lenghts by 1" to add about 1.5 g to the head (6 total strips * 1" = 6" total = 1.5 g) and this will increase SW about 3 g to 333. Offset handle weight proportionately too - add 1 gram to near butt location and .5 gram to 7" location.
     
  30. Larrysümmers

    Larrysümmers Hall of Fame

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    well the whole point of the APD is a racket that is light enough to whip with ease, but a sw high enough to give it some punch. you can add as much wt as you want really.
    and dont worry about the og wt.
     
  31. TennisManiac

    TennisManiac Semi-Pro

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    Very interesting thread. Lots of knowledge in this one.
     
  32. TennisManiac

    TennisManiac Semi-Pro

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    I have a Head Youtek IG Prestige Pro and would like some opinions on how to polarize and depolarize this particular frame. I'm looking for more power and stability from this frame to suit my game. I have an all court game, a one handed backhand and can serve flat or kickers. I feel I need more pop on my serve, more depth and power on my groundstrokes and more mass and plow to get through my one handed backhand in order to get through heavy balls. I'm a 4.5 level player trying to maximize my potential. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
     
  33. Larrysümmers

    Larrysümmers Hall of Fame

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    try adding some at the 10 and 2 and some either in the buttcap or handle. or above the grip. the best advise is to add a little at a time and just experiment.
     
  34. TennisManiac

    TennisManiac Semi-Pro

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    Thanks Larry. I was out today playing before I had a chance to read your advise about 10 and 2. I played two sets with 3 grams at 12 and 1.5 grams in the butt. I found that it gave me a bit more pop on my serve and really helped me get through my backhand while allowing more spin from both sides. It felt a lot better then it did in stock form. But I still feel like I need a bit more power and stability. Do you think I could get away with adding some lead to 3 and 9 and keeping the 3 grams at 12? And if so, would you reccomend adding a bit more to the butt as well? I bought a really nice scale the other day and weighed the racket as I have it set up now and it weighs 325 grams.
     
  35. Larrysümmers

    Larrysümmers Hall of Fame

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    hi. i think that a couple of grams wouldnt hurt. i wouldnt put extra down low to counterbalance right away. but if you feel like you need some more tail weight then you could put some on.
     
  36. TennisManiac

    TennisManiac Semi-Pro

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    I tried adding 1 gram each at 3 and 9 along with the 3 grams at 12 and 1.5grams in the butt and it felt horrendous. I like the polarized version way better then combining the two. I'll try depolarizing it a bit at 10 and 2, then again at 3 and 9 and see how those set ups feel.
     
  37. mixedmedia

    mixedmedia Professional

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    Hey, everyone, I haven't read through this entire thread but have been looking through a lot of lead tape info. I noticed the question on this page about the Head Youtek IG Speed 18x20 because this is my current racquet. So far it is all stock plus a Super Grap overgrip. I have leather replacement grips on the way (over which will be wrapped my choice overgrip), and I intend to follow the instructions found here: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=83285, with a target static weight of 375 g. I hit pretty flat sometimes but can work the point with spin. I am very aggressive.

    Comments/concerns?

    Thanks so much!
     
  38. mixedmedia

    mixedmedia Professional

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    TennisCJC, is that really the Djoko setup? (And yes, I know my racquet isn't the actual one ND uses.) Am I overdoing it by following the instructions in the link?
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2012
  39. mixedmedia

    mixedmedia Professional

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    Maybe my target static weight should be closer to 360 g?
     
  40. JohnB

    JohnB Rookie

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    Have you tried those various set-ups? I have also tried those set-ups (on a different racket) but it would be interesting to know if there are similar findings.
     
  41. TennisCJC

    TennisCJC Legend

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    I don't have exact specs for Djoko setup but someone on these boards has a thread about a Djoko racket they acquired with exact specs.

    Here's the thread: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=389215&highlight=Djokovic

    But, he does put long lead strips down the sides of the head and more lead under the bumper around 1:30 and 10:30. I don't think he puts any right at noon. Search for the Djoko racket thread and I think they have more exact specs.

    I have seen pictures of Djoko racket on these boards and on TV where you can see the long strips of lead down the sides. It is likely a monster SW.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  42. NickJ

    NickJ Rookie

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    Where do I need to add lead tape to on my wife to make her less aggressive?
     
  43. mixedmedia

    mixedmedia Professional

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    Thanks for the replies!

    And yup, I knew I had seen a thread with the specs before, and I found it again. Bookmarked it this time! But I don't think I'll pursue matching his racquet and specs atm--maybe just for fun later. I think I'll use the link I posted earlier. As it turns out, with my strings, dampener, lead at 3/9, leather grip, and Super Grap overgrip, the racquet is right near 360 g w/o adding lead under the grip.

    EDIT: Just checked TennisCJC's link and that's the specs link I'm referring to as well.
     
  44. saoarvoredo

    saoarvoredo New User

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    Question 1.

    How is the reference groundstroke for SW2 performed, the maximum power that you can control inside the baseline with the maximum amount of spin you can generate?

    And if so,

    question 2.

    If, as an intermediate/rec player, the gap between your maximum power potential and your ability to perform the right tecnique and generate enough spin consistently on your groundstrokes is disproportionately, should you avoid this aspect of customizing racquets completely?
     
  45. JohnB

    JohnB Rookie

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    SW2 isn't about maximizing power. If you take a stock racket and you increase SW, with most stock rackets you'll notice an increase in power. If you keep increasing SW you'll hit longer and longer. Just before you start hitting too long you're at SW1. If you keep increasing SW and thus hit longer and longer eventually you're reach your max. power for your groundstrokes. If you then still keep increasing SW your shots will be going less and less deep (still out). At some point, when the SW is high enough, there comes moment when they land in again. That's SW2.

    I think it's important if you want to try this, you shoud do this with a technically sound/controlled stroke. Because you can hit the fence at SW1, but also at SW2.

    My personal advice would be to play with a swingweight that you can comfortably control. A swingweight not to high and not too low. Than adjust the powerlevel with stringtype/set-up in combination with the powerlevel of your racket.
     
  46. dman72

    dman72 Hall of Fame

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    IMO, yes you should avoid it. It seems great at first but unless you hit everyday for hours and are very physically fit, your perfomance will diminish drastically as you fatigue. Take it from someone who tried it.

    As I believe I stated before in this thread, the main benefit of 360+ swingweights is the ability to get back 120MPH+ serves and the ability to defeat huge pace and spin. Against most rec players, you rarely if ever face those things, so now you have put yourself at a disadvantage in your reaction time and defense.

    In addition to wearing yourself down more quickly, you are customizing your racquet to combat things you will rarely if ever see.

    I like "high" swingweights (330-345) personally, but once I start getting into "pro" swingweights my game falls off drastically.
     
  47. Shred

    Shred New User

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    I have two Head IG Radical Pros. One weighs 11.5 oz strung and has a swingweight of 321 measured on a Babolat RDC machine. The other weighs 12 oz strung with a SW of 336! Two different racquets really. ****ty QC from Head. Anyway, I got the app Swing Tool for my IPad for .99 cents to see how close it would measure the swingweight compared to the $4000 Babolat machine.

    I measured the weights, hang point, balance point and swingpoint and got swingweights within 2 points of the Babolat machine. Two points is pretty close, way better than going blind if you don't have access to a Babolat RDC machine. You must make as accurate measurements as you can using the Swing Tool.
     
  48. TennisManiac

    TennisManiac Semi-Pro

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    2 grams each at 3 and 9 and 2 grams in the butt felt very stable at the net and gave me a little more pop on my serve. But feels very clumsy and less manuverable. And my groundstrokes were hard to keep in.

    The same set up at 10 and 2 felt a little better.

    4 grams at 12 and 2 in the butt plays perfect for me. The racket still feels manuverable. I get a ton of spin on all my strokes. All my groudstrokes are staying in now. There's plenty of plow to get through heavy balls on my backhand. And serving is amazing. This will be my new setup.
     
  49. LeithaL

    LeithaL New User

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    best way to customize an aeropro drive gt?
     
  50. Bowtiesarecool

    Bowtiesarecool Rookie

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    Location:
    New Smyrna Beach, FL
    I decided to plug Travlerajm's math into my PS85. Here's what I came up with: With a 4 3/8 stock leather grip, 349g, 6.5 points hl, 332 sw... MgR/I = 21.1, and based on the calculation for final weight and balance point from this post: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=788364&postcount=1 the balance point is exactly where it's supposed to be for a depolarized setup.

    I wonder, if Travlerajm's observations are accurate, could this be why Wilson had such success with the PS85. Thoughts?
     

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