The Pacific 10 Alliance!

Discussion in 'College Tennis Talk' started by db379, Jan 21, 2011.

  1. mikej

    mikej Hall of Fame

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    clark and I have already given you an example...#9 frank carleton, wanted to join his family legacy at duke tennis, was nixed, went to WFU...i'm not asking for a testimonial from a player - because obviously i don't have one from frank - i just want that one anecdote from you

    it's as simple as this: if you're constantly going to bring this overwhelming hardship of getting top tennis players past stanford admissions into play whenever recruiting is talked about, you should at least be aware on one instance in which this has happened in recent years

    i'll admit i'm in med school not law school, but i watch a little law & order and know a bit about burden of proof

    anyway, i'm thinking this argument is pretty much at its stalemate point again, so i'll leave it alone til the next time it's brought up, but i'd love to hear your anecdote from stanford tennis - again, I don't need it in writing from that top player that stanford wouldn't take him when he wanted to go there - I trust there are enough knowledgeable tennis fans on this board that will call you out if you throw something out that's not true

    have a nice day my buddy
     
  2. db379

    db379 Hall of Fame

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    What proof do you have of what you are claiming about Frank Carleton? Someone told you...?
     
  3. mikej

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    lol, i properly addressed this issue in my last post

    but yes,
    1) i was there when this recruitment was going on and knew a good deal about things going on in the tennis program
    2) his two older siblings went there as well, Jackie and Reid - stands to reason his family might have liked the program and he tried to go there, eh?
    3) the fact that uva fans know the same story is nice as well - despite what you may think, clark and I don't have weekly meetings to come up with anti-db arguments

    like i said, i just want your story, not an affidavit

    if you know of no such story, you should stop making the claims that you do regarding stanford tennis admissions - simple. as. that.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  4. matchplay

    matchplay Rookie

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    ah, back on this subject......I would assume that Stanford - and Duke for that matter, has had several players ultimately not attend (not because the could not get in, perhaps), but that they felt they could/would not handle the workload both on & off the court, in the classroom. As mentioned before, 99 out of 100 of these kids will never make a dime on tour (after expenses)...that includes farah, klahn, Davverman, you name them. At the end of the day, if they have any personality and work ethic, they will secure whatever life ambitions (other than tennis) they have and at at the highest level. Give these kids a coach that coaches for life & they will succeed from either of these outstanding institutions.
     
  5. tennisnoob3

    tennisnoob3 Professional

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    did you even read what i wrote? you cant hold a large public school to a small private schools standards. do you understand the term "worlds apart"??? i'm not saying there isnt a difference between academics, you're just overestimating the gap.
     
  6. ClarkC

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    First, there is the fact that he de-committed from Duke and then committed to Wake Forest. For some evidence of that, see the recruiting rankings for his senior year in high school. You will notice that Frank (a.k.a. Tripper) Carleton's name is in italics in the Wake Forest listing there, indicating that he is a new commitment since the winter rankings came out. The winter rankings reflect the November commitments, while the late spring rankings reflect the spring commitments as well as changes in previous commitments.

    Look below the top 25 listing and see the list of schools that dropped out of the top 25 from the winter rankings to the spring rankings. Notice that Duke was #17 in the winter rankings but dropped out of the top 25 in the spring. That is because of the change in commitment from Tripper Carleton. In fact, I just saw the link to the old winter rankings and you can see that Duke was #17 on the basis of a single commitment, Frank Carleton.

    As late as March 20, Carleton was still a Duke commit. However, that is the time of year when you get an answer on your college applications. The spring signing period is in early April, so the change in commitment was pretty sudden. Why? Well, insiders at several schools have said that it was because Tripper did not get admitted into Duke. There is no official announcement of such things, of course, but the explanation fits better than any other. You can believe it or not.
     
  7. mikej

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    thanks clark, good info as always. i know the story to be true according to duke players, but visual evidence was going to be hard to come by.

    i'll be waiting for the stanford equivalent, db. you can be sure i'll bring it back up any time you try to say stanford's recruiting position is so different from all the other top tennis programs.

    and i'd settle for a story less substantiated than that one; just one recent top 10 recruit that gives a name and face to all this hot air you blow around about rigorous tennis admissions over there in palo alto.

    i won't hold my breath waiting for your response.
     
  8. db379

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    With all due respect, your little detective work doesn't prove anything. 1) Carleton didn't get admitted to Duke? So what? Do you even know the reason why? There could be hundreds of reasons. 2) You base all your story on one case, which may or may not be accurate. I wouldn't bet on it.

    According to insiders at several schools...? Who are these insiders? Honestly, this doesn't sound very solid. You should cite your sources if you want to have some credibility.

    Sorry that I cannot contribute to your college tennis gossip, but I don't have any insiders info to share unfortunately. As mentioned before, I don't work for Stanford admissions, and what I know about their athletes admissions is through regular channels. The article I referred to before about admissions says it pretty clearly, with lots of testimonials from actual coaches and admission officers, with their names and dates. Do you think this is ********? If you prefer to listen to some "insiders" talk instead, which may or may not be accurate, then all power to you. And peace my friends. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2011
  9. mikej

    mikej Hall of Fame

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    Db my good friend,
    Would you mind terribly if I shared with you a story that has been passed down in my family for many generations? It doesn't have anything to do with tennis or the current discussion, but I just feel that others should know the tale. Here goes:

    Many years ago there was a very vocal government official, let's call him Genghis Klahn, who was in charge of press relations for a nation that was once a world superpower. While the nation's dominant history was rivaled by few, its influence had begun to decline in recent years, and Genghis was forced to face increasingly difficult questions as to the reason for this. One day, he decided to try to divert attention, saying "we may not be one of the great nations anymore, but we have ducks - and no other country in the world has these creatures." Some citizens of other countries that valued research more highly said to themselves, "wait - we have this animal that looks very much like a duck, quacks very much like a duck, and those most in the know tell us it is a duck - i'm pretty sure we have a duck too." When Genghis heard of this country's claim and its mounting evidence, he was understandably furious. "That is no duck," he said, "it could be any of a hundred animals - a zebra, an owl, hell even a dragon." People around the world thought Genghis seemed a little nuts at this claim, but he had no alternative - his personality could not allow him to admit that another country might also have a duck.

    The story did not end here, however, as some individuals began to question whether Genghis's homeland itself even had a duck. "Well," Genghis said, "I have never seen much evidence to suggest that we have one, but read this!" He presented a press release with many heart-warming quotes from fellow government officials talking about all the wonderful ducks they had, and how their ducks were unique and amazing creatures that no other country could fathom.

    To this day, no one that has visited Genghis's homeland has ever seen a duck, but rumors abound, and in every subway station many copies of this press release are plastered to the walls. Genghis sleeps better at night knowing that he has not admitted the veracity of the other country's claim to a duck, and that he inundates all tourists with his flowery press release.

    The End

    Anyway, back to the topic at hand. To summarize your reply, you don't know of any actual top tennis recruits that have not ended up at Stanford for academic reasons. As I suspected. Thank you for playing. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2011
  10. db379

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    :) right... it sounds like you're completely lost man. You've been trying to prove something that doesn't make any sense from the beginning, and now that you've realized it doesn't make any sense, you're trying to not lose face by claiming that you have won your argument. Sad.
     
  11. mikej

    mikej Hall of Fame

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    haha, well did you at least enjoy my story? i can only hope...
     
  12. Fedace

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    Was Bradley's first name Genghis in his last lifetime ??
     
  13. matchplay

    matchplay Rookie

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    i liked it
     
  14. socaltennnis

    socaltennnis Rookie

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    Seriously, this topic has been dragged out. Every school has trouble with recruiting, whether it be because of high academics or for other reasons like that the school is in the middle of Waco, TX. I don't care much about these reasons nor will the other schools care either. If Stanford wins the NCAA's on top of having a successful academic team, then all the more power to them. However, when they don't succeed on the courts because Alex Clayton is too busy studying instead of playing tennis, you do not get any sympathy from me. Nor are Stanford's wins any more impressive because they have such a hard study schedule.

    At the end of the day, winners win and losers lose. Stanford looks shaky in multiple positions as stated various times by pro-Stanford and pro-Others posters. Virginia is not shaky. I don't like either team, but I am awaiting their results at the Indoors. However, I am not going to lie, if these two teams went head to head today, most of us have a pretty good idea of what will happen. You can interpret that however you want :)
     
  15. db379

    db379 Hall of Fame

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    No! This is too much! I shall not accept that this thread be hijacked anymore by some ducks, I mean dukes, or whatever. I shall remind everyone that this thread is exclusively for West Coast and Pac 10 TTers. Enough said. :)


    Let's get back on track here. Stanford against Cal tomorrow in Berkeley.
    Stanford is 5-0, and will get their top 2 players for the match. Cal lost to a pretty good team of Texas Tech recently, the same team that the Cards beat a week ago. Will Cal take advantage of the fact that they play at home, or will they find the proximity to Stanford a bit too close for comfort?

    Your predictions?
     
  16. ClarkC

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    I think Stanford beats Cal comfortably.
     
  17. db379

    db379 Hall of Fame

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  18. Fedace

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  19. db379

    db379 Hall of Fame

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    ok, thanks for confirming that.
     
  20. db379

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    oh, and btw, who do you think will show on the line up today? Can Kandath still pretend to a spot on the team? I mean, I'd like the guy to step up and show he's a solid 5 or 6, but this is not happening... Kehrer had a pretty good win at 5 last time, and Ball has potential. Will Whit give them a chance against a top 20 team?
     
  21. Fedace

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    I dont' see that happening. Kandath beats up on Kehrer in practice all the time, i think. Jamin Ball has promise but he doesn't hit the ball very hard. and coach likes Kandath and expects him to improve as the season goes on.
     
  22. SoCal10s

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    sounds like a good summation .. I want to see when Stanford takes on UCLA this year.. I think UCLA will take them down.. but I think Stanford will win against USC..
     
  23. ClarkC

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    I predict the exact opposite: USC >> Stanford >> UCLA. Should be interesting.
     
  24. SoCal10s

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    it's about the player's match ups.. and most likely will come down to doubles .. USC doubles are not looking too good..
     
  25. db379

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    UCLA doubles don't look good either. Stanford so far has had the best results in doubles. In singles, UCLA will be interesting, but I think they have too many inexperienced players this year. They had two difficult wins against UC Irvine and Baylor.

    I think that Klahn>Kosak , Thacher>Inbar, Clayton>Taba, Hirshman>Seguso. Thomson>Lin, and whoever>Kandath!

    Result should be a win for Stanford.
     
  26. db379

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    Stanford in action against Cal right now!

    Live feed available for all as well.
     
  27. db379

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    Clayton/Kelly on court 2. Who's this Kelly guy? He looks terrible out there, should have stayed in the library today... He missed several really easy shots in only the first two games.
     
  28. mikej

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    he even has a loss to yours truly tarnishing his junior player record back in his mid-atlantic days, so clearly he's rubbish, haha

    i see the live feed page, but where can I find the match summary live stats rather than watching court by court???
     
  29. db379

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    great job Kandath! Double fault on break point when they were ahead and just one game away...
     
  30. db379

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    all the action on court 2. 1 double for each team so far. 6-6 in the deciding double.
     
  31. db379

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    :shock: this one was close, but the Cards finally win the doubles point! Go Cards.
     
  32. Fedace

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    Stupid Cal has Videofeed but NO scoreboard.......how dumb is that. ?
     
  33. socaltennnis

    socaltennnis Rookie

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    Pedro Zerbini is so clutch. he won 7-5, 7-5. What is he? like 3-0 vs Klahn in dual matches in the past 2 seasons. lol. bad performance by konigsfeldt who has beaten clayton before. and WHAT? hirshman falls but Kandath on the verge of clinching a win for Stanford? who woulda thought.



    EDIT: Nvm. Kandath missed the clinch by a few minutes to Thacher. Stanford wins 5-2, i think. Hard to remember cause the no scoreboard issue. have to continuously click thru all the courts to see the score.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2011
  34. db379

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    Stanford beats Cal 5-2. Amazingly, the two losses came from our two best performers....
     
  35. db379

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    yeah I know. Hirshman losing in straight sets? I can't even remember the last time Greg lost a match... To be fair his opponent played great. And as for Klahn, yes, I remember last year when Klahn already lost to Zerbini. Even the best have a few players against which they have trouble winning.
     
  36. mikej

    mikej Hall of Fame

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    Good away win by Stanford, and nice job closing out those last two in straight sets. So I wasn't totally off in suggesting this as a 'potential loss' as I was previously ridiculed for. Considering the doubles point was one good return away from being Cal's, this could have easily been a 4-3 result with a lot more pressure on Thacher and Kandath to close those out.

    Sometimes my predictions have a little to do with reason, just a little, and aren't totally based in my proposed anti-Stanford-psychosis.
     
  37. Fedace

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    Told you Kandath will come thru when you need him to. Klahn looked really tired. Probably spent alot of time this week with practice and all.
     
  38. Jakes On A Plane

    Jakes On A Plane Semi-Pro

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    The reigning NCAA singles champion lost today because he was tired from the team practices this week?.......yikes
     
  39. Fedace

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    Not team practices. but Individual workouts and Practices in preparation for his big singles and doubles matches at SAP open.
     
  40. Fedace

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    Anyway, Congrats to Bradley Klahn this week on good showing at SAP open. Nothing to be ashamed of regarding the loss in doubles to Falla and Mellise. They have reached the Final of SAP open by beating the #1 seed in the semifinals. so They are Pretty Good doubles team as i have stated in the past.
     
  41. db379

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    Good work at #2,3 and 4 for Stanford. Even when our top player is not performing well, we can still beat a top 20 team comfortably. :) And we don't have to make excuses for our players when they lose.... Wonder if this east coast flu virus reached the Stanford team lately...
     
  42. mikej

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    maybe i missed something, what east coast player had an excuse made for him when he lost? flu?

    and you should pass that "we don't have to make excuses" mantra on to your boy feddie...every time klahn loses he has a reason...let lacroix win because he was injured but being a gentleman...sap took too much time out of him this week, etc
     
  43. Fedace

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    Nice to see Alex Clayton starting to dominate. With Alex back in form, We are unbeatable.
     
  44. db379

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    It's ok with me, I enjoy reading your posts about how great Duke tennis is. After losing 7-0 to Tenn, they may be a contender for the most sets won during a beat up by a top 10 team. :)
     
  45. mikej

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    this had what to do with the theme of excuses you brought up? pretty sure i didn't offer any excuses for either of duke's recent losses...

    so who again was excusing their players losses due to flu? was just wondering if you're making stuff up or i missed some discussion somewhere...

    edit: ps im glad you enjoy my posts about duke - i don't know how great i say they are - very good for sure and at stanford's level i'd say, but not among the top 2 or 3...i likewise enjoy hearing from you and feddie how klahn is going to roll through all his college competition this year, then watching him suck and get beat up by three people already this year, including a freshman :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2011
  46. ClarkC

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    Wake Forest got wiped out by flu, Tripper Carleton did not even make the road trip recently, and they were upset by Michigan State. That's the only one I remember.
     
  47. ClarkC

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    One last weekend match before the new rankings come out: UCLA vs. Boise State.

    Boise State is on the decline these days, but UCLA barely took the doubles point.
     
  48. Fedace

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    Here we go. GOOD LUCK to Scott Lipsky in the SAP doubles final. Playing with Illini Rajeev Ram but that's ok, we will forgive you. lol. Anyway, Good Luck Scott, this one's for Stanford. KEEP the spirit high going into the ITA indoors. Maybe this win can rub off on the boys.

    http://www.sapopentennis.com/index2.html
     
  49. 10isplayer

    10isplayer Semi-Pro

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    mikej never called a duke upset he just said the positions that Duke would have the best chance of getting points at. Tennessee is a very good team and duke did lost 7-0 but they lost 4 three setters. also duke isn't even at their full strength lineup because wietoska is still out for unknown reasons. stanford has yet to face a top 10 team so we don't know how they would stack up so don't go dissing duke for losing a tighter-than-the-score looked 7-0 match. maybe stanford should schedule a tougher non-conference as it seems every other school is doing. UVa, tennessee, ucla, illinois, florida, georgia, duke are all challenging themselves with some very tough matches to prepare for national indoors. lets see if stanford will be as prepared as them.
     
  50. db379

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    never said he did.

    sounds like an excuse to me...
     

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