The pro stock to end all pro stocks: The Fed racket

Discussion in 'Pros' Racquets and Gear' started by FEDERERNADAL13, Aug 7, 2012.

  1. RJYU

    RJYU Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2007
    Messages:
    142
    I saw it. Just chose not to answer it because I've stated in the past that we don't discuss any specifics about our customization procedures or materials.
     
    #51
  2. ENJOY TENNIS

    ENJOY TENNIS Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Ron



     
    #52
  3. arche3

    arche3 Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2009
    Messages:
    5,389
    There is a tiny black hole in the handle. Used to slow down time. That's why they can't tell you.
     
    #53
  4. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Of course it is likely to be a Roger mould - ALL of the retail racquets are. It's the internal composition which matters most in terms of differentiating between the retail and Federer exclusive frame.

    I think, considering what Ron has said here compared to your original thoughts on the frame, you've likely been misled.

    We know your frame is definitely not from P1, and I highly doubt any actual Federer frames would end up in the pro room. There is no reason for them to when Wilson could just as easily (and at a fraction of the cost if Federer's frames are as exotic as some believe) hand out retail frames and say the same thing... as has likely happened here. Your friend has probably been outed and his story about the frame has been adjusted accordingly to continue to make it look special.

    Many people have claimed to have owned a Federer frame previously and the vast majority have shown to be incorrect as more details become available.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2012
    #54
  5. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Ron, a question on general practice if you don't mind. I've always wondered if you conduct any kind of integrity tests on frames you receive? (seeing if have any odd vibrations etc). I mean, what a mission would it be to do all that work on a frame and then have the player discover it played noticeably differently because of a fabrication issue which happened long before you ever saw the frame. Or is a visual check good enough considering Roger's (and Novak's etc) frames come via to you a higher quality process than retail frames?

    And near the end of a racquet's life-cycle (3 months for Roger?) do they need to be tested for consistency/flex?

    I know from personal experience that a frame bought a year after one of the same model will feel a little sharper. The way the top guys play surely their frames change to a noticeable level over that 3 month period.
     
    #55
  6. sixone90

    sixone90 Professional

    Joined:
    May 7, 2008
    Messages:
    1,244
    Hi Ron Yu! Ron Kohn says Hi! And asks whether you still take the average of 10 swingweights when calculating swingweight? :p

    EDIT: Guess you gotta be named Ron to be a good stringer, eh? :D
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2012
    #56
  7. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2011
    Messages:
    4,078
    QFT

    + 10 complete idiots
     
    #57
  8. SwankPeRFection

    SwankPeRFection Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2012
    Messages:
    1,509
    Wait, I'm lost.... Are you saying the ProStaff in the first pic is a Fed racquet? I don't think so... that looks like a Dimitrov one. I think your source was incorrect on that. The reason I say this is because the troat curvature is too small.
     
    #58
  9. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,326
    Huh? Dimitrov uses a 93 sq. in. racquet. The racquet in the OP's pic is obviously not that large, so it's a 90 and not a 93:

    [​IMG]
     
    #59
  10. West Coast Ace

    West Coast Ace G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2005
    Messages:
    13,310
    Location:
    So Cal
    Even for a Nadal Troll this is a moronic comment; go to a tennis shop - since we now ALL know you are an Armchair who doesn't play - and hold a 90 up to a 93 - the difference is tiny.

    OP, thanks for the pics and insights! Your connections are the envy of all.
     
    #60
  11. SwankPeRFection

    SwankPeRFection Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2012
    Messages:
    1,509
    The OP said he scored a 93 Pro Stock. Then he took another pic of it on top on last year's BLX90 and it appears a bit larger in the hoop. Could be the able, but who knows.

    As for the grommets, those are standard BLX90 grommets from last year. They fit the new ProStaff 90 without any issues.
     
    #61
  12. FEDERERNADAL13

    FEDERERNADAL13 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2009
    Messages:
    3,423
    The 93 prostock was featured in the thread "Dimitrov with the new Blx 95".

    The picture above is the Fed frame.
     
    #62
  13. aimr75

    aimr75 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2007
    Messages:
    3,330
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    Have you spoken to your source about its authenticity?
     
    #63
  14. Geology_Rocks!

    Geology_Rocks! Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    May 19, 2011
    Messages:
    492
    Location:
    Salvador, BA
    Is the leather grip still magical?
     
    #64
  15. FEDERERNADAL13

    FEDERERNADAL13 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2009
    Messages:
    3,423
    Yes, he talked to his connection (at wilson) and he convinced me that this is a fed frame with a generic Wilson grip. The grip is shorter than retail, the paint job has a few stickers missing (showing that it's a pro room frame), and there is only one pro room pro who uses the 90- roger federer. In addition, my connection sold 3 rackets to a fed fan in Asia who has federer frames that were used by him (I presume this is fabfed), and this guy has confirmed that the frame is a legit federer.

    Therefore, I am happy! :)
     
    #65
  16. Fabfed

    Fabfed Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    418
    I didn't buy 3 racquets (or any racquets for that matter) from your contact, whoever he is. I've never bought any pro room frames, only interested in match-used racquets which are purchased via auctions. But it's an interesting thread, thanks.
     
    #66
  17. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Fair enough. For those who have followed Federer's custom frames for a long while I'd say not many would side with the "legit" claim. There are too many unknowns in the mix and mysterious suppliers of supposed player frames very rarely turn out to be legit - no matter how keen their attention to detail is.

    FWI, there are other reasons the Wilson pro room would have a 90 sq-in frame - I can tell you one > the same person I mentioned a few pages back tested 90 sq-in frames - I held it in my hands (the previous paint job). So that line of argument, to me at least, isn't really proof of much. They already make consumer frames with that exact mould and the vast, vast majority of frames ever made with that mould are simply retail models of various production runs. Only a tiny fraction of them - we're talking 1 in 100,000 - have more cowbell added in some way.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2012
    #67
  18. FEDERERNADAL13

    FEDERERNADAL13 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2009
    Messages:
    3,423
    Awe, that's too bad man! I was hoping you were his other person (as I already know the other guy who bought some Fed frames).

    How have you been? Haven't seen you around in a while! :)
     
    #68
  19. Fabfed

    Fabfed Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    418
    Hey, i'm good, just really busy, thanks. I'm hoping to get Fed's used BLX PS90 in the next few weeks (fingers crossed), so maybe we can make some comparisons with your Fed stick then :)
     
    #69
  20. FEDERERNADAL13

    FEDERERNADAL13 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2009
    Messages:
    3,423
    Sounds cool :)

    Good luck to you! It'd be really nice to have the new PJ, to complete the collection :)
     
    #70
  21. ENJOY TENNIS

    ENJOY TENNIS Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    How did You get those? Are You a Roger's friend? Or do You buy these frames?



     
    #71
  22. SwankPeRFection

    SwankPeRFection Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2012
    Messages:
    1,509
    What comparison? A superficial one? No offense dude because I'm sure you're paying a pretty penny for them, but with each stick, you have the opportunity to put to bed all the BS that's floating around about Fed's actual sticks, but you're too scared to do anything with them short of weighing them and taking some shots. Great thanks. :rolleyes:
     
    #72
  23. FEDERERNADAL13

    FEDERERNADAL13 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2009
    Messages:
    3,423
    He pays a good amount of money for these, he can do what he wants with them. If I had a match used Fed racket, signed in 3 places, I would never play with it.

    It's to special for that.
     
    #73
  24. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,326
    But what do you expect him to do? Cut them open with a hacksaw? What do you expect he will see in there? Magic gold dust? He's just going to see graphite, like any other frame.
     
    #74
  25. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    This ^.

    An idea which just popped to mind though was getting the frame x-rayed. It's non invasive and would show if it was a braided composition which some suspect (a hangover from the PS85 era) and would show definitively that his frame is not merely a modified or higher quality controlled retail frame.

    X-rays don't cost a whole lot usually. I wonder if, at some stage, Fabfed would consider it.

    As per this x-ray of a PS85 > http://i42.tinypic.com/2hf17rt.jpg
     
    #75
  26. Fabfed

    Fabfed Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    418
    Here we go again. It's not like I've only taken pics of the racquets, i've weighed them and measured the balance for each and everyone of them, and taken pics of the measurements. I've seen pics of racquets weighed on these boards but I don't recall seeing any taken of balance measurements. Sure Ive not measured the swingweight, I've explained why, and if you think it's not a good enough reason then too bad. I could actually just come up with some fictional SW without any proof just to appease some of you guys, but I won't do that. And what's not useful about knowing the weight and balance of Fed's racquet from 2008-2010, I have in fact his 2011 BLX90 as well and his N90 from 2005/06 both of which I've not measured but I plan to do so. As for actually play testing the sticks, I won't do it, I mean c'mon, they're the legend's sticks, apart from the pretty penny I paid, why would I want to play with any of the racquets with the autograph on the overgrip and everything and most of all risk breaking the strings? As they say, to each his own. But even Ron said I should not play with it and just display the racquet. I like to think I've made some contributions to these boards, I'm sorry if you feel otherwise.
     
    #76
  27. Fabfed

    Fabfed Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    418
    Hey Bobby, interesting idea, I don't mind doing that, where would I get it done though?
     
    #77
  28. onehandbh

    onehandbh Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2005
    Messages:
    3,031
    Fabfed, curious if you happen to have any of Fed's PS85's as well?
     
    #78
  29. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,326
    I can't seem to make out a whole lot in that x-ray pic.

    In any case, are you sure all the versions of the Tour 90's that came after the PS 6.0 are not also braided graphite? I'm not convinced that they are not. I believe they all still use braided graphite. I'm pretty sure that's why all the PS 6.0's and Tour 90's all have a similar and unique feel to them.
     
    #79
  30. jeroenn

    jeroenn New User

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    Messages:
    41
    You indeed have, and you're appreciated for that!


    Your best bet would be a veterinarians practice.

    You have a great collection, sir!

    J
     
    #80
  31. Povl Carstensen

    Povl Carstensen Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2004
    Messages:
    5,747
    Definitely agreed.
     
    #81
  32. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Oh, I thought they didn't, but I don't base that on anything I've read. I've made light work of a K6.1 Tour which was broken - busting it open (unscientifically, by hitting it on a wall rock :D) and it didn't seem braided like a PS85 I've seen cut open.

    This doesn't make a census of course but I just assumed they stopped doing it basically because of the cost it added to a frame. I'd think they would add other stuff in to recreate the old school feel.

    One thing about an x-ray though, you can't tell the composition - but I'd have assumed a braided layup would point to a more PS85-ish build imo.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2012
    #82
  33. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Hey, as jeroenn mentioned below - try a vet. About 15 years ago I got a cellphone x-rayed at a vet for use in a piece of (advertising) artwork. From memory it wasn't all that expensive.

    I actually know a vet somewhere I'm visiting in Asia in a few months - I might ask if he can x-ray one of my PS85s as a benchmark. Maybe could get a more detailed look at the layup than the existing photo I linked to.
     
    #83
  34. Fuji

    Fuji Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2010
    Messages:
    6,587
    Vet x-rays are fairly cheap here in Canada as well FYI. :D

    I'd love to get some frames X-Rayed now that you mentioned it!

    -Fuji
     
    #84
  35. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,326
    On Wilson's own website, it states that the PS Six-One Tour 90 BLX still uses braided graphite:

    "The Pro Staff Family has been cherished by the game's greatest icons, including Federer, Sampras, Edberg and Courier. The legendary braided graphite construction provides the perfect blend of control and feel."

    http://www.wilson.com/en-us/tennis/rackets/prostaff-sixone-90/

    I'm fairly certain that ALL of the Tour 90 iterations have used braided graphite. That's really the only way to get that unique feel.
     
    #85
  36. aimr75

    aimr75 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2007
    Messages:
    3,330
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    .......................
     
    #86
  37. aimr75

    aimr75 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2007
    Messages:
    3,330
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    I've seen pics of guys who have sanded back k90s to the graphite and you can see the braiding. I presume no different with blx's
     
    #87
  38. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Ok, that's good info. Perhaps an x-ray is a red herring then. It wont show the composition, only the layup.

    What I'd love to know *someday* is if they're made using a PS85 style graphite/kevlar combo. I've hit with the K6.1, the BLX and the BLX PS and none really felt overly PR85-ish to me - albeit still much closer than other frames I've tried.

    The hunt continues!
     
    #88
  39. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,326
    I know what you mean. The PS 6.0 85 just feels more solid and more dampened. Maybe they fill the PS 6.0 85 with more foam or some other filler inside the graphite tubes? Or maybe they used more Kevlar in the braid of the PS 6.0 85? Not really sure. It seems all these "modern" materials they've been throwing into the various Tour 90s just makes them feel worse. Nothing feels better than just plain old braided 80% Graphite/20% Kevlar. :)
     
    #89
  40. SwankPeRFection

    SwankPeRFection Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2012
    Messages:
    1,509
    No, I agree to some extent. Don't get me wrong, I'm not taking you for granted, but if it was me, unless the racquet(s) were from a particular match which actually finished the match on that racquet, I would put much more value on them than if they were just used during a match. (We all know how many times Fed changes sticks with each match... let alone if it was some match which had almost no major value.) Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is that if the money you paid for it went to a good cause, I would much more rather view that money as a donation to that cause and just enjoy the stick a little bit. It is after all just a racquet...

    I guess I'm just one of those people who isn't all that star struck with celebrities of all venues in life. Honestly, I would must more enjoy talking to Fed than asking for his autograph. I honestly see no value in his signature... everyone can get it if they strive hard enough and he gives it out no matter what. That deminishes the value to me.

    Anyway, I think you still need to do the swingweight measurement. I never did understand why you wouldn't do it... there are no damaging affects on the stick to do so. Hecks, you can do it at home with a makeshift setup that will cause no issues. Either way, it doesn't really matter... P1 has take a lot of shots of what the sticks look like with the customizations they make. The bottom line remains that I never understood the secrecy over the customizations. It's not like anyone else on tour could copy them and all of a sudden play like Fed to win. :roll: It's an idividual customization and I think more pros should be willing to share what and why they do it.
     
    #90
  41. Fabfed

    Fabfed Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    418
    Fair enough. I'll try and measure the SW at some point after the USO. Believe me even merely taking the pics and posting them takes quite a bit of time, but I'll get round to it.
     
    #91
  42. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    34,794
    I have four PS 85s I purchased from the TW reintroduction.

    I have replaced the leather grip by Wilson Shockshield though and it is much more comfortable.
     
    #92
  43. Geoff

    Geoff Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2004
    Messages:
    943
    Location:
    In the now
    Hello Fabfed

    Thanks again for sharing your amazing collection of Federer gear. There is an iPhone app that is pretty easy to measure swing weight for the whopping price of $.99!

    Here is a video on how the app works http://www.appmaker.se/index.php?m=6&s=1

    I respect your care of your collection and am fine knowing or not knowing the actual swingweight. How is that for Swiss neutrality?
     
    #93
  44. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,326
    I have no problems with the leather grip. In fact, I can't play without them since I've been using leather grips since the days of wood racquets. Of course, now I also use an overgrip, whereas, back then it was just the raw leather. I find leather grips with an overgrip to be very comfortable. :)

    BTW, I'm surprised you would buy four PS 6.0 85's. I thought you preferred bigger racquets, like Nadal's? You must feel you play better with the PS 6.0 85 than with bigger racquets or else you wouldn't have bought four of them, right? :)
     
    #94
  45. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    34,794
    I bought an original PS 85 but it was in one grip size bigger than I wanted. I did not use it much. I paid 400 bucks for it. When the new PS 85s came out, I thought let me buy two for the future. Then I bought 2 more. I use two of them with the grip changed, and the other two I have stored as they are.

    I have been using the PS 85 from that time on. On mishits I found them uncomfortable, so I changed the grip and also the string to Wilson Shockshield. The basic advantage is that the HL balance and small head helps in the one handed backhand and the first serve and the rare volley. I think the forehand does suffer, and also the second serve - requires lot of spin to keep it in due to the weight. However, power comes effortlessly in everything and with the new grip and the weight of the frame, there is no discomfort at all.
     
    #95
  46. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    Since you have 20,000 posts I'm going to assume you know what you're talking about. :D If you were to compare an early 90s PS85 to the current one, do you notice any discernible difference in how they play?

    I have been close to buying some new ones but most of my existing ones which I play with often are the Taiwan model (all bought about 93-ish) and they play much nicer than the Chinese frame I bought in about 98, which is last resort to play with it's so crap. The Taiwanese frames are miles closer to the St Vincent frame in how they feel imo.

    Are these new-era ones worth the effort given Wilson's famous lack of quality control on it's other frames? (to be honest, I wouldn't be surprised to even find out the new frames have no kevlar in them or aren't braided).
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2012
    #96
  47. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    34,794
    See who has even more posts. BP is the guy for these questions. I really don't know the answer as I did not use the original PS 85 much, and it is not a St. Vincent one (it is the Taiwan one). I also changed my strings to Shockshield for the new ones, and they are very comfortable but feel is not what they are known for.
     
    #97
  48. JoelDali

    JoelDali G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2009
    Messages:
    10,506
    [​IMG]
     
    #98
  49. West Coast Ace

    West Coast Ace G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2005
    Messages:
    13,310
    Location:
    So Cal
    ^^^ Well played, JD!
     
    #99
  50. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,338
    :lol: I was just being nice, thinking someone might have a keen eye/arm for the differences.
     

Share This Page