The TT Football Club

Discussion in 'Odds & Ends' started by Ross K, Aug 10, 2008.

  1. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

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    Chelsea win, Arsenal draw = Three way tie at the top of the table works for me ;)

    Looks like the deal for Zouma is done, with him staying in France on loan for the rest of the year. Should probably be our last deal of the window.
     
  2. Lukhas

    Lukhas Legend

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    Learnt that Juninho was retiring. Miss him hitting penalties from 30 meters distance... :(
     
  3. SempreSami

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    The weekend results have put Schalke back in contention for a Champions League place, qualifying for that would mean Draxler wouldn't necessarily have to be sold.
     
  4. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    Draxler is the only great player Schalke have. I doubt they're going to sell him.
     
  5. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

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    Arsene is known for not being willing to pay big money, but it's hard to argue with this one. The kind of money they want for Draxler is the kind players like Mata and Ozil have been going for, Draxler has potential, but he's not at their level.
     
  6. PED

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    Well said, I'd even rather have Mata over Ozil at this point. I think Mata is more PL proven. Ozil will get there.

    No telling how Draxler would work out in the PL. Holtby hasn't taken the league by storm but I also realize Draxler is higher quality but still.....
     
  7. PED

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    Your typos are getting worse, don't worry, I fixed it for you ;)
     
  8. Feña14

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    Haha, Man City will probably win the title fairly comfortably in the end, might aswell make it a 3 horse race for as long as possible!

    As for Draxler, Wenger said £27 Million was about the price, which seems more than fair. Schalke will probably get a bidding war going in the summer to get the price they want. Just depends if Wenger was willing to pay extra now, because it's hard to see them competing with every other major club in the summer.
     
  9. PureAlph4

    PureAlph4 Semi-Pro

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    Exactly what I said to a mate today. Draxler is 20, has scored one goal this season, and his price is largely based on potential; how can he be the same price as Ozil or Mata, who have succeeded at the very top level over a number of years? Of course price is about what someone is willing to pay, and someone will pay £37m this summer, so I suppose you would argue he is 'worth' that.

    I think the same thing about Luke Shaw. He's looked great this season, and has bags of potential for the future, but how can he be valued at £30m? It's crazy. Even accepting that the market has inflated quite a lot recently, I wouldn't have thought anyone would pay much more than for a Walcott or Oxlade when they they were at Southampton. To me £15-17m seems about right, but once again, of course someone will pay that £30m this summer.

    Exactly 3 years ago, £50m for Torres seemed an absolutely collosal amount. Now, probably most PL teams would be quoting £30m+ for their best player, with the top teams wanting £70m+.
     
  10. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

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    Totally agree, Shaw probably gets a slightly higher price because he's English and that comes with alot of benefits. Even so, any more than £20 Million tops for a left back is crazy money.

    Torres for £50 Million wasn't too crazy imo, he'd had a bad year with injuries before the move, but at the time it seemed like a blip. He actually scored two great goals in the game before he moved and looked to be on his way back. £50 Million for the Torres from his Liverpool days would of been money well spent. Nobody really thought he would of lost it forever at the age of 26. Either way, that goal in the Nou Camp when he ran the length of the pitch, rounded Valdes and Gary Neville went crazy was worth every penny :) probably the longest 10 seconds of my life, i had time to jump up, look away, look to my family and still look back in time to see him approaching Valdes was so surreal.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kO6ULZ6Qis8
     
  11. PureAlph4

    PureAlph4 Semi-Pro

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    ^
    Torres was a great player at Liverpool, and £50m just about seemed understandable for the leading striker in the league, who could scare opposition defences to death. What I'm trying to say is that it seemed a huge amount then, but was just about within the grasp of a structure of value that football fans here could comprehend.

    I'm a child of the PL (pretty much properly started following in the first season with that United, Norwich, Villa title race), and until now the general hierarchy of valuations of players, and how they inflated over time, seemed to make some sense. For me, in the last year or two, when every half decent prospect is worth £30-40m, and any top player is £60m+, I just can't make sense of it any more. Maybe it's a sign of old age setting in, and I'll be that codger in the pub moaning that football isn't what it used to be!
     
  12. Feña14

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    That's true, when Shearer went to Newcastle for £15 Million it seemed crazy. Especially when we were getting the likes of Gullit, Desailly, Zola, Vialli, Leboeuf, Weah etc.. around that time, for less combined.

    Suarez and Aguero, the best in the league are probably valued at more than Torres went for so it seems about right. As you say though, it's the prices teams want for talent who haven't done it yet that gets me. Draxler for £40 Million, Shaw, Mangala, a centre back for £40 Million? Wow.

    Obviously you want teams to be rewarded for nurturing talent, but it doesn't always work out. You then get teams buying players very young in an attempt to get round this, where their growth is then stunted and they never settle.
     
  13. forthegame

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    I'm ashamed...
     
  14. PED

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    So true: Cesc, Henry, Viera, Nasri, Clichy, RvP, etc LOL

    TBH, Cesc is the only one I'd have back.

    Would love to see how City would do without their dubious interpretation of the FFP rules and their 40 million # "licensing" agreements. Jose talked about just that. Worries me when I'm on the same side as Jose ;)

    If (when) oil prices ever reverts to the mean, there will be a big changing of the guard. Just ask Anzhi what happened about when the Potash consortium fell apart.....
     
  15. Solo

    Solo Banned

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    What's the mata Man U? It didn't mata much even when Rooney and RVP were out :lol:
     
  16. forthegame

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    Grrrrrrr !
     
  17. PED

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    Who was that team in blue? Wow, I'd watch Chelsea every week if they played like that. City have depth but Arguero is the one they really need.

    Well done Fena, your boys took care of business.

    Matic looked a little tentative but settled right in. Maybe having him cleaning up in the middle gave Jose the backup he needed to send men forward.

    Love Eto'o this year, how about when he racked Toure...lol Wiley old hand, Arsenal could have use a guy like that.
     
  18. Cesc Fabregas

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    Great performance from Chelsea. Back 4, Matic and Hazard impressive. Vincent Kompany has been dogshit for 18 months.
     
  19. Breaker

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    Not really. Well done to Chelsea though, outplayed us from beginning to end.
     
  20. Anaconda

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    Lol idiot.
     
  21. norbac

    norbac Legend

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    Hazard was a joy to watch. Very impressed with how well Matic is already fitting in as well.
     
  22. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

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    Agreed on Matic, at times it looked like Toure on Toure, not bad going for your first start in the league!

    Still don't know how it ended up being only 1-0, the chances before half time and the 3 or 4 times hitting the post made the last 10 minutes uncomfortable, but it was still a great performance.

    City will still win the league, but to see how far we've come over half a season is reassuring.
     
  23. liam1

    liam1 New User

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    Chelsea played great and yeah Matic had a fantastic debut. Both himself and Luiz really closed the space Silva likes to operate in. City really missed Aguero,Nasri and Fernandinho. The only downside for me is Mourinho, I really wish he would shut his mouth and just let his team do the talking. He is the last person who should be complaining about financial fair play. Jose mark 1 was entertaining but now he's just a pain.
     
  24. raging

    raging Professional

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    all the way Jose!
    That's just his style, he loves needling, looking for an edge, always scrapping for a fight. He is better in some ways than a lot of others
    who say nothing and try to be so correct - his heart is on his sleeve, he will do anything for his club to get the points. There will be more of this from Jose before the season is out. Guaranteed.
     
  25. PED

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    This!

    I've started to warm to Chelsea and loved their performance yesterday but just wish Jose would STFU :)

    I do applaud their dealings in January, it's almost like they're operating like a regular club with financial restrictions. Yesterday, they didn't seem to miss Mata at all, I can see know how he doesn't really fit in with Jose's plans.
     
  26. Feña14

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    Personally, the way Mourinho was at the end of his first spell is something i'd understand people not liking. This time round he's been great though imo, the way he talks about English football, the players of all teams etc.. He just seems happy to be where he knows he belongs.

    One of the better football writers described the performance against City like this:

    "He got everything right. The team, the strategy, the tempo, the mood. He knew the stakes, he knew how to win, he knew when to risk, when to gamble, when to hold. It was, quite possibly, the perfect game.
    There have been more than a few landmark performances in the career of Jose Mourinho, but a very strong case can be made that this was his finest as a Premier League manager."

    Hard to argue with that, from the way he said after the game how his plan meant nothing without the players to execute it. He even said how the physio took the final team talk, he's a crazy guy who always pulls pranks on Chelsea TV so that probably lightened the mood and allowed the team to be free to pull off that performance. After the game his quote about Chelsea being a little horse who needs milk and water before growing into a team that can win the league was just classic Mourinho.

    My girlfriend is actually a West Brom fan and hates Mourinho, watching the game with her on Monday as an honorary Chelsea fan she said how that opinion is now changing. Mostly after the way he deflected the praise that everyone was trying to put on him for the tactics and putting it onto the players who executed it perfectly.

    As a fan, it's great to see our style coming together. There are other teams who the neutrals will prefer to watch, but this style is what we are. We've had years of trying to be Barcelona, which we will never be. Now we're back to the counter-attacking, defensively perfect, high pressured team who now have the one thing we've been missing since Ballack, a Rolls-Royce in the middle to bring it all together. i've always been proud of what we are, the power we have at our best. Now everybody at the club seems to be on the page in trusting Mourinho to let this happen.
     
  27. Vcore89

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    The One is keen on bringing in Mario Manzukic for £40 million. Quite prudent considering losing the Rooney bid.
     
  28. Feña14

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    He has a high work rate, so it makes sense for Mourinho to be looking at him. Someone who can do the things Eto'o has been, whilst being prolific is the ideal player for the system, so that could be an option.

    £40 Million seems alot, but if he wants to go and Bayern are wanting Draxler, a deal could be done i'd of thought.
     
  29. Vcore89

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    The commanding rate from Bayern seems to be fair considering No.9 was bought for 50 million quids more than a couple years back. Now, I really see how they missed Eto'o.

    And I wonder what is the intrinsic value of Draxler in £ terms.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2014
  30. bezs

    bezs Legend

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    If that Mandzukic deal went through Bayern would be laughing their way to the bank a replacement which they already have for free.
     
  31. PED

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    40 mil might be rich for a 28 yo striker IMO.
     
  32. liam1

    liam1 New User

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    Maybe Jose is realizing that he's running out of places to go. Don't think he left Italy or Spain with too many friends. Having said that it was for me the most enjoyable Chelsea performance in years. Really since they beat Manure 3-0 at home and he went to shake hands with Whiskey Nose with a few minutes left to play, now that was classic. He has the players, he just has to let them off the leash more often. Why didn't he let them play like that at Old Trafford earlier in the season?
     
  33. PED

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    I think he didn't have his lineup sorted at that time. That game was snoozer, almost as bad as City under Mancini playing for ties at home ;)

    The newer players were indoctrinated to the Jose style yet. Look at the resurgence of Terry not having to play a high line now. Eto'o is coming on and Matic is a big uptick over Obi-Mikel.
     
  34. hawk eye

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    Matic was already very impresse in the Vitesse team a few years ago, you just knew he was gonna make it to the very top. Great vision, and allround skills, not to mention his stamina.

    On that position City had Demichelis (no idea why big clubs keep spending money on this guy), plus they were missing a tad refinement upfront with the absence of Aguero. That sums it up i guess.
     
  35. liam1

    liam1 New User

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    I take your point but I still think they had enough to win there. He had the same players apart from Matic and as it was his debut v City he didn't have much time to become indoctrinated in Jose's way. Hopefully he keeps Obi Mikel out of the team as he is one player who just bores me. BTW it's funny how the English papers are now full of praise for Terry and want him to come out of International retirement. Read a statement this morning saying of all the English players in the Prem he is playing at the highest level. He could've played in his slippers v City.
     
  36. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

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    Yeah, it seems like he's achieved everything he wanted in his time away from the Premier League. Now he's back where he was at his happiest, where his family want to be and his attitude has shown that. His post match interview after beating Liverpool where he spoke from the heart about how special the Premier League is with what the players do over the Christmas period was class imo. Let's not forget he's actually done alot for British managers also, he was the one who saw something in Rodgers and gave him his chance, same for Steve Clarke and Paul Clement who has gone on to assist Ancelotti at PSG, and now at Real Madrid.

    At one stage this season Rodgers, Clarke and AVB, Mourinho's proteges were all managing in the Premier League. That's something that gets overlooked imo.

    Think you nailed it on the head, Luiz and Matic in midfield, using Ramires on the right instead of holding, Azpilicueta at left back, Eto'o over Torres. Willian in the side when he hardly got a game the first few months of the season are all big changes.

    The style at the moment, although it's not beautiful in the classic way, it's actually pretty enjoyable to watch. There are parts which are taken from the total football philosophy he learnt from in his earlier years at Barcelona. Full backs having to attack and defend, wingers who fill in when they go forward, the holding midfielders can go forward, as long as one of the front 4 drops back to fill the gap etc.. Looks seemless at the moment, but no doubt alot of work has gone into that.
     
  37. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

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    He's probably playing better than i've ever seen him, which is crazy. He shouldn't go back for the political reasons around it, but on form he'd probably be the first name on the team sheet.

    Luckily Cahill has been just as good, a player in the form he's in, who won the Champions League on one leg should be enough to make up for not having Terry there in the summer.
     
  38. liam1

    liam1 New User

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    Some centre halfs make their partners look much better players than they are and I just wonder is that the case with Terry and Cahill. Terry is a leader, not sure Cahill is. Showing my age now but I remember when Paul McGrath was playing along side Phil Babb in the Irish team. Mc Grath made Babb look like a world beater so much so that Liverpool ended up spending 10 mil on him, remember the Spice Boys in their white Armani suits. Now I'm not saying Cahill is the same as Babb but if say its him and Jagielka at the back for England in Brazil would you be completely confident?
     
  39. Feña14

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    No that's a fair point, it's hard to say regarding Cahill. The thing with him is that he's done it in a Champions League final, the biggest stage in World football today imo. He was injured for the game too, not to mention he played alongside Luiz who was also injured (and known for making some strange decisons). People say Jagielka is the best English centre back, but at the end of the day he's not done it on any significant level.

    Carragher is a big fan of Cahill, he and Gary Neville were raving about him after the Liverpool win. When he first joined I thought he was weak mentally and would never be able to perform at the highest level, his performances from day one have totally changed my opinion of him though. He leads, is great in the air, loves defending and he has real pace. Pace isn't the biggest asset for a centre back, but to see a quality defender timing tackles at speed is something i've always loved to see.
     
  40. BlackSilver

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    Gervinho walking on the water, Arsenal's managers must be ****ed off.
     
  41. Anaconda

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    Fena, you reckon Utd will take 4th?
     
  42. Vcore89

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    Man U will not be able to qualify this year!:-|
     
  43. BlackSilver

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    Agree. They are totally messed up.
     
  44. Feña14

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    That's going to be an interesting one, for me, it's Liverpool's to lose. Everton, Spurs and Man Utd are too inconsistent, but it's going to be a good battle.

    We've got the fight for 4th, the 3 way battle for the title that keeps changing and a close relegation fight with a few teams who've been in the Premier League awhile looking like they could lose their place next year.

    So much that needs to be sorted in 4 months. What's your prediction for 4th? Man Utd missing out and the implications that has on spending and their ability to attract top players could be huge long term.
     
  45. Anaconda

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    I think Man Utd will do some freak a5s champions league 5hit and win the champions league like Chelsea did - which was get outplayed by every team they face yet somehow fluke the win. I see it happening, just because it's Man Utd. I think they should take 4th; Rooney, RVP, Januzaj and Mata. You can't really go wrong here; Two creative geniuses, a top goal scorer and a very good all round player. If they can't score goals then it will be the biggest joke in football.
     
  46. PED

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    Well, this is embarrassing. Feb form comes true, we are probably done for the title now.
     
  47. PureAlph4

    PureAlph4 Semi-Pro

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    ^ Done for the title, I think so (had to take at least 4 pts from Southampton and Liverpool for that to happen).

    But no reason for us to collapse. Got to still beat the teams outside the top 6, and see where that gets us. Today was terrible, but we've improved this season.

    Why today didn't surprise me was that it was a repeat of our last away match at Southampton in the first half, where they should have easily been 3-0 up at HT. We also have not been playing freely since November, and have been very poor in the first half of matches, but have been grinding out results. Eventually, our average performances have been shown up by a decent attacking team.

    I also don't think this match is too out of character with our decent form over the past 13 months. Liverpool haven't beaten us at Anfield for a while, but I suppose they now count as a genuine top 4 team, who we struggle against, especially away from home. Really have to win the games vs United, Everton and Spuds now.
     
  48. PED

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    I wrote that when we were four nil down and still in shock...lol

    At least city dropped points today but Fena's boys look ominous now.

    I'm not a fan of Wilshire ATM, would rather have Ox in the middle. Jack still isn't playing as well as he did a fee years back against Barca in the CL plus he's a hot head......

    Pool looked like City out there today, those front three are terrifying.
     
  49. Vcore89

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    Anyone saw Arsenal vs Liverpool and Chelsea vs Newcastle match? Some might be disappointed, anyways, no spoiler, so I'll zip it.:)
     
  50. Feña14

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    We looked great, we're in a good run of form at the moment, but everything can change. If Hazard keeps this up it's hard to see him not getting player of the year, just depends on what Suarez does from here I think.

    I'm taking the girlfriend to the West Brom game on Tuesday, not sure how she'll get on being a West Brom fan in the Chelsea end, but should be entertaining.
     

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