The Unheard Let Call

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by Cindysphinx, Sep 1, 2012.

  1. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    During team practice, my partner missed her first serve. As she prepared to hit her second serve, a ball came rolling onto our court. Three players began calling a let, trying to get the server's attention. For whatever reason, server did not hear this commotion and hit her second serve.

    How should this be handled? Obviously if a ball rolls onto the court when server has already started her service motion, she takes two serves. What if the issue is the server didn't hear everyone trying to get her attention? In that case, is it just one serve?
     
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  2. amorris525

    amorris525 Rookie

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    Still two serves.
     
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  3. blakesq

    blakesq Professional

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    i think the only time there is only one serve on a let is if a ball rolls on the court between first and 2nd serve , and there is no or very little delay in clearing the ball. hence in your case, First serve.
     
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  4. JoelDali

    JoelDali G.O.A.T.

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    Its not Sarah's fault.

    Its the USTA's fault.
     
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  5. Mike Y

    Mike Y Rookie

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    I don't think there is any situation where a let call doesn't result in two serves.
     
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  6. TENNIS4FUN2

    TENNIS4FUN2 New User

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    23. THE LET
    In all cases when a let is called, except when a service let is called on a second service, the whole point shall be replayed.
    Case 1: When the ball is in play, another ball rolls onto court. A let is called. The server had previously served a fault. Is the server now entitled to a first service or second service?
    Decision: First service. The whole point must be replayed.
    USTA Comment 23.1: What happens when the server is interrupted during delivery of the second service? The server is entitled to two serves.
    USTA Comment 23.2: What happens when there is a delay between the first and second serves? If the delay is caused by the receiver (such as a broken string or contact lens problem), an official, or outside interference, the whole point is replayed. If the server caused the delay, such as when the server breaks a string, the server gets one serve. Note that a spectator’s call
    (“out,” “fault,” or other), a spectator’s ringing cell phone, or grunting on an adjacent court is not basis for replaying the point. Action should be taken to prevent further spectator interference.
    USTA Comment 23.3: What happens when a ball from an adjacent court rolls on the court between the first and second serves? The time it takes to clear an intruding ball between the first and second serves is not considered sufficient time to warrant the server receiving two serves unless this time is so prolonged as to constitute an interruption. The receiver is the judge of
    whether the delay is sufficiently prolonged to justify giving the server two serves.

    I was curious so I looked it up. This is from the Rules of Tennis. Page 15 from the USTA website.
     
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  7. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

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    Personally it would be second serve since everyone was calling for a hold up on the serve. Clearing a ball is not much of a delay, but rule would allow for 2 serves
     
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  8. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    Pardon? I'm not following you.

    Wouldn't the "receiver readiness" rule apply here as well? If you serve when the receiver is not ready, you don't get two serves. If the receiver is yelling "Stop! Hold up, Becky?" what better way is there to indicate the receiver is not ready?

    Even if the receiver was ready, she can become unready due to outside interference. If the server serves a second serve, she doesn't get a first serve.

    Right?
     
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  9. Fusker

    Fusker Rookie

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    One serve, as noted in 23.3.

    Just a general question, but are people in leagues looking for any micro-advantage possible that conflicts like this come up frequently? I don't play leagues, just a local ladder, a this sort of situation would usually go something like this:

    Returner: "Want two?"
    Server: "Nah. Not a big deal."

    We play courts that sometimes have a barrier between them and sometimes not. In any case, they aren't Flushing Meadows and balls will make their way in from other courts. I'd feel like a jerk getting benefit out of the random act of a ball coming in my court. if it happens right in the middle of a point, the actions are pretty clear. But given that half of the faults require the returner to chase them down and a few seconds taken away from the server, I don't see the big deal in clearing a neighboring court's ball.
     
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  10. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    There was no squabbling. This was team practice. I just wanted to know the correct answer.
     
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  11. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    I think I have the answer, and it does pertain to receiver readiness:

    "USTA Comment 21.7: What happens when the server observes that the
    receiver appears to be ready and hits the second serve in, but the receiver makes no attempt to return it? The server wins the point if the receiver had no reason for not being ready; if the receiver was not ready because of something within the receiver’s control (broken string or contact lens problem), then the server gets two serves; and if the receiver was not ready because of some reasonable factor such as clearing the errant first serve or a ball from an adjacent court, then
    the server gets one serve. If the time to clear the ball from the adjacent court is so prolonged as to constitute an interruption, good sportsmanship requires the receiver to offer the server two serves."
     
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  12. tennis tom

    tennis tom Hall of Fame

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    The team should pitch in and buy this lady a hearing aid.
     
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  13. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    Actually I'm pretty sure that's not correct.

    It depends on the timing of the let call.

    If the server had already began their service motion of the second serve then it should be a first serve because 23.3 talks about a ball rolling on "between" your first and second serve but once you start your service motion you are no longer "between".
     
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  14. Fusker

    Fusker Rookie

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    Based on what the OP stated, the ball rolled on their court in between serves. It only became an interference to her serve because she couldn't hear several people telling her about it. I agree with the idea to buy her a hearing aid.

    It's amazing to me how oblivious some people are to their surroundings. Sometimes getting a ball from the players on an adjacent court is just painful.

    Me: "Little help please."
    Them: "Huh?"
    Me: "Ball rolled onto your court there."
    Them: "Where?"
    Me: "Right behind you."
    **They then proceed to do a 720 degree spin looking for the ball. Usually it's sitting right next to one of theirs and apparently they can't count how many they have in their possession.**
    Them: "You playing Wilson 4"
    Me: "Nope - Penn 2" thinking "You're playing Wilson 4 buddy."
    Ball returned.
     
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  15. Nostradamus

    Nostradamus G.O.A.T.

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    Cindi, give your opponent 2 serves in this kind of situ no matter what. even if the ball was behind the court and didn't really affect the play that much, you still give them 2 serves.
     
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  16. JoelDali

    JoelDali G.O.A.T.

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    Tina is a rabbit and not a real poster in the forums.
     
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  17. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    That is not the point.

    I am always free to give two serves whenever I feel moved to do so.

    The question is what the rules require. Say our opponents in this situation did not offer two serves. If I am sure about the rule, I would tell them the rule and then explain I get a first serve.

    Not everyone is sporting. You have to know the rules to deal with those people.
     
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  18. johndagolfer

    johndagolfer Semi-Pro

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    To me there is a difference between what the rule states and what you stated happened. If a ball comes rolling onto the court before the wind up and it's a simple clear, one serve is fine. But the fact that the entire court is yelling for a stoppage of play and thus may cause confusion after the "aborted" second serve, two serves given should be the well within the rules.
     
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  19. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    I may have to send up a flare for Woodrow or JLyons on this. I really think this is a receiver readiness situation.

    I mean, think about it. It is very common for a ball to roll onto the court between first and second serve, and it is common for one or more players to yell, "Hold up." A smart server would quickly serve when that happens and then argue that they get two serves.

    If you hit a second serve when the receiver isn't ready for any legitimate reason, you do not get two serves. Right?
     
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  20. tenniscasey

    tenniscasey Semi-Pro

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    This is obviously a take-two situation. I'm surprised it's even being debated. Outside force disrupting server and all other players means two serves every time where I play.
     
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  21. kylebarendrick

    kylebarendrick Professional

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    I usually believe that too many people expect a first serve after even the most minuscule delay. They missed their first serve and they want any excuse they can find to get another one. My personal yardstick is if the delay is shorter than the time it takes for a singles player to clear a first serve that hit the net, then a first serve is not warranted.

    That said, in this case, give the server two serves.
     
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  22. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

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    Cindy- I think this would be a benefit of the doubt situation. The server had her service motion interrupted through no fault of her own- she is entitled to 2 serves. This happens so very rarely that if someone were to try and do it twice in the same match then its a different story. But as a 1 time occurrence I think that you have to give the benefit of the doubt to the server and give them 2 serves.
     
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  23. Fearsome Forehand

    Fearsome Forehand Professional

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    Had this happen recently in a doubles match. I was at net, my server was serving from ad, the returner was overprotecting his bh and was way wide.
    Server hit a medium paced serve up the tee, returner was over so far that he could not reach it. Let!!!!!!!!!! :)

    I was right there, there wasn't the hint of a sound of a let. To me, it looked like the serve cleared the net by a foot or more.
     
    #23

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