Theory: Kevlar is better for club players than poly

Discussion in 'Strings' started by The Dark Knight, Sep 29, 2013.

  1. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    But the crosses are at 40 so when the frame squashes its more like 50lbs. Would you string kevlar at 50??

    Now in my case it is crazy because I do the crosses at 86. But the racket is a 110 with an open pattern and its arm friendly

    Also most kevlar experiences are with a string that locks the bed like syngut, and IME if you have a smooth cross it makes it more armfriendly because the kevlar can move on contact and that lessens the shock.
     
  2. graycrait

    graycrait Semi-Pro

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    I'm pretty sure Ashaway Zyex is the only monofilament PEEK string. The others are multifilament. I went on a walk-about for another string or combo. I'm back to Ashaway Kev x Ashaway Zyex. I do have 20' of Forten Aramid Gear but don't have anything I feel like cutting out right away. I had a particularly good night playing doubles the other night against a couple of guys who at one time were ranked juniors. For grins I was using a 2013 Blade 98 strung with 18G Ash Kevlar in the mains and 17G Ashaway Zyex Pro in the crosses. Now I am tweaking a pair of 2013 Blade 98s, one 16x19 and one 18x20, both strung with Ash Kev x Zyex, tailweighted to 11.9oz. I've found my string, still looking for a racket that feels just right.
     
  3. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    Cool! Good luck on the racket. I think I have found the one for me but I only played 2wice with it but one was a USTA match we won so it got off to a nice start. Still some sticks to wade through though.

    Where did you shake out on the prestretching and cross tension differential?

    I thought I was right about monogut zx being unique in its construction.

    If you ever get a wild hair you may want to try mosquitobite as a cross. Though i have been digging prince tournament poly. But I kind of miss zx. may have to see if the new racket can handle lower tensions without launching.
     
  4. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I'm not biting ;-)....if you want to go forward with that fight be my guest . I'm tired :)
     
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  5. graycrait

    graycrait Semi-Pro

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    I quit prestretching and string pretty much 58lbs in the mains and 62 in the crosses. The Zyex fullbed for me is a somewhat erratic rocket launcher. But when strung up a little tighter than the Kevlar it is my theory that it gives the Kevlar a flexy backboard to slide along. Neither Ash Kevlar or Zyex by themselves works for me but that combo sure does and it lasts a long while for me. I tried Zyex in the mains and Kevlar in the crosses and although an interesting feel I couldn't make it work well for me. If I were wealthy I would buy a reel of that Acelon Flouro Extreme. I don't know how long that stuff would hold up but it too might do remarkable things when paired with Ashaway Kevlar. The fullbed I strung up at 53lbs in a 98" racket played a lot like gut. Wish I had strung it up at 63lbs instead of 53. I recently tried some of Mikeler's top rated polys and have a love/hate relationship with poly. I love fresh poly when I am hitting the sweetspot, but I hit enough shanks that the stuff does affect my arm in short order. The Kev/Zyex doesn't do that to me.

    I'm probably going to have another go in the mid 40s with Kevlar/Zyex. If initial tension loss stats are right then that Kevlar should be in the 30s at play time. I wonder if Kev at 20lbs and Zyex at my normal 62lbs would play any different than 58/62?
     
  6. TinTin 1

    TinTin 1 Professional

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    I just strung a new Donnay 114 frame with Ashway Kevlar 17/ and Acelon fluoro extreme at 48 and I can already tell it will be too tight.
    I will need to go to 43lbs. I don't like to string mains and crosses with more than 5 lbs difference due to possible stress on my frames .
     
  7. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    You are the first person I have heard of who strung the mains with zyex and the crosses with Kevlar .

    I am dying to try that .....sort of a poor mans Federer set up.

    I understand it did not work for you ; however it may in fact work for my game .

    I'm a serve and volleyer and I use Kevlar in the mains and natural gut in the the crosses.
     
  8. graycrait

    graycrait Semi-Pro

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    dk,

    One very good hybrid is Gut mains, Zyex crosses. Keeps the cost down, lasts a long time (for old men tennis) and the comfort is really good. I prefer Nat Gut x Zyex vs fullbed gut.

    For some reason when I had Zyex mains and Kev crosses the change in feel (not saying bad) was so dramatic from the the converse (which I am very used to) sort of shocked me and I cut em out with less than an hour on them. Now I may try that again, just to see what I may have been "missing." I've got a pair of matching Volkl V1 Pros. I'll make an opposing string pair and then compare them.
     
  9. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I can understand that .

    Personally I love gut mains and poly crosses but it's just a pain in the neck to maintain that combo consistently
     
  10. comeback

    comeback Hall of Fame

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    Maybe, but when i prestretch ashaway kevlar 18g by stringing it at 84 (the highest my crank will go)..I leave it in the racket for several weeks..When i went to take it out to put it in my playing racket it seems medium loose..Not as tight as i would think...IIRC others have mentioned the big sways in stringing kevlar doesn't matter much:)
     
  11. comeback

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    I have it both ways in (2) 105s rackets..I use the gut/zx for easier on the arm practice and warmups..I use the kevlar/zx in most competitive matches and it gives me more control and spin:)
     
  12. graycrait

    graycrait Semi-Pro

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    comeback,

    When you prestretch the Kevlar by leaving it in a racket at 86lbs for a couple of weeks and then string it in your playing racket do you expect next to zero tension loss after restringing? And how long would you expect this stringjob to last in your playing racket?. I've got an unstrung Ti6 to use as a prestretch racket:)
     
  13. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I'm no stringing expert ...but it's not simply the gigantic tension loss with Ashaway that bothers me ( the most of any string I have seen on the market ).....but the string entire playability also changes .

    It's frays like gut .....I swear the string just falls apart .
     
  14. comeback

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    Yes i am hoping less tension loss basically by trusting Traveljam's prestretching philosophy...I don't measure tension after stringing...I do the same thing with ZX but only string it 62lbs then leave it in an old racket for several weeks..I then restring the Kevlar/zx at 50/50 in my 105s..This is only the 2nd time i have done this method (which was suggested by Drak in another thread for a ESP racket)..I got a good 15 hours out of it the first time before i ruined the ropelike texture of the ashaway kevlar with lubricant so i cut it out..I'm only on my 2nd try (without lubricant LOL) and it's playing with great spin and control at 10 hours with very little notching or fraying with mains moving freely..i'm hoping for 15-20 hours before i restring for my next tournament May 9th..
     
  15. graycrait

    graycrait Semi-Pro

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    Yeah, ZX is kind of funny. I haven't figured out a good way to prestretch it with any predictability and still am not sure if it is really worth it. I have prestretched both quite a bit in terms of weight but not time. Zyex seems like taffy and it would seem to me hard to gauge when it is done stretching yet still effective.

    I think Zyex works pretty good out of the package as does the Ash Kev.
     
  16. comeback

    comeback Hall of Fame

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    Basically Graycrait, i try to read everything and follow if something makes sense to me..I remember the Ashaway kevlar/zx TTW string test..many testers here were so-so on Crossfire BUT DIDN'T PRESTRETCH..But after reading Traveljam's long diary and some others with prestretching then Drak confirmed it for me on an ESP racket..My 105s has control problems with full poly or gut poly or with zx as a main or cross..The kevlar/zx puts the ball almost exactly where i aim (with decent comfort and durability) ..So for me it's been a solution to my string search..
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2016
  17. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    That's exactly what I'm talking about with the Ashaway!!!

    It just degrades quickly ! You can actually see the fibers coming apart .

    Forten and other kevlars don't do this and have very little tension loss .

    I find the Forten to play almost exactly like Ashaway except that it just lasts forever and does not lose tension .

    But to each his own.
     
  18. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    what lubricant?

    I use natural oils like sesame or olive, etc. The Ashaway kevlar lasts like crazy and it takes forever for it to fray.

    But I can see that depending on the lubricant. Kind of like gut getting wet.

    FWIW I have been stepping on my strung racket to increase the prestretch, since I cant string tighter in the prestretch racket like you can. I jsut got the racket and will see how it compares.

    FOrtunately the kevlar lasts months and months, and I end up replacing the crosses more than 5 times before the kevlar needs it. I do mostly rotate the weave so the crosses are on the other side of the mains the 2nd time, etc.
     
  19. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    10 characters
     
  20. comeback

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    it was a guitar string lubricant i saw here on another thread..If you examine the ashaway kevlar closely after several hours it's texture is rope like (not smooth like poly)..in my case the lubricant soaked into the kevlar; locking the stringbed..I didn't realize it until i played really badly,cut it out and examined it
     
  21. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    Yeah, I don't understand the results you get or the posts you make. Its like you live in some Bizzarro world where everything is jacked.

    All I can say is that the Ashaway kevlar lasts and lasts for me. I can only remember one time it broke and that was when I was getting tons of spin because the "archerbow" effect in a soft PS85 with zx crosses 20lbs less. Rest of the time I just reuse it and swap the crosses. I have frames that are over a year old with ashaway kevlar that are still quite playable and feel great. And I can go whole USTA leagues with the same kevlar mains and no need to restring (except the crosses). Thats with an open pattern, 86/86lbs tensions and a heavy sw racket.

    Good luck oh your poor man's Federer string job, but really dude you don't understand why he puts the poly in the crosses....once you figure that out you will see that kevlar in the crosses is not the way to go if you want to mimic feds setup.
     
  22. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    Interesting. I never had anything like that exactly. Sure if the string is getting notched it will fray but when I was using the natural oils I didnt notice anything like that. Maybe the lubricant started breaking down the jacket? Also was this the reg kev or the kev+ since they do have different jackets.
     
  23. comeback

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    Not the coated one..It was the Regular Ashaway kevlar 18g.I bought a 360 ft reel...Possibly it might not matter in your heavy racket set up and how hard you hit..My 105s depends on free moving mains and my very medium stroke lol ...which depends on the racket and strings for the extreme spin
     
  24. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    Yeah thats the kevlar I use except that I stopped using the 18g version and now do the 17g. Back when I was doing lube (I stopped mostly because I ran out) I had a different racket that had a higher static weight but less sw, so I have no idea what that would do.

    Yeah we do hit very differently!! I do have a 105s and some day play to try it out. I was going to cut it down a bit and lead it up. Still on the docket. I will be seeing if a spin racket will work for me and have the 105s, Prince Warrior 100l and a 6.1 95s to see if they work. I hit with the Prince and the 6.1 and I think I could play with them if i get the right string setup.
     
  25. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Please enlighten us with your pearls of wisdom of why Federer strings the way he does .

    As far as "Ashaway" lasting for you that's just wonderful . It doesn't for me compared to other Kevlar .

    But hey different strokes for different folks .

    I don't care for Ashaway you do . Move on .
     
  26. comeback

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    IMHO the minus 11oz 105s will feel like a toothpick in your hands..And the 16x15 string pattern might not hold up to the force of Shroud..:eek:..
     
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  27. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    LOL. Its weird because I find I cant hit out as much on the spin rackets, but often when I do and it goes in, OMG thats an awesome shot! 1 out of 100!

    Don't worry, I am betting it ends up at 13 0z or something like that.
     
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  28. TinTin 1

    TinTin 1 Professional

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    I used to play the 105S customized to 12 ounces. It played great but I just couldn't keep strings in them.
     
  29. Shroud

    Shroud Legend

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    What did you try? And did the crosses break or the mains?

    I am looking at kevlar/poly as a durable option.

    Or some thick poly like 15g prince xtc, or revolve.
     
  30. TinTin 1

    TinTin 1 Professional

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    I either broke the mains or tension was lost.
    I used , 4g, revolve, Kirshbaum pro X, Ltec pro. Never tried Kevlar in them.
    I liked pro X and Ltec pro the best.
     

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