This final showed that tennis is badly missing Nadal

Discussion in 'Pro Match Results and Discussion' started by Dutch-Guy, Jan 27, 2013.

  1. tusharlovesrafa

    tusharlovesrafa Hall of Fame

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    Post of the thread.Like last year AO when he was getting thoroughly out-played by djokovic,he kept on fighting and some how found a way to drag that match to 5th set,thats what separates him from the rest. :)
     
  2. oneness

    oneness Semi-Pro

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    Yep, lets hope Rafa's body allows him to play at his best again.
     
  3. djokovic2008

    djokovic2008 Hall of Fame

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    Rafa is actually less talented a player than Murray is, it's funny how the armchair *******s can't appreciate good tennis but all the ex pros can the Murray djokovic matches are full of high level tennis rallies if you can't understand that you should watch another sport. And for you having a go at Murray remember he was too strong for fed.
     
  4. rafafan20

    rafafan20 Professional

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    :confused::confused::confused: and what in your mind is "talent"? Regardless of your feelings on Rafa me might be, along with Djokovic, one of the best pure athletes around in any sport.
     
  5. djokovic2008

    djokovic2008 Hall of Fame

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    I'm not talking about athleticism it's about touch and feel which Murray destroys rafa at. He has better volleys, slice, serve, backhand, touch, drop shot, technique need I go on.
     
  6. rafan

    rafan Hall of Fame

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    Murray is a very talented player and nobody should give up on him yet. I still think the best is yet to come. More talented than Rafa? Well I think Rafa has shown his genius so many times to really say that Murray is more talented. Talent in tennis is a movable feast because when it really comes to the bottom line it IS who wins that final game that shows the most talent to survive.
     
  7. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Honestly, I don't think Murray destroys Rafa at anything, technically or athletically. He's never destroyed him on a court either on any surface. Nadal is a class above Murray in every department.
     
  8. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    The final was an anticlimax, as was one of the SFs. Other than that, the tourney had its fair share of good matches and a couple of classics. Nadal's absence didn't make or break it.

    It would be great if the AO organizers grow a pair and ditch the slow-playing Plexicushion formula in favor of either a faster HC or go back to grass or a similar synthetic. The last option mentioned would take an ITF/ATP/WTA approval.
     
  9. mandy01

    mandy01 G.O.A.T.

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    No, aggressive players are good and exciting for tennis. One more grinder really doesn't change much. I hope the courts speed up and we see an advent of aggressive all-court tennis once again. :)
     
  10. Magnus

    Magnus Legend

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    I love it when you keep proving you have no knowledge of the sport whatsoever :)

    Murray has several things superior to Nadal. His 1st serve is much better, stronger and more percise. Murray has softer hands at the net, and the funny thing with Murray, is that at his best he can actually outgrind Nadal, despite his height. Sames goes for Djokovic. I would not be surprised to see that the only times Murray loses to Nadal is on clay.
     
  11. mandy01

    mandy01 G.O.A.T.

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    Nadal lost in four sets to Djokovic at the USO in 2011 and the last set wasn't close. Just sayin.
     
  12. Magnus

    Magnus Legend

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    Tennis does not miss Nadal, you do. You miss him because you are his fan (god knows why, but still). With you being a fan, you clearly want to show as if the sport itself needs Nadal, but it has proven it can do fine without him. To me, tennis is much better when Nadal is gone, this AO didn't only prove to be one of the more interesting events to watch, but also one of the more clean ones as far as cheating goes (men's side).

    This AO delivered some of the most epic matches in recent years, some beautiful tennis. The crowd seemed to be as into it as ever. What has been Nadal's contribution to tennis other than bad behavior? Epic matches? yeah, eveyone does that, even Wawrinka proved he can. Heck, even Almagro.

    Nadal should be banned from the sport, but his suspension was at least something positive, and I hope more suspensions are to follow. Tennis does not need Nadal, it needs to get rid of Nadal.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2013
  13. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Nadal's netplay is way underrated and it is definitely NOT inferior to Murray's. Otherwise, it would be Murray with 5 W finals, 2 W titles and he would probably have scored at least 1 victory over Nadal on grass, the surface where netplay is the most relevant. I'm sorry but I'm gonna side with JohnnyMac on that. And BTW, Djoko's netplay is also underrated for whatever reason. The most striking stat about the AO final is Djoko being 23/27 at net vs Murray who went there hardly a dozen times.
     
  14. mandy01

    mandy01 G.O.A.T.

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    Nadal has good technique acquired through a lot of work (though he rarely uses it and when he does, it's usually for put-aways). Murray's more talented of the two.
    JohnnyMac is known to go to extremes. Do you also side with him when he says "Federer is the greatest ever?" Yeah, thought so. :) :twisted:
     
  15. Magnus

    Magnus Legend

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    Really? You give Wimbledon as an example? Wimbledon is SLOW. You don't even see anyone going to the net there, instead they exchange baseline rallies one after another. Nadal doesn't even go for hard to hit volleys, he will just go for sitters and finish them off, something even I can do pretty easily.

    And again, if you even watch the matches (something which I doubt very much), you know many times the net points stat does not reflect actual volley points. It counts drive volleys, overheads from close to the net, droppers from close to the net, and even regular FH/BH from close to the net, as net points. You barely see classic volley play these days.
     
  16. sandiegoman

    sandiegoman Rookie

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    When Murray wins a major, he doesn't try to eat his trophy
     
  17. stringertom

    stringertom G.O.A.T.

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    His British dentist (oxymoronic) advised him in advance to avoid that habit!
     
  18. Sentinel

    Sentinel Bionic Poster

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    Brilliant Sir

    :shock::shock:

    Rafa is chemically unstable at high altitudes and therefore cannot be used as rocket propellant.
     
  19. Sentinel

    Sentinel Bionic Poster

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    The sins and crimes you mention don't compare to his depriving -- no cheating -- Federer of a dozen calendar year grand slams by exploiting his backhand. For standing up to Rogi humankind and God can never forgive him.
     
  20. Sentinel

    Sentinel Bionic Poster

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    I personally miss Rafa, but tbh, you can;t base such a conclusion on one match alone. What if Rafa has lost in the semi and we had the same final ? I think it was more of Andy having foot issues after set one. Otherwise it could have been a closer final.

    I too felt let down yesterday -- but what about the French Open final with Rafa last year ? Are you saying its okay if Rafa gives straight set beatdowns to others, but if Nole gives them then its not good for tennis ???
     
  21. zagor

    zagor Talk Tennis Guru

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    And when Novak was making a mockery of the rest of the field in 2011 (to arguably the same degree Fed did in your example) it was 29-30 year old Fed who stood tall and gave him a challenge, Nadal in one of his prime years was getting smacked 7 times in a row across different surfaces and couldn't even push their Wimbledon and USO matches to 5 sets, sure he got Novak in 2012 when Novak wasn't on that level anymore (heck Jo had him on the ropes at the FO) and that was on clay (where Nadal should still be at an advantage over everyone else).

    Not to mention that Nadal had several straight set losses in slams when outmatched like say to Tsonga in 2008 AO, Murray in 2010 AO, Gonzo in 2007 AO, Delpo in 2009 USO etc. so no he doesn't always raise his level when outmatched.

    You say Nadal made Novak suffer for 6 hours at last year's AO, well Murray gave Novak a heck of a match at AO last year as well and was almost as close to winning and that was against the Novak with a fresher set of legs than in the eventual final.

    Sure this year's AO final was lackluster but Murray started having some physical issues and gave the best effort he could against a Novak who was playing better than in 2012 AO (especially serving much better), let's not belittle it, as I'm sure you're aware of Nadal's performance also at times suffered from some physical ailments and many bring down his loss (or poor performance atleast) to JCF in 2008 Rome down to blisters.

    Is Nadal the mentally strongest player on tour? I'd say yes overall but the gap isn't nearly as big as you and some of his other fans make it out to be. That's not to say that the game doesn't miss him, it definitely does for various reasons (1st or 2nd most popular player at the moment, unique playing style, energy he brings on court, Ferrer being a weak link etc.).
     
  22. rafan

    rafan Hall of Fame

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    Yes Rafa is good at the net and it has been honed by all the doubles he has played. When he does come in it is terrifying for his opponent
     
  23. tudwell

    tudwell Hall of Fame

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    So that's why he lost in Madrid!
     
  24. Steve0904

    Steve0904 G.O.A.T.

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    It wasn't the final that showed how badly tennis misses Nadal, it was the Djokovic/Ferrer SF. Sure a "healthy" Nadal probably would've lost to Novak as well, but he would've made it much more competitive. We need Nadal back because he balances out draw so that the top guy that gets Ferrer doesn't get a sizable advantage.
     
  25. Stinkdyr

    Stinkdyr Professional

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    What tennis needs is to shorten the matches to 2/3.
     
  26. Steve0904

    Steve0904 G.O.A.T.

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    Shorten GS to best 2 out of 3???

    Ahhhhhh...........NO!
     
  27. DeShaun

    DeShaun Banned

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    Well, I think Federer did some of this against Andy in the semis. Andy was owning Roger in terms of aces, winners, and total points won, the entire match. Still, Roger dragged it into a 5th set somehow. It was not pretty but if that's what you like, fighting spirit, he displayed it abundantly.
     
  28. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    The best finals in the last 5 years at AO have been Nadal/Fed in 2009 and Djoko/Nadal in 2012. No offense and nothing personal against Murray either but one has to admit that the 3 finals involving Murray there (2010, 2011 and 2013) were not up to par.
     
  29. Top Jimmy

    Top Jimmy Semi-Pro

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    I'm sorry but the courts ARE too slow. Shots that should be winners are being retrieved and it's not because these guys are so much better than anyone that has ever played.

    Obviously I am not anywhere near the same level as these guys but they recently resurfaced the courts at my local college. They intentionally put in a slower surface, and by slower I mean incredibly slow. It's like 80 grit sand paper out there. Every other court I hit winners past anyone I play. Now, out of shape hacks can dig everything out and just send up moon balls. Playing there is not fun anymore, everyone hates it.

    I felt the same way watching these guys smoke shots up the line but then watch either one of them slide and smack one back. There is no reward for going for it anymore.

    There is a certain balance that needs to be achieved. I always thought we had it perfect before: Wimbledon, fast quick points, rewards moving forward. French, so we could get our fix of grinding baseline tennis. US and Aussie Open, somewhere in between.
     
  30. ruariatp

    ruariatp New User

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    now wimbledon is very slow - thats the one that needs to change i think. i think if they made that fast again, then the US and Aussie would fall somewhere in between.
    Regardless, they were all saying how much quicker the courts in Melbourne were this year - surely that supports the fact that DJoko and Murray are unbelieveable athletes. And the long rallies do make for great drama!
     
  31. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    There is nothing wrong with the surface as evidenced by the # of spectacular 5 setters we've had at AO. And although, we didn't get one in the final, we got lots of great ones during the fortnight. Retrospectively, the real final seems to have been Djokovic/Wawrinka: unforgettable, breathtaking battle over the equivalent of almost 6 sets. The courts were faster this year than last year according to a number of players and people are still complaining. Unreal. AO is not supposed to be faster than USO and W. There's supposed to be 2 slower slams: AO and RG and 2 faster W and USO. That's perfectly fair and people have 0 basis for complaining about it.
     
  32. steenkash

    steenkash Rookie

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    Grass courts have been slow the last 4 years, I seriously think its ruining the game. The game on grass is supposed to encourage attacking tennis tactics, however due to the slowness of the current courts we get rally after rally.
     
  33. tusharlovesrafa

    tusharlovesrafa Hall of Fame

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    LOLWUT?? Surface is ****ing slow at AO.Just because we have had Spectacular matches in last 5 years doesn't change the fact the surface is just sooo slow.Initially I wanted everything to be slowed because i wanted rafa to win everything,but its evident in last few years that slow surfaces are not good for body and it could kill you and finish your career per-maturealy.
     
  34. Pet

    Pet Semi-Pro

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    Yes, I think that too.

    Except for the epics Nadal-Federer 5 sets matchs, the rest are holy crapy.
     
  35. Nostradamus

    Nostradamus G.O.A.T.

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    Some people still dont' like nadal though. saying he is just topspin trick pony. and knows nothing else.
     
  36. Prisoner of Birth

    Prisoner of Birth Banned

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    Yeah, can't wait till he is back. I want Federer to win the FO (yes, I know it's unlikely) but if he doesn't, I hope it's because Nadal beat Murray, Djokovic and Federer back-to-back-to-back to claim his title as the French Open Champion.
     
  37. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    Wrong. The courts are so slow it's painful. Slow courts encouraged Nadal's grinding style of play have now destroyed his knees. I guess a few 5 setters were totally worth his career being cut short.
     
  38. Mike Sams

    Mike Sams Legend

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    I'm calling BS! If you look at the play by play thread of the AO final, everybody was enjoying the match because it was a very closely contested match for the first 2.5 sets up until Murray began to wilt. But up to then, Djokovic was very vulnerable and unsure of himself. People here were impressed by Murray's display of shot making and aggression. It was a quality match between 2 top level baseliners who were also going for their shots.
    The match was high quality for 2.5 sets and there was no sign at all of who was going to win the match until Murray began to feel the physical effects of his previous match against Federer.
    Only until Murray went away after 2.5 sets is when everybody on here is now claiming that the match was boring and how much they miss Nadal, etc, etc. :lol:
    What hurt the quality of the match is Murray's inability to go to the trenches and fight hard! I don't know how bad his blisters or hamstring were but the fact that he didn't fight is why people can't accept him on the level of the greats in the game. If he had taken the match to 5 sets by fighting, people on here would've been impressed. But he didn't, hence the quality of the match suffers.
     

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