Thoughts on Fed's racquet

Discussion in 'Pros' Racquets and Gear' started by burn1986, Jul 11, 2014.

  1. burn1986

    burn1986 Banned

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    I know, another thread about this.

    I'm convinced that Fed's new racquet has not helped his game, in fact his game has suffered. Sure, his age has played a role too. Even so, it is not a fault of the racquet!

    Federer, to my knowledge, has never played competitively with a larger headsize than a 90. He even played with the Pro Staff 85 before switching to the 90. For him to go to a 98 is a huge break from what he forged his Pro game on and what he is accustomed to playing competitively with.

    Players like Djok, Nadal, Roddick, Agassi, Pam Shriver, Chang, Safin all used larger headed 95+ racquets and were accustomed to playing with them and molded their games to these racquets in their formative years, just like Federer, Courier, and Edberg. For them to switch to a racquet smaller than 95 would be detrimental, as would the latter to a significantly larger.

    Of course hindsight is 20/20, and sometimes you can only discover things after you've tried them. Such is the case with Fed now. Just my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2014
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  2. tarkowski

    tarkowski Professional

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    I agree. 2013 was a year of injury for fed and I think his health this year is the biggest reason for his return up the ranks. He still seems to lack confidence with the new racket, especially on the FH. The racket probably provides more innate power and might keep his exertion levels lower to cope with the aging process. But for the matches i watched him play at this years Wimbledon, I agree - racket might have even hurt him due to less 'extension of the arm' than he had with the 90.
     
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  3. Hawbolt

    Hawbolt New User

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    I agree with this, Fed should go back to his K90. He achieved GOAThood with that racquet, he should not ditch it for a 98 LOL.

    I know people are arguing go back to the 85. I say, maybe go spend some time warming up with the 85, but get on the 90 when he's ready for the tour.

    Honestly, he should be using that damn 90, not a 98.
     
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  4. aimr75

    aimr75 Hall of Fame

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    BreakPoint in 3, 2, 1....

    Btw, Safin used a prestige mid, not a mid plus
     
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  5. mmk

    mmk Professional

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    Why, why, why won't Fed just listen to the wisdom of the Talk Tennis forum? If he would then the forum could turn to other, lesser problems, like curing cancer, solving the conflicts in the Middle East, ending world hunger. But no, Fed just won't listen.
     
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  6. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

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    ... Safin used a 89.5 sq inch Head Prestige Classic 600...

    Facts yo, facts.
     
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  7. Audiophile

    Audiophile Rookie

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    No offense to anyone, but I'm guessing that Fed knows his own game better than anyone and I doubt very seriously he would do anything within his control to harm it.

    If he believes his current racquet is what he needs and gives him the best chance to win, who in the heck am I to question him?

    That's just me though.
     
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  8. RFGOAT1992

    RFGOAT1992 Semi-Pro

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    I think the 98sq inch bigger head gave him more MOE on his backhand and his serve's are better then ever but i think the head size really affected the forehand, Feds forehand is like a whip the 90 help with this because the head was smaller allowing the racket whip around faster the 98 seems really not maneuverable, how many times have you seens federer whiplash forehands when he switch to the 98 his forehand is not a flatter shot thats prone to error, this is just imo
     
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  9. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    You beat me to it. :)

    Safin used a 89.5 sq. in. racquet for his entire career.
     
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  10. RFGOAT1992

    RFGOAT1992 Semi-Pro

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    federer using the 98 kills the 90's wilson will not be making anymore in 2015, i hope its just temporary and it will return in 2016, i hope my 90's storage room will last me
     
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  11. burn1986

    burn1986 Banned

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    Okay take Safin out.
     
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  12. robok9

    robok9 Semi-Pro

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    Fact: Fed has lots of experience with his game. He probably knows whats best for it, and if not, there are TONS of people to aid him with the process of choosing the right racquet.

    Fact: It's hard for us to comment on what's best for him considering we don't have firsthand experience or solid evidence.

    Also, I feel like everyone is completely disregarding the fact that 2014 has been great so far (for someone his age) apart from a couple tough losses in finals (Brisbane, Indian Wells, Monte Carlo, Wimbledon). Though his game may not have the same "magic" that it used to, his new style is effective for his current ability. It would be interesting for him to go back to the 90, but I don't think it'll happen, nor should it.
     
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  13. TeamOB

    TeamOB Professional

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    This is honestly too funny! Back in 2010-2012, all the TTW armchair experts were yelling at Fed for not switching to a bigger frame. Now, when he finally makes the switch, they are telling him to switch back! Come on guys, leave the poor old guy alone! Roger and his team are professionals. They are definitely among the most knowledgeable tennis experts on the planet. They know what they are doing.
     
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  14. Team10

    Team10 Hall of Fame

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    +1. Who are the OP and everyone else to be calling out Roger and saying that HE needs to switch back to his old frame? I'm pretty sure that Fed and his team know what they're doing, just give the guy a break and let him play the sport that he loves. He has nothing left to prove and just took a guy almost 6 years his junior to 5 sets in the Wimbledon final!
     
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  15. Team10

    Team10 Hall of Fame

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    Who are you again..? The bolded part is true, he's almost 33, why don't you just give it a break? How do you know that Fed's larger racquet has made his game suffer? The **** on this site....
     
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  16. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Ahem....."all"? I believe I was one of the very few that was adamant that switching to a bigger racquet would not dramatically improve his game and that he should just stick with his Tour 90 since he was so used to it that it was like an extension of his arm, and because he's had so much success with it. Looks like I was right all along. :)
     
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  17. ringwraith

    ringwraith Rookie

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    I think it has not been positive in every respect. He has easier access to defensive shots with the larger headsize, but has lost a fair bit of accuracy and is no longer painting the lines.
     
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  18. big ted

    big ted Hall of Fame

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    i think he does some things better with the new racquet and some things worse, and overall its going to help him in the long run for his career. i think its helped his serve, backhand, and he doesnt seem to be hitting as many mishits, am i wrong? hes getting older and its hard to imagine him winning another major with that 90 frame, since his margin for error with it is smaller imo. i think he has a better chance winning another with the larger racquet
     
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  19. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    wow that really stinks, the end of the wilson mids. Hopefully tennis warehouse will continue the pro staff 6.0. thats just really sad.
     
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  20. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Well, his 1st serves are slower on average with the new racquet and he still mishits the ball quite a bit.
     
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  21. Sander001

    Sander001 Hall of Fame

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    Nailed it. The biggest section of this forum is the racquet section where people are deciding what racquet to use, making that decision for themselves. Sure others can make suggestions and recommendations but the final decision is always made by the person who uses the racquet. From beginners to intermediates to advanced players.
    Because only the player using that racquet will know if it feels right for them, for their strokes and all the shots they need to execute, for their fitness, for the moment to moment situations, the infinite variables of the game of tennis, weighing strengths and weaknesses with compromises that can't be quantified.

    But no, let's toss common sense out the window and think that we should decide from the armchair what one of the greatest players of all time should do. Because he's a mindless drone who doesn't know what's best for him and needs to be told what to do by us plebeians.
     
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  22. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Well said. Which is why it's silly that there were literally dozens of threads and many hundreds of posts over the past few years by people here telling Federer that he needed to switch to a bigger racquet.
     
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  23. jxs653

    jxs653 Rookie

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    BreakPoint, the sillier is that you keep saying Federer is worse off with his new racquet in your armchair,,,
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2014
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  24. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    First of all, "no better off" is not the same as "worse off".

    Second of all, so sitting in an arm chair and telling the greatest player who ever lived what he should do is only acceptable when telling him to switch to a bigger racquet but not acceptable when telling him to switch back to his old racquet that he won 17 Slams with? OK, I see. So arm chair quarterbacking is only valid in one direction? And Federer is only "a mindless drone who doesn't know what's best for him and needs to be told what to do" when he's using one racquet but not another racquet? Interesting.....
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2014
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  25. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    federer loosing all those matches to nadal and others has nothing to do with headsize. It has everything to do with Rogers head. He is just weaker mentally when playing Nadal. If your shanking its going to happen with any headsize as your out of position or not seeing/watching the ball. If your not shanking you will be spraying.

    Now hes just old...if anything he should try a longer racquet to make up for loosing a step. maybe serve and volley more often and finish at the net instead of stumbling around at the baseline thinking he is still 24 years old in his prime.

    Still a very fine player though. Just not what he once was. welcome to the reality of father time and having kids!
     
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  26. torpantennis

    torpantennis Legend

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    TBH, his new racquet should've been a 27.5 incher. That would've retained the sweet spot at roughly the same distance from his hand as the trusted 90. Remember, adding racquethead size extends it ONLY towards the handle and sides, if the racquet length is not increased.
     
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  27. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    well I was joking a little. adding length really throws of players. I ussually dont suggest it. Lots of things change.
     
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  28. torpantennis

    torpantennis Legend

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    Sure, but a slight change to maybe 27.25in. would've retained the sweet spot location better than having the same length.
     
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  29. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    Possibly but that length isnt going to do much for reach so whats the point?
     
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  30. jxs653

    jxs653 Rookie

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    No, I am not defending those who say Federer should use bigger racquet at all... I just wanted to mention you don't seem to be the right person to respond Sander001's comment and call it silly because you're the one who's been the most vocal of Federer's racquet choice/change...
     
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  31. torpantennis

    torpantennis Legend

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    To not have to change anything in the stroke mechanics, as the sweet spot location is at the same distance from hand as with the 90.
     
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  32. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    The point is to keep the center of the stringbed at the same distance from his hand that he's been used to for so many years. When you switch to a bigger head but keep the length the same, the center of the stringbed moves closer to your hand, thereby decreasing your reach. The extra real estate of a bigger head is at the bottom of the hoop, not the top.
     
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  33. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    careful....breakpoint is a living legend in his own mind. Just ask him.

    just kidding BP. Honestly though BP knows racquets pretty well so his views are relevant even if its not popular or right...not saying he is wrong.
     
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  34. torpantennis

    torpantennis Legend

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    TBH, this logic got a bit of interest in me to test out some extended length racquets, with normal 98-100sq.in. head. There's something special in the feel of my K90, maybe it's that distance of sweet spot from hand...
     
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  35. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    Ok, i get you now.

    Or he could have just stuck with what worked. I have yet to see a racquet make a player better outside of placebo effect. Maybe chang could be an exception but the extra inch didnt really help his first serve a whole lot. If anything chang should have just learned to choke down on his old prince. He did make a lot of money off that longer frame though.
     
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  36. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    do you have a one handed backhand, low ball toss, like to hit inside out forehands, or volley?
     
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  37. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Well, you're wrong about that. For at least the past 6 years or so, there have been numerous people on here telling Federer that he should switch to a bigger racquet, and I was always the one saying that they shouldn't be telling the greatest player who ever lived what to do, and since he's still using his 90, so he must know what's best for him.

    Oh, and I didn't say Sander001's post was silly. I said it was "Well said". I agreed with him that it's all the threads and posts telling Federer what racquet to use that are silly.
     
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  38. torpantennis

    torpantennis Legend

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    No, 1HBH, not low ball toss, yes I like hitting I/O FHs, no, I hate volleying. :lol: Just bought K90 as it has that amazing control. It nice to just test it out sometimes in practices. K90 is not my normal racquet, it's a 102sq.in. Yonex...
     
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  39. magnut

    magnut Hall of Fame

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    OK, You should have a pretty easy time adjusting to length other than the inside out forehands but its a fairly minor adjustment.
     
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  40. jxs653

    jxs653 Rookie

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    I meant you called it silly to advocate the change to a bigger racquet for Fed, not the Sander001's comment itself.

    OK.. I didn't read all the posts in this messageboard anyway... sorry!
     
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  41. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

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    How so though? This year has been better than last year. He should be going backwards all thing being equal - he's older, more young guys are stepping up and delivering... His seems more confident and even if he's having a relatively poor run his his forehand he seems to be serving better then he has for quite a while.

    A bigger racquet was never, ever going to dramatically improve his game. But he was likely never after anything more than a little more power, a little more stability and a little more usable string-bed. All of those things he likely has got. All that matter is whether he's really used to it. Only he will know that. Any of us making claims to know are talking complete and utter ****, you especially given your inability to accept any notion which you don't already agree with.
     
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  42. Captain Ron

    Captain Ron Semi-Pro

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    Do you think Fed wonders why all these rec players are trying to use 90 si racquets. He would probably tell us all to go by an apd or pd and admit we can't handle a mid.
     
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  43. Vcore89

    Vcore89 Hall of Fame

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    And I may be the 100th to urged (sort of) Rodge to stay with (Tour 90).;)
     
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  44. robok9

    robok9 Semi-Pro

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    The problem with this whole argument though is that there are so many variables (age, racquet, injury, opponent) that NOBODY will ever "win" the argument because there is no right answer. We can only speculate.

    Considering that, I think the best time to compare his game is at the 2013 AO and the 2014 AO given that is the last time Roger was playing close to 100% with the 90. Although, even that is like comparing apples and oranges. All we can mostly confirm is that Roger is serving better than with the 90 (even in his prime). Aside from that it's also hard to compare considering he has changed styles since adding Edberg to the coaching staff. There's just too many variables.
     
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  45. gplracer

    gplracer Professional

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    Well spoken.

    I think Roger plays better with the 90 but maybe he likes the larger racket because power is easier to come by. Maybe he is not serving bigger because he wants to serve at about the same speed as he has his whole career. Maybe he just wants a racket that makes it a little easier to do so it is not as hard on his body. If he can swing his serve at 85% of his usual and get the same result he might like that. Just another angle to think about.
     
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  46. tennis_balla

    tennis_balla Hall of Fame

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    Wrong part of the forum, but appropriate here....

    [​IMG]

    By the way, your post lost all credibility when you mentioned Pam Shriver. OK, ok I'm being harsh but come on telling Roger Federer what racket he should be playing with is like telling Gordon Ramsey how to cook.
     
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  47. Teniludius

    Teniludius New User

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    I think Federer's own self-report on the racquet is quite important in this discussion, even if not decisive. The first quote is from a presser at this year's BNP Paribas Open; the second is something relevant and interesting Djokovic said at the same tournament.

    Q. Can you give us an update on the racquet, how it's feeling, how it's playing?
    ROGER FEDERER: It's good. I'm very happy. I mean, I'm not really thinking of it, so that's a major step in the right direction. That's the best you can ask for when you change racquets.
    Then you hope that success follows. That's happened, too. That's why basically ‑‑ I had a meeting with Wilson this week looking to see if there is any small changes coming up or if that's how I'm going to keep it right now. So we're just looking to see what's going to happen the next sort of month or so. I'm really happy about how it's playing, how it's given me extra power, easier power, just easier to play with it day in and day out. And I think have the spin necessarily, but have the control there, too.
    I must say I'm overall very happy, and it's exciting to play with a new racquet after so many years.

    Djokovic: . . . Roger is playing in a very high level. He has more depth on his shots especially from the backhand side. He's opening with his backhand shot down the line.
     
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  48. Teniludius

    Teniludius New User

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    Sorry, the part in yellow reads, "I'm really happy about how it's playing, how it's given me extra power, easier power, just easier to play with it day in and day out. And I think have the spin necessarily, but have the control there, too."
     
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  49. tennis_balla

    tennis_balla Hall of Fame

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    Nope, I don't buy this. Roger Federer has no idea what he's talking about. He should spend some time on TTW and let the armchair experts tell him how it should be. Poor guy is lost and needs help....TTW help!
     
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  50. John Z.

    John Z. Rookie

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    I would personally argue that it's been a few years that Fed has been off his peak, he's been on a slow down slope for at least 3-4 years now. It is primarily his consistency that has suffered the most; the 98 head size has helped him a bit on that side, but he doesn't have the same touch, hand-eye coordination and 'game iq' he use to in his prime... and that has little to do with the stick imo.
     
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