To rest his knees, Nadal may not play Indian Wells...shocker?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by cluckcluck, Feb 17, 2013.

  1. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    After Lendl suffered a devastating loss to Becker in 5 sets in the 1989 Wimbledon semi finals, Lendl announced that he wouldn't be playing on clay in the spring of 1990 at all, and that included the 1990 French Open, and would instead play golf and practice on grass. By this point, Lendl was obsessed with winning 1 tournament, even sacrificing his number 1 ranking and the chance of winning a 4th French Open.

    What's skipping Indian Wells and Miami compared to that?
     
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  2. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    Most excellent analogy. If Rafa never played another match on hardcourt he'd still be an all time great.

    I have to say though that he does look a lot worse than I thought he would - but that can change.
     
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  3. Gut Check

    Gut Check Semi-Pro

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    Although the method is potentially the same, it also demonstrates the complete opposite mindset of Lendl and Nadal. Lendl went all in trying to go against the grain and overcome the greatest challenge (grass) standing in his path. Nadal instead chooses to retreat to the environment in which he has the greatest chance of success. One could say that Nadal is at a different point than Lendl, having already proven that he can win majors on all surfaces, but to me it still says something about their very different motivations.
     
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  4. Smasher08

    Smasher08 Hall of Fame

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    Oh dear: poor Laver, Connors, Lendl, McEnroe, Gonzalez, Edberg, and Becker.

    And you're wrong: Decugis owns the French. Even with another win, Nads would merely be tied with him.
     
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  5. Smasher08

    Smasher08 Hall of Fame

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    That's true: IIRC 2009 was the year that Fed comfortably straight-setted Nads at Madrid. A true portent of things to come.
     
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  6. vernonbc

    vernonbc Hall of Fame

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    That's a pretty sketchy conclusion. If that was the extent of Rafa's accomlishments that might be true but the fact is that Rafa has a US and an Australian as well...so far.


    I don't think it says anything about their motivations at all. It says something about Rafa's physical condition but I am very sure that Rafa is more than motivated to play the hard courts and rack up some impressive titles if only he was physically able to.

    I fear that his intense motivation will in fact push him to play some tournaments that he would be wiser to skip and when all is said and done his career will be shortened and I/we'll be deprived of watching him play tennis.
     
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  7. Gut Check

    Gut Check Semi-Pro

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    We'll have to agree to disagree. It's not just motivation to play or skip certain tournaments. It was the motivation of Lendl to go as far as trying to reinvent himself to adapt to his goals. Nadal (very successfully) chose the opposite path, to stick with what was already proven to work for him, and even go so far as to lobby to have aspects of the game and pro tour changed to fall within his preferred parameters. As I said already, very different motivations when comparing the two. Nadal has probably already passed his window of personal reinvention though. He bet it all on becoming the clay GOAT, and arguably got what he wanted.
     
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  8. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    1. It wasn't a major until 1925, and no professionals could play it until 1968
    2. Only amateur players with a membership with a French tennis club could play from 1891-1924
     
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  9. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    But Lendl never did win Wimbledon. Nadal has won the career Grand Slam.
     
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  10. Gut Check

    Gut Check Semi-Pro

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    Like my post further above says;

    "One could say that Nadal is at a different point than Lendl, having already proven that he can win majors on all surfaces"


    The point is that Nadal with his attributes and some tweaks to his game possibly had a shot at top of the GOAT heap. He gave up that shot to ensure his status as clay GOAT.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2013
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  11. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    I think the chance of Nadal catching Federer sailed when Incredible Hulk Djokovic showed up in 2011, maybe even in the middle of 2009.
     
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  12. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    So if he wins more, it would make his resume worse?. No way.

    He cannot be at the level of Sampras. You would have to go back in time and stop him from getting to any of the hc slam finals or any of the Wimbledon finals.

    Only if you, for some bizarre reason, decide to just ignore the other two slams.
     
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  13. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Maybe, he should play only 1 of the 2. Playing both masters may be too much play before the packed clay season, skipping both may be too much skipping. If he only plays one master, I hope it will be Miami. He's made finals there and I would love for him to win it once.
     
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  14. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    It's not at all the same. Rafa has no such greatest challenge standing on his path. You yourself point this out, it really makes all the difference.

    Plus you leave out the fact that Rafa is trying to avoid injuries here.
     
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  15. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    It worries me a little for him to meet one of the top players especially Novak, when still not on his level. It would only hurt his confidence and raise Novak's against him and he doesn't need that.
     
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  16. NoZak Djokovic

    NoZak Djokovic Rookie

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    Not a shocker as he has expressed his concern about the amount of hard court events
    But he should stop being such a whiney bum and play, everyone else has to play on the same courts. I respect Rafa but his whining is getting annoying
     
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  17. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

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    Just making it to Novak would be a great achievement that would boost Rafa's confidence immensely. I think Nadal realizes full well Djoko is the best hard court player right now. No shame in losing to him (and maximum glory in winning of course). In 2012, Rafa beat Novak in 3 clay finals despite a prior long losing streak to Novak. I don't think it would affect his confidence at all. I think if Rafa played the masters on hard, losing to any of Djoko, Fed or Murray would not be a disaster for him. 1st event on hard in a long time, he will more or less expect something like that to happen and his goal to start would probably be not to lose to someone else at least. No, the main issue is whether he wants to keep his good feelings on the red stuff and whether inserting an event on hard in the middle isn't too disruptive for his preparation. But I see it as a purely physical problem, not mental.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2013
    #67
  18. vernonbc

    vernonbc Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, we really disagree. I don't think Rafa chose the opposite path at all. He was extremely successful from a very young age on clay but, like Lendl, his dream was to win Wimbledon and he worked very hard on adapting his game until he reached that goal. Becoming clay GOAT wasn't his dream - it just happened because he is so damn good. There is video of him from when he was 12 or 13 years old, probably his first proper media interview, and he is asked what tournament he most wants to win and he said Wimbledon. He has worked very hard to adapt his game to all surfaces and I don't think he gets enough credit for it.

    And he's not lobbying to have the tour changed to fall within his preferred parameters. He has said over and over again that he knows any changes wouldn't benefit him but he wanted to improve things for the next generation. He sincerely believes that hard courts are bad for athletes and both shortens their careers and also damages them physically so that they'll be unable to do certain activities after they retire. It's unfortunate the much of the English media hasn't bothered to report what he discusses very intelligently in Spanish or Catalan as the snippets from his English interviews often are misinterpreted.
     
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  19. SLD76

    SLD76 Legend

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    or...he could play more aggressive and go for winners more.
     
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  20. citybert

    citybert Professional

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    Nadal is Loki? I guess maybe. What would Feds and Murray be then?
     
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  21. adil1972

    adil1972 Professional

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    #71
  22. adil1972

    adil1972 Professional

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    #72
  23. MasturB

    MasturB Hall of Fame

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    Looks like Nadal is self-imposing a silent ban on playing on hardcourts.
     
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  24. Netspirit

    Netspirit Hall of Fame

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    I am sticking to my AO prediction that Nadal is going to skip ALL hardcourt events up until Canada.
     
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  25. TheFifthSet

    TheFifthSet Hall of Fame

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    awesome pic buddy! R.I.P Stan the Man.
     
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  26. ViscaB

    ViscaB Hall of Fame

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    I just read an interview with Nadal in a Spanish newspaper in which he says that he might never play on "such" surfaces again in reference to Miami and Indian Wells.
     
    #76
  27. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

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    The usual BS from Nadal.
     
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  28. fed_is_GOD

    fed_is_GOD Professional

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    what a baby... vernoqueim, vernonbc, crissitti.. my question toyou guys.. dont you get tired of his antics?? i mean as a fan you ought to have some breaking point.. what might that be?? ;-)
     
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  29. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    What is getting annoying is the (constant) whining about anything he says or does.

    He shouldn't play if he thinks it will hurt his career. He has to do what he thinks it's good for him.

    Well, I hope you're right, but I'm not so sure. Losing those IW and Miami finals in 2011 was a big factor in then losing those clay finals to Novak.
     
    #79
  30. malbaker86

    malbaker86 Professional

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    what does this have to do with this thread
     
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  31. Flash O'Groove

    Flash O'Groove Hall of Fame

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    I agree with. I think what matter for Nadal now is to find is game, to feel as good physically as possible, whatever the results are. Right now I don't see him go far on a HC master 1000, where he would have to play better players than Nalbandian very early. If he lose it doesn't matter. You have the right to lose, and your are expected to lose after such a long break. He should simply focus on himself, try to be close to his best level for the european clay season, if he isn't, work again to find his best level later.
     
    #81
  32. bjk

    bjk Hall of Fame

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    That must be some fast drying concrete!
     
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