Toni Nadal on Rage

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by cork_screw, Nov 29, 2012.

  1. PhrygianDominant

    PhrygianDominant Hall of Fame

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    I agree that clay is awesome. I just wish they would make more faster clay. It's not the surface that is annoying, it's the speed and height of the bounce that leads to endless boring grinding. Fast clay courts are super bada$$.

    Also there should be an even amount of grass and clay tournaments.

    The end.
     
  2. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    LOL, you acting as these journalists are out to get Toni Nadal. Your translating isn't accurate. One of the member at Youtube(from your link) had him saying..."If we all can get them (Roger and Djokovic) injured, it would be really good for us"
     
  3. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    My translation is just fine. And also included the part you're saying. Since apparently you missed it, I quote myself:

     
  4. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    Journalists are under pressure from their editors, who are under pressure from the proprietors, to get a juicy story, and thus increase corporate profits. You should know how the bourgeois press works, particularly those newspapers who shut out journalist trade unions.
     
  5. Tanya

    Tanya Professional

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    A youtube comment is now fact then? As someone who studies spanish in college I can tell you without a doubt that you are incorrect. What's more embarrassing is that you're trying to pass off an incorrect, biased translation as fact to people that clearly understand the true meaning of the original Spanish phrase. Invest in Rosetta Stone or shut up.

    Even the youtube comment which you are now backing is a far cry from the bs posted in your signature btw.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  6. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Erm GRASS is tennis, it started on grass.
     
  7. hersito

    hersito Rookie

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    Things start as something and then evolve, I don't think you want to play tennis with your hand as they did in the beginnings. Anyway if you think the best way to have fun and play tennis is on grass be my guest and do it.
     
  8. Sabratha

    Sabratha G.O.A.T.

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    Hardcourts are tennis too if clay is.
     
  9. hersito

    hersito Rookie

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    Of course I'm not saying you cant like it or that tennis on grass or hardcourt is not tennis, in my opinion, tennis is way better on clay. I would love to know how many of the people that post here have really tried clay. I would guess that a lot of the people that post from USA have never played on a clay court.
     
  10. Feather

    Feather Hall of Fame

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    How about a fast Wimbledon and fast US Open? How about the slowing down of courts that has hurt Roger Federer the most and benefitted Rafael Nadal the most? And still even after all that you need more clay courts.

    Talk about self serving
     
  11. Feather

    Feather Hall of Fame

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    This is highly selfish from Toni

    I mean how can he demand more clay events. There are three masters in clay, that's one third of the total masters. If he wants lesser hard court masters then let it be on grass, carpet etc.

    Why are the treating the indoor season in a step motherly fashion? They held three indoor events back to back and Roger had to skip Paris. Did anyone complain about that?

    Imaging all the three clay masters held back to back. Rafa and Toni would turn the world upside down..

    Rafa benefitted the most.. Uncle Toni tends to forget that they slowed down the grass, slowed down US Open and again they slowed down AO also.. Rebound Ace was faster than Plexicushion.
    Almost all the events are slowed down to suit Rafa's style and the guy who benefitted most from those changes complaining about ATP.

    The real issue is Rafa lost his Madrid clay last year. They are cribbing about that. What about attacking players who have almost all their surfaces being slowed down to suit grinders? It's like they don't complain when they get the benefits
     
  12. Crisstti

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    No, the ones who benefit more are the like of Fed with 6 masters and two slams on hard court.

    To complain about so much hard court (whether it'd be replaced by more clay, grass, carpet, whatever) is perfectly valid, and very logical for that matter.
     
  13. mandy01

    mandy01 G.O.A.T.

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    The tour was structured the way it was because hard-courts are easier to maintain and was like that since before either Nadal or Fed got on board. Why doesn't Toni pay out of his pocket if clay is what he wants? Moreover, Nadal still has the option to play the South-American events. To cap it off, HCs are largely slowed down today, so more or less it has equalized conditions for the players. Toni isn't just complaining about HC. He clearly wants clay to get a major portion on the tour. Well, that makes no sense considering most players on the tour prefer hard.
     
  14. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    Exactly, but these Fedites will never understand that, nor will the Djokotards. I can promise you they would if their fav's best surface wasn't hardcourt, with more than 70% of the tour being dominated by them. I wonder how they would feel if more than 70% of the tour was dominated by clay? This place would be like a nursery full of crying babies if that were the case.
     
  15. SQA333

    SQA333 Professional

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    Sadly for the Nadal's and their tards, everybody else incl rational nadal fans don't take an almost 30 yr tennis tradition as a personal insult. We just stick with it, and carry on.
     
  16. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Well if 70% of the tour had been on clay since before Federer was born, I'd be more annoyed with Federer that he couldn't adapt his game better to Clay.

    Plus, Federer's best surface ISN'T HC. It's grass. I mean early on Federer's best results were on clay, both his best slam results (a first quarter at RG I believe) and a first masters title (Hamburg 2002), then his first slam win was Wimbledon on grass which is even more neglected than clay (clay is in fact not really neglected, if a good deal of HC gave way to grass it would be pretty even between grass, clay and HC) so if Federer had stayed just a grass court player, he'd be even more screwed than Nadal. You can say Federer's best surface is HC, but that is only because there is hardly any grass so of course he's won more on HC. Federer has won 7 slams at Wimbledon but only 5 at the us open and 4 at the AO. There are no grass masters for him to win.

    You're basically complaining that Federer learnt to be the best player on more than one surface, because grass was his best surface he just happened to be dominant on HC too. If he didn't he'd be worse off than Nadal.

    But I do believe there should be less HC. But it should be replaced with grass, not clay. Which still would have suited Federer, in fact would have been even better for him, so if everything was truly fair in terms of shares given to surfaces, Federer fans would have nothing to complain about. Now grass also would suit Nadal more than HC, but I think a lot of Nadal fans would still groan if grass benifitted from a reduction in HC, rather than clay. I also do realise that a lot of people insult clay because of Nadal, but clay isn't really under-represented, grass is. Just unfair that HC got the lion's share.
     
  17. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    What about before those 30 years? Hardcourts didn't exist on the tour for years until the ATP became cheapskates and decided it was cheaper to dominate the tour with them instead of keeping grass and clay courts. Hardcourts only exist because they're cheaper to maintain.
     
  18. YouCantBeSerious

    YouCantBeSerious Banned

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    The OP clearly meant "Toni Nadal enraged" or "Toni Nadal in rage". Toni Nadal on Rage sounds like he is on some sort of hemorrhoid medication.
     
  19. Crisstti

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    Lol, yes it would be. One just has to remember the ridiculous poly strings threads after Rafa won RG this year.

    That on top of that some have the face to get mad at someone like Toni bringing this up… well. there’s a good word for that in Spanish with no good translation to English.

    And your point is?. Fed is still clearly the one favoured there.

    Sure, let’s compare 250 tournies to masters and slams…

    Maybe most players prefer hard because players who prefer otherwise would find it harder to begin with to make it on tour.
     
  20. Crisstti

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    You mean it's good for your fave, so you've got nothing to complain about?. Sure, we can see that.
     
  21. Crisstti

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    It's credit to Fed that he's that good on two surfaces, but I think it was you saying hc are more similar to grass.

    Plus just adapting your game cannot be that simple, you have the talents you have. I really doubt Fed would have the same titles if 70% of the tour was on clay.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  22. RoachTennis

    RoachTennis New User

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    Who cares? Clay court tennis is boring to watch anyway! Who wants to watch endless retrieving?
     
  23. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    Sure, let's just watch mindless ball bashing.
     
  24. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Yeah HC is more similar to grass than clay is, it's not the same though, it can be very different. HC can be a slow as clay, but overall i feel it's better for a grass court player than a clay court is especially the right type of HC since they can vary so much. So it's the nearest to grass. Carpet was probably closest before it was removed from the tour.

    If 70% of the tour was on clay, no doubt Federer would do worse, though the biggest part of this would just be Nadal rather than the actual surface - Federer has not done badly on clay. For instance if you consider hamburg and madrid clay as one event, it's then Federer's best masters event out of any (4 hamburg titles and a final, 2 Madrid titles and a final, biggest combined win percentage of any masters event), plus he made his first quarterfinal of a slam at RG and has made 5 finals there. But say if 70% was on clay and most of the remaining 30% was HC with little grass as it is now, I think the correct thing for a Federer fan to be arguing would be take away some clay and replace with grass (not HC) so it's roughly an equal third for each surface. A lot of Federer fans wouldn't argue for the sake of fairness, I admit that. But my point is really the HC should give way to grass. If you can't do that then it's really hard because maybe there should be more clay but some should be faster clay, some hardcourts should be slow and some fast, but then you get into a question of high bouncing or low bouncing etc.. Maybe some ort of astroturf should be used if grass is too hard to maintain.

    I do agree there is only so much you can adapt and you make do with what talent you have, but if the tour was truly fair it wouldn't get more clay, it would get more grass and it would be up to Federer, Nadal and everyone else to try and be as good as possible across all 3 surfaces. The better adapt, the more you win. For the record I do think Nadal would also benifitt a bit from grass replacing HC, but not sure how much (in terms of grass masters for instance he might do less well than wimbledon because of the best of 3 format, but he might do better than HC masters in general because of several factors)
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  25. tennis_pro

    tennis_pro G.O.A.T.

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    I wonder if Toni will change his mind in a few years when Nadal is retired.
     
  26. Crisstti

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    Federer has been more consistent on his level on clay than Rafa on hc, but Rafa's peak level on hc is probably higher (than Fed's on clay).

    Anyway, I pretty much agree with you. Though I do think how harmful hc are should be taken into consideration here. I don't see why carpet or something else wouldn't be a better option.
     
  27. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Well Nadal is able to beat anyone on hardcourt. I would greatly favour Djokovic over Nadal on hc, but Nadal has still managed to beat him there. It's like he's such a great competitor when he's playing well that he can win on HC vs players who are better on that surface. But it's really rare that someone can do the same to him on clay. Other players are great on a surface but when below their best or when forced under pressure, they will lose that edge. Nadal is so gifted on clay that even under pressure it's hard for him to lose enough of an edge to be beatable.

    With regards to carpet, I understand that a lot of players got injured on it so they took it out. Even Federer agreed I heard and carpet probably suited his game more than most HCs do these days, but players were getting injured (or so I heard) But grass would be better for the body than HC. Also maybe if grass is really a no go, Har-tru could be used. It's a bit different from red clay. Then maybe HC could be sped up a bit - if all hc is going to be slow it will cause a lot of wear and tear. At least have some events where you don't have to grind on an unforgiving surface
     
  28. Crisstti

    Crisstti Legend

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    There doesn't seem to be a consensus about why they took carpet out.
    But yeah, grass, or artificial grass or har-tru or some combination would seem to be a better choice.
     

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