Top Babolat Stringing Expert Recommends 2 Piece Stringing

Discussion in 'Stringing Techniques / Stringing Machines' started by mikeler, Jun 21, 2012.

  1. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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    There is an interview in the latest issue of RSI magazine and that was his answer to the first question. He cites three reasons which you can read in the article. I find this interesting since it contradicts what Drakulie was doing while stringing for an ATP event. Discuss.
     
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  2. Radicalized

    Radicalized Semi-Pro

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    And in the May 2011 RSI article about "Standard Practices," Ron Rocchi (Wilson Global Tour Equipment Manager, RSI Stringer of the Year 2009, Wilson/Luxilon Tournament stringing team) writes how, in "a tournament setting," they "string one-piece whenever possible."

    Reasons:
    1. In tournament setting want to minimize things that can go wrong.
    2. Players hit more toward center and lower outside string tensions do not matter as much.
    3. "Two-knot" is "cleaner."

    It is like a lot of business, your "shop" runs things with its own "culture." They have beliefs and go with it.

    Interesting, but he also notes how two-piece with the extra knots will slightly lower tension due to tie offs, "which is a plus for average players." This is because he said, "lower tension should be more forgiving on off-center hits."

    I guess the pros don't need that based on the logic of #2 above.

    It's Federer (brand) vs. Nadal (brand) all over again. Don't let this get out to the "pro player" discussion section.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
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  3. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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    Hopefully Drakulie pops in but I think those were the reasons his team did 1 piece. Thanks for sharing that info.
     
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  4. BHiC

    BHiC Rookie

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    That is very interesting. I will always string 2 piece whenever possible, just because I am so used to it, and it will work on every racquet that I deal with. Unless someone states that they want their racquet done 1 piece (which no one that I have strung for ever has) I will string every racquet 2 piece.
     
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  5. Radicalized

    Radicalized Semi-Pro

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    I also string two-piece, except for an older racquet that I have around that is "one-piece" that is the "extra" for guests. I know the original pattern and it requires a method to lock down the guard. I just go with it.

    I go with the following (and not a pro stringer, obviously):
    1. A properly tied "knot" will "not" be a problem. I've seen some really bad ones that have held.
    2. I have less string to pull, thus less of a chance of that taking time and causing friction/mishandling damage.
    3. Cleaner? I'm hitting nowhere (hopefully) near a knot. And my knots are beautiful. ;)
    4. The string tension, I feel, is plenty in the center with the number of outside frame-turns, regardless of any loss at the tie off. I don't even add extra lbs. on the final strings. It always makes me think of break bars in a repelling device.

    That stuff feels basic to me.
     
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  6. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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    I learned how to string 2 piece. Since I only string for myself, I've never found the need to do it any other way.
     
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  7. mchjhn

    mchjhn Rookie

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    i would disagree on a couple of points

    1. with a 1 piece, blocked grommets are not as much of an issue b/c there is no tension on the string. you still have to work around the blocked grommets at the throat.
    2. less overlap of string at the throat where you have your tie offs
    3. although you have more string to pull through the mains, you need less string overall
    4. less knots+less time tying them=faster
    5. some racquets companies, wilson in particularly, allow one piece or two piece on racquets, regardless of stringing crosses head to throat, or throat to head. i know that's going to cause an argument, but just saying what Wilson says.
    6. as mikiler states with 2 piece, i learned doing a 1 piece, and that's what i am most comfortable with...

    EDIT

    concerning tension, i would be very surprised if a player could tell the difference in tension between a one piece and two piece. the difference is so small and there are so many variables.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
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  8. SwankPeRFection

    SwankPeRFection Hall of Fame

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    The guides I use are as follows.

    1) Is the racquet built for two piece stringing or one? (i.e. does it have proper places to tie off the crosses and mains like larger grommets to accomodate a two piece or not. Why mess with tying off on a grommet that wasn't meant for it?)

    2) If the racquet calls for one piece becase of the manufacturer constraints, is the job a hybrid string job?

    Basically, unless there's a manufacturing call for two piece or there is a necessity to do two piece because it's a hybrid job, I go with a one piece string job. It's as simple and as basic as that. If you do a professional job, it shouldn't matter what you string, as long as you go with what the manufacturer calls for. I like my stuff and the stuff of those I string for to be right, so I do it the right way. If someone specifically asks for something else, I will explain to them why it may or may not be a good idea, so they can formulate their own more informed opinion, and then string based on their final decision/choice. At that point, all responsobility is placed on them and their decision. They will still get a great job done, but if there's any issues which their own choice caused, then it's out of my control.
     
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  9. drakulie

    drakulie Talk Tennis Guru

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    I'm of the mind that either one is good. There really is no right or wrong.

    That said, over the years of testing strings, patterns and tension loss Ive come to the conclusion that one piece is superior. Tension loss over the entire string bed is less as well as the string beds ability to maintain it's playing characteristics longer. With two piece, there tends to be more pockets of tension loss in a scattered number of zones in the string bed, which results in loss of playability VS a one piece.

    To add, a three box or stacked around the world makes a much more uniform string bed than a standard one piece.

    I will be stringing at the Cincinnatti Masters this year and will be curious to find out what pattern will be utilized. I do know from speaking to Ron and Nate they prefer one piece for some of the reasons I cited above.
     
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  10. Clintspin

    Clintspin Semi-Pro

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    I like one-piece stringing for a number of reasons but do have concerns about that quick turn with the long side. Some racquets don't have a lot of space between the last main and the first cross. It seems like a fair amount of stress on a very small chuck of graphite.
     
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  11. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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    Congrats on the Cincy gig. Don't forget your camera! Interesting stuff about where the tension loss occurs, thanks for popping in.
     
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  12. Dags

    Dags Professional

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    I find it quite amusing that this advice is coming from a Babolat expert: whenever I get a Pure Drive I'll string it one-piece wherever possible because the tie-offs are so damn tight! :twisted:
     
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  13. Ramon

    Ramon Hall of Fame

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    I learned with 2-piece, but now I use 1-piece when possible. I don't use standard 1-piece patterns. I reserve some extra string on the short side and weave 1 or 2 crosses with it, so my tie-offs are at cross strings. Every main string is pulled to correct tension. I also like having less tie-offs and using less string.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
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  14. PointTaken

    PointTaken New User

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    Ramon, can you explain for me 'leaving extra string on the short side to do a couple crosses'. I may try that.
     
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  15. jim e

    jim e Hall of Fame

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    With a racquet that is a natural one piece, (that is a racquet where the main strings end at the head of racquet), if a typical one piece job is used, you will have one tie off a main string and one tie off a cross string. Some players like to have both end mains the same, so if you leave a little extra on the short side you can weave the top cross with the short side and tie off, as that way the top and bottom cross strings are the tie offs. Only thing is with O Port racquets this will throw off the pattern, and will not line up properly, so you have a chioce to either string the top 2 crosses with the short side or what I do is start the stringing with the long side as the short side and the pattern lines up properly, and top and bottom crosses are the tie offs.
     
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  16. Ramon

    Ramon Hall of Fame

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    I allocate 12 ft of string on the short side instead of the usual 10 on my Pro Kennex. The normal tie-offs are at the top of the frame (16 mains, 8 holes in the throat). Instead of tying off the short side at the last main, I string the top 2 crosses while I use a starting clamp or floating clamp to hold down the long side. After I tie off the 2nd cross, I start the long side crosses on the 3rd cross. I like to have my top cross tight because it helps reduce shear stress on shanks. On some racquets, it's better to just do the top cross and tie that off because of difficulty with blocked holes.

    Some racquets require an ATW pattern. On those racquets, I do 7 mains on the short side and do the top 1 or 2 crosses with the short side. Then I string the bottom cross and 8th short side main with the long side and do the rest of the crosses after that. Make sure you know what configuration you need for the bottom cross before you weave it. You don't have a choice in the matter.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
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  17. PointTaken

    PointTaken New User

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    Thanks for the explanations. I will try that this evening.
     
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  18. Radicalized

    Radicalized Semi-Pro

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    Blocked grommets have never been a problem for me. Knots are blown way out of proportion in terms of effort. Although, I use knots for other purposes as well. If there is a requirement, then I'll do it. No big deal. I'd just rather not have to pull the extra string and have it lying around. As far as the string goes, there's always enough anyway for most racquets, at least with synthetic gut. You're using the whole package anyway. Even with a reel, there is always going to be that bit left over, depending on the racquet(s) you do. I'm accurate in measuring my string, so as long as the string manufacturer doesn't throw in a wrench, I'm good to go, or at least see the potential problem beforehand.

    You have to use two-piece for a hybrid, anyway.

    As to Drakulie's further details on the one-piece beyond the RSI article, there is no way I would have his depth of analysis.

    And put most simply, I'm never in a tournament setting like Drakulie.

    Again, at most levels, personal preference can rule, disregarding the factors noted by Drakulie.

    Drakulie himself, as far as I remember when asking a question about a gauge of Black Magic, has been using gut mains and Black Magic 17 crosses recently. I wonder how he approaches that situation given his abilities and knowledge of tension loss, etc. I'd be doing a basic two-piece, and that's it. This guy is out of my league, but I do try to keep up with all of these issues, even if I don't apply all of them regularly.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
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  19. fortun8son

    fortun8son Hall of Fame

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    USRSA states that when given the choice between 1pc or 2pc; choose the one that allows top to bottom crosses.
    That should be what applies to us mere mortals.:)
    Tournament settings are different and ATW allows this to be done with one piece.
    What's important there is absolute standardization, regardless of who does the stringjob.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
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  20. andtapes

    andtapes Rookie

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    I didn't find the interview, Can you post the link?
    Thank you
     
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  21. Rabbit

    Rabbit G.O.A.T.

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    Congrats on Cincy!

    I string all hybrids 2-piece. ;)

    When given the choice, I'll string one piece. But, I don't know that there are distinct advantages one over the other. Aesthetically, I prefer fewer knots and tie offs on crosses.
     
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  22. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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  23. Wikky

    Wikky Rookie

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  24. themitchmann

    themitchmann Hall of Fame

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    Over the years, I've become a 2 piece guy. I don't mind the knots, and I am happy with how the stringbed is symmetrical. I know you can achieve symmetry with certain ATW/Box patterns, but I like the simplicity of 2 pieces.

    That being said, I'm no tournament stringer. I'm really digging this conversation guys!
     
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  25. andtapes

    andtapes Rookie

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  26. Valjean

    Valjean Hall of Fame

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    To me, yours is not only counter-intuitive, it's the reverse of what my own two-piece measurements have said. I even wonder how one could hope to identify one-piece stringing as enough the cause of a stringbed's rate of deterioration or pockets of insufficient tension (did these occur, though?) to say this...
     
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  27. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    i base it on the racket. for wilson and babolat i may do 1 pc, but for head and prince i always do 2 pc. for me 1pc is slightly faster.
     
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  28. Wikky

    Wikky Rookie

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    For the past few days I've been switching from my regular two piece ways and have been trying out different 1 piece ATW patterns. The problem I have found is that with many of these patterns when switching from mains to crosses the string is wrapped around two very close grommet holes with a 270 degree turn. This is putting a lot of pressure on the frame and on the string and in one case actually broke on the mount when i was stringing the crosses several minutes later (It was psg 17, I wasn't very upset about it)

    Does anyone have any suggestions on what ATW patterns work the best for certain companies? Babolat would be my biggest interest since I string those the most. And no I will not string bottom up, just a personal preference.
     
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